It quickly descended into a yelling match led by JD Vance. It had all the appearance of a planned baiting of Zelensky to blow up any chance of a deal. If so, it worked. A perfect ending if what Trump wanted was a reason to pull the rug out from under Ukraine and create a reason to support Putin's thuggery.
Regardless, it's a disaster for Ukraine and a triumph for Putin. Also bad for Europe, which we can hope will now step up. Not to mention a very bad day for the US, which will now be known as a betrayer of its allies and an unreliable partner.
Another question is, does this prove Putin has something on Trump, as many have long suspected?

Don't you know this is just a negotiating tactic? Yeah, all you need to do is humiliate a man who loses hundreds of thousands of soldiers, innocent civilians and 20% of his country. Cant you see this is all working out perfectly? Dont you know that Ukraine CAUSED this war? How are you so out of touch with Trump's mastery??????????

He just blamed Zelensky for ALL OF IT! I swear, watching the Trump Administration and his sycophants is like reading The Onion. Except that it's all true!

Their tiny brains don't process sarcasm.
As for the rest of it, I was just listening to Kurt Volcker, former US Ambassador to NATO and special representative to Ukraine who became involved in the Trump/Giuliani effort against Biden that resulted in Trump's first impeachment. There is conflicting testimony about him but I find him fairly credible. He's certainly no Jesse Watters.
He says he thinks Zelensky really blew it by pushing too hard to the point of being disrespectful and derailing the minerals deal. No one really knows how to get this back on track.
Zelensky tried to clean up the mess with a post about how grateful he was for US assistance but it doesn't sound like it will be enough.
Putin and his cronies are splooging themselves with joy.
What a mess.

There's no mystery why sleazebag hates Ukraine.
1) It hates Ukraine because Ukraine refused to manufacture evidence of wrongdoing against Biden's son.
2) It hates Ukraine because it is a bully and a coward. It insults its opponents, lies, cheats, all the behavior of a coward that doesn't dare play fair. It blames everyone or anyone else for its mistakes. Bullies and cowards always side with the strong over the weak, the aggressors over the victims.
3) It admires and envies Putin as the dictatorial leader it wants to be.
4) Most of all, as an incompetent, stupid, and insecure cretin, it hates Ukraine because it is on record saying shortly after the invasion that Russia would win quickly and cheaply. It is terrified for how this could out it as the ignorant imbecile that it is.

and posting more toxic, stupid, deluded, ignorant shit than Wanker?
Most sentient beings would say that's impossible.
And yet.....

A N D yet... You do all the time ickus

Today was ugly as a Train wreck but I can't help but wonder? Why did Zelinsky Ask "What kind of diplomacy? Are you talking about? Vance's reaction was at first measured and then a bit over the top with his "you're being disrespectful"  but the whole thing went off the rails after that.  

Zelensky is stuck between a rock and a hard place here. Hell, they all are. Putin is a FUCKING EVIL BOND villain in real life. He is N O T going to be bullied or threatened. His perception is that we the US were coming for him through the proxy of Ukraine after we deposed his guy and put Zelinsky in. Which, we were really but that was in response to Putin taking Crimea. If we were going to do anything, it was 2014 for damn sure but we sat on our hands and handed the Ukrainians HUM Rats and Blankets.  

Anyway.

A. How do we stop the war?
B. How do we get Russia out of the areas they have captured?
C. How do we get war reparations out of Russia for the death and destruction they have precipitated?

P.S. After you lefties come down off your Meth and rabies TDS high that you're riding right now, answer those questions.

The best way to stop the war is to resume robust American military aid. That, of course, won't happen. The spigot was shut off weeks ago. So the only hope is that the Europeans will step up. It's in their own best interest and I believe they'll do it. But it won't be as effective as if American aid continued. This may still work because Russia has been so weakened.
In fact, Russia's weakness in manpower and workers for its industrial base will be the main constraint on Putin's ability to project power in the future.
The answer to B. is more problematic. It will only happen if Ukraine wins the war so decisively that Putin is forced from power. That is unlikely. So some territorial concessions may have to be made, as unpalatable as that is.
War reparations are easier because estimates are that there are $300 billion of Russian funds frozen in Western banks that can, and should, be tapped. So far the West has taken some of the accumulated interest but not the funds themselves.
There! Wasn't that fun for you??? I actually answered your questions. You must be thrilled. But it's simply a pat on your tiny head for having asked reasonable questions.
For once.

Ukraine didn't lose the war. In fact, with our help and Europe's they have basically taken apart the Russian Army, which won't be in a position to threaten us or any European nations for many years.
But in Wanker's bizarro "reality" black is white and the truth is a lie.
Wanker is a Russian Stooge.

Zelensky is asking for $250 Billion of RUSSIAN FROZEN ASSETS held by the EU. He not asking for the European countries' money. He's asking the European to release the Russian funds they froze to help pay for fighting the war RUSSIA STARTED.
So the question is, did Wanker know this and fail to reveal it?
Cuz that's what a Russian stooge would do.
]

Icky wants more death… death Death and  again more DEATH with two side orders of death!

Face it icky Ukraine can’t kill enough Russians to make them stop. The Russians on the other hand can kill enough Ukrainians to then take over the country and then we will have a hostile Russia on Poland's door step.  

PS if all the money and weapons we were pouring into Ukraine was making it to the battlefield that would be one thing but it’s not happening.

And your own words betray you. You say "Putin is a FUCKING EVIL BOND villain" but you offer ZERO to stop him except by giving up.
Also, the FACT is Ukraine IS killing tons of Russians. More than 850,000 killined and wounded today. Thousands of Russian tanks, etc. destroyed. Ten percent of Russian oil refining capacity wrecked. If properly supported they will take apart the rest of the Russian army, which is now relying on DONKEYS to move supplies.
Looooser is a defeatist....Looooooser.

Ickypus is going to say he did not open the link. And we know he is lying when he says that. Then he will call me a liar….which is total projection …..which is the only thing he can do correctly …well most of the time I will then let him have his coveted last word so as to not go around and around in a circle saving him from total humiliation.

Wow the shoe chicken don’t share! I mean you know he’s supposedly sitting on some rare Rolex and it’s doing nothing but nothing sitting there and I have tried repeatedly to get him to sell it and donate the funds to a worthy cause and he refuses. I mean I even tried to get him to start a go fund me for he’s third favorite koolaide miller Joy Reid who just got fired (thank god… wait was that my outside voice?) anyway yeah ole dirty bastard is stingy!

First, Wanker typically dodges how I busted him for putting up a half truth. He should be happy. Usually I bust him for posting no truth at all.
Then there's SwallowMeat, with his usual hackneyed word-turds. He even trotted out one of his old ploys that I love to tease him about. Guess what it is?
And now Looooser surfaces like an East River Whitefish (a/k/a a used condom) with more of his old, tired and stupid so-called smack.
What a trio of losers....
Do better. Oh, right. You can't.

Geeeee whee did ya steal that from I wonder?

850,000 huh? gotta link to that? oh wait I'll save ya the trouble.

http://kyivindependent.com/a-very-bloody-war-what-is-the-death-toll-of-russias-war-in-ukraine/

So this is what the Ukrainians are saying. ok good for them they have to put out the propaganda.  

NOW... a quick Google search brings up the following.  

First from Mediazona  

Which btw (from their website) is a Russian independent media outlet focused on Anti-Putinist opposition that was founded by Maria Alyokhina and Nadezhda Tolokonnikova, who are also co-founders of the protest group and band Pussy Riot. They have ZERO reason to downplay the number of Russian dead as they HATE Putin.  

http://en.zona.media/article/2025/02/24/losses

They are saying 165,000 Russian Soldiers that they have verified through various sources that have checked by name and court records.  

Now here is a NPR (as far left as you can get and this is back in 2023) interview of Mika Golubovsky, the English language editor for Mediazona. BY MARY LOUISE KELLY far lefty. Anyway, These cats put the number of Russian dead at 165,000.  
http://www.npr.org/2023/07/14/1187847548/how-many-russians-have-died-in-ukraine-new-data-estimates-soldier-casualties

Now let's take a look at stats for the disparity in the numbers, shall we?

http://www.statista.com/statistics/1296573/russia-ukraine-military-comparison/

Personnel - -                              Russia          Ukraine
Estimated available manpower 69,002,197 18,187,531
Active soldiers                          1,320,000     900,000
Reserve forces                          2,000,000  1,200,000
Paramilitary units                     250,000     100,000
Air force - -
Total aircraft                                         4,292           324
Total helicopters                                 1,651           136
Fighters                                                    833             70
Dedicated attack                                    689             36
Attack helicopters                            557             39
Trainers                                                    611             73
Transport aircraft                                     456             24
Special-mission aircraft                    141               3
Aerial tankers                                      19               0
Land power - -
Armored vehicles                            131,527      18,920
Tank strength                                5,750        1,114
Towed artillery                                8,505           615
Self-propelled artillery                5,168           658
Mobile rocket projectors                3,005           279
Naval force - -
Total military ships                          419             89
Patrol vessels                                  123             33
Corvettes                                            83               0
Submarines                                            63                       0
Mine Warfare                                    47               3
Frigates                                                    12                     0
Destroyers                                            10                      0
Aircraft carriers                                      1               0

It kinda looks like the Russians outmatched the Ukranians and this is sad for me to see.  

As for your perception, are they on their last legs because they are using donkeys to pack ammo? We do it too believe it or not.  

http://sof.news/special-forces/pack-animals/

Here's the field manual on how to do it.  

http://publicintelligence.net/fm-31-27-pack-animals-in-support-of-special-operations-forces/

Donkeys can carry a fuckload of weight over extremely steep difficult terrain.  Since you have never carried ammo over any distance ever you wouldn't know what it is like to pack a couple of thousand rounds anywhere now would ya dodger of the draft?

And you say I'm a defeatist? Go fuck yourself ODB. What I am is a realist. The reality is we have created a much stronger Russian army and a much larger Russian military-industrial complex and if we don't stop the war NOW we are going to wind up with Russia ON the doorstep of POLAND!!!

-- Modified on 3/3/2025 12:28:55 AM

Of course there are LOADS of differing assessments of casualties but virtually everyone believes Russia's far outstrip those of Ukraine.
There are pages and pages of assessments in the link below.
And only a hyper-partisan FOOL would think Russian donkeys aren't relevant. If donkeys are so great why didn't Russia use them from the get-go? Your attempt to rebut this simply proves you'll do ANYTHING to avoid criticism of Trump and Putin.
So, yes, you are a defeatist who is divorced from reality.
What a fucking Looooooooooooser. And a complete fraud.

wants to feel like Trump is on "his side," but if Trump acts that way, a deal will never be made.  Mediators, by definition, are neutral and do not express a preference for either side.  Trump has been in mediation on disputes himself and knows this.  Those of us that are routinely involved in mediation have seen by this example that Zelensky is an idiot and doesn't understand how you mediate to an agreement.   Now, Zelensky will have to concede even more because he didn't allow Trump to play the neutral in order to get a fair deal for Ukraine.

The meth/rabies infused left will only scream that Trump is in Putin’s camp. 🤷🏻‍♂️ They do that you know!

He thinks Trump is "neutral." So I guess he thought Neville Chamberlain succeeded at Munich. LOL.

This is no surprise.
Geeeeee.....

It is the truest of Blue Goooo to believe that Russia is on it's last legs and about to lose. iIf you're basing your assessment on them using Donkeys, you really are delusional. Ukraine has fought beyond valiantly. In fact, toooo much so. The "don't give an inch theory has destroyed three generations of their officer and NCO corps to the point that there aren't that many seasoned officers left.  

Anyway, from the linked article

"History knows of no example where taking on Russia in an attritional contest has proved successful. Let’s be clear: this means there is a real possibility of defeat – there is no sugar-coating this."

"However, there are limits to the losses Ukraine can take. We do not know where that limit lies, but we’ll know when it happens. Crucially, there will be no victory for Ukraine. Unforgivably, there is not, and never has been, a western strategy except to bleed Russia as long as possible."

P.S. Pointing out this fact does not support Putin or Russia in any way. Putin is evil and he's been throwing away huge numbers of Russians in this misadventure and killing a fuck ton of Ukrainian civilians as well as all the military deaths.  

This war has been an even bigger disaster for Russia than for Ukraine. Russia never recovered from its massive losses in WWII and the Ukraine War has only made it worse. Russia already suffered from a labor shortage and low birth rate when the war began. Its massive casualties due to the "meat wave" approach to offense has made it far worse. Beyond that, a couple of million of their smartest, best-educated people have fled the country rather than serve. The Russian Army has stooped to relying on Africans, Indians and North Koreans. They have failed to make much progress because Ukraine has gone on the defensive and is inflicting massive casualties on them.
As for the donkeys, are you really too stupid to comprehend the Russians are using them because they have lost so many APCs and trucks to transport troops and supplies? Donkeys are not a means of choice but of necessity. The Russians have even been running out of confiscated civilian vehicles to use.
And it's not just donkeys, Loooooooser. See????????

You’re a moron for many reasons but today it’s really shining, your NPD preventing you from reading the article is obvious.  

As for Russia never recovering from WW II  

http://www.reddit.com/r/dataisbeautiful/s/biVXA4IMfC

Looks like they did ok to me…

As for the donkeys keep believing it’s an indication they are completely on the ropes. They are not. I wish they were.

Here’s the reality of the situation  

http://youtu.be/7sc4FiMmT-I?si=UeIeXd415pKEwLZ_

Listen the this, it’s even from MSNBC

http://www.msnbc.com/ayman-mohyeldin/watch/jeffrey-sachs-on-the-trump-zelenskyy-meeting-and-what-comes-next-for-russia-ukraine-europe-and-the-u-s-23330925370E

The Russian population didn't decline by 12 million during WWII as Reddit says. Russian losses were between 24 million and 27 million.
So much for your "reality."

Ok Num nuts who cares how many they lost in WW2 or the Stalin Purges the point is they have about 143.5 million people where as Ukraine has roughly 37 million people. Slightly under a 3 to 1 advantage and PUTIN DOESNT CARE ABOUT KILLING HIS OWN PEOPLE to achieve his goals. PS. North Korea is QUIET willing to sell its people to Russia, I'm order to go die in this conflict as well. They see it as a win win. Get combat experience and less mouths to feed. They are all about it.  

http://www.worlddata.info/country-comparison.php?country1=RUS&country2=UKR

Ukraine can't win a war of attrition, and if they keep going they are going to lose their country. AGAIN I SAY... if that happens we then get a pissed-off Russia on the steps of Poland with the land mass, mineral wealth, and massive farming capabilities behind the Russian line. Ya want that?  

It's a delusion to believe they can win if we just pump more money (which btw we don't have) into this war.

it's "QUITE" willing, you illiterate dunce. Your ineptitude with Spell Check won't help you there.
And, yes, there IS a disparity in population and, yes, it DOES matter. And I actually agree Putin doesn't care about killing his own people. Ukraine shouldn't be winning a war of attrition with Russia but it's actually close to doing so. They have basically taken apart the Russian army.  Partly because they are smarter and fight better, and partly because the Russian military is totally corrupt. And, even without our support, they actually have a shot at winning the war, despite Trump having come close to snatching their defeat from the jaws of victory.
He's a traitor to America's best interests, a slave of Putin and a disgrace.
And so are you.

You are over optimistic. If this continues as a war of attrition, Ukraine can’t win. And you generally need a 3:1 advantage to go on the offensive. Ukraine doesn’t have the troops or armaments to dislodge Russian troops from Crimea, Donetsk or the other territories that Russia currently occupies.

First of all, I said nothing about "dislodging Russian troops," or Ukraine going on the offensive. It is correct they don't have the manpower for that. But their strategy of a dynamic defense is bleeding Russia white.
Victory would be comprised of an end to the fighting; a guarantee by Russia and the EU/NATO of Ukraine's territorial integrity; reparations in some form; the successful use of Ukraine's captured Kursk territory to get back SOME of Ukraine's captured land and who knows what else.
Is this inevitable? No.  
Is this possible? Yes.

Jesus Icky you're a bigger bastard than I ever thought.  

Your plan is to cave in to aggression and let a freely-elected democracy be swallowed up by a dictator, incentivizing him to go after more countries.
You are a bigger fool than I ever thought. Also a traitor to your country.
Oh, and a fraud.
Some tough guy you are....

My plan is to get a cease-fire in place and negotiate a peace deal, that gets the advancing Russian Army out of Ukraine and stops the killing of Ukrainians.  

As for traitor? That term would better fit a draft dodger. Know any?

But I do know a stolen-valor fraud. Now who do you think THAT would be???

no such thing as a six-star general?  Lol

Icky is caught in TWO LIES ! ! ! What is it you like to say LIAR LIAR pants on fire?  

First, ya know yourself FACT and you are a Draft Dodger, Fact.

Second, you don't know any Stolen Valor People Fact sooooo two lies were exposed. Duran will be along shortly to spank that ass as well.

You know you've lost when you feel the need to beg that weakling for help.
As for the rest, both statements I made are TRUE.
I didn't "dodge' the draft. I served as a state law enforcement officer and went before my local draft board and received a deferment. This is the exact OPPOSITE of dodging the draft.
And, in fact, I've said this before and you know it. So it's YOUR statement that's a lie.
I've also been told back channel that you're a fake.
So go spank yourself, faker.

END OF MESSAGE

The branch (NOT the thread, dummy) is gone so The SPOAT can say anything he wants. So of course he lies and lies and lies about the ass-kicking he got.
As always.

No one cares what you say. You have no credibility here. So take the last word.
We know you desperately need it, magnum wannabe.

OK, I'm going to take a different view.  In a previous professional life, I was working on joint U.S. - Russian technical programs.  Yes, I know that Zelenskyy is ethnically a Ukrainian, but the Russian Slavic culture is the same.  When the Slavic leader won't budge, the only approach that works is to insult them and attack them personally.  This concept is completely foreign to those of us in the west, where we pride ourselves on compromise and low-key diplomacy.  You can't do that with a Russian, Ukrainian, or anyone else who is Slavic.  Believe me:  I've been in those situations and acted just like Trump and Vance.  I got mad in a meeting (won an Oscar doing so), blamed the failure of the program squarely on the Russian, and stormed out of the meeting.  30 minutes later, the Russian came back into the conference room to declare that they had "found" the missing data and that all was well.  Having this argument in front of the whole world was downright brilliant.  There could be no "leaks" or disagreement about what was said behind closed doors.

I speculated that Zelenskyy would be back within a week ready to negotiate a deal.  I was right.

Ohhh interesting. so basically you have to brow beat Russians into submission?

No you don't. Yer just MAKIN SHIT UP as usual.  

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-l_2An11-P0

If we were characters in the above clip...

Icky would have been tex with the gun.  

Duran would have been the dog

I of course would have been Brad.

He thinks just sayin' it makes it true. Just like his little butt-buddy, The SPOAT.