Every once in a while someone will ask me why Dave in Phoenix, let’s just call him DIP for short, has had a crusade against me for years. I would take this opportunity to tell my side of the DIP Story.

Back in November of 2000 TER began the Phoenix message board.  The fifth post on this board was by DIP welcoming TER to Phoenix and of course writing several paragraphs promoting his own board. Though this was very tacky, because TER was very new on the market, I allowed him to continue to post.

As TER grew, DIP became a more and more active poster on our message board.  Very few weeks went by without a post from him either bashing TER’s explicit reviews or promoting his own competing site.

One day Dip posted a formal complaint against TER’s review approval process stating he had submitted two reviews that we not approved.  I checked his reviews.  The reason they had not been approved was that he had only posted “had a great time” in the “Juicy Details” field. Those of you familiar with TER know that reviews like that are not approved for “lack of explicit details”

Out of professional courtesy I emailed DIP a very nice letter explaining how our review approval system worked. I also gave him 30 free VIP days to look at other reviews so when he resubmitted his he would understand what we were expecting. He responded thanking me and enjoyed the free membership.

After the 30 days he wanted me to continue to give him free access to the juicy details on TER.  Though I had enjoyed the 30 days without TER bashing, out of principle, I sent him a link to our payment page.  My refusal to give him continued free membership caused the Anti-TER posts to begin again.  At this point I had no other alternative then to banish DIP and remove hundreds of his self-promoting messages from the board.

A short while after his banishment, DIP created the “TER (The Erotic Review) is A Disgrace to Sexworkers” page of his website.  He would scan the internet looking for any message, accusation, or story that he could post on it trying to discredit the site he was recently such an active poster on.  

About two years ago I got a letter from DIP. He offered to remove this page from his site if I would allow him to come back to TER and post with his signature at the bottom of the messages that included links to his competing website.  Since we have a policy against giving into extortion, we politely refused his offer.  The “TER (The Erotic Review) is A Disgrace to Sexworkers” page is still up today.

Any responsible site would not post letters from anyone in support of their views if they themselves did not believe the content of these letters to be true.  Recently, DIP has poste,d items commenting on my supposed “CRACK” habit. This would mean that DIP must also believe that these letters are true in order to post them.  If he posted them not believing in their content, then it proves the sole purpose of posting letters like this was for revenge with no regard for the truth he touts so proudly.  I would like to give DIP the opportunity to put his money where his keyboard is.

Tomorrow, I will be at the Phoenix Toys for Tots drive sponsored by a couple of very reputable agencies in the Phoenix area. I will be joining these agencies to donate TER shirts and mugs to help raise funds to purchase more toys for children. I would also like to take this opportunity to post a public challenge to DIP.

Here is the BET. I, David Elms will put up $10,000 for the bet.  You, “Dave In Phoenix” put up $10,000. If I am addicted to CRACK, as you proudly display on your site, then a simple urine drug test purchased at the local pharmacy should prove whether or not this is true.  If I piss dirty, I will donate my $10,000 to Toys for Tots.  If I piss clean, then you donate $10,000 to Toys for Tots.

It is your call DIP, got the balls?

David Elms

and I thought jack and dannys karoke debute of of new new york was going to be the only entertainment at the party! GO DAVE TERS ROCKS!!!!! PS If he doesn't show up do we still get his money?

Just in case he decided to send that 10000 via mail!

My hat is off to Dave of T.E.R. for his offer, and his post.  I have found this D.I.P-person  to be quite a despicable human being, and I'm glad you're calling him out for his sleazy, one-sided treatment of anyone he'd like to bash.
.

-- Modified on 12/10/2006 8:12:24 PM

and a classy way to prove yourself.

People can be jealous, mean and rude...even when they are misinformed as well.  When people take things public, especially with lies, it can be truly damageing.

What a great way to put your money where your mouth is and prove you are not on drugs like the CLASSY man you are...and all for the great cause our whole community is involved in this year.  

I have a great idea...can I be there for the pee test and help you aim...to witness it came from you...lol.  I would love to assist you anyway you need.  Not like you need to prove anything to anyone quite frankly.  It sure sounded like a great idea to me!!!  You know I am a fetish freak...however, I am the one usually peeing...lol.

I am happy you will be enjoying the party with us and really appreciate your genuine intention on a donation for our needy TOTS.  I hope we can raise a large amout of LOVE for our CHILDREN. My FIRST party with ROSE was five years ago and I predict this to be the BEST EVER. No child should go without a toy, food or shelter for Christmas...especially when we are so fortunate in our Country.  If everyone helped a little...it could make a major difference in the countless children that are crying in the DARK!!!

 On a personal note...I would like to make an offer too.  For everyone willing make a donation to me...I will match it 'in time' and donate it all back to ROSE to give to the TOTS.  Basically it will double the original donation.  I have several ways to accept the donations and can work closely with Rose on this, so you can TRUST me.  Some of you may believe the lies spread about me, however they are not true.  Believe me...you can trust me to do the BEST I can, always speak my truth and stand up for my integrity and morals...that is why I make this offer.

Everyone who does trust me and would like to make their donation go further, actually double, then contact me through email, phone or at the party and the rest will be explainded better in private.

I look forward to seeing everyone at the party. Don't forget to stop me and get your CANDY KISSES. I really look forward to partying with DAVE again the GOOD OLE FASHION WAY...NATURALLY...friends, spirits and CANDY KISSES.

Happy Holidays EVERYONE and don't forget to be responsible...don't drink and drive.

Don't be a DOPE...dig DEEP and donate for our children PLEASE!!!

AZCandyCANE
xoxoxoxoxox
602-760-8092
310-691-8430
[email protected]

-- Modified on 12/10/2006 8:36:29 PM

Reoes "DIP" have the event's mailing address?

I will be waiting for DIP's email until noon tomorrow and will gladly confirm him to attend the party and bring his money with him......  the address is

[email protected]

Reave in Phoenix....Well can't wait to see..

how DIP puts his spin on this one in his weekly newsletter....but you can bet he will and then add his usual commentary...which will be a bash against all who posted here I am sure.........

Great challange lets see if he shows up to take it......

Now Danny and I are back to practicing out singing debaut for tommorrow night........

...unlike the site advertisers and fellow TER employees here.

Phoenix Dave is not a bad guy. He has some serious blind spots, definitely some white knight blindness, but he is not malicious. I have received his newsletter off and on over the years, and I remember the information being better in the years before TER's ascension into the Phoenix market, and the Phoenix market becoming agency dominated. Still a useful piece of info. Not everyone wants to pay $400 and up when it was $200-$250 two years ago. Still, going off on you, when he probably didn't have all the facts makes him lose credibility. I read it and didn't take it seriously; I'm a little surprised you are.

Dave, with all due respect, some of the dissonance is your responsibility. We don't need to have that discussion here, but I think you know what I'm talking about.

Hey, we're all crack addicts here. Just not the type of crack you smoke!

I think the better course would be to reach out and discuss it with him. Because of your prominence in the AE community, people are always going to talk about you, for better or worse-usually worse. I think it comes with the territory. Too much gets lost in the translation online, and some people don't translate themselves well at all online.

Now if we could only get you to pay half as much attention to Vegas ...

Reave in Phoenix

DIP champions free expression and no censorship. He complains that he was censored on TER, so his newsletter says it is committed to free speech. I once wrote a negative review on one of his favorite providers, and he told me that he would not publish it, but he wasn't censoring my review. How is that for hypocrisy?

Reave in Phoenix.....Lets see Banned from TBD...Banned from TER

is a master at editing posts and adding his own
commentary to make it look good for him....he has already tried to slam again since the challange from David Elms went up.......hypocrisy is his middle name........

He decries anyone that does not belong to his "group" or "board" as being bad or that disagree with his positions......

And yes "ole Dave" as he referes to himself has had providers give him freebies...lets see him deny this one

I remember (was it really THAT long ago?) when Rose's little holiday gathering was a chance to have fun and come together and yuk it up at The Vine to do a good thing for less fortunate children.

Dave in Phoenix would be there, those who didn't agree with him would be there. Those who despised him would be there, too. Indies would stop by and even an agency or two (such as there were at the time) would bring their crews over.

And we'd all hoist a drink and celebrate the holiday. Those are the good times and good friends I will always remember, and was proud to be a part of.

Now, it's holiday drug test challenges, is it?

A largely meaningless challenge, by the way. For as anyone familiar with drug testing knows, urine tests, particulary simple over the counter ones suggested here, are only a reliable indicator of drug use in the last 7 to 10 days at best.

And easily beaten by the most simple countermeasures.


A hair test might be more...revealing? Detects drug use (especially regular recreational use, such as one steeped in the adult entertainment industry might be exposed to) reliably up to 90 days in the past.

Now THAT might be actually putting money at risk.
Who knows-and who really cares?

And what does any of this really matter, anyway?

You've got national prominence, and more than enough support from the power brokers in this town. All the credibility in the world, and absolutely nothing "to prove" to anyone.

Now, Dave in Phoenix? He has famously been off on one quasi-political rant or another, slinging baseless, secondhand (at times thirdhand) allegations, tilting at this or that windmill for the better part of the last decade.

Some agree with his agenda, most don't...hell I DON'T...and took what useful information they could glean from his List, and dismissed or just ignored his politics.

So what's gained?

Publicity...for DIP. And we know, ultimately, press is what motivates him more than anything else. Doesn't matter what they say, as long as they're talking about you.

An empty challenge that gives wind to a largely dead  and marginalized sail, and plays right into his hands. You're a respected businessman, certainly above this.

Instead of empty challenges to irrelevant detractors, why not ignore it and go ahead and donate money (the amount isn't important-but ten grand would make a hell of a lot of Christmases for those who wouldn't have it otherwise) to Toys For Tots anyway.

Mr Elms-that's REAL balls. Shows real class and integrity-plus it's the right thing to do. It's what the event is all about, after all.

Help those who really need it. DIP doesn't need any help-there's always other windmills.



God bless all of you this holiday season-enjoy the party. And in the midst of the lobbying, market share dominance and politicking...

Maybe remember how it used to be. That's the REAL spirit of this community.

Happy Trails

JJ

*edited for horrid spelling errors-hopefully I got them all*

JJ


-- Modified on 12/11/2006 4:38:59 PM

Here's the thing, those inclined to believe Mr Elms will, and those inclined to believe the Other Dave will.

An odd "pissing contest" at a Christmas party intended to help raise money and toys for a worthy cause ultimately proves nothing, and only serves to make the gathering about one of the attendees and distracts from what is said to be the reason for the gathering...ie merriment and helping a good cause.

Why the challenge will prove nothing is easy...
A urine test done at a party using a cheap over the counter test can and will be disputed by whichever side "loses"....

Test comes back negative...the arguments go to the fact that it tests only for recent use, and has a high failure rate, etc.

The test comes back positive, the arguments go to the high number of false positives and that certain over the counter medications and other things can cause false positives and that the test doesn't account for that...

All this "challenge" serves to do is make the gathering about Mr Elms and the Other Dave...draws attention from the main purposes of the party.

If someone wants Toys For Tots to get $10,000, or any amount they should simply give write a check and support the cause and keep the focus on who it helps rather than making about themselves...of course that's just my opinion, and I am also one of those people that believe in anonymous giving so as to not even attempt to garner accolades for doing something for another... but that's me.

As for any challenge...not sure why Mr Elms would make one, if what the Other Dave purports is lies and wrong, why give it any credence by taking it seriously?  if the accusations are true why draw attention to them?  Either way it gives the Other Dave his much desired attention and I would imagine his hits went up for his Anti-Elms page after this post appeared, and Google searches for “TER (The Erotic Review) is A Disgrace to Sexworkers”  most likely spiked last night.

Now, if Mr Elms wants to counter the accusations so badly then he should do it right...
Go to an independent testing facility, strip down and wear nothing but a paper gown, go into a bathroom where the water is shut off, the water in the toilet is blued, and there is paper over all faucets and sinks, and the urine sample labeled and sealed by Mr Elms and handed off to a nurse...and for good measure have a hair test done as well.  That would go further in proving accusations false more than a cheap over the counter test done in a non-sterile environment.

Now, I do have a problem with the Other Dave...
He has what, in theory, is a good cause site, sex workers rights...where he supposedly works for the rights of sex workers and their clients, where he argues for decriminalisation, and supposedly attempts to counter the public held misconceptions of associated crimes teid to this industry, ie pimps, human trafficking, drugs, etc...
and then he goes and dedicates a section of that site to claiming racketeering, extortion and drug use by the owner of the site that is arguably the largest gathering of sex workers and their clients online....brilliant way to undermine your own cause.   Yeah...what a good idea, prove those that would keep keep this industry illegal right by making a huge statement on your site about how all the things they think are integrally connected to the industry are happening...what a f***ckin' genius that guy is.

If he wants to dedicate time and effort to making or sharing accusations about Mr Elms...let him get another server and url...I think he could get "teristheanitchrist.com" maybe a .org would be better...but keep it away from the sex worker's rights site...what is it with people obfuscating worthy causes with extraneous crap?

Then, if he kept his issues separate and clearly defined he could maybe, actually do good for sex workers and their clients with his current site...have his personal vendetta or whatever on the other site and if it bothered him Mr Elms could have a lawyer draw up a cease and desist letter for libel and get the other site killed, if by no other means going to the host and with the accusation of libel...

All that said...I hope everyone that attends tonight's gathering has a wonderful time, collect many toys for TFT and merriment and good tidings ensue.

Reave in Phoenix.....Lets see Banned from TBD...Banned from TER

Whether it be true or not that Dave has gotten "free samples" from providers is not necessarily relevant.  I suspect we've all heard rumors of similar inproprieties by TER staff and by T-Man (amongst others).  Anyone who runs an Escort site or forum like this will get accused of sampling the "goods" in exchange for free advertising or better exposure.  It simply goes with the territory.

For me the concern would be the use of editorial license to modify posts to change the focus or tone of the post.  This, in and of itself, is self-serving behavior.

Reave in Phoenix

Ah, NOW I understand the stack of (empty) urine sample cups on the table at the entrance to last night's party!

exchange of emails to him over another issue.  He puts up certain portions of a email with his commentary and leaves out the rest and gives you the exact slant he is striving for....

I never had issues with DIP until I realized he puts up any email sent to him whether it be true or not citing "reliable provider" each time....

He runs a public board that is seen by others not subscribing and he knows it..he gives the appearance of "let me cry wolf" and bash those that don't agree with me on every isssue.

Then all those that don't agree are in his opinion "TER Puppets"....