Now that we have endured the second beheading of an American, the shooting, beating, burning and hanging of four Americans, Americans jumping to their deaths from the doomed WTC buildings, I wonder if the American Networks will have the balls and the integrity to show this latest cruelty inflicted on their television networks!  Hell no!

Day after day we have been subjected to the cruel, although not deadly or even bloody, actions by a few renegade Soldiers, but never are we shown the absolute depravity of our enemies!  Oh no, we are fed a line of bullshit that Islam is a religion of peace - right.  And they yelled  "Allahu akbar!" as they SLOWLY decapitated Nick Berg!  See the video, it wasn't a chop, it was more of a saw.  If that's too graphic for you don't worry, all you will see on your TV tonight is more towelheads standing on boxes with wires tied to their dicks at the hands of  "Americans"!

Oh no, we are the unlawful, we are the bad guys, what a bunch of shit!  The networks along with their treasonous cohorts in the Senate (I.E. Ted Kennedy, Joe Biden, etc.) and their ghetto pimp bros in the Congress are doing their level best to assist our enemies.  If this was a perfect world they would all be in jail, without bail pending trial for treason and since their treason has been televised, they would get the penalty that treason begets!  ( What would be fitting is the same end that Nick Berg suffered!

To say they are unpatriotic is a fucking insult to those who are unpatriotic, they are verbal terrorists, nothing less.  

When we are prosecuting a war against people who are willing to die and to commit such atrocities and we are unwilling to send their asses to allah, as it appears we are, we are doomed.

Those vermin slaughtered Danny Pearl who was attempting to write "their" story in cold, heinous, blood!  He wasn't a combatant, he was a writer, and unarmed slightly built man whose only crime was being Jewish and American.  And those slimebags murdered him in the name of their god, just as they murdered Nick Berg today, who by the way was also not a combatant.

America better wake the fuck up, get fucking serious or 9/11 will seem like a fucking garden party.

And to those of you who are itching to call me a racist, the moderator won't let me tell you what I would like you to do or where I would like you to go!

Calling you racist would be redundant and unnecessary - you're doing fine on your own.


-- Modified on 5/11/2004 11:03:51 PM

  What you said isn't racist, its one level below that.  It's ignorance at its apex.  
  Your arguments would make even an ounce of sense if we actually hadn't supported, financed, and provided the WMD's to Saddam and countless dictators around the world.  When Saddam gassed women and young children by the thousands our government send a secret memo to Saddam saying the US would overlook the incident and actually wanted to strengthen doplomatic ties.  
  I hope they cut the balls off the people who did this to Berg.  And remember you don't like it when it is done to your fellow citizens just as other human beings don't like being gassed by dictators who gain power through the support of the US govt.
  If most you would have been this outraged at the govt when Saddam was gassing children maybe we wouldn't be in this mess.  Instead of being outraged at Kennedy, how about outrage at the people in our govt who actually put Saddam in power and gave him the WMD's in the first place.  
   Of course to the blind faithful the govt is never wrong.  Our govt is full of angels and has never ever done anything cruel to any other human being in the world.  Wake the fuck up!!

Bribite has put the Rush twist & spin on his post.

They showed the hooded cowards, and Nick Berg up until the actual atrocity. They did show quite a bit of footage when the 4 contractors were burned & beaten, it was even quite a bit more graphic than the latest.
I personally do not want to see it. The graphic detailed description on Fox news was enough for me.
I also cannot imagine a parent trying to explain the sawing off of a persons head to their children.

... But that is because we have an open society where we air and discuss our problems and we have processes in place to deal with them.  If we continue to defend ourselves, stay vigilent, and recognize our enemies for the losers they are, We will stay that way.  It is emotionally satisfying to fly off the deep end:  However it isn't useful.  Let's take our retribution in cold blood.

When we have the senior Senator from your state comparing the evil that has been done by a handful of American Soldiers to the atrocities committed by Saddam Hussein what we have is an Enemy Within!  Just whose side is Ted Kennedy on?  I have no problem with saying he's not on our side!

The silence from the leaders of the religion of  "peace" is just deafening.  When American's are disgusted with the mistreatment of prisoners, taking action to right the wrong, airing it publicly and yet the Islamic world dances in the street at 3,000 souls lost in the WTC what we have is a polarization so vast that our only avenue to victory is brutal, unabashed military power.  This is a war, not a police action and in a war the enemy is not defeated until they think they are defeated.   Look to the history of WW2, we had to take every square foot of Germany to claim victory.  In Japan, the leadership vowed to fight to the last man, and would have.  They didn't even surrender after the first A-bomb, it took two.  Victory is only attained when the enemy is defeated, not just contained.  

World opinion be damned, we need to unleash hell on these slimebags, and do it soon or like I said in another post, 9/11 will look like a garden party.  (and please remember I predicted that!)

And to EmeraldVodka, no American Television Media outlet played the video of Nick Berg screaming as those murderous thugs butchered him, the subject line in your post is simply a lie!

Watch the video of Nick Berg's slaughter, if not just close your eyes and listen to his screams.  And the chants of  "Allahu Akbar!" from his executioners.  They believe that what they are doing is pleasing to their god.

And your response is that I am a racist.  To say that you and those on the left have lost your moral compass is misleading, you have taken it out and willingly stomped the shit out of it, rendering it useless.  

"Nick Berg, the American beheaded by terrorists in Iraq, also helped people in Third World countries and returned emaciated from Ghana because he gave away most of his food."  AP 5/12/04

This was a good man, doing his small part to help the people of Iraq and elsewhere in suffering countries, selflessly putting himself in harms way.  And your response to his slaughter is to call my outrage "racism"?  I don't want to live in your AmeriKa!

of course we need to know the truth, however a persons death is so sacred and is not for all to see.

We're aces at retribtuion! It wasn't too long ago  that Americans would toture other Americans, including humiliating, burning, dismembering, whipping, castrating, and then  doused with coal tar prior to setting them afire; all for trying to vote.

If there is a higher authority then we are responsible for OUR actions not theirs.

Amen my brother....could'nt have said it better!

I would never let a child see this.  When I saw it I almost vomited, the horror was so... no words.  I have seen some pretty bad stuff in my life, but for pure, unadulterated evil, this is a new low.

My point is that we have been inundated with seemingly minor, (albeit terrible treatment of prisoners, who I might add will all see their families again.  Will be compensated financially and apologized to.) images of our people doing a much lesser evil.  So what is the point, to undermine our Soldiers?  To undermine Bush?  Fine, just don't wrap it with the label "News", because its biased, plain and simple!

We have that blow hard, off the wagon, Ted Kennedy claiming on the floor of the Senate that we are as bad as Saddam was.  Holy shit, Saddam had people, PEOPLE, lowered into plastic chippers for entertainment.

I watched ABC's Good Morning America this morning that they referred to Nick Berg's slaughter as a "decapitation"!  Talk about sterilizing the language, he had his head slowly cut of by five (again I have no words) while they yelled over Nick's screams,  "Allahu Akbar!" - or "God is great."

Where's the outrage from the muslim world?  There is none.  You won't find too many people in this country who will condone what was done to the Iraqi detainees, almost everyone denouces it, but the Muslim world?  Is their silence because Nick Berg was also a Jew?  Their silence leaves me to think they condoned it, whatelse are we to think?

Why is it that the networks take so much glee in making America look bad and use words like "decapitation" in describing the vicious acts of the terrorists?  From my viewpoint it seems that they are on the other side!  And I think it comes pretty close to treason.

And by the way, that is the best picture yet, you are magnificent even if I do disagree with you from time to time!

"To say that you and those on the left have lost your moral compass is misleading, you have taken it out and willingly stomped the shit out of it, rendering it useless."

LMAO, that's one of the best lines I've read on this board yet.

RLTW

  and rightfully so.  I think everyone got the message and it is already unbearable as it if for the family, why add to the grief??  Regardless of politics, would you want the actual beheading of your son being shown on TV for the world to see???  Out of respect for the family I think that was the right thing not to show!!!!!

Apparently, another terrorist group in the mid-east has condemned the murder. (Sorry, I can't remember where I heard it - some TV news program last night.) So let's not jump to conclusions about there being no outrage.

... They can talk about him and loose sight of lessons learned.   The large majority of people in the US can look at the US and the Terrorists and see what the differences are.  The same is true of the people in the Middle East.   As I said, we are better and reasonable people can see it.

Handling the problem of the treatment of prisoners requires putting blinders on, setting up an open process to fix the problems you can fix, and keeping the nation and troops as safe as possible.  We may have the luxury of doing it on this board, but "justifying" our actions isn't available to the administration.  If the administration or the GOP moves in that direction, they do so at their peril.  Saying the other side is just as bad puts us at the level of the other side and sounds like two kids arguing why they shouldn't be punished when they get caught.

It won't get fixed in this cycle.  but this problem will open issues about prisoners in Cuba.  By treating them as enemy combatents and denying them due process, we are infusing a power into these people they would not have otherwise.   We really ought to treat them for the ragtag losers that they are.  We are dumb to turn them into "freedom fighters" and heros for hotheads in the Arab streets.  

Harry.  

To quote that great line from "Patton,"

"No, I never said that.  I never said anything like that...

But I wish I had."

And Al Qaida or an Al Qaida-sympathizer group is clearly responsible for Nick Berg's horrible murder.  Unfortunately, our efforts in Iraq aren't doing anything about Al Qaida right now, except giving them some great recruitment material.  

If being able to distinguish between our true enemies and other unrelated Arabs and Moslems means that I have no moral compass, than I am afraid I wouldn't want the type of moral compass that leads to such a mis-navigation of reality.

They said that it would have been better to just strap on some C4 and blow the infidel to pieces.

Or maybe, their leaders are finally getting the message from the IDF that terrorism is a high-risk occupation.

RLTW

Nick Berg was killed by Al Zarqawi's Al Qaida sympathiser group.  They are the enemy.  All Arabs are not the enemy.  You seem to have a complete inability to distinguish between those who genuinely would kill us all, and those who are simply moslem people who would like to go about living their lives free from our occupying force.  I wouldn't call this type of viewpoint a "moral compass".  Perhaps just a "moral compass" with the first 9 letters deleted.

I have no wish to view something so brutal. The Al Qaeda scum who perpetrated that act deserve to pay for it, but wholesale slaughter of Iraqis won't accomplish that. Nor will the occupation of their country.
Before we removed Saddam and tried to turn Iraq into a clone of the US, Al Qaeda could not operate there. Now they move with impunity. We had a renegade group, funded and suported by Saudi Arabia and others, plotting attacks on the US. We removed the Taliban, a logical move as they were a state sponsoring such terrorists.
Saddam is an awful human, but his brutality was confined to his own people. Now we have a breeding ground for terrorists of our own making. Perhaps it we treat the population of Iraq as if they're inmates in Oz long enough, they'll all become 'terrorists' and you can realize your dream of nuking the whole lot - but at this point in time there are a lot of people there who just want to live according to the tenets of their religion. You may hate them, and denigrate their religion, but there are laws, rules of engagement, that require us to treat them as the soverign people that they are. Even when a few of them act contrary to those rules, we do not have the luxury of dealing with all of them in kind.
Cool off, stop throwing stones and attempt an understanding of how we arrived at this awful place.
We have some responsibility for the current situation in the middle east. We have treated arabs as lower class humans for years, supporting and encouraging brutal regimes for our benefit. We set up Pahlavi, we supported Hussein, we still look the other way at the policies of the House of Saud even to ignoring their complicity in September 11. Now we have multitudes of people across the region rising up against us and the most common response I hear is to kill them all.
Well, that's one option, and probably an attractive one to many here. After all, they just won't act like good Americans.
We either have to do a thorough examination of our own behavior over the past decades and take responsibility (which means trying to set it right) or we have to kill them all. Any other measure means we're in for decades of looking over our shoulders, waiting for the next attack.
I am sorry I called you a racist. That was unnecessary and petty. Try to remember (I'm working on it) that we are all of us Americans, all of us want to live in peace with those around us, and all of us are scared of the escalating tensions and the death and destruction it brings with it.

I get sick just seeing the footage of him kneeling - knowing what horrific fate he will face.  I understand that you wish vengeance, however if you want to honor this guy it seems so me that you would respect his privacy - Would you want the whole world viewing your murder. Would you want your Mother, Father, children to see you slaughtered.

The whole world should know of this atrocity - but to want to see it is sacreligious in my eyes.

It doesn't take balls but in my view a certain lack of respect to watch such a thing.  I know you do not mean any dis-respect and truly admire this man - So, please, if you would, explain to me why you (seemingly) have such a strong desire to see this man slaughtered.

Trust me, I'm glad you did not see it, I have been sleepless since I did.  It may well be the worse thing I have seen in my 52 years on the planet, and I have seen some shit.  However, if you had seen it, I believe that you may have a slightly different outlook on our enemy.  And the use of the word atrocities currently being used to describe treatment of Iraqi detainees.  If what we did was an atrocity, what then is the slaughter of Nick Berg?

I of course do not support the "kill them all" mentality that you might believe.  I also know that all Muslims are not supportive of al qaeda or other terrorist groups.  Like most Americans I have friends, vendors, customers and neighbors who are peaceful Muslims and are frightened by this most vocal and publicized sect of their religion.  Many afraid to speak up.

I would however, when the terrorist are using "Holy Places" and Mosques as fortresses call in a few Tomahawks from any number of our warships and submarines sitting close by and blow the motherfuckers up.  I would immediately drop leaflets letting the innocent civilians know that this policy would commence in 24 hours.  No delays, no arbitration.  If you are in the area of fighting, evacuate immediately or suffer the consequences.  And then I would unleash hell on those who oppose us.

This would of course result in widespread criticism of the destruction of "Holy Places" and Mosques.  To the critics I would give the same respect and ear as I give to Sdstud.

As far as understanding how we arrived at this awful place, I agree it is worth study and changes in our policy.  But now is now, and we are there working towards turning Iraq over to self government.  (I also understand that you might not accept this a true.)  This, I believe is the fundamental Muslims worst nightmare.  The fight is an away game, I think we should keep it that way, finish the job on their court.

Attempting to understand them is useless in my opinion.  Many have bought hook, line and sinker the claptrap that Berg's slaughter was a retaliation.  I would point out the missionary who was beheaded in the Philippines recently or Danny Pearl or the massacre of the innocents in the WTC, Pentagon and the airliners loaded with our people.  None of these were in retaliation for "prison abuse", they happened months and years before the Iraqi war started.  These were "atrocities" committed by people who embrace misery and death, who it would seem believe that such actions are pleasing to their god (small g intended).

Understanding them will not stop them, they yelled "Allahu akbar!" as they sawed off Nick Berg's head.  These people are beyond understanding.  It's us or them, I prefer them, and with God speed.

In the spirit of reconciliation let me say that I truly did not mean to disparage your Military service.  I have the utmost respect for you and all Veterans for your sacrifice.  Even when we disagree.  I'm still a little wierded out about a guy poking a hole in his dick though.

Harry,
  You indirectly point out the crux of the problem that the country faces.  Some on the left consider that Iraq is separate from the war on terror.  The reality is that state sponsored terror can not hide in the shadows in the post 9-11 world.    President Bush is exactly correct in a preemptive doctrine.  State sponsored terror groups can not thrive and survive without their state sponsors.  Terrorists are not afforded the same protections under the Geneva Convention that are accorded uniformed combatants.  To grant that status is legitimizing their barbaric murderous tactics.  
    The abuses at the prison are unfortunate and they do set us back somewhat, however, they are not indicative of the US Military or what is going on over there.  The American left, and most of the press, have similar interests in the failure of the U.S. in Iraq albeit for different reasons.  Failure of the U.S. in Iraq represents a huge victory for the terrorists and for the left in the U.S. the ability to regain power.