by concealed carry permit holders starting in 2016, thanks to a bill rammed through by the Republicans.  

Shooter. And if any of them are black guys, well you know the police presumption

It seems to me they are safer than the areas around them. And, yes, most violent crimes occur in the home, and by someone the victim knows already. I guess that all doesn't matter much to the Texas Republicans. They want what they want, and no reasoning is going to stand in their way.

While I'm personally not in favor of generalized open carry (because the public disturbances come from people like you), your objections (as well as those in Texas) are quite late to the debate.

...42 states, but as far as California is concerned, the unloaded open carry law was repealed as of January 1, 2012.  Maybe you should check the date of your link.  No wonder you carefully avoided including it.

Do you really need someone to show you how to determine the source of the picture I included? In case you still can't find it, it is a CC group in the state of Hawaii. Care to address all the non-California states that Texas is following?  

“uniformed” or not – in my post. Sadly, all of the reasons why open carry is a bad idea that I gave are factually based- you can quibble with how often it happens but each entry in the parade of horribles has actually happened in other states.  

took your exaggerations seriously and thus were not hyperbole in your minds. My criticisms were plural and include the hyperbole in the posts by others that followed yours.

any of you name a single instance where a good guy, legal firearms owner got into a shooting match with another good guy? Any one single instance in the last five yrs?  
       I mean with conceal and carry and open carry and more people carrying every day it has to happen daily or at least weekly to explain your fears right? How about yearly? Does it happen yearly? Out of all the different things I ve heard argued for gun control this is probably one of the weakest. I don't think you can track down a situation like you hypothesize that has happened in 15 years. I ll worry more about drunk drivers, over use of prescription drugs and a hundred other things before I worry about an ok corral style shootout.  
       Besides the average citizen doesn't have a blue wall protecting them. If they shoot and kill someone even if it's righteous it s going to bankrupt them because of the civil suits and possible criminal charges. At the very least they should retain a defense attorney before ever giving a statement to the police. So while you think it's every gun carriers dream to use their weapon; I can promise you most of them know it would be a nightmare that could destroy everything they ve worked for. They typically are a hell of a lot more selective than the police on shooting someone. Check some of the fbi s stats sometime.  

...why your picture was dead WRONG about California?  How many of the other states was it wrong about?  We don't know because you're too scared to post the link.

Instead, you "up the game" with a Wikipedia link.  ROFLMAO!!!  You consider Wikipedia to be "upping the game?"  You don't have a clue as to the lack of credibility of Wikipedia.  For all anyone knows, you could have edited the article to make it say whatever you wanted just before posting it.

Wikipedia is a joke...and so are you for repeatedly relying on it as authority..

that is too stupid to figure out how to follow it.  And I forgot you don't get sarcasm by written word only. You require colored pictures to tell you how to infer such things. Wikipedia? You don't deserve better since you think the world revolves around California.

...you throw out.  It's you who has the responsibility to post a link if you want to have any credibility.  That's why TER supplies a "link URL" box.  Maybe you don't know how to copy & paste an URL.  Or you're too embarrassed that it's one of your right-wing tinfoil hat wearing websites that routinely makes lots of errors like yours did with California.  In any case, you still haven't admitted that your BS link was wrong about California being an unloaded open carry state.

Do these other posters deserve better than Wikipedia, your go-to link?  .....

quick draw on LBJ freeway

There was no ramming.
  The bill was passed by The Texas House of Representatives  96 to 35.  
   
 An inquisitive mind would like to know, why are there missing votes, or is my Math incorrect,  
   leading  me to believe, there were  Texas Representatives not present, or absent of courage when  an important law was on the floor ?  
 
   I've been wrong before, usually Grammar or spelling, rarely with Math.  
http://www.house.state.tx.us/members/

I'm guessing you've been unemployed for a long time.

as far as where the best looking P & R Board posters reside. I may have to invite Priapus back to school you and Ed on proper word choice. While never fully appreciated, Priapus did have his own copy of Strunk and White, The Elements of Style.

Regarding hyperbole, I've agreed we will probably never concur on what you consider to be an exaggeration or that you truly intend for even your most outrageous examples to be taken literally.

on just this one bill than Harry Reid offered his opposition in total over several months, maybe years. So is "ramming" OK when the result suits you?

...you didn't (and still don't) want to reveal your source.

the Republicans took the Democrats by the hand, served them tea and raspberry scones, and in the spirit of collegiality asked if they wanted any changes to the bill.”

by concealed carry permit holders. Currently the web site has tracked 732 minus the suicides. They claim to remove self defense cases.

From what I can find, with family members. Most aren't because of the convience of cc and having a gun. Still none of these are like the shootouts between good guys you claim will happen all the time. Killers decide to kill regardless of the law and don't care who or what they hurt to do it. Some of the killers were police officers or retired police officers and I don't hear an discussion about taking their cc rights.  
       I am assuming they are taking data from 1987 when Florida first issued cc permits. Just as an example Florida has 1 mil permit holders, even if the 732 was a single state number since 1987 so twenty eight years. That's roughly 30 deaths (most probably wouldn't be prevented by banning cc or open carry) per yr. Nationally there are 8 million permit holders, the numbers prove that cc is safe.  
       " a 3-year study of Texas crime statistics immediately following passage of CHL legislation found that the most common crime committed by CHL holders that would be grounds for revocation was actually DUI, followed by unlawful carry and then aggravated assault. The same study concluded that Texas CHL holders were always less likely to commit any particular type of crime than the general population, and overall were 13 times less likely to commit any crime."
      Revocation is very rare in other words. There are places in this country I wouldn't travel without cc. I ve seen some parts of Detroit and Chicago that I wouldn't want to live in without the right to firearms and there are more I m sure. The idea of a gun free society on its face I don't completely disagree with but don't believe it s possible and would make the streets more dangerous in many cases.  
     
"  

I've already stated (twice) that I disagree with open carry, but not for the grossly exaggerated reasons given here by you and others.

Your information source clearly has an agenda. They include accidental shootings in the home where concealed carry has absolutely zero bearing. Same for suicides. You lead with they’ve backed out the suicides from their tracking yet they LEAD with the much larger total that included suicides, even calling the suicide victim “a killer” (technically true but that message is not their intent.) All their distortion makes me wonder how many of the homicides or suicides they tallied did not even involve a firearm.

Why do you live in Texas, even if it happens to be Austin, the lone enclave of liberals in that big bad state? If you don't live in Austin, I'm surprised you haven't been shot yet.

...a post in this very thread.  Of course he's totally wrong and you are right that CA does NOT permit open carry but when has that stopped a righty from posting false information.

Now I know why they're called "Righties" - they always think they're right and can never admit when they are wrong.

You make this post (4/20/2015 4:56:48 AM) AFTER the one above (4/19/2015 1:27:33 PM) where you acknowledged the data I sourced was created BEFORE California changed their laws. You knew the record had been corrected but still perpetuated the lie.

"BTW the source wasn't wrong."  You led people to believe that California is an open carry state TODAY. And you still are saying that the source wasn't wrong.  Of course it wasn't wrong - FOUR YEARS AGO!  But you posted a map leading people to believe that California is an open carry state TODAY without telling anyone that your post was hopelessly outdated and useless.

You're just pissed off and embarrassed that I showed you for the dishonest person you are for using obsolete data and deliberately not linking your source to try to fool everyone.

Continuing to misquote me makes you look more guilty than ever (if that's even possible).

...your map ORIGINALLY, you claimed there were 42 open carry states.  Maybe you're too stupid to know that map was wrong but more likely, you knew that the data was four years old and hopelessly outdated so you deliberately omitted the link to make us think there really are 42 open carry states TODAY.

You only "acknowledged" California was not an open carry state when I busted you.  How many of the other 41 open carry states are no longer open carry states?  I know, I know, it's up to me to find out because you want everyone to believe your four year old bullshit map that says there are 42 open carry states.  We're supposed to believe your bullshit unless we want to dig up the TRUTH for ourselves.  Which I did, but which you still won't "acknowledge."  Righty bullshitter!  Why didn't you "acknowledge" your map was bullshit when you originally posted it?

BTW, it's not 1/50, it's at least one 1/42 of the open carry states that you lied about and deceived us with your old, outdated bullshit map.  Math isn't one of your strong suits, is it?

-- Modified on 4/22/2015 4:07:40 PM

The correct count was in the link attached to the post which also specified that California did not allow open carry. You apparently read only my post and not the link. Next time before you declare victory by showing that a gun law change is not a big deal , perhaps you should actually read the link. In fact texas is the biggest state to allow this so it was a big deal and made national news.

then you confirmed my acknowledgement. Then AFTER your confirmation you attempted to call me out AGAIN for the error, as if I was STILL claiming it to be true.

Next time try to not link to a protected news article. I had to go find my own data. Google images happened to pull up one from prior to 2012. Good news for me visa-vi BP's blood pressure. Too bad BP can't grasp the NATIONAL implications of my point as he only cares about California and not the national trend, but then again it now seems maybe you're in the same boat regarding Texas.

...with your old-ass bullshit link. You got caught like a wolf in a leg trap and you did everything including gnawing your own leg off to avoid admitting it.

When I asked you for the link, you didn't post it. You said: "...it is a CC group in the state of Hawaii."

When I asked again, all you had was an insult.  You said I was: "too stupid to figure out" (how to find the link).

When I asked again, more insults to avoid posting the link.  You said I was: "unemployed for a long time."  You said I should get out of bed and get off my ass and "read with comprehension."  All to avoid posting a link you knew was bullshit.

Would you like to post the link now or do you want to chew off your other leg?

where you were absolutely sure, yet totally incorrect, that Bill O'Reilly was no longer heard on radio. You need to do the same thing here and simply disappear.

...quadseasonal, wake up with stupid.  Congrats, you just proved you're as stupid as quad.

...quadseasonal posted a link to prove that O'Reilly's radio show was still on the air.  Only problem was the link was from 2008!  You and he have that in common - you love to post outdated bullshit links.

When I pointed out his old link, he backpedaled and claimed he was really talking about the audio version the The O'Reilly Factor being re-broadcast on radio.  Sure, that was what he meant.  LOL!  And you're supporting him because you're a partisan righty and as stupid as he is.

Have you got a link newer than 2008 to prove that it is still on radio?  Where is the vast national network of radio stations that's carrying the audio version of The O'Reilly Factor that quad claimed after he claimed that O'Reilly's RADIO show was still on the air?  

ed2000's bullshit map of open carry states:

http://www.theeroticreview.com/discussion_boards/viewmsg.asp?MessageID=243899&boardID=39&page=1#243899

WRONG!!

quadseasonal's map of the vast nationwide network of radio stations that carry Bill O'Reilly's RADIO show:

http://www.theeroticreview.com/discussion_boards/viewmsg.asp?MessageID=243914&boardID=39&page=1#243914

WRONG!!


ROFLMFAO!!!




-- Modified on 4/25/2015 3:34:38 AM

His multi-hour show did indeed end in 2009 but he still has a short spot called Talking Points that is aired just as the radio station finder indicates.

...familiar with the phrase "grasping at straws?"

Talking Points Memo is a 3 to 4 minute editorial given by O'Reilly where he uses the gimmick of referring to himself as "Talking Points" when giving his opinion rather than saying "I."

The fact that you consider a 3 to 4 minute editorial to be "still on radio" shows just how picayune your argument is.

of on the radio. Only a pathologically dishonest person would contend that producing a daily editorial spot, aired on HUNDREDS of stations, typically twice a day does NOT qualify as being on the radio".  

...You lied when you called TPM a "different show" in this post:

Quadseasonal:

""I don't care about OReilley, I don't watch his show or listen to him on the radio.""

""I don't care about OReilley, I don't watch his show or listen to him on the radio.""  
   
    That statement of mine was a reflection of stations I listened  to on my radio, before last week.  
        Since the day you  showed , for the ninety  ninth time,  to be stuck in your  small minded snail shell, surrounded by your  own version of  reality, my listening habits on the radio have changed.
 
    Being the inquisitive guy I am, I've listened  to O'Reilly on the radio a few times since then.  
     
    Last night as I was driving from Mayberry to Hoboken, I had time to listen to an hour of O'Reilly  TV on my car radio.  
   
    Since you don't grasp the truth, I'll repeat myself for you.  
   
    I don't know where you concocted your 3 minute editorial idea  , must be another  
   one of your  wrong answers  when  confusing  left coast with  East Coast.  
     
   When I posted a photo of EC stations near me, broadcasting O'Reilly for all to *see , par for your  course, you  continued to dodge the truth.  
 * see as in seeing where they are, to know where to tune in to hear.  
   
   
 Due to your  teachers giving you  passing grades all through all your failed school years, as an adult you don't have the mental capacity to recognize when you're wrong.    
     
  In your  defense, both you and Laffy  have serious afflictions stopping you two from  opening links, and understanding pictures  that aren't coloring books .