The economy under Trump is doing well. Everyone in America has job opportunities. Job growth is alive and the economy is booming. Everyone wants to do business and work. If we get tax reform it will be even better since the HWMC Americans like lower taxes.  

I would like to see a new healthcare bill put forth and passed by the republican party. Obamacare is unsustainable is an initial FAILED ATTEMPTED at SOCIALISM by BARACK OBAMA and the DEMOCRATIC PARTY in 2010. Eventually, it will be replaced. I'm not surprised that republicans gained the house, senate, judiciary and TRUMP since 2010.

Do you think the government and government workers can solve our problems? I don't.

Government is necessary to a certain limited degree. I'm actually socially liberal but fiscally conservative. Y'all should be wary of your pro government proposals such as medicare for all, democratic government proposals and more government regulations on businesses and individuals alike that require SUCKING THE LIFE OUT OF ORDINARY American folks.  

The federal budget is ridiculous. There NEEDS to be painful cuts in all government programs except our military where our friends, family, fellow Americans, sons and daughters serve.

It's no comparison and Trump is already a total failure.

...From Crappy Changes the next time you feel like pissing on government employees Crappy try sending your letters thru UPS or Federal Express instead of the government run United States Postal Service. See what private industry charges you.

Spoken like a true scared conservative...falling for the typical BS that republicans spew. Instead of 600B, why not 500B?
There need to be cuts EVERYWHERE...got that? Everywhere.

It's an Entitlement, but it's NOT Socialism. The means of production and ownership are still in the private sector.

If the Republicans keep fucking around with this monthly repeal shit, all you are doing is giving Bernie Sanders, A SOCIALIST, the audience and momentum to implement his vision for health care, which would be a SOCIALIST takeover of healthcare.

There are some interesting ideas out there on how both sides can win, but unfortunately those days of compromise are long gone.

-- Modified on 9/22/2017 5:52:49 AM

...And that is the cause of most of the problems with our healthcare system, the insurance industry, hospital corporations, & big pharma are sucking away so much of the funding that the cost of healthcare has become un-affordable. Fortunately a system is already in place that currently covers more than 20% of Americans, but then again maybe we would rather give our money away to those business profiteers than to use it for more affordable healthcare. Medicare has made it possible for those over 65 to afford healthcare, try removing Medicare & no politician that voted that way would ever be re elected.

and then after the Government takes over healthcare which is about 17% of the total economy, they could move on to nationalizing the oil business next, and then since they would undoubtedly do such a good job at that, maybe they could move onto Telecommunications next, and maybe farming after that until we finally have the "workers paradise" that all you lefties secretly (or not so secretly) envision for this country.

 
I don't know how many of you have been around long enough to remember "Charlie the Commie" at least he was honest about his communist/socialist beliefs.

END OF MESSAGE

I love it! It typically comes up when discussing government intervention or controls; particularly gun control. What's truly revealing is, the same people bringing it up, during these discussions, do not bring it up in relationship to Trump's tendencies toward kleptocracy and authoritarianism!

...News flash for GaG Medicare is here & working well & that has nothing whatever to do with the other industries in your imaginative rant, the fact is the health of Americans should not be just an opportunity for the enrichment of profiteers

http://www.politifact.com/florida/statements/2010/dec/09/rick-scott/rick-scott-claims-his-company-caused-national-heal/

How people can be so stupid, to elect this crook and liar, I cannot fathom!

I suppose you think that Great Britain, France, Japan, Italy etc etc etc are now communist states because of their healthcare systems?  OK.  There may be a problem there.

Or do you think it's ok to use when it suits you, but not okay to be used against you?

 
Or do you plan on denying that the right is fighting a war of attrition where it comes to the abortion issue and is trying to whittle away at abortion rights with the ultimate goal of making abortion illegal altogether?

And, how do you interject me into a discussion I've not had, here, let alone used the 'slippery slope defense' in?

...any time he wants.  Oh, he may not need it now, but if he ever has a string of dry wells, he may have to go to the VA if he has to be treated for "dry sack" not caused by too much fucking.  "Pfffft!"

 

Disparate pundits such as Paul Krugman and Lawrence Kudlow have described the VA as "Socialism."

 

http://www.newsmax.com/Finance/LarryKudlow/Veterans-Affairs-healthcare-scandal-Obama/2014/05/23/id/573150/
http://www.nytimes.com/2011/11/14/opinion/krugman-vouchers-for-veterans-and-other-bad-ideas.html?mcubz=1

I was surprisedly pleased with how well I was treated! I guess socialism ain't that bad after all!

Nor do I ever expect to, but I certainly don't look down on those that do.

 
It is ironic though that less than an hour ago I was in a liquor store buying tequila (shocker right? lol) and the girl behind the counter asked me if I were military. At first I said no, as I certainly don't consider myself "military" after having only served a couple of years almost 40 years ago, but I did say that "technically" I was ex military as I was in the Army once upon a time, well that was good enough for her and she knocked off five percent off my total HooAh!!! I took it. lol

 
I don't know if the VA is truly "socialism" but it is certainly run that way and I don't want any part of it if I have a choice in the matter.

please get a copy of your DD214 and find out what you qualify for; vehicle tags, if they will pay a percentage of your health, etc.  Why not do this?  I don't know what state you are in Augusta does any amazing job.  My 91 year old grandfather uses them and look how long they have kept him alive!

I don't agree. I doubt that low taxes really produce jobs. How many pairs of pants can a billionaire buy? If you want someone to spend money and really stimulate the economy give the low taxes to the middle class. Trump and his cronies only want to give it to the big money guys.

You are operating under some very common misconceptions.

First the economy is doing well because Trump hasn't done anything to radically change policies that were put in place during the prior administration.  I'm not saying all those policies were Obama's policies because that would not be true.  But to say Trump has some responsibility for it is equally untrue.

Second, the people that voted for Trump wanted desperately for government to make things better for them.  That was the whole idea behind "Drain the swamp".  Get of the people that don't do things for us and replace them with people that will.  Forget the fact that a lot of those things were simply non-starters for the GOP platform in general and Trump in particular.  The modern GOP economic policy has always been trickle down economics which time and time again has been proven not to work.  There is just too much greed involved in it.

Healthcare for all is not socialism.  Calling an entitlement is probably correct, but what really needs to be understood is that its not a bad thing.  One need not look any further than the Preamble to our constitution:

"We the People of the United States, in Order to form a more perfect Union, establish Justice, insure domestic Tranquility, provide for the common defence, promote the general Welfare, and secure the Blessings of Liberty to ourselves and our Posterity, do ordain and establish this Constitution for the United States of America."

Health care for all is a cornerstone of our American ideal.  The sooner the clowns running the GOP understand this, the better it will be for all of us.  Sure it would be nice if corporate health would play along, but in the presence of such greed as we continually see, our government is compelled by our constitution to act.

What the hell does that mean? What is the main tenet of Socialism that makes it 180 degrees different than Capitalism? They are opposing schools of economic thought. The means of production are owned by public enterprises, aka government or worker cooperatives. This is the model that Bernie Sanders eventually wants for health care. Look at his plan. He is driving the Progressive Left, basically the Democratic Party, on the direction of health care. This is the issue GaG was referring to. He doesn't want to transfer another 17% of the economy to the government, and neither do I.

When somebody says Medicare for All, Universal Health Care, whatever, you need to be specific on the exact model want, because there are significant differences. The current Medicare system is not Socialism as the means of production, delivery and ownership is in the hands of the private sector. Medicare is just a large insurance agency that reimburses providers (doctors, hospitals, labs, etc). Is that the model that you want ALL Americans to have?  

As I read the various posts on this board, there is NO negotiation on either side for addressing health care. This board is just a microcosm of what is going on in the country.  Then why would you expect any movement on this issue? Tell me exactly what you want, as well as what you are willing to negotiate and compromise on?  Just repeating over and over Medicare for All won't get the other side, or even the Independents to the table.

-- Modified on 9/23/2017 8:17:52 AM

...Just for St. Croix  I will repeat what I have stated many times in these discussions the Medicare system that I believe would serve American healthcare best would be on a sliding economic scale, people with greater earnings would get a smaller % of Medicare coverage & could purchase supplemental insurance policies to cover what Medicare doesn't. The reason I like the Medicare idea is it can control the charges of medical & drug providers.

You willing to horse trade?  

As I understand, you are OK with the current Medicare model. The only change you want is the coverage and taxation for the top X%.  

Normally in a negotiation, you don't reveal your hand at the beginning of negotiations. Fuck that cause I don't have the time. Here we go.................

1. Let's be honest, Obamacare has some nice features that I would keep, i.e. can't deny, can't cancel, up 26 on parents plan. Obamacare is only addressing a small portion of the market. It was touted as some kind of transformational legislation. It wasn't, plus the implementation was real shitty. Terminate Obamacare, and transition them to Medicare, using your tax model, and we can provide subsidies so we can keep it at expense neutral for the customers.

2. Keep the private market, specifically for corporation. They need to continue to provide healthcare insurance as today. This is about 160M of the population. Individuals not on a corporate plan can at their option opt into a private plan or Medicare.

3. Before I agree, I would need to see a detailed plan and timeframe for identifying and significantly reducing fraud, abuse and waste. Medicare has said, "we don't even know the level of waste and fraud in the system". Experts put the numbers at $60B to $100B just for Medicare. Medicare is a "pay and chase" system. That is one of their main problems.

4. Scope creep - This is another issue GaG has, and I totally agree. Entitlements don't die, they get expanded year after year. Once they are ingrained into society, you can never change or cancel. I don't want the Progressive to come back in 5 or 10 years wanting more. We have to agree to an extended period where no significant expansion occurs.

OK, I lied, I have a few other, but they are relatively minor (lol). But the main takeaway for you is my willingness to open Medicare to an extended audience other than seniors and disabled.  

-- Modified on 9/23/2017 2:13:54 PM

-- Modified on 9/23/2017 2:22:52 PM

yes.  and immediately put everyone with a chronic condition, degenerative, poor prognosis on Medicare.  While they figure all this out.  

No thank's St.Croix all of the things I have stated are suggestions of a healthcare system I believe would benefit the citizens of this country.  Corporate & private insurance plans other than plans that supplement Medicare wont work because everyone would already have Medicare. As far as the Medicare fraud & abuse I do not have the experience to answer that other than to say change what ever rules allow that & strictly enforce them. Scope creep, since I have never personally implemented a government service all I can say is that is up to our elected representatives to control. In reality neither you or I have the accurate information to negotiate these details & what this really is just a suggestion to a fuck board that only 6 mongers might read & to use a Gumpism that's all I have to say about that.