in power AFTER subsidies out the ass!   What is with THAT?!

back when i was smoking grass and gettin tubed.


the incumbents know how to price....

Check out these JackO, these are fuckin sweet:
http://www.capstoneturbine.com/prodsol/products/index.asp

-- Modified on 8/16/2007 9:59:16 PM

British Petroleum Solar is licensing some deal and marketing thru Home Depot.   So I thought what the hell, let's see what it takes to put them on some apartment units.

Well now the electric bill isn't all that much to begin with because there's no pools, no air conditioning and the tenants tend to be low maintenance anyway, but the bottom line is, $40K to generate what'd I say, $200/month in power?

Who the hell do they sell these things to?  Sure and there is issues of economy of scale, but I wouldn't have the balls to sell the financing on these.   I'd have to tell people it's for those who want to be off the grid when the Iranians nuke us.

I'm thinking, it's hardly worth trying to chisel these fellows down.  I might do it if it was close to break-even, but it sure doesn't look it.

OTOH, to think that our consumption habits have nothing to do with us being in Iraq is pretty myopic.  

War is Ma Nature's population control.   It doesn't kill that many people, but it sure disrupts things and pisses off the ladies.   The reason Republicans are into it is because they can't see that far ahead.

-- Modified on 8/17/2007 12:41:47 PM

but the point seems to be that decent accounting will get us to an efficient solution.   Like copier patents took about 30 years to get to  market.

One of the things that kills me about the "wrecking the economy" argument is that of course the economy always changes, and it's just a matter of what people are doing.   Over the longer run, you gotta have fair stability and you don't want to be wasting TOO much, but sheesh, look at us now, all the shit we're wasting.   Not that there's anything wrong with that, except the bitching about not having the money.

As much as I like being out in the countryside, I don't buy BenD's isolation theory.   Much more dangerous - to say nothing of boring - to separate yourself over the long term.

As a practical matter, a fellow living in many rural and even just unincorporated areas has a much bigger real risk from fire than almost anything else.  

So it doesn't hurt us to subsidize some of this stuff with tax breaks, just to figure out our options.

by the time these things get subsidized and down to the street, they're usually cut so many ways to sunday that the people making the money aren't the buyers.

I'd be paying these guys for the next 15-20 years instead of the utilities.   If the equipment was reliable, maybe it'd be worth it.  But betting on anything, even with no moving parts, lasting that long is sort of a long shot.  

They claim 15% degradation over that span.  Pretty dodgy, if yoou ask me.

Nobody ever has or ever will make it make sense to decenteralize the grid and self-power from an economic standpoint, but when it's retailed to an over-financed, emotionally-charged liberal community as "eco-justice", they buy it!

The intrinsic value of having the apearence of being "eco-fabulous" in the current green-culture FAR exceeds any practical energy-offsets...

It's just like anything "trendy", it's never made economic sense for a woman to buy a $600 Louis Vuitton hand-bag either, but hundreds of thousands of women have them!

If everything was only measured for it's linear-functionallity and priced accordingly we'd all fuck fat-chicks from craigslist for $50 a pop, but only jack0 does that, lol!  







-- Modified on 8/17/2007 4:59:54 PM

I'm not one running around with your fairy-assed purse.

lol

Seriously, what's the application? Electrical or water? No utility rebates availabe? You know where that money comes from, right?

whata freeegen racket runnin a utility in Ca..

Water has never penciled out even when there were 50% tax credits, but then again, retailers doubled the price of install.

It's been a while but I would sure like to see what's SOtA in photovoltaics these days.

Those CPST's are nice. a buddy of mine wanted to do a distributorship with them and market them to medical buildings.....That's who needs power when the towelheads come.

-- Modified on 8/17/2007 8:36:43 PM

It's the "Solar-purse"!

Now when you go in drag down to the leather-bar, you will be green AND in high-fashion!

Remember to exercise your "don't ask/don't tell" rights if you accedently walk into a VFW with it over your shoulder, LMAO!

you obviously know more about it than anybody else here - I can't even guess why you like shopping for purses so much.

-- Modified on 8/18/2007 12:40:13 PM

any outage, even because of a stupid pigeon, can kill patients and create serious liabilities.

Rackets seem to pop up anywhere there's any kind of monopoly, even based on simple geography.  It's just a matter of keeping it reasonable and not arguing over nickels.  

Most businesses have their attention getting loss leaders that they need to make up elsewhere.   That's not really a racket, and I don't think reaonable people argue about that.  It's when people - and politicians and clergy are the usual suspects - don't get reasonable value added for their money, or there is too much difference between what is promised and what is delivered.

Energy, health & education issues are definitely going to be watershed issues if we can ever settle these wars and get back to normal.

shop to yer lil hearts content.

you can only wish for a fraction of that man's accomplishments.

As I have repeatedly said - energy solutions have to fit three things...

Gotta be technically feasible.
Gotta be politically acceptable.
Gotta be financially sensible.

if it does not fit all three - well, it won't do over the long haul.

it's financially sensible.  Can't be financially sensible if it's not technically feasible.

Technical feasibility requires research, which is going to be directed by one agency or another.  So I don't have a problem with any association or govt deciding that they should spend money on a particular type of research.  That's a legitimate policy issue.

This goes way beyond Al Gore.   British Petroleum is the organization behind this, which shows a good example of how life and political organization ain't simple.

Some part of the cost appears to be stuck in CA subsidies.

BK has pointed out other possibilities that are in fact common in many applications.

What's PROBABLY the underlying issue is that as soon as we figure out some economy, somebody else is going to figure out how to spend it, and how debt doesn't really matter.

When the fucking Democrats are the party of fiscal responsibility, you KNOW we are in DEEP SHIT.

He'd probably be living in your oceanside trailer-park drawing section 8 and a disabled-vets pension for his delutional mental illness if he didn't have all that money he married into to cloak his condition... She'd be an old French harlot self-medicating on heroin if she hadn't caught the eye of that rich old conservative bastard she married...

Never has there been a better example of two people living off of someone elses fortune that they did NOTHING to earn... IMHO

He was against mooching off women, until he was'nt..

I say NOTHING about what Kerry might have accomplished.  

But if he manages to fart successfully a couple times a day, he's got BenD beat by a few numerical orders.