In the strip club business, there are men called "dancer hounds" who spend just about every waking moment and every available dollar (and often a few dollars they don't have) in pursuit of having a dancer girlfriend.   Then ... when they finally GET one .. they invariably try to get her out of the business .. they say it's mainly because the business is filled with an unsavory element (um ... but ... YOU'RE here???) but in reality it's because they don't want OTHER men to have the opportunity to take her away from THEM.   They think that as a housewife in middle suburbia ... she won't be so tempted.

Well listen up:  No girl is in the provider business because she HAS to be.   No girl wants desparately to get out ... but just CAN'T unless you help her.  Maybe she DOES have problems.  We ALL have problems.   But if she CAN'T get out it's because she doesn't WANT to get out.  She doesn't WANT to face a world where you have to work harder, for less money.  She doesn't want to have a job where she has to show up where and when THEY SAY for her to show up.   She doesn't want a world where she has to get along on other people's terms.

She has two arms and two gorgeous legs.  She can walk away from this business any time she wants .. by just not taking appointments .. and accepting the rules of work & life that everyone else lives with.

Maybe there's something about the life that she's addicted to.  Maybe the money and how much of it there is - maybe the flexible schedule and all the places she goes and the people she meets.   But whatever it IS .... if she's an addict ... then she's an addict.    As soon as you have the ability to 'cure' an alcoholic, or a drug addict ... then you can move on to a harder case.   In other words, SHE has to handle that problem herself.

If a provider has been in the business for three years she should have at least $45,000 in the bank (that's $300 a week, 50 weeks a year .. or ... perhaps one appointment per WEEK) saved for her retirement.   If she doesn't ... you MIGHT be able to teach her to handle money better, but you're not going to 'teach her' to think that "the future" is more than just "Day after tomorrow"

So ... if she has the money in the bank, she can walk away any time she wants to.   If she doesn't ... if she hasn't planed for her retirement .... then perhaps she thinks someone (like you?) will come along and BE her retirement.   Ask youself if that's what you had in mind.

Is this an indictment of all providers?  Of course not.  Most aren't like that.  A lot do it because they're smart enough to know that this is an easier way to make a better living than most other jobs they could get.  They live well, but wisely.  They have money for today, tomorrow AND for next year .. or at least they're on their way to having that.    But THESE girls are the ones that will tell you they LIKE the business and don't WANT to leave until the time is right - not the ones that tell you they need 'someone' to help them get out.

You want to take her out for dinner?  Sure.  Have a good time.  Just remember that she made more last year than you did and could afford to take YOU out to dinner.   In London if she wanted to.

ok, what are you saying? I'm not really sure right now? I going to read your post again and see if it's makes more sense to me.

recommending that clients don't try to "rescue" them.

Not a bad post.

There is currently a 'discussion' raging on the Boston board re: "falling in love" with a provider..and "offering her a better world" that could be placed seamlessly in this thread.  Problem is probably not a lot of people..at least hobbyists that is, would understand the subtlties and implications.

And here I thought that I was the one with the money to take HER out to dinner.  

On a more serious note, I hope many providers do read your post and plan for their long term future.  It is so easy to think that retirement is such a long time away, but if you get into the habit early, especially when you are making a lot of money, you won't even feel it.  And you will never regret it.

I just had two different emails via my web site telling me to be quiet and not blow their deals.

How many men on this board care whether their wife/SO/partner sleeps around with other men?  If so, why do you care?  (Other than the obvious health reasons.)

For the record, I wouldn't care if my wife did the dallas cowboys...as long as she wasn't always telling me "Sorry honey, not tonight.  I'm too tired from doing the dallas cowboys."

(Actually, she usually just "doesn't feel like it"...women like her keep providers in business, alas.)

It's a long post that covers alot of topic's. This is why I just wondering?

Providers save your money
Clients don't try to rescue your atf or dancers in a club

Just wondering what he trying to say?

even if you were a multimillionaire and you tried to rescue a provider, you would probably fail. Not because she would start escorting again but because she is so addicted to sex with different men that she will cheat on you. make no mistake about it.

You said:

No girl is in the provider business because she HAS to be.

I disagree. I know at least one lady who is DESPERATE for the cash and ABSOLUTELY would not be in the business except that she needs the cash. I have helped her with her business and have had lengthy talks with her. I believe her when she says she hates it.

But you'd never know she hates it from her service. She is one fantastic provider. Truly a wonderful actress. Truly.

How many others are there who feel the same way but, for whatever reason, simply are unwilling to admit they hate it. This would be a great survey -- I would lay you a wager that a good 20% hate it.

Ladies?

Make that three emails....

they are single mothers receiving no child or spousal support.  They could work other jobs, but the pay would be less and the hours much longer.

Whta if I hate my job too?  I'm here for the cash.  But I made the CHOICE to put up with it in favor of the cash.

There are receptionists and secrataries and business executives who don't like their jobs and are desparate for the cash.

They can leave any time they want.

Pig

From what I observed, 40% to 50% remained in this business for more than one year, the others only lasted for a few months.

For those who are in this business for more than a year, they have developed ways to block off the negative or have adjusted their attitudes so that it is much harder for them to get out.

But consider this.  Providers are but a tiny fraction of the overall female population.  The overwhelming majority of women somehow find a way to make it in this world doing something else for a living, no matter how desperate they are, and there are some very desperate women out there.

With the possible exception of immigrant slavery operations, or girls with violent pimps, they all had to make a choice to do this job.  For some it's really not a problem.  They like what they do.  Then there are others (probably the majority) who hate what they have to do for a living, BUT ...  the money and hours are good, along with some other perks too.  

My (former) ATF was like that.  Always saying how she hated to be providing, but damned if she'd quit and get a regular job.  She wasn't desperate by any means, but to maintain her lifestyle with her limited job skills would have been tough to do legally.  Living within the means of a regular job was not something she was prepared to do.

Guys, these "I was desperate" stories are told for your comsumption.  It makes you sympathetic and perhaps more inclined to be generous or otherwise helpful.  It's also because it's a taboo lifestyle that even some of those involved in feel guilty.  Same reason why some of us make up excuses why we see providers.  Have a heart, but don't be a sucker!

tuitions so they don't have to drop off and come home.  Some need the money so they could be a single mom; others use that to leave their abusive/cheating SOs.  Some use the money to pay for rent/mortgage while supporting their drug habits.

They could all choose not to be escorts and survive.  But survival is not their goals.  They wanted to either maintain the status quo or move ahead.

Really, how many situations can be described as truely desperate except those of live or death?

For every provider paying college tuition, supporting herself as a single mom, trying to leave a bad relationship or paying the rent while having a drug problem, there are probably hundreds if not thousands of other women doing the exact same thing by other means.

This is not to say that providing is a bad job or an evil occupation, because I don't think it is.  However, it does say that few women are forced to do it because they have no other options.  Those other options might include working long hours at low wages, buying things second-hand, never taking long trips and doing without a lot of the things most people enjoy, but guess what?  Those are the options women choose more often than life as a provider.

Some providers might truly hate their jobs and are damaged emotionally by the experience (the job does take a lot out of a woman), but few of them have guns pointed at their heads making them do it.  There are some very attractive (and addictive) aspects to providing that make it hard to quit, so some stay in it even though they really don't like what they're doing.  Nothing unique about that.  How many people work at jobs they hate because the money's too good to pass up?  Doesn't make them desperate.

If I misunderstood your post AS, please enlighten me.

PC

in this business.  Many others couldn't.  (Many intelligent women simply could not afford the living expenses and tuition cost to go to college and/or graduate school.)  Some women are willing to place themselves and their kids through welfare in order to escape abusing SOs, others wouldn't.  Some women have strong family supports to help them even if they failed, others didn't.  Some people have the strength or epiphany to quit doing drugs.  Others need a lot more help to initiate the first step.

Everyone has his/her idea of desperation.  Some people can follow a certain set path to reach their goals.  Others require detours to do so.

As far as I understand, your intimate experience with a lady occurred when she has already established herself.  I was close to one lady on her downward path and knew two other ladies very well when they just started the business, so my POV is different from yours.

I am not claiming that ladies continue to be in this business because they are desperate.  I am just saying that for some ladies in certain situations, desperation is the reason why they start doing this in the first place.

GC

My ex ATF loves to travel. She goes to places like Cannes and St. Tropez, lives on a guy's yacht for a week at a time.  She says some of her clients will drop $10k on her in 2-3 days.  Knowing her education and age, there is no way she could do the things she is able to do through any other profession.  She keeps telling me she wants to quit but I told her there was really no point until she either hooked up with one of those guys on a more permament basis or was ready to come back to a more normal life style.

With some not so gentle help from the group, I finally stopped seeing her because I couldn't compete with what she has become used to and wanted.  I have talked to her a couple of times since (she called me to apologize, I didn't call and grovel) but for now I am not going going to get dragged back into the "my other clients fly me first class" BS.  As someone said I am not her ATF client, thank God. I couldn't afford it.

Is she saving money for the future.  Well she bought a house in Florida and drives a Mercedes (I know because she called me onetime to help her with roadside service) so possibly.  My best case scenario for her though is she meet some guy on one of her yacht trips, hooks him and gets married because she has a long, long way to fall before she gets back to the rest of us.

I would agree that desperation can mean different things to different people.  However, it's hard for me to characterize as "desperate" not being able to find another way to make a lot of money quickly and still have a lot of free time, because that's basically what it comes down to.

I used my (former) ATF as an example, because I knew her almost from the beginning of her career, and of course she had a sob story about why she chose to start providing.  I never said it was a bad choice, just that it was A choice.  She already had a regular full-time job, but she gave it the old "heave ho" and took to providing with encouragement from one of her girlfriends.  Nobody made her do it.  As for myself, I went to school while working two jobs and supporting a family.  Yeah, it was tough, and it took longer, but it's what I chose to do.

For some women working a "day job" is harder than working as a provider.  For other women, working as a provider would be too much for them and they opt for the "day job" instead.  Each group of women have their own set of problems and some of those problems are big ones, on either side of the fence.  Each group of women chose what was for them the easier (lesser of two evils), or more acceptable, means of acquiring the income they needed.  That's why I have a hard time with the "I was desperate" defense.