I actually mentioned this on another thread, but it seems like it merits a thread of its own as it's moved on to a different topic.

I've now gone from one situation to another....I feel that a prov shortchanged me in our last encounter which she vehemently denies.  I just got an angry call from her vehemently disagreeing and more-or-less saying "You're bad mouthing me after everything I've done for you!?  I can talk shit about you too you know!!".

I PMed several who've reviewed her on another site complaining about how my last visit went and asking them what their experiences were like.  I haven't done anything public like write her a bad review, post a complaint naming her...or indeed naming her in public at all.  

But she obviously feels that I'm doing a "smear" campaign behind her back, and now I'm wondering if she's going to wage one herself or retaliate in other ways.

Has anyone else been in situations like this?
Is this something that can really get out of hand and screw things up for me?

There is a dynamic that can happen with a newbie more often than with the seasoned hobbyist that just kills me.  If the session is not going the way you want it to, or if there's something you want to do, say it at the time.  Providers aren't mind readers and without your feedback/input - we're may be taking things in one direction and you may want things to go otherwise.  Don't wait until later.

I would not be happy to have anyone contact my clients based on past reviews.  You have the reviews they wrote, why do you need to query them unless it was simply to vent your displeasure with her - it's rude and seems rather assholish to me.  In fact, though you meant no harm, taking that action is a sort of "negative campaign" against the provider.  Word of mouth from previous clients/reviewers is one of theest ways we gain interest in perspective clients.  Your actions may equate to them not recommending her in the future, souring them from repeating with her or, at least, is a definite negative you are placing in their mind.  You might not see that as taking it to the public because you didn't do it on the general board.  But it is putting into the public in fact, it's her public specifically that you complained to and that sucks.  

Here's a great example of what doesn't have to happen. I got a  review on a local board a few years ago.  It was authored by someone who was a brand new hobbyiest, I was his first.  It was an hour appt., he 'finished' after 40-45 mins of fun, we sat and talked for about 15 mins, and then I asked if there was anything else or should I set up a shower for him.  He said he was great and a shower sounded good and then did his thing and left with a kiss at the door.

Then the review came.  He knocked me one number and said I would have got the max except that a second cup was not available. Okay, he never indicated he wanted a second cup.  So I sent him a note,"Uhm, you did not indicate you wanted seconds at the beginning or anytime during the appt.  I ASKED you before climbing out of bed and you still didn't let me know what you wanted.  And, as a first time hobbyist I had taken the time to write a longer e-mail instructing him to be sure to engage in the activities as this was (HIS) appointment. Not to simply lay back and expect things to happen [unless of course that's (his) thing].  He immediately saw what I meant and agreed he should have mentioned it or at least finished his first pop early enough so that we would have time.  A great guy and a lesson learned but all he had to do was say something.

So, if your session wasn't up to par, you should have addressed with her at the time.  At worst, bring it up to her, nicely, in an e-mail a bit later but if that is iffy.  Still, if she was having a bad day and knew it, she possibly would try to make it up to you or at least have a chance to address your concerns.



-- Modified on 12/30/2009 1:49:09 AM

"There is a dynamic that can happen with a newbie more often than with the seasoned hobbyist that just kills me.  If the session is not going the way you want it to, or if there's something you want to do, say it at the time.  Providers aren't mind readers and without your feedback/input - we're may be taking things in one direction and you may want things to go otherwise.  Don't wait until later."
Unless you're not sure that the provider is being forthright in her explanations of why she's acting differently.
We aren't mind readers either and many social situations often seem to have unwritten rules that aren't clear.
Besides, disagreements over how much time had passed wouldn't have been any different then as now.


"I would not be happy to have anyone contact my clients based on past reviews.  You have the reviews they wrote, why do you need to query them - it's rude and seems rather assholish to me.  In fact, though you meant no harm, taking that action is a sort of 'negative campaign' against the provider.  It is taking it to the public (her public specifically) though you didn't post on a general board."
I had asked them about specific experiences they may or may not have had because her behavior towards me was different.  This kind of specific info was not included in their reviews and even then they were for the purposes of comparing them to mine.
What skin is it off their noses if she was being "unfair" to me in particular?  They already see her and have their own experiences with her.  Thus if it doesn't effect them, it doesn't effect her.

My intent for these queries was not to spread some underhanded propaganda campaign against her but to gather information to help ME decide what to do with MY relationship with her....which already was on the rocks to begin with due to finances.


"So, if your session wasn't up to par, you should have addressed with her at the time."
I did.  Within the time we had left I wanted to engage in some more amorous touching as I had done earlier and some DATY like my previous mtg with her, but she refused based on "I don't do MSOG".  Which confused me b/c what did DATY or touching her body have to do my orgasms?
To me odd answers for very recent changes in behavior (allowing DATY this time, but not now due to "no MSOG") indicates that I'm not going to get a straight answer.

Well, something tells me that getting involved in a he said / she said on a discussion board is like doing so in real life; it's bound to backfire.  But I'll try anyway.  Loneone, the girl's in business doing this. If you start communicating with her other clients on backchannels, it's going to make her nervous, even if your intentions are innocent.  Also, you mentioned a couple of things that, to me, raise red flags. One is the word "relationship."  It's a dangerous and loaded word, depending on what you mean by it.  We only have an hour-long relationship (or however long we paid for) with a provider.  There's nothing on-going, much as we might like to think otherwise But I don't mean to read too much into it.  Also, you mentioned financial issues affecting the relationship.  There shouldn't be any financial issues.  Either you've got enough dough to pay 'em what they charge, no quations asked, or you don't.  If you don't, save your money until you do, then call them.  That's really all there is to it, mate.

I'll let Erica give advice to the provider, but if I were you, I would drop this and find someone else who likes to let you DATY and does MSOG happily for a price you can pay. She's out there, I guarantee it.

Ok, this is the newbie board, and I'm supposed to be nice. Your relationship is P4P. You pay, she provides. Very simple. You're just getting started in the hobby and you already have a jackpot. Going back and contacting reviewers after you've seen a lady to compare is not something I would recommend. When you have a less than satisfying session with a lady, decide if you want to write a review or not, and then just move on. Finally I think you need to spend sometime on the Erotic Highway board. The LG can certainly give you some professional advice. Good luck and happy new year.

Write an objective review of the session you had with her. Don't get into the I think she should have done this or that. Say I asked for this and she stated x. Since you don't have any reviews it maybe a moot point, but it is still a contribution to the community.

Bottom line (that at times seems to get lost):
Reviewing our experiences is what this board is about.

loneone,
I'm a guy here...  but I think you were WRONG.  You went to other clients & after reading their reviews, PMed & COMPLAINED about your experience to them.  This has a TOXIC EFFECT on the lady's business.  This is a direct attack, nothing less.

If you were disappointed, then you were disappointed.  Chemistry is not guarenteed, especially on a first date, even with the best of intentions on both sides.  The real question is did she give her A game?  Admittedly it is more difficult on a first date to make your desires known, but did you?  Be fair now!    

Yes, this can get out of hand.  Other ladies may decide to not see you if they think you are too picky or an *ss h*le.  You could even get on a DNS list.  

Even if you ARE genuinely disappointed, you should temper your review with the knowledge that each individual coupling is individual & each of us has our own ideals & expectations.  
As for PMing other clients, if you were to simply ask for their experience or a clarification, that would be ok.  When you COMPLAIN (your terminology), you cross the line.  

I write a draft of my reviews the next day...  on TER PM drafts or a secure e-mail account.  Then I wait a few days to let it mello...  I reread & rewrite as necessary before posting.
skb

Actually it was our second date, and we had done more on our first.  As I said to Erica up above, when I asked why we couldn't do what we had already done on our first date, she said it b/c she "didn't do MSOG" (which if true must be a very recent development, as many of her reviews said otherwise) which as I've said, struck me as odd and evasive.

As for the PMs, I've only sent 3 of them and 2 have already responded.  They seemed to have understood that upset or not, I was mainly asking for their experiences that weren't clear from their reviews.

That was the first thing out of her mouth when she called me "Did you write a bad review about me or something?"

Which, to paraphrase shuda's response to me, would also be regarded as "a direct attack".

In anycase, no, I didn't write a bad review.  I had already written a review (a favorable one)about our first encounter on that other forum.  That's still the only review I've ever submitted.
The only thing I've publicly said about her there.

All public bitching I've done about this situation was done here...without naming her of course.

I've submitted no reviews here about her on TER.  I had intended to wait 'till maybe the 2nd or 3rd meeting before doing so.

Wer'e supposedly able to judge them in our reviews...that what reviews are all about.  But based on this experience, if you give them a bad review, as this prov apparently thought I did or thinks I'm going to do, then they'll be pissed at you and might retaliate.

I am surprised.. I thought that the reviews were something a provider has no choice over. You provide the best possible service and hope the person enjoyed it as much as they said during the appointment. I really enjoy what I do, and I want the person I am with to have the same experience. Review or no review. I would feel horrible if someone wrote something saying that they had a bad experience with me, but I would definately try to make it up to them some how, or ask what they didn't enjoy. If I had the nerve that is..I realise there are moments during our time together that maybe something different or creative is needed..So, I would definately do my best ~~

I would hope the person I was with wouldsay something at the time..but I understand it can be an uneasy situation..

sorry to hear you didnt have a good time..

If you are worried about things getting out of hand the best thing to do is move on starting now. Eventually she will get bored and do the same.  Ignore any further contact with her and don't get involved with any PM's or discussions with others who have seen her. That's probably where she got the idea that you where trying to smear her in the first place.

You betcha.

I have been threatened by a provider who NCNS'd me.  She called me at home to make sure I knew she could follow through.  I have never named her and never will.

I have been threatened with exposure and physical violence by a lady who didn't like my review.  It wasn't a bad one, just not up to her usual.  I had it pulled.

As warm and wonderful as a lady can be in the room, SOME of them can be vicious in protecting their reputation from threats real and perceived.

TER and the review process is here to help inform the hobbyist, but we all have to consider the personal price that certain actions can carry and proceed accordingly.  You guys are great, but I'm not going to throw away my life and livelihood to spread the word...

I thought it was "P4P" AND "P4T": "Pay For Time".
Yes, we "P4P" but buying their time isn't just some de jure cover.  If I'm charged for an hour, then I expect an hour...or at least 55 minutes.

If I were to short an SP and retort "Well why didn't you say anything at the time!?" and "I DID give you what you asked for!  Don't blame me b/c you lost some of it!" should she later complain about it, do you think that would fly?

"You pay, she provides. Very simple."
Is it?  "She provides" and that's it?
Then why bother with "reviews"?  With 1-10 ratings? With "the juicy details"?
We should just have a single Yes-or-No question asking "Did she provide?" then.

"decide if you want to write a review or not"
The first words out of her mouth when she phoned me was "Did you write a bad review about me or something?" (and no, I didn't).
It seems no matter what I do, I'm the bad guy.  Write a bad review for all to see?  Fuck me. Privately contact her regulars for clarifications (which they didn't mind btw)?  Fuck me.

Damn!

The Hobby: Yet another example that you don't need government to have censorship, coercion, and blacklists.

P.S.
That review you pulled, was that your first one?  Because looking at your user name, i don't see any.

If her regulars liked it, they wouldn't have contacted her and she wouldn't have found out.  By your responses, I think you are not only new but may be a bit of a jerk.  Good luck.

I realize you feel you were out 15 or 20 mins of time.  And that's valid if that happened to you - she should have made some effort.  But one thing is most guys don't do a 2nd round if it takes that long for the first round to finish.  What I'm shaking my head at is the fact that you have started a couple of threads and back channeled and are so hot over this issue.  A little too invested IMHO.

I can't help but wonder after reading your posts/responses and hearing you say what you have done those regards:  Perhaps she didn't want to see you anymore and just didn't want to have to tell you.

One of them obviously contacted her but they all seemed to understand where I was coming from and we've all even chatted a bit about this and they've been helpful.

If they DIDN'T like it, they would'nt have bothered responding to me all....or at least they'd have responded in a negative tone like you.
It's strange.....that some people who don't even know who she is never mind met her are all upset whereas those who do and have aren't.

"But one thing is most guys don't do a 2nd round if it takes that long for the first round to finish."
But again, I didn't have to pop off a second time.  No DATY (as we did last time)?  Not even just cuddling naked in bed?
It doesn't take THAT long to get dressed and leave!

"I realize you feel you were out 15 or 20 mins of time.  And that's valid if that happened to you...
...A little too invested IMHO."
Yes, literally.
What we do during our time may vary sure, but don't we get SOMETHING during that time purchased?  

"I can't help but wonder after reading your posts/responses and hearing you say what you have done those regards:  Perhaps she didn't want to see you anymore and just didn't want to have to tell you."
Well considering that I did all that AFTER the meeting ended: I suppose that yes, upsetting me by ending a meeting in a lousy way and not being straightforward about things is a good way to lose a client you don't want to see anymore.
But to call that same person later and threaten him against writing a bad review (which I haven't?)?