A few short years ago 'Hydroponic' supply stores were popping up everywhere. It was a certified gold rush for them as well as their customers who were growing "MM" in any un-used room in their house or property. Since it was for "Medical" purposes requiring a doctor’s prescription there was no "tax" on the final product. And when Obama initially told the DEA to lay off the States with MM laws the sun was shining so brightly you needed sunglasses at midnight.
When the State realized that the "Medical" caveat was keeping them from probably BILLIONS in potential revenue they decided that 5 or more liquor/tobacco stores per city block was TOTALLY acceptable; but more than ONE Cannabis dispensary in a 20mile radius brought in every kind of insalubrious/criminal activity and patron.
Or, perhaps it's time to take some cases to the Supreme Court!
but good for the Canucks, a huge step in the right direction.
As for taking a case like this to the current SCOTUS, I doubt we would get the same ruling. Nor are we likely to anytime soon, but we can always hope.
and not to throw cold water on the victory, but the Canadian legislature has been granted a year to rewrite the laws, so this is far from over, a great first step I agree, but the war still goes on.
I'd like to combined my hobby interest with deep-sea fishing, so I'd better brush up on my Spanish! 
If that's the case, I imagine WW will be moving north in the rather near future.
30% of EVERY transaction between hooker and john for paying towards the interest on the national debt; prostitution will NEVER be legalized in the U.S.
If however we ever go to a totally cashless economy where EVERY monetary transaction has a digital paper trail to the banks and U.S. Treasury; THEN you will see it legalized.
Mutch of the continued prohibition on Cannibis is for the same reason. California's recent closing of nearly all MM dispensaries vindicates this
California has shot themselves in the foot from what I have seen. They had a thriving, tax paying industry until they shut it down. Now they get nothing from the still thriving pot business.
You are much more expert on this subject than me, but let me ask you did California shut down the MM business of their own volition, or did they simply cave to the pressure from the Obama administration who doesn't seem to recognize the 10th amendment.
I do find it ironic that just like Bush spent money like a Democrat on crack, so Obama seems to be every bit as harsh as any Rep where it comes to things like privacy, the war on drugs, etc. Those of you that claim there is no difference between the parties may be closer to the truth than many of us have been willing to admit. Of course I have always voted for gridlock, I have never been under any illusion that either party is "on my side", nor have you I might add.
A few short years ago 'Hydroponic' supply stores were popping up everywhere. It was a certified gold rush for them as well as their customers who were growing "MM" in any un-used room in their house or property. Since it was for "Medical" purposes requiring a doctor’s prescription there was no "tax" on the final product. And when Obama initially told the DEA to lay off the States with MM laws the sun was shining so brightly you needed sunglasses at midnight.
When the State realized that the "Medical" caveat was keeping them from probably BILLIONS in potential revenue they decided that 5 or more liquor/tobacco stores per city block was TOTALLY acceptable; but more than ONE Cannabis dispensary in a 20mile radius brought in every kind of insalubrious/criminal activity and patron.
You are much more expert on this subject than me, but let me ask you did California shut down the MM business of their own volition, or did they simply cave to the pressure from the Obama administration who doesn't seem to recognize the 10th amendment.
I do find it ironic that just like Bush spent money like a Democrat on crack, so Obama seems to be every bit as harsh as any Rep where it comes to things like privacy, the war on drugs, etc. Those of you that claim there is no difference between the parties may be closer to the truth than many of us have been willing to admit. Of course I have always voted for gridlock, I have never been under any illusion that either party is "on my side", nor have you I might add.
I am surprised that everyone didn't realize from day one that was a "too good be true" scenario, not to mention unsustainable.
One of the whole premises of ending the "War on Drugs" was to legalize AND tax it, just like every other industry. To have a multi billion dollar industry operating legally, but tax free, is simply a pipe dream, and it's no wonder they/you were shut down.
BTW I don't have any illusions that this could not happen to my business. There are some people in my business that are secretly, or not so secretly hoping for oil to go through the roof, I am a realist, and I am perfectly aware that if oil ever breaks the $200 barrier, I won't be able to enjoy my "ill gotten gains" there is no doubt in my mind that if oil ever reaches those stratospheric heights that I will be taxed so heavily that I will find myself wishing for $60 oil.
but it was the "Medical" benefits that were originally lobbied for Marijuana's 'limited' legalization. The same reason was used for Colorado, Washington, and the rest. Serendipitously a once 'outlawed' substance was/is now "Un-lawful" for the State to tax.
The "taxation" conundrum goes even further. If they "legalize" it similar to alcohol & tobacco there really is no way from stopping millions of people from simply growing their own for the price of water and a bag of manure. It may not be some hoity-toity designer strain; but it will still give the desired effects. If whisky and tobacco were as easy and cheap to make, transport, store or grow they too would be illegal.
One of the whole premises of ending the "War on Drugs" was to legalize AND tax it, just like every other industry. To have a multi billion dollar industry operating legally, but tax free, is simply a pipe dream, and it's no wonder they/you were shut down.
BTW I don't have any illusions that this could not happen to my business. There are some people in my business that are secretly, or not so secretly hoping for oil to go through the roof, I am a realist, and I am perfectly aware that if oil ever breaks the $200 barrier, I won't be able to enjoy my "ill gotten gains" there is no doubt in my mind that if oil ever reaches those stratospheric heights that I will be taxed so heavily that I will find myself wishing for $60 oil.
I'd like too know more if you would kindly expatiate.
but I warn you, after reading everything available about Bitcoin, you may walk away more confused than ever.
One more thing, if you don't trust the Federal Reserve, you will absolutely HATE Bitcoin. It requires almost as much faith as any religion. Faith that quite frankly, I don't have.
BTW it got shellacked on Wall St yesterday, losing about 17% of its' market cap, and the selloff continues today with Bitcoin losing another 12% of it's value.
I Googled it and am now more confused than when I first heard the word.
I agree! ANYTHING that convoluted cannot be trusted.
One more thing, if you don't trust the Federal Reserve, you will absolutely HATE Bitcoin. It requires almost as much faith as any religion. Faith that quite frankly, I don't have.
BTW it got shellacked on Wall St yesterday, losing about 17% of its' market cap, and the selloff continues today with Bitcoin losing another 12% of it's value.
Bitcoin is not traded on "Wall Street". It's traded in face-to-face transactions or on private exchanges--none of which have anything to do with Wall Street.
ATM, most of the traditional financial world is enormously ignorant on the topic of Bitcoin, and frankly I'm pretty happy that that is the case, for the time being.
To say that Bitcoin "lost" 17% of its market cap yesterday, and another 12% today is sort of missing the point. As somebody who has been involved in the Bitcojn space for a fairly long time now, these bubbles are a relatively familiar recurring phenomenon. Is there a large amount of short-term volatility in there? Of course. But anybody who loaded up on Bitcoin in the beginning of 2013 is pretty darn happy today.
You're thinking of Bitcoin as if it were a stock. Those who bought stock in Apple in the $700's range may never see the stock go to that price again (or at least not for a very long time).
OTOH, in five years, Bitcoin will either be worth quite a bit more than it is today--or it will be worth nothing. As someone who is very libertarian-minded, I both think and hope that it will be worth a lot more--but I'm prepared (mentally and financially) to find that I'm wrong. Anybody with enough disposable income to be in the hobby is someone who should be willing to put 5% or so of his net worth into an admittedly speculative vehicle such as Bitcoin.
I fail to see how Bitcoin requires more "faith" than believing in the Fed (one of the most horrifically evil entities ever brought into being by the Federal government, to be sure). The Fed is just a scheme to make a small group of rich banks ever richer at the expense of everyone else. The fractional reserve banking system is dependent on all of us being in debt in order to keep the system operational.
Bitcoin is set up to have a money supply which grows at a predictable rate, and to cease being produced after all 21,000,000 Bitcoins are mined (compare with "geniuses" like Greenspan and Bernanke who keep on "printing" money merely by distributing more dollars into the banking system via "quantitative easing"). Rather being backed by the "full faith and credit" of the government (I.e., nothing), it's backed by the "proof of work" of those who mine Bitcoin and keep the ledger updated.
There's no way to quantitatively ease Bitcoins. The money supply grows at a known, predictable rate.
Full disclosure: I am an owner of Bitcoins. I facilitate conversions of Bitcoin for US$ and vice versa for a small group of people. I am an "angel investor" in Bitcoin-business start-ups. So Yeah, I'm a believer.
I do sympathize with those who find it all a little hard to understand. But IMHO, it's very likely here to stay, and will only grow in influence over time. As always, I am willing to be PMed if anybody has any specific questions they'd like answered.
-- Modified on 12/20/2013 9:10:14 PM
I would try to dissuade a certain someone from his bet based on faith, but experience has taught me that most people need to learn lessons like this on their own. Especially those who count themselves among the "faithful"
The thought of me putting 5% of my net worth into something like Bitcoin is laughable. I am glad our "friend" has no fiduciary obligations as an "insider" or he could be facing criminal prosecution when the whole thing collapses.
Maybe AF has a few bucks he would like to throw into Bitcoin? Or most likely he has put all forty five dollars of his life savings into "rials" Wasn't that the last "get rich quick" scheme in currency?
-- Modified on 12/20/2013 10:07:35 PM
http://www.theatlantic.com/technology/archive/2013/12/how-many-tulips-can-you-buy-with-one-bitcoin/282062/
Mein will love this photo. 
-- Modified on 12/20/2013 10:16:03 PM
...and 900 also. How would those have worked out for you?
ATM, Bitcoin is volatile, Yes. But as it becomes more widely used as a means of exchange (rather than as a speculative investment), its volatility will decrease, ultimately being approximately as volatile as gold or silver--or possibly even more stable than that.
There are quite a large number of basket-case countries (think Zimbabwe, with its 250 trillion dollar notes), which would be happy to embrace something as stable as Bitcoin as its primary means of exchange.
A monetary system controlled by the people, rather than by central bankers...just imagine...
if they can be exchanged for U.S. dollars.
What's the current(and just for fun) projected exchange rates between the two "currencies"?
You've already admitted you have an agenda, in the end the marker will prove whether you are right or wrong.
FWIW I don't short stocks as volatile as BitCoin, nor do most people that lived and traded through the dot com era, It's not enough to be right that a stock is going to crash, your timing has to be good or you can get trampled by the thundering herd of momentum players, Just ask anybody who correctly, but prematurely predicted that the Dot com boom in the stock market was nothing but a bubble with air inside. They of course were proven right, but they went bust just the same.
and which is it, volatile, or stable? You just admitted it was volatile, not that you had a choice as it's lost 50% of it's value in just the last couple of weeks, but then you tout it's stability, it can't be both you know.
One other thing, just who are these "people" that will control this new monetary system? and how are they any better than the central bankers? Those were the same type of statements made when Castro overthrew the Batistas, How's that working out for the Cuban people?
Sorry, but I am not sold on this whole bit coin deal, and just remember Bernie Madoff was thought to be a genius until it was proven that the emperor had no clothes, only time will tell, but count me as a skeptic.
Look "it" up. lol
And how do I "invest" in money? How are you doing with your 0.5% interest rate that your savings account is paying you?
Face it: QEForever is forcing everybody into the stock market since you can't get a yield on anything anywhere. And who knows if any of us will be smart enough to get out when the inevitable "re-appraisal" of equities occurs.
I'm plenty invested in dollar-denominated investments, thanks (although I admit I am touched by all the concern you guys are showing for the health of my portfolio--it just brings tears to my eyes...).
So I'm invested in Bitcoin also--just as I'm invested in commodities, real estate, guns, booze, etc.
Sorry, my faith in the US government is none too great nowadays. The lesson of events like 9/11, Katrina and Sandy (or even things like Fukushima in Japan, or the recent weather events in the Phillipines) have taught me that when the SHTF, you're gonna be on your own for awhile. Anybody who doesn't take a certain amount of effort to prepare for various sorts of "events" may eventually find themselves stuck high and dry at some point in the future.
Lol...IDK, but I'd invest in "A-M" before I'd invest in Bitcoin.
isn't QE an investment in "A-M"?
Serious question time: Why do believe Bitcoins would have any value, once the U.S. dollar has collapsed???
Face it: QEForever is forcing everybody into the stock market since you can't get a yield on anything anywhere. And who knows if any of us will be smart enough to get out when the inevitable "re-appraisal" of equities occurs.
I'm plenty invested in dollar-denominated investments, thanks (although I admit I am touched by all the concern you guys are showing for the health of my portfolio--it just brings tears to my eyes...).
So I'm invested in Bitcoin also--just as I'm invested in commodities, real estate, guns, booze, etc.
Sorry, my faith in the US government is none too great nowadays. The lesson of events like 9/11, Katrina and Sandy (or even things like Fukushima in Japan, or the recent weather events in the Phillipines) have taught me that when the SHTF, you're gonna be on your own for awhile. Anybody who doesn't take a certain amount of effort to prepare for various sorts of "events" may eventually find themselves stuck high and dry at some point in the future.
True investing in that many asset classes plus fairy dust aka bitcoin will certainly protect you if we have a 2008 event again but that's not going to happen in the next five years. You can't really make any serious money this way bc a lot of those asset classes are going to sink or go sideways.
Commodities may or may not be a good idea depending on which ones you chose. But really palladium is the only really smart move right now as the first physical ETF palladium fund will force prices upward.
Bit coin though is not really an investment-it is pure speculation like buying one of the 90s dot coms that didn't have any earnings.