Get the fuck over yourself!
She told me because she felt the reason was estrogen based infantile.
Did she break your wittle code?
Does anyone really care? Maybe Romeo!
You all need to remember that TER is simply the Junior league for hobbyists. There are OTHER forms and forums where-in one can find R & R activities. Blacklists do have their valid purposes but remember that WE are all emotionally fallible. Do we really concern ourselves with the ONE pissy guy or girl that we didn't click with? When I began to see my missus, we had already had history. After about 5 times together she informed me that 1 girl had placed me on a blacklist. And i'm NOT black!!!LOL She said that she contacted the girl to see what the problem was. The girls explanation was ticky-tacky at best. A personality quirk(what?, who me? LOL)
A good friend of mine here on this wonderful board(is that big enough praise LP?)continues to remind me that TER is NOT the TELL-ALL and KNOW-ALL that some like to believe it is.
So be damned with Black-Lists! Who gives two flaming farts?
RED FACE? Made you look didn't it?
I'm on a few sites. Not as active on them as I am here, but none the less.
Not on a blacklist, that I know of, but it wouldn't surprise me. Especially lately.
If some of the ladies want to turn me onto the fact, I'd be more than happy to hear and know why.
I got put on a national blacklist for doing a "no-show". I won't go into all the details here but I don't feel the least bit bad about it.
Fortunately, I didn't give her all my personal info and now I'm glad I didn't and will be much more wary of doing that in the future. She only had my P411 ID which can now be found with a google search. Not a big deal really but the thing is I can see she (not sure it's SHE, actually) could have done much more damage if she wanted to.
I just turned off my whitelist here on TER after reading this. Its just not worth being associated with anything, even something more subtle as this list stuff.
Man, most of the posts here regarding blacklists sound pathetic. A couple sound psycho enough just in writing to be put on a blacklist. You folks have scary attitudes, just remember perception has to be dealt with.
My first beef with the National Blacklist is that it OUTS hobbyists. That is, it puts their real name, work address, email, etc. right out there where any google search on the guy's name let's the whole world know he is a hobbyist.
My second beef is that too many providers, showing an extraordinary sense of disproportionate justice, out guys to the world on this list for things which are problematic to be sure, but unworthy of such an outing. About a third of all NBL listings are for NCNS. What is that missed appointment worth? $300? $600? And over a lousy 300-600, they think NOTHING of totally outing the guy so his kids get to grow up without a father or he gets canned from a six figure job. Total irresponsible bullshit.
My final beef is it is unaccountable. That is, providers who OUT a hobbyist nationally, especially when doing so for reasons other than violence, are in no way accountable for having done so. It's a way of being able to cost people their families, jobs and homes while being immune to reprisal. Used injudiciously, the lack of accountability can make it a form of terrorism.
With all due respect to providers, this is very different from trashing a lady in a review. The review is under your stage name. It is not the same thing as making your status as a provider show up under google searches for your *real name* so that future employers, potential boyfriends and future husbands won't touch you with a 10' pole or so that your ex-husband will use that as leverage to challenge child custody and turn your life into a living hell.
Furthermore, a review provides some context because most ladies have many reviews; so potential clients see both the bad AND the good. By comparison, the blacklists do not give that sort of context -- they list only the single NCNS (for example) and *never* show the dozens of on-time, cleaned-up, paid-in-full appointments.
Incidentally, to the best of my knowledge, I'm on no blacklists, so I don't have a personal ax to grind here.
I understand the need for personal safety for the ladies, but come on! You see 30 providers and do a NCNS cuz shit happened? Then get on the list?
And they wonder why business is slow.
Easy for you to say....your NCNS was with 2 hobby buddies. Am I wrong????
Damn, that was a week ago. Didn't think anyone remembered that! 
...your PM's, email....as wordy as you are...you'd be listed as a 'time waister'!
I feel really guilty for laughing so hard. Truly, I feel really, really guilty! 
Usually providers use diet, exercise and maybe a little liposuction to deal with their waist; not me. (*grin*)
And any provider who knows what she's doing knows how to make me speechless. LOL
I agree that outing real names and real info for a no show is very wrong and I'm always aware and careful with people's information. In my experience, most people who were not good did not give their real info, just hobbying info and references. I don't want to discuss my bad experiences here but I really felt at the time that other girls needed to be warned. You're right it's not like a review so it can't be taken too seriously unless there is a real issue; otherwise you have to read between the lines as I've seen clients in those sites that I really liked.
My second beef is that too many providers, showing an extraordinary sense of disproportionate justice, out guys to the world on this list for things which are problematic to be sure, but unworthy of such an outing. About a third of all NBL listings are for NCNS. What is that missed appointment worth? $300? $600? And over a lousy 300-600, they think NOTHING of totally outing the guy so his kids get to grow up without a father or he gets canned from a six figure job. Total irresponsible bullshit.
My final beef is it is unaccountable. That is, providers who OUT a hobbyist nationally, especially when doing so for reasons other than violence, are in no way accountable for having done so. It's a way of being able to cost people their families, jobs and homes while being immune to reprisal. Used injudiciously, the lack of accountability can make it a form of terrorism.
With all due respect to providers, this is very different from trashing a lady in a review. The review is under your stage name. It is not the same thing as making your status as a provider show up under google searches for your *real name* so that future employers, potential boyfriends and future husbands won't touch you with a 10' pole or so that your ex-husband will use that as leverage to challenge child custody and turn your life into a living hell.
Furthermore, a review provides some context because most ladies have many reviews; so potential clients see both the bad AND the good. By comparison, the blacklists do not give that sort of context -- they list only the single NCNS (for example) and *never* show the dozens of on-time, cleaned-up, paid-in-full appointments.
Incidentally, to the best of my knowledge, I'm on no blacklists, so I don't have a personal ax to grind here.
Unlike the hothead above with the trigger finger to blacklist guys. ( No I am not addressing you granny).
The problem I see is the rampant abuse of the NBL. I have seen guys real name outed for being late or a NCNS and one because he sent too many emails.
I have always been in favor of providers protecting themselves and keeping safe, but the mental midgets and man hating providers ruin it for everyone.
Who r u calling Granny? I don't get why the alias' though. We are all here behind fake identities anyways. Maybe I'm missing something.
That was directed to someone else on this thread.
I hope you didn't stop reading my reply after the word granny.
I spend too much money to look like her grand child No I read don't worry!
Not surprisingly, we agree on this.
But here is where the rubber hits the road, and why the misuse of these lists by anonymous providers in an unethical and disproportionate fashion is actually bad for *providers*.
Human beings remember negative stuff much more powerfully than positive stuff. As a result, it looms larger in our minds.
When a hobbyist becomes aware of the pervasive nature of such misbehavior on the part of providers, he becomes very concerned about certain aspects of verification -- specifically anything where he gives the provider any information that she could use to hurt him. But this is the VERY information she most desires, because her mere possession of that information could be used as a deterrent to misbehavior.
A cycle of mutual distrust ensues.
A cycle of distrust is bad for business. It makes a marginal difference in thousands of decisions every day where appointments aren't booked and money is never exchanged.
It is always preached in my job that the customer doesn't remember the good shit you did for them, but the bad shit sticks in their skillet.
You could've busted your ass, saved them thousands of dollars because you were 'looking out' for them, but you fuck up once, of yeah, that sticks.
It's fucking bullshit, but that's the way it is.
Personally, I no longer share information with other providers about inconveniences such as time wasting, soft bookings, last-minute cancellations, attitude problems/conflicts or other general annoyances.
I once shared my thoughts about a hobbyist on the Provider-Only board after what I perceived to be antagonistic communication ( I provided his name and email address as a *warning* to others. My intuition said he was a time bomb - and others did find him to be a problematic client in months following).
This entry made its way from TER's Provider Only Board to the National Blacklist. I had to work to have it removed- but too late, damage done!
I posted another entry about a client who frightened me because he brought a very large knife to an hour appointment to cut fruit; the odd behavior scared me so much that I let him remain for an additional hour.
This complaint immediately returned to the client.
Simply put: A this point I am now unwilling to endanger my livelihood or compromise the quality of a client's life over anything less than physical or mental abuse, thievery or refusal to pay.
In addition to the siphoning of entries from private provider networks there are the entries which are placed purely to disrupt lives over petty grievances.
I saw a client who visited Boston last summer despite an entry for him on the Blacklist because he was extremely forthcoming, thoughtful, kind and engaging in correspondence with me.
Upon meeting I found him to be the consummate gentleman: fun, energetic - really everything that a provider could hope for in a client.
I mentioned in passing that I made myself available to him despite the entry on the public Blacklist- and he was completely unaware of it. He immediately Google'ed his name and lo- there it was on the National Blacklist directly under professional and personal profiles. He suspected the entry was placed by a vindictive provider he'd dated.
The National Blacklist is completely abhorrent and I agree with your complaints entirely.
I may have lucked out thus far but I have not had to even consider putting anyone on a blacklist. I honestly don't feel like a NCNS is an adequate reason to blacklist someone. I just block their number and move on. This didn't put my life in danger and just because he NCNS with me does not mean that he will be like that with every provider. I had to do a NCNS once with a client and would hate if that would have negatively effected any potential clients that I would have in the future.
On the other hand I can understand having a blacklist for anyone that may have some STD or was violent towards a provider or was LE, as these are things that put providers at risk.
Civie or P4P... men are men & women are women HalfHour
Just curious if anyone knows why admin has this policy. On the surface, it just doesn't seem to serve any beneficial purpose, but maybe I'm overlooking something.
if people were to write reviews about appointments that didn't occur there would be no end to the story however NCNS goes both ways and it is just as bad if a lady does it.
I am not trying to be argumentative, and I fully support a provider's need to stay safe. But how does it out a provider in jeopardy when we don't know their real name or address? You ladies know so much about us, hell you even call our offices to verify identity (I live in DC and I ain't no bricklayer, so I cringe at this). We know very little at all about you, and if you wish to avoid a hobbyist it is much easier to do so than it would be for us to avoid being outed.
I agree in spirit with the NBL but there is not enough accountability and way too many crazy providers for me to not be scared shitless about it quite frankly. I've heard enough from a ex-girlfriend who was a retired provider to know you can not collectively be trusted to police yourselves.
Anything that is not violent or otherwise unsafe should NOT be grounds for possibly ruining someone's life.
Why the alias? A brick layer's life is less important than yours and he can afford to be outed? If you were that high up in the government you would be here chatting us up for our entertainment and you wouldn't be dating ex providers as you wouldn't be able to afford it.
-- Modified on 12/18/2010 8:49:21 PM
When did I say that your life is any less important than mine? I simply asked how it puts a lady in danger if she can't blacklist a guy for a simple NCNS or by him finding out.
And why do you care of I post under an alias? Would you otherwise blacklist me just for asking a question? I'm not against you ladies having a way to keep yourselves safe. I want all of you ladies to be safe and avoid creeps. But if you expect me to close my eyes and pretend it is not abused by some you're crazy.
Basically anytime I give a provider my information I am trusting she's not going to flake out and disclose that information because I gave her a subpar review or didn't tip or got pulled into an emergency meeting or got in a car accident (I have never, ever given a woman a legitimate reason to blacklist me, I am a very non-violent and caring man, nor have I ever been blacklisted AFAIK).
It only takes one time for an unbalanced provider to have a bad day, or perhaps even a bad trip, and now my info is potentially available on Google.
Yeah, pardon me for giving a shit about that.
If you have good references I'm not quit sure why you have to keep giving your office info to every new provider you meet. The black list sites I know you need to be screened as a provider to be able to see what's in there I don't remember any sites where info is available without being screened but it wouldn't surprise me and yes I find that wrong.
I'm in the same boat, I never know what a client can do or if he can flake out on me during a session, after a session while chatting on boards or in back channel, mailing list etc... He can turn around and have his friend Charlie to book me for a session and get even with me. It's that simple and in the States LE could care less about an escort and because it's sooooo illegal I couldn't even call the police to press charges. In a less dangerous scenario my name could easily be wrongly trashed and that would be tragic for me. I can't change my fake identity that easily, my business is just as important to me as your office job is to you, plain and simple.
Thanks for explaining; that all certainly makes sense and I certainly encourage you to do whatever is necessary to stay safe. I find it hard to imagine how anyone would ever be capable of harming another (let alone having the desire) but I guess it is a fact of life.
Several of my regular ladies have retired during the recent DC implosion, don't know the other referenced provider, or explicitly do not provide references outside of date-check or P411, so I have had to do employment screening the last couple of times. There is a lot of paranoia going on around here right now.
PS: I just PM's you so you'll know I am not a board troll hiding behind an alias.
What is it with you and your constant assumption that I value others as less than me? I am no better than a brick layer, but my job is certainly much more in jeopardy if I am outed. There is a lot more than congress and politicians around here. Some people here have jobs where a misdemeanor DUI can result in them being blacklisted from an entire industry.
You ask me why I am using an alias... well why are you modifying entire posts?
You brought up the brick layer honey... People have big balls behind alias'.
I was off the board for the day and look at these threads as long as my arm! I can't even read the whole thing! I need to sleep so I can go see my hoped-for new ATF tomorrow night. But, jeez, I had no idea providers paid taxes! Really, that's news to me. Why do you need to do that? I mean, I know you don't want to get arrested but how would you get caught? What do you list as your profession. Mine used to say "Public Relations," which reminded me of the old joke that went: "I'm in public relations, but please don't tell my mom 'cause she still thinks I"m playing piano in a whorehouse!" So I figure it would be a big step up for me to list my profession as "Provider" next time on my 1040.
they're not too interested in knowing what you do for a living (or who you do). All they check is what you spent on paper versus the amount you declared as your income. As long as it balances you're good. Reality is we don't get paid via our bank accounts unless we accept deposits and even then you can get away with it so not so sure why the argument of paying taxes on ALL our income was brought up as it makes no sense at all. I don't think I'm bringing up a new concept here about not claiming all income on a cash biz. However, I live in a country where it's legal, where I can call the cops if I catch a beating while at work and where taxes would be 40% to 55% if I would declare ALL my income so it may be a very different story for me.
Why pay taxes?
Because god-forbid a girl gets caught and a slap-on-the-wrist misdemeanor becomes years of jail time for tax evasion.
Because (arguably) it'a the civic-minded, right thing to do.
Because if there's ever a chance that you might need Social Security (assuming its still around) for disability or old-age pensioning, its better to have paid into it than not.
Because if you plan to ever buy a decent car (over 10k), house, investment property, send a kid to college, start a legit business, etc you need a healthy bank account balance, records of your taxes paid appropriate to the level of loan you seek and some sort of "job" (even self-employed) and for your debt-to-income ratio being appropriate to make you a good loan candidate.
Because its smart to keep your resume updated and competitive (running a company always looks good) and it's smart to be able to get credit for all the marketing, administrative, executive experience that being self-employed affords - provable by tax records. (Anyone can claim anything on a resume but tax records are especially important for the self-employed)
Because everyone must retire one day and investing for that purpose requires traceable income.
How could a girl get caught on tax evasion?
Anytime something prompts the IRS to audit her or look into her standard of living v reported income. Could be dozens of different things that trigger this.... only one of which is a nutty client.
Listed profession.... anything you please! "Escort", "model", "entertainer" are all relatively accurate, legal and appropriate.
You are spot on in your reply as far as "why pay taxes", but I doubt that the majority of ladies report this income, let alone think long-term as to how to utilize the information to an advantage for all of the reasons you have correctly listed. For those ladies (like yourself) who do understand that this is an important part of running this "business", I truly applaud you. Where I find the others lacking in their objectivity is so short term as to see that they will be forced into making bad decisions for perhaps the rest of their lives. And I see similarities amongst many small business owners who simply fail to understand long-range planning. All you need to look at are the current crop of "retirees" who are living in sub-standard lifestyles since their earnings power is gone and the "nest egg" was no where near enough to maintain their standard of living while they were earning (in many cases) a nice living.