Searching through threads here, I find a lot on the subject of STDs, obviously of very basic concern for all of us.  From the hobbyist side, we feel our sexuality, want to take it to where it leads.  I've been away from TER 5 years or so, was into a single-provider multi-day relationship (not sugar daddying, way-reduced fixed rate for way-more hours, actually worked quite well).  Anyway, now back into the glorious variety of hourly dating, so back with TER, and back into the world of stranger-danger STD concerns.

Obviously everything we do sexually is at a balance of pleasure vs risk.  What I'm looking for here is discussion, from the hobbyist's point of view, of relative rating of the risk component.  Leading the list I suppose would be uncovered Greek or uncovered sex or maybe DATY; at the other end of the scale I suppose would be LK.  I'm assuming here that no hobbyist would take part in the presence of stringent odor, open cuts and/or skin eruptions (same for providers), so possibly we can eliminate those as variables.  And I'm guessing that activities inviting treatable uglies are the same as would invite untreatable disasters, so possibly we can eliminate those as variables also.

I'll put myself out there as a beginning point of reference: I recently had a date including BBBJ, covered sex and inside fingering, but on which I passed DATY and FK (talk about will power!)  My passing these heavenly treats had nothing to do with the provider, she was great, merely a pang of conscience over relative safety.  So using that as a starting point, what is a rational/factual hierarchy of activity risks?  Certainly none of us wants to leave pleasures on the table, but on the other hand, good not to be  smiling in the dark.

Many thanks for responses ...

You are Willing to have uncovered Greek and uncovered Sex which is a high risk in catching something...however the lower risk which is DATY You pass on...and personally I can Not imagine You are getting provideres to Not use protection...however I have been known to be wrong before...there are many sites You can go to...to deteremine the safer methods of Enjoying sex...I would suggest maybe You might want to do the research...so You may feel confident in Enjoying the Hobby

but not with SOs are all fine by me.

the risks are real but slight (to the hobbyist) in my opinion and experience.  The enjoyment IMO outweighs the risks.  

Unfortunately the risks accrue more to the provider with respect to daty (hsv1 and 2) and also with cim if she does not follow the old rule to "swallow or spit - don't let it sit".

I "shop" for ladies who meet my specs but entirely respect those who decline to offer some of these services for what they perceive as unacceptable risk.

I am not married but do have a housemate almost all the time. We are "adventurous" and test very regularly...

Have not had an std attributable to the services I mentioned above.

To each his own but whatever you do - do not assume that being conservative with service choices will protect you from STDs -

get tested regularly

see the link for a respected STD risk chart and anonymous STD testing

-- Modified on 3/23/2010 11:36:04 AM

Matter of fact, your post risks making me and all the gals I've been with look like total dunces.  How about deleting and cleaning the slate?

-- Modified on 3/23/2010 2:15:34 PM

Very thorough and appreciated, many thanks.

Take a hypothetical: a guy hobbies maybe a couple of times monthly, only well reviewed providers, no uncovered sex, glorious bbbj without cim, probably dfk, fingers inside wherever allowed.  What might a sane/rational person consider "regularly" for testing?

on how you weight your concern about infecting someone else - another provider, a significant other, a wife....

What I hear from providers most frequently is that they test *every six months*. Providers are generally professional and care about maintaining their health and managing their risks.

When I am in a personal relationship (uncovered) I test very frequently. When I do not have an SO at home, quarterly. But then again, I do get around a great deal in addition to the hobbying bit, and am aware that my choices are a bit more on the risky side.

That being said, I have not had an STD since the 70s, when going bareback FS

I can't tell you what conclusions to draw from this.  I don't know how many providers you will be seeing over what unit of time, or what risks you want to manage in your personal life....

Several issues here. First, what is the definition of what is sane/rational. Second, who here qualifies, and based on what, and in who's evaluation. Third, an issue of probabilities. Some people are quite comfortable with the probabilities regarding not getting in an accident while texting and driving, others aren't. You are asking for the probabilities of getting an STD given the conditions you mentioned, but no one here can give you a clear answer. And finally, given these are only probabilities, not absolutes, and you could contract something your next time out, how long are you comfortable with not getting tested?

He asked for a reasonable interval for testing, and you turn it into psycho-babble.  You complain regularly about the constant train wrecks, and yet you seem to love to germinate them.

Alias avoided to remove one of your favorite things to bitch about.

ROFLMMFAO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

This stuff is even more fun to sit back and WATCH.

Absolutely positively one of the BEST posts simply EVER!!!!
Holy Christ I'm still LMFAO!!!

Damn Phil...you done got yourself a strong pimp hand, don't cha?

But it gives me gas (juvenile fuel humor).

Let's see, I did not insult his intelligence, nor call him names, yet you allow others, in other threads to do so without a peep. You say, "He asked for a reasonable interval for testing, and you turn it into psycho-babble." I'm not certain what you exactly mean by that. Specifically, what is it you disagree about, what I wrote? You say, "You complain regularly about the constant train wrecks, and yet you seem to love to germinate them." Well, do I complain more that anyone else? Have you been keeping a list of all the times? And, what are all these train wrecks that I've germinated? I can think of only one, off hand. If I have been problematic in my posting, I would have appreciated hearing about it from you and/or DC in a PM, but I have not. So I was unaware of any problem. But, for some reason you now feel a need to put me in my place, because your comment was not instructive but rather, punitive. From now on, if you have an issue with me, I'd appreciate a PM from you.

Matt....
What a pain in the FUCKING ASS!
Blah blah blah...whine whine whine.
God Damn it's like a never ending pussy fart.
SHUT THE FUCK UP!!!


(ok...I realize there may be consequences for this action...but I thought about it beforehand...and I'll take it. It just felt so FUCKING GOOD to say that finally!)

STFU you annoying twirp!  Jesus, do you ever stop wimpering?  The answer is YES, you complain about everything......constantly!  You are like a freaking mosquito, and every so often need to be swatted.

Note:  No alias here either!  You've already complained enough, I'm not feeding you any more bait tonight!

I guess I am the dunce...lol...it'll teach me to get on the boards early in the morning...sorry...and like I said...You keep Enjoying the Hobby

This topic appears so basic yet very essential. One's risk of acquiring an STD, including HIV, is a function of a variety of both parties' risk factors as determined by lifestyle and health conditions.

Health conditions requiring blood transfusions or human blood/plasma derived pharmaceutical products are HIV and Hep risk factors.

Tatoos or piercings are HIV and Hep risk factors.

Use of shared hyperdermic needles is a risk factor.

Medical, surgical or dental procedures as well as transfusions etc... performed in countries without proper sterilization / screening protocols and oversight are risk factors.

Unprotected oral, vaginal or anal intercourse are risk factors.

The number of sexual partners increases risk factors. ie You see provider A. Provider A has seen 12 distinct partners per week for the past 6 months ( 26 x 12 ) or 312 distinct partners.  Each of these partners has seen 12 providers during the preceeding 6 months prior to seeing Provider A.

Provider A has been indirectly exposed to 3,744 partners ( 312 x 12 )through her 312 direct contacts in 6 months that can be accounted for.

A lot can happen in 6 months between testing. The risks exist for provider and hobbyist alike.

I may have not directly answered texastwostep's question but hopefully I reinforced what is already well known. Ultimately, it's your choice.

for you.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LnVBgp7Ud98

Knowing my scientific background and that I grow pathogens for experimental purposes, he recommended two books, both by the same author, Dr. Paul Ewald: "Evolution of Infectious Disease" and "Plague Time: The New Germ Theory of Disease."

Let me give you the executive summary: pathogens adapt to deal with their environment in an interplay between ease of transmission, degree of virulence and frequency of transmission.

He did specific research on the difference in ease of transmission and virulence of the same pathogens in LOW promiscuity environments and HIGH promiscuity environments.

The bottom line is that the hobby is a *high promiscuity environment*. And in such environments, the pathogens are more easily transmitted AND more virulent than they would be in a lower promiscuity environment of the community at large.

The charts and graphs you see at health departments regarding odds and risks are taken from the population as a whole; rather than the specific population of the hobby. As a result, these *underestimate* the actual risks faced within the hobby. By how much? There is no telling.

My Dr., who I admit is a tad conservative but nevertheless brighter than the average bear, characterized having sex with a prostitute, even using condoms, as "insane and suicidal."

Again, this is a matter of odds.

Personally, I think a 6-month testing interval is too infrequent considering the volume of providers directly and by proxy through their clients.

I realize that tests are expensive at about $250/pop; but clients should likely be getting tested more frequently as well.

Many thanks.  Your post is a straight forward, intelligent take on the question.  A couple replies above showed similar forethought and wisdom.

Problem is, I've never been into hobbying regularly as I plan to be now, so looking for practical guidance, not from docs, but from fellow hobbyists.  I'll eventually turn to docs, but practical path generally seems a good place to start.  As already written, I figure about twice monthly, covered sex, employing max willpower to stop daty, probably continue with bbbj and dfk and fingering wherever allowed.  And who knows, maybe go to covered bj, add another layer of safety, something I'll have to decide.  The message I'm getting from this thread and others before it is that there is no benchmark, that testing "everyday" represents maximum caution, anything less represents less caution.  For those who might misread, I'm not suggesting getting tested everyday, just that somewhere between these two extremes is where I and presumably the rest of you ought to be.

thanks for the assist ...

As with wholerod's post (immediately above) and a couple earlier, I greatly appreciate the seriousness with which you approached my question.  Many tanks for that.  Please read my response to wholerod, I think it applies to much of what you've said.  Apparently, somewhere between "daily" and "never" lies the answer caution-wise, although only abstinence will totally close the door.  You've suggested that because of the more-promiscuous population we comprise, six months probably is too long between tests.  From all I've read, that makes sense.  In my particular case, after reasoning long and hard, I've decided that given all that's come before in my long life, and my limited time remaining, sexuality has to become a more prominent player.  So I've obviously bought off on accepting some level of risk, I will become more sexually active, just a matter of setting bounds and abiding by them.

BTW, I also chatted with a doc.  Told him I'd talk only up to the point where entry would be required onto a medical record, lol, always fear for privacy.  He gave me about the same conclusion as your doc, gotta be a moron to be considering this stuff!  He did confirm there were legit anonymous test centers, I presume like the tSTD centers linked from another poster's response.  You have any knowledge on that?  I have taken the time to visit another brand center not too far from where I live, came away with zero trust and confidence they knew fully what they were doing.  Is there a trusted list hobbyists receiving testing work from?

Again, many thanks for the assist.

I use the AnyLabTestNow center that is near me. There just happens to be a place on a street I drive down every day. I get the complete panel, which costs $229.

These are franchise operations so the fact I like the one near me doesn't mean the one near you will be any good!  

Because I am very conscious about this stuff; and don't see many ladies ... I just bite the bullet and get tested 2 weeks before a session unless I'm having 2 sessions in a row with the same woman.

I do it beforehand in order to give maximum time for antibodies to develop and test positive; and I choose two weeks because that way if anything comes back positive that gives me enough time to cancel the session without causing the lady undue hardship.

Even so, a negative test just means a negative test -- it doesn't mean disease free because some stuff could show up later.

NOW -- there IS one other risk that few have mentioned; but I will mention it because it has affected me.

When I started hobbying; I had not been widely exposed to the common everyday germs that everyone carries in their mouth and throat.

One little known fact is that there are variations in these germs and in immunities such that a germ in my mouth that is perfectly benign to me could actually make somebody else ill, and vice versa.

For the first couple of years, I would get ill to varying degrees with about 2 out of 3 providers I saw without regard to their classiness or price. There was nothing wrong with the ladies -- in fact, their hygeine and health was in all respects exemplary. Nevertheless, I would contract illnesses ranging from acute exudative pharyngitis of unknown etiology (i.e. they couldn't ID the bacteria) all the way through a weird asthmatic bronchitis. Nasty, nasty. I'd get sick as hell.

Once I figured out what was going on, I actually consulted with a provider who has extraordinary levels of practical knowledge about such things; and adopted a supplementation regimen of her recommendation plus a few other things I researched. Fingers crossed, I haven't been ill from seeing a provider since. (People who think providers are only good for sex are missing a BIG part of the story!)

HOWEVER, all of my visits but one since that time have been repeats where I may have gained immunities from earlier visits; so I cannot definitively state that the regimen does any good.