No way do I see a Hate Crime. Juvenile ignorance for sure. Its a shame that someone would stoop so low. A woman involved in this sort of bullying is the big shocker to me.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/39445225/ns/us_news-crime_and_courts/?GT1=43001

-- Modified on 9/30/2010 8:52:13 PM

Of course it was invasion of privacy. Thats a given, even if the film hadn't gone on the internet.
The kid was 18. Maybe he hadn't told his parents he is gay? Maybe he was a closet gay?
Maybe he was shy or ashamed of his body?
Putting it on the interent was definitely.
bullying IMO. Mocking and humiliating someone, by filming their private moments,on the  Web is bullying, even if he was gay and proud.

You take pride in things you've accomplished, choices you've made etc. Being gay or bisexual is simply what we ARE, its WHO we are. None of us woke up one morning and thought to ourselves "Hey, I think I'll choose to live a life filled with intolerance and hatred!"

Pretty fucking low blow dude.

Interesting case. I see the media is already hard at work shaping their desired outcome of the case.

Yes, the kids are guilty of invasion of privacy. There may perhaps be other charges related to disseminating pornography that would be appropriate. But that is all they are guilty of. Nothing more.

Hate crimes legislation is asinine period. ALL crimes are based on hatred. No one ever comitted a crime against someone because they loved them. Even crimes of passion stem from hatred, not love. Its asinine to think one crime is deserving of more punishment than another simply because of what is going on in someone's head when they commit the crime. Is the victim of a drive by shooting somehow less dead than the victim of a hate crime? Are the families less grieved? No, and no. Why then should one defendent face much stiffer sentencing?

Judges already have the means to apply waht they deem to be an appropriate sentence for a particualr crime. That is why we have minimum and maximum sentencing guidelines. The judge has the discretion to consider all of the circumstances, including racist/sexist/other-ist motivations in determining sentencing. Why do we need more? Can we not trust judges to be fair and impartial, to consider all the facts of a case before handing down judgement?

Hate crime legislation has always amounted to little more than a sop to liberal groups who want everyone to be protected from the bad old mean world out there. Trust me, I've seen enough hatred directed at the gay community to know it is very real, but that doesn't entitle one victim's experience to be treated as any worse than any other victim. Assault is still assault, rape is still rape, and murder is still murder, regardless of who perpetrated it, or why.

I feel so badly for this young man who obviously had not come to terms with his own sexual orientation. Some of us come to terms with it easily, others not so easily. But the kids involved certainly did not in any way encourage or cause his death. Those kids are the scum of the earth in my opinion, but not to the level of deserving jail time. They will have to live with what they did for the rest of their lives. With any luck, that alone will be more punishment than anything the justice system can mete out.

one thing is for certain : it was a vile & reprehensible act.

-- Modified on 10/1/2010 3:43:32 AM

It may surprise some of the people here, but I sorta fall into the conservative category on this one. I don't see the point of hate crimes laws. A crime is a crime, and that should be the end of it.

I can see the point of making intimidation a seperate crime (think Klan members intimidating black families by burning crosses), and I can see using it to make a harsher punishment if someone is found guilty to some extent, but there's something a bit obsurd to me about our gov't trying to make our people more decent. Pot calling the kettle black and all that.

I'm sure bullying goes too far in many cases. And maybe growing up today is a little different than it was when I did it back in the 80's. But I seem to recall bullying as a natural part of growing up. The counciling I got from my parents was "hit them back" and that's exactly what I did. Eventually you got good at this, or you wouldn't be left alone. In retrospect, this was probably a positive life experience.

willy"The counciling I got from my parents was "hit them back" and that's exactly what I did. Eventually you got good at this, or you wouldn't be left alone. In retrospect, this was probably a positive life experience."

Sounds like that worked for you. It worked for me as well.
The big problem, some children, and adults, are too meek to fight back.Everyone isn't wired the same way. When the bully loses with one target, he will quickly find another.
Bullie's usually have a problem coping with their own issues, desperately trying  to knock others down, to make themselves look better.They feel the need to eliminate the competition. It looks like Tyler was the competition. I'm betting his dorm mates didn't have what it takes, to excel on their own. Quite Disgusting!


http://www.nj.com/news/index.ssf/2010/10/rutgers_student_tyler_clementi_1.html

http://www.foxnews.com/us/2010/09/29/nj-student-secretly-taped-having-sex-kills/


-- Modified on 10/1/2010 10:31:01 AM

All crimes are based on hate? No. A child steals a toy from the five and dime isn't stealing out of hatred for the store owner. A hungry person who steals food isn't doing so out of hatred, but need. In this case, they were certainly trying to embarass him about his homosexuality and I doubt they wouldve done this to a straight person. I'm shocked that a woman was involved in this, but then again knowing how catty women can be...

I wonder about this quad. I realize that some kids aren't wired that way. I wasn't particularly wired to it myself, but I was forced to adapt. I wonder if we're over protecting our kids and not allowing them to adapt.

Hey kid whats new I

-- Modified on 10/1/2010 6:28:53 PM

What a horrible story that was...9 punks put Phoebe thru hell before she killed herself back in Jan...I hope they throw the book, along with just about anything else that can be thrown, at those 9 SOB's...

May Phoebe Prince rest in peace..

-- Modified on 10/2/2010 11:27:54 AM