I'm a wife who found out about this site and that my husband has been with protitutes for 9 years. Do all you wonderful men out there think I should stay with him? What would you wnat your wife to do? Would you give it all up for her if she found out? I'm a beautiful woman and deserve better!

What was your hus... reason for seeing others?

For starters, I would say that if you are on a discussion board, any discussion board, asking total strangers what you should do about your marital situation then you and your husband have issues that run a lot deeper than his infidelity.

Secondly, you are asking a bunch of guys who cheat on their wives what we think of a guy who cheats on his wife.

Maybe it's time to log off and go talk to your husband.

My wife has no idea I hobby and am on this site.  I love her dearly and try to treat her the best I can.  I used to have girlfriends but I figured it would be safer to have pay for play since a couple of girlfriends acted a little psycho.  I don't know what I would do if my wife found out.  I want to be with her the rest of my life and I want her to be happy with me.  I guess I am just a pig that can not control his biological urges.  Please understand that this has nothing to do with how much your husband may love you.

I'm a provider that is doing this to pay for school. Please know that there is no emotional attatchment in these situations, except for a few looney toons every now and then. Most guys do this because they want something their wife wont do if they're married and I guess the urge with some of these things is so strong it can't be resisted. This is worse than cheating in my opinion, this is a crime he can be arrested for if caught. Please get tested. Some providers/clients aren't condom friendly. Confront him, see what he says. If I were you though, honestly, I'd leave him. Better to be alone than taken for a fool. Again, I feel very bad for you. Men suck.

Thanks you to all who have posted. I have been talking with my husband every day about this...it's like beating a dead horse. Many reasons, none good enough, attributed to his seeking prostitutes. He said it was for the oral sex, which I wasn't into.  Now I am, like crazy. Every day for the past six weeks since I found out. I want to be everything and the only thing he wants. I have really appreciated the various views of those of you who have posted. I want things to work out. I just want to know, and I can't really, that it will stop. I can't talk to my friends about this and that's why I've turned to faceless strangers. Thanks.

Counseling.  Go by yourself if your husband won't join you.  If you can't talk to your friends it's the obvious choice.  Whatever happens you need support.  You need someone to talk to and a way to vent your feelings.

to follow up from what other posters have said - there is some reason he is doing what he is doing...and it either has something to do with you (i.e. the oral sex thing you mentioned he said) or it doesn't (i.e. he has some compulsion that you have no control over)

either way, you need to decide, knowing what you know, if you want to fight for your relationship or if you want to cut your losses at the betrayal and leave, and he needs to decide the same

you need to talk to him and find out what his motivation is, and i would strongly suggest couples therapy if the two of you decide you want to try to fight for your relationship - despite what is said here, the decisions about what happens are made by you and him

good luck

heinous

I have been afraid I would get caught by my wife for some time now.  I try to cover my tracks but if she looks hard enough she could find clues.  My wife is very trusting.  I value the freedom and trust she gives me.  I never want to hurt her.  I have found sex and the hobby to be quite addicting.  My therepist suggested the book, Out of The Shadows,  Understanding Sex Addiction.  I found it helpful to see what I am going through.  I do not want to quit.  I just want to have it under control enough not to get caught.  If my wife found out I would have to quit or lose her.  I would probably have to attend counseling with her. There is a high likelihood of eventually falling back to my old ways over a period of time.  

Sex with my wife is very good.  Not top professional level but certainly no reason for me to stray.  I have been able to teach her a couple of things I learned from "reading books" so I say.

Do not blame yourself.  It is him, not you.  Of course you should try to be the best lover you can Be as should he.  That has nothing to do with his hobbying.

Prostitute is such a harsh word.  These ladies are providers.  They do not go psycho to your wife and try to steel your husband away from them.  I see it as much better then a love affair and I hope my wife would also.

To the provider that thinks that all men suck:  We are not that bad.  We are just from Mars and Ladies are from Venus.  It is just the way some of us are wired.  I am sorry you have such a harsh view of men.

I hope you do not end a great marriage over this.  If it was a lousey one anyway then what the hell.  Certainly if you let him have his cake and eat it too he will.  If I had an ultimatum to quit or my wife leaves I guess I would have to quit.  Boy would I be bummed.

That was so cool of you.  You said what you felt despite what everyone else on this board feels.  Most people don't have the courage that you do Macdaddy.  Good to see someone with strong morals.  Rock On!!

If your post is a legit post, you already know the answer. Just ask your favorite mirror.

Forget the "I am a beautiful woman crap". That's BS and you know it.
Go out, hit the gym, fix yourself up, and learn how to satisfy your husband in the sack.

Problem solved!

speakprice,
I never cheated on my first wife even when she cheated on me.  She avoided sex...  with me... as much as possible, while she was screwing every guy in town including some of my friends.

I did not cheat on my present wife for most of the 20 years we've been married.  She honestly told me that she "can take it or leave it" about sex.  Mostly she avoids it.  She's busy with her carreer, her several hobbies & activities, first our kids, now grandkids... all of which are more inportant than intimacy with her husband.  It's after 11PM & I'm home alone again...  have not been intimate for a couple of months.  
After a NON-sexual first marriage wasted my best sexual years, I'm now confronted with a progressive medical condition which has already reduced my sexual ability & which will eventually take it completely.  You know on occasions I get to a point where my partner needs to "do whatever it takes to finish what we've started"...  not quit on me & say she's too tired.  If she'd been open to what was needed then we'd have finished already.

I carefully explained my situation to my Favorite "provider" she said "It wouldn't be a problem"...  and it hasn't been because she quickly learned what to do & when.  So this lady...  a mature woman, attractive but no model to be sure...  gives me what my wife just does not seem to be able to, or want to...

I do love my wife.  We do make love.  It's totally different than paid sex.  The ideal would be to combine the LOVE with the pleasure.  Physically it's a disappointment.  If my wife would be open to sex other than after 11PM (not my best time).  More than a ration of "once a week".  Have the empathy to finish what we start.  Make me feel that I was important to her...  I would not have the energy to go elsewhere.  I can only speak for myself...  I don't know how other men might feel.  

You know what I desire most of all?  A lover who drains me, takes all I have to give...  but still reaches for ME...  who still wants me.  Who still loves me in the afterglow.  I love to lie with a partner & to have my hand on her chest over her heart...  to merge out heartbeats & breathing...  it is truely bonding if both are open to it.  

You asked for advise.  I have to suggest counciling...  separate first before joint sessions.
First YOU must decide what YOU want.
Second HE must decide what he wants.
Then you must compare the choices & see if they are compatible.  If they are, then you must work on the communication.  If they are not, then all the promises in the world will not change things.  {I was blessed in that dark period of my life when my soon-to-be-ex told the councilor "I don't want to be married to him any more."  As much as that hurt...  I was crushed...  it removed the doubt from my mind as to what I had to do.}  But if both of YOU want to fix your marriage...  you can do it.

I wish you well.  I wish you Peace.  You must each find the answers within ourselves.
jtp

In the meantime please know that Ladies on this board probably the reason why you and your husband are still married.

Whatever were his reasons for seeing other women (and nobody knows what they were except him) he would do it even there was not one available escort in the world.  


It could have been worse - he could end up having emotionally charged affair. His mistress could end up calling your house all hours of day and night. He could fall in love with another woman and get her pregnant.  He could get sued by secretary.  Scenarios are endless.  With us .. there are well defined boundaries and mutual need for discretion.

I am not defending him. He made a conscious choice and his responsibility was to shield you from finding out. It is possible that he subconsciously wanted to get caught.  If both of you have something worth saving in your marriage this unfortunate even may be what two of you needed to open communication. If not, you were given a reason to end the marriage.  Whatever your decision will be, only you and your husband can decide.

Best wishes

Lina

not you.

Lina

I just started this year seeing escorts.  I love it and I love my wife.
The reasons are many.  Excitement, variety, seeing 20 somethings again.   My wife wants sex 1 time a week.  I need more than that.
I am a very sensual person.  When we were first married and up
until Menopause, Osteoporosis, Fibro Myalga we did it 3 times a week for years.
Complicated you might think. I am close to 60 in age but don't feel that way.  My motto is enjoy today, tomorrow may never come....
Your husband may have alot in common with me...

who regularly take care of what the "Wife" could have and should have been taking care of for a VERY long time. You may be an absolutely gorgeous woman; but that doesn't necessarily mean you "deserve more", or less.

break up with him. I am a provider myself, caught my boyfriend with providers over 10 times and he lied about it all 10 times. says he will change, says he won't lie, it never happened. i even said "ok i'm a provider, you can see other providers if that makes you feel better, just tell me about it" he still is lying. he's not going to change, he is willing to give you up for the providers he can potentially fuck. also- if he's hiding this from you, imagine what else hes hiding.

there is a very good post of GD board that deals with exactly this issue ...

As for why we see married men, we can't make moral decisions for people we see.

They make their choices and have to face the consequences.

I am a provider, that is my JOB. It is not cheating, I don't do it for fun, I do it for work. There's a difference. I am not the problem. If I'm 100% honest about everything I do, he should not  feel the need to lie and do it behind my back.

It is not my responsibility to keep these guys faithful. Me telling them I won't see them if they're married won't change anything. It is THEIR responsibility to do what they feel is right and it's on them, not on me.

You are absolutely correct. I do not see every man who contacts me.  Nor do I intend to.

But whether or not the potential client is married or has a girlfriend is never deciding factor for me.  Other things are, not this.

Why? Believe me not because of potential revenue I may loose  (if you read my site you would know why).  

I see both single and married clients and interestingly enough I find that in case of married gentlemen I provide them with service that allows them to have better and happier marriage.

I am not speaking in generic terms here. This sentiment is based on very real individuals and their particular situations.


Is there certain degree of double standard as far as my opinions on cheating are concerned?  Of course. I basically facilitate infidelity while I would never tolerate it in my personal life.  Do I feel that I am doing something wrong and morally reprehensible? No.  I am yet to hear from someone "I was hell bent on being faithful to my wife but this big bad escort made me do her".

I know that if and when i am in LTR i am monogamous and I would expect the same from my SO.

As Provider I am not monogamous not do I claim to be.  So expecting the same from my clients is hypocritical.

Finally, even if my client is single and unattached in any way shape or form, unless he is seeing only me, he is technically engaging in cheating every time he books another escort.

Ever considered this?

Lina

Changing hangle from Broken Peter to Broken Record?

I'd kick him out personally.
I am a companion and have been for a very ong time. What I do I love yet its my job in the end.
The guys I see are for work its not a fantasy of mine. There is a huge difference between seeing a companion and being a companion.
I have always been faithful in my relationships I have no sexual fantasies about my clients. Many of them i have a great time with but they are not my lovers just my clients.
I would not in any way tolerate cheating even in a relationship while I was doing this. Sounds one sided right, well I see gentlemen sight unseen and knowing really very little about them. I am there to fill their fantasies and I do. But even when I have a Great time with them its still my job. I go home and don't think about them. Theres a difference for certain.
Yes you do deserve better.
Noone can tell you whats the right thing for you to do. You have to live with your choices. I do agree counciling is a good idea. I am sorry you are having this trouble.
One thing I can say is you came here to understand it seems with an open mind and thats more than most can do. Sounds as though your hubby is quite lucky you are thinking your choices through. You sound very hurt. I wish you well and hope what you seek you find, what ever that is.

shes not cheating her clients are and they are the ones who need to live with that, not her.
I agree I would dump a guy for cheating on my I too deserve better. Yet I am in this busines key word here is "business".
Her hubby is paying for it its not work for him its fun, I too would feel betrayed if I was cheated on.

My condolences miss. Speaking for myself, I'm completely single and wouldn't be doing this otherwise. Having been on the opposite side of this, I can only tell you that I had to walk. Whatever you decide, please get yourself tested as some clients/providers aren't very safe. And again, you have my sympathy.

I am amazed at the 'thin ice' i've been reading. Ma'am, there is really noone(I just stepped on a lot of toes) on this board that can truely assist you. I am single and have never cheated on anyone. While married my wife was plenty for me. Some of the respondants suggested that only you can make the 'ultimate decision'; that is the bottom line. Is your husband worth fighting for? Is he willing to enter the 'fight'? Marriage is the greatest commitment you will ever be asked to make. Don't take the word 'commitment' lightly. You will be the BETTER for doing so. My best wishes to YOU AND your husband.

I like how you recognize her open mindedness to be willing to talk to us in this site.

Please find a Neutral Councilor who can help you explore what you truly want.  There is no 1 answer that is right for everyone.  

Also your husband needs to look inward & decide what outcome he wants.  

Until you each make this inward journey, you can not decide the next step.  Unless both of you have compatible goals then all the counciling in the world is a waste of time.  

If you have compatible goals, then you'll need to EACH take the steps necessary to make it happen.  I wish I could tell you it will be all right, but no one knows that.  Neither of your lives will ever be the same.  This is a LIFE CHANGING EVENT...  like a fire or car wreck or heart attack...  

But rather than wallowing in it, you both must decide to move forward either together or separately.  In either case, you will never forget, maybe you can forgive (I don't know).  It takes time to work through & a lot of hard work.  [Honestly, even with counciling, it took 6 months to begin to get my head straight after my separation & eventual divorce.]  Do not expect a quick fix.

Stop asking WHY?  It happened.

What is important is if each of you have compatible future goals?  Really.

You seem willing to do what ever it takes to recreate your marriage.  The old one is gone.  But you 2 can build a new and better one TOGETHER if you both want to.  

Is HE willing to committ to do so?
Are YOU?
If so, you have the basis to move forward.  Do NOT expect to be healed overnight.  It just won't happen.  

If HE committs, you must not hold grudges but allow him to EARN your trust & respect one day at a time.  It will take many days of baby steps.  

Best wishes for your life moving forward,
jtp


 

-- Modified on 8/9/2009 6:59:53 AM

Wow, I gotta say, I do agree with some of what you said, Broken.  But I agree with Mac, too.  It goes both ways as does my opinion:

Honestly, and I don't mean to be catty, but a lot of the men I've been seeing since I started have the same story.  They love their wives, they want to make their marriages work, they want to be faithful... but the wife just isn't giving it up anymore.  Either sex straight and sideways, blowjob, handjob, footjob, hugs and kisses, pats on the head, even a smile or two and random "I love you, babe!"s have flown the coop.  They get nothing.  Failing all else and having grown tired of masturbatory practices, they turn their eyes elsewhere.  If you're one of those wives and you're sitting there scratching your head, there's your answer.  He needs sex.  Bottom line.  Period.  Sometimes love just ain't enough.  Doesn't mean he doesn't love you.  Doesn't mean he doesn't love all the things about your marriage and commitment.  It means give up some pussy or he's gonna get it somewhere else.

On the other hand, you could be riding the freakin' stripper pole at home eight days a week and sometimes he just wants to stick it in something new.  If that's the case, Mac's right, leave him.  He's not going to be able to commit to you cause his wanderlust will always be there no matter how far over backwards you bend.

Limited provider experience, TONS of girlfriend experience here.  That's just been my observations in the dating/relationship game.  However I have not been married so my value for that sacred institution may be less than appreciable and therefore my opinion not as learned.  Take it as you will and good luck, I'm sorry you've been hurt if anything else and hope things work out for you.

sad really...

A healthy balance between all things in life and Intimacy for me at least does not take a back seat.
I need Passion in my life and sensuality is a huge part of who I am.

I have to agree with why many men wander..it is true and the song all seems to sound the same mainly no matter whos singin it.
They do all love their wives many of them that is, want their marriages to work are happy with their partners but theres usually more than just the hot and steamy sex missing theres the Intimacy. Hand holdiing gentle touch the smiles kind words sensual touches...Intimacy.
Oh and it never hurts if you "fuck like a porn star" You need to be HIS Fantasy Girl. You need to be the one who blows his mind...and that doesn't always mean a BBBJ. But hey it can't hurt.
Noone has ever cheated on me,I don't believe its just the sex but the constant passion and Sensuality. They feel wanted Desired and therefor why go else where.
There are those who cheat cuz they r cheaters. Cuz they can. I see theres no future for a one on one relationship with a man who can not will not and refuses to be faithful. This is the guy you kick to the curb. He is not worth your time energy or loyalty.
Its not fair to yourself if he is just like this, a cheater by nature. Intimacy and sensuality is a 2way street, it has to be worked at by both partners. I am sure you as well feel something is lacking and missing in your relationship. Missing out on a few BJs is a BS excuse if I ever heard one. Sounds like hes dumping it all in your lap like its your garbage and your fault. Thats a load of crap. when was the last time HE romanced you. he pampered you he did what you like to please YOU! Its a 2way street. Passion does always flow freely it has to be dragged back into relationships some times.
I know the habit of kickin of ya shoes after a hard day of work and puttin on those comfy sweats that are far from flattering is the way to go. Sometimes ya really have to go above and beyond and throw on that sexy teddy put effort into being playful. Both of you that is. Passion can exist in any relationship but it has to be rekindled and refreshed to keep it new. Hell I am a "whore" and I have to work at my relationship at times to keep it fresh and exciting. Sex is far from the only thing most Gentlemen seek here.

Oh you can Tell him to feel free to leave your "donation" on the nightstand in a plain envelope...$300 is a good place to start, and just grandfather him in from there. If it all works out there could be some pretty good petty cash there for ya Hon. If he been payin all these yrs for what he says you have lacked in and now you are puttin out no reason why you shouldn't be spending the $$$. Its a 2way street.

She is a provider who obviously hates her clients and her profession, where on earth do you get strong morals out of that scenario?

If she had "strong morals" and truly feels this way, she should get the fuck out of the hobby and leave to those of us with "weak morals" that actually enjoy what we do without the fucking guilt trip.

I'm overwhelemed and grateful for all the replies...even the fucked up ones...I was NOT admitting fault. I did not choose to seek what I wanted elsewhere, rather than ask my wife for what I wanted! Also, to Mr. "Go to the gym and put on make-up", I hope your future partner the best...Women love to dress up and look great, but it would nice to know we don't have to wear it every day.
A little more background for those of you who are interested. I tested positive for HPV, the virus that causes cervical cancer. My OBGYN told me in April, but she said she wasn't too concerned about it...I didn't know anything about it, but 6 weeks ago when I had time on my hands I researched it. I was shocked to find out it was a sexually transmitted disease that you can get with or without a condom. It's caused from skin to skin contact. Also rarely, but can be orally passed. I of course confronted him knowing what I've NOT been doing. He lied at first and said it happend twice, but over the next week of discussing lie detector tests, etc...I told him I didn't want to find out more that way, from a stranger...he admitted that it had occured over the last nine years about four times a year (maybe more if he's not telling the truth) when he traveled. He liked a certain agency, that gave him exactly what he wanted...in his words a nasty blow job and fucking someones face. He said he didn't want to cross that line with me, the mother of his children...I'm studying pornhub to get it right now. I am Fredrick's of Hollywood's best current customer!
Anger comes and goes, but it was mostly hurt. We are going to couseling twice a week. We both want it to work out.
Thanks for everyone's support. I'd like to challenge the married men to tell your wives what you want...Make plans in advance to have a hot night. Ask her to buy  hot lingerie and get a hotel room, go away, get a babysitter if needed...Tell her what would totally turn you on. Get blindfolds, ties, toys, etc...Don't hold back. We can all pretend it's someone else...Do that if you need to, but make it hot with her.  Let me know how it [email protected]

And if you are already on Pornhub you are off to a good start.
Please feel free to send me a photo

Seriously...Good luck.

I LOVE Fredricks...you would have to spend a mint to catch up to what I have spent there.
Its also an ego boost for you to know you look damn hot all dolled up and sexy so Good for you on that front.
I still think for all that, I'd expect the donation hes been leaving after all he wants the whole experience and you are worth at least that. Remember, plain white envelope.

Stripper pole can also be purchased at Spencers and comes with a video and book n all. They are hot and can really spice things up. He needs to bring it all to the table as well. Remember your needs wants and Desires matter also.

Good luck Hon...

Sweetnicole1,
Thanks for the stripper pole info. With two kids, not sure how I can swing it...no pun intended...All his years of dropping $300 per vistit, he's buying me a 4 karat. It doesn't make up, but hey, I'll take it!
Thanks,
s

It would not be out of line for you to sleep with someone else and call it even. How was HE at oral lol?

This post was bothering me yesterday and if I am wrong I completely apologize here but to me a flag went up and I trust me instincts... First I will say this in case I am wrong... and surely read to the bottom....

Maybe you are a real wife in this position.  If you are I am very sorry.  Not because of what I do.  I am not responsible for your relation problems.  That is between you and your husband.  I do not actively seek out married men.  Nor does most providers.  They come to us.  We do not try to ruin your marriage.  Most of us have boundries that does not allow for that to happen.  If you are real, it does not mean he does not love you.  Both of you need to communicate better and satisfy each other better.  Not being mean here.  If you both love each other and one of you do not want to satisfy a certain request then why would you care if he went and got it somewhere else?  He still comes home to you and does all the other stuff.  They do not care about us in most circumstances.  It is  all about getting what you want and that is it.  Yes we may be friendly together but it is nothing like a love relationship.  If either of you can not do that then leave.  Find a better fit for what you want.  He may have not been honest to you out of embarrassment or not wanting to hurt your feelings.  I can understand that.  I still feel he should have said "Hey hun, you won't do this and I don't want to force you... but I have to get this because I feel lacking in what I want... " But logically maybe 5% of people will ever do that because if your marriage isn't strong you won't want him bouncing around on you.  Yes there are couples who know what their partners do and totally accept it.  They communicate.  If this is a real post you had put that is what I am saying to you...

******************************
Ok now getting to what I sense here.  It's kind of odd that we just got asked something similar just a day or two ago but in a different way.  Anyone clicking here?  I am seriously wondering why this seems to me as a  research project... on our responses.  If I am wrong I very much apologize.  If I am wrong that person should have no problem accepting my apologies because they are smart enough to see WHY I think this comes across as a research project.

If I was researching that is what I would do... give the "subjects" a direct confrontation on the matter of cheating from a wife who got cheated on and see the responses.  That way you may have differing responses from the other question.  I am not loony tunes here I serious hope someone caught that as well.  Again if I am wrong I apologize but this seems way to weird that this got asked such as it did.  I am aware it was not posted by an alias... but notice no reviews (?) and it is not like someone couldn't get and pay for another account and/or have another freebie account so as not to have it asked by an alias.

Do I win a prize for figuring this out?  lol  I would like a all expenses trip to see you and give you a run for your money  I am not a dim bulb heh heh.

put it in your bedroom can be taken down when not in use. I have one its actually quite hot!!!
Bought it for my now ex for xmas then we broke up before I could give it to him. Its alot of fun!

At first glance it may seem that way .. but original "research" poster's writing style is too unmistakable to do this

Lina

I wish I could say this was a research project. I'm laughing as I'm writing. This was my first ever posting.  He told me that he was told about this website from a colleague, about how to go about not getting caught...according to him he was using the yellow pages in cities he visited...Then he began using this site and also told me the name of the escort service, elite canadian. I found an outgoing email after he gave me his password to his account. He must have forgotten to clear his "sent mail".  He told me his last experience was at SuperBowl in Phoenix.  Then I found that. He said the encounter never occured, but he tried to set it up in our home city. I spent the last 6 weeks obsessed with reading their reviews, every day. I finally thought I could get support/answers from just putting it out there. He's given me a lot of answers, tried to stay away from specific details, but my stance is he needs to tell me any and everything I want to know.  I think my immediate future is secure, especially since he's agreed to allow a gps on his blackberry and passwords to all email accounts. I suppose he could still create a new account, but I feel safe with the gps.
I felt uncomfortable receiving oral sex as well, but now I am letting go and loving it.
I love hearing him talk to me about som stranger having sex with me during oral sex on him, and I love thinking about it, but I wouldn't be able to act on it. Just like the fantasy, and he knows it.  I'm wondering if I should work up to allowing him to meet with a provider for the bj while I watch. He told me not to bother wasting my money because he wouldn't do it. I think he would like it, if I'd be OK with it. I know some couples allow that, and now would be too soon, but maybe in the future??? Has anyone experimented with that, given my situation?
Maybe I shouldn't be thinking to alow it, but I don't want him doing things behind my back. He says he doesn't need it and never did, especially now that he's getting what he wants from me.  I just want to be sure...

You need to get into the hobby yourself.
As soon as you whip yourself into shape, and get some experience under your garter, I will call you.

MacDaddy is a man hater. Period. Any man who pays her one thin dime for anything is a self-hating fool.

If MacDaddy had REAL courage, her reviews would be linked to the identity she uses for posting her evil crap.

That way, she'd actually be putting her money where her mouth is.

I'm with you, GaGambler.

Between the two of you, you've largely nailed it -- though I think Broken Peter has stated some truths too.

Every provider has an absolute right to limit her clientele in whatever way she wishes. MANY limit by age, some limit by race, etc. It would be no big deal to limit services to "Single men not engaged in monogamous relationships." If you don't have that limitation, then you are knowingly providing the means of cheating to a man with motive. You cannot be completely off the hook for that morally any more than if you had knowingly sold a gun to a would-be robber. This is why I asked the question I did last week on the GD board.

So, providers who have not imposed such a limitation have already convinced themselves that what they are doing is good, right and justifiable. There could be a million ways in which they do this -- some of which are positive, and some of which are frankly as harmful to the provider as anyone else.

While my own situation doesn't precisely match the examples provided by Sascha and Nicole -- it's close enough for the same general principle to apply. So I can relate completely that sex is not what is actually being sought. Smart providers know this. Sex is the mechanism -- that's all.

When men aren't getting sex at home -- that's just the most obvious thing. But there are a million little things that go with it that are missing too in the form of "small kindnesses," expressions of desire, etc. Basic human warmth is often missing; and this can be injurious to the spirit. I would suspect most men who cheat, wouldn't; if it were ONLY the sex that was missing.

And, no, it isn't always morally right to "just divorce her."

This is no different, BTW, for women who cheat. Women cheat at the same rate as men. They don't cheat for sex. They cheat to feel like human beings, like they are worth something, like they are loved, and for other reasons.

We men are not especially adept at deep emotional introspection. Some are, most aren't. For most of us, we may not even be able to express in a conversation what our needs may be, and will use something else as a proxy for it.

We have very serious problems, overall, with men being extremely clueless about how to treat wives; and women being extremely clueless about how to treat husbands. If we invested half as much effort in *relationship education* in this country as we invest in "sex education," about 80% of providers would be out of business as their clients would be happy at home.

It should also be understood that 30% of visits women in this country make to doctors are for a new or refilled SSRI prescription that leaves 60% of them uninterested in sex and more emotionally flat than they realize. About 10% never recover sexually, even after the meds are stopped.

Why we accept, in this country, essentially the mass sexual and emotional castration of women by the millions, I do not know. But it is time to re-think this if we actually care about people's lives and not just selling billions of dollars of "lifestyle" drugs. (BTW, I realize that 40% aren't adversely affected. But 60% ARE. This is not a minor thing!)

As for the OP -- she needs to talk to hubby. Men are just as complex as women in many respects, but less capable of expressing it. In order to understand, she'll have to care.

As for what someone "deserves" .... I'm not sure that "deserve" has much to do with it.

And have posted the pretty much complete reasons for the question to that thread; though Amber has a more complete answer for the reasoning in her mailbox.

I have to guess that, were either dddbabe or sexyflirtamber in an explicitly monogamous relationship; that for all but the dogs, they already know how to make sure a man doesn't cheat -- because he's not cheating for sex.

nope sex is just an extraplus for most its a much deeper reason that most men cheat.
Pasion has got to exist in a one on one relationship. We all need to feel wanted Desired and valued.

because I need another x months in the gym first. LOL

A lot of issues were raised in this thread; one being the culpability of providers in such scenarios. I'd like to share my thoughts; understanding that my thoughts are subject to change based upon superior knowledge offered by others, further research and further experience.

Everybody needs a standard of value from which to judge the rightness of one's actions. For some, it is "It's what I WANT to do, therefore it must be right." For others, it is social convention, religion, law, etc. For me it is "rational human life." I hold to this even if it flies in the face of law, religion, or social convention except where other compliances are compelled.

I won't get into it too deeply, but I derive all of my values from that standard. For example, lying can be wrong because it may lead a person to make a decision other than what is in his best interests.

But values like this have to be applied flexibly according to a hierarchy. You can't just say "all lying is always wrong." Is it right to lie to a hijacker in order to save the lives of innocents? Of course it is. It is entirely permitted to commit a lesser wrong in order to prevent a greater wrong.

Lying, killing or stealing in one circumstance may be right, but wrong in another. The same applies to cheating. Why would cheating be the only thing exempt from such qualification?

Obviously, if I cheat, I have justified it to myself on a hierarchy of values and decided that the cheating prevents a greater wrong that would be more injurious to rational human life. And I believe my position in that regard is supportable.

The details of that shouldn't matter to anyone but me. I will simply state that, yes, I believe that what little cheating I do actually benefits my wife. It certainly takes nothing away from her.

And this is the point. A provider is not in a position to sit around untangling someone's personal life, vetting it, and judging that person's decisions on an objective basis.

Once a provider has accepted the same premise that I have; that cheating may be either right or wrong and COULD benefit the wife -- the provider is off the hook ethically, EXCEPT that she has an obligation to take precautions to prevent the spread of STDs.

There is no way for a provider to establish the rightness/wrongness with certitude. She has to rely on the hobbyist for that. Sometimes the hobbyist is acting rightly, sometimes wrongly. That's part of being human; but it isn't reasonable to expect a provider to be a mind-reader in order to make that distinction.

At first blush, it appears that some providers have a double standard. That is, they will assist cheating but would not tolerate this in their own lives.

But looking at it at a deeper level, it really ISN'T a double standard.

The fact that a provider wouldn't tolerate cheating personally doesn't mean that she believes all cheating is always bad. Rather, from her knowledge of men and why men cheat (and her knowledge in this regard is superior), she believes that no man with her would ever be justified in cheating on her. Probably, she is correct. After all, 30% of men never cheat in their whole lives -- and part of that is having married women who know how to deal with husbands.

This entire arena is extremely complex due to the human capacity for self deception both to secure material goods and positive self-image; along with the fact that human drives are complex, interrelated and far from monolithic.

The crucible of evolution has endowed us with a wide range of behavioral adaptability in the sexual realm among others. This is no mistake, and exists because at various times different behaviors have been adaptive and have withstood Nature's harshest test.

This is why I use the standard for judgment that I do: rational human life.

Either way, anyone who thinks this is a simple area in which to assign harsh judgments to providers is not looking deeply enough.

But from my particular perspective, I see nothing wrong with providers enabling cheating per se. That judgment lies with the hobbyist.

The hobbyist, however, should endeavor to avoid self-deception as that could lead to mistaken decisions that could end up doing more harm than good. Let's face it, a lot of guys should really be talking to their wives well in advance of visiting with other women. I understand this can be difficult, but it can also be rewarding. If you can't trust your wife, of all people, with your fantasies -- why should you trust a stranger?

At the same time, providers should also maintain an open mind that permits of the possibility of a cheating husband still being capable of moral action and worthy of respect. They don't know the whole situation, and likely never will.

There is one place where I would hold providers to a very high standard; however. And that is that if a provider has the moral view that all cheating is always wrong or that men are generally incapable of moral action. In those cases, providers SHOULD have the courage of their convictions to limit their clients to single men only.

Plenty of single men use escorts.

If it was wrong for the husband to cheat, you correct the wrong -- not avenge it.

Vengeance is not conducive to stable relations.

world's oldest profession.  Guys sometimes need afection that they are unable to get elsewhere.  Two options exist: (1) have an affair and (2) see a provider.

With option #1, there are way too many mental, emotional, time, etc. challanges.

Therefore, I choose option #2.

He says it was not about passion or affection...He didn't even want the provider to talk...one reason he chose the escort service he did, not much English, also well trained in BJ. He simply wanted a non relationship, ronchy bj he could watch with the lights on. He made the arrangement in advance with the service. They knew him MO after a few times...He never saw the same provider twice. Are there any elite candian providers out there who can help me verify any of this? He said he was usually there for only 20-30 minutes. He didn't want them undressing him or touching his clothes. He didn't want o rub on their skin, never the less sex happened on a few occasions because the BJ didn't sufice, but he said it was not the original plan.  This may sound pathetic, but I can almost handle the BJ, it's the intercourse I'm struggling with more. That's not to say I'm completely OK with the BJ, just easier to deal with, feels less intimate.

Thanks again to all,

I am sorry for what has happened to your family.

Obviously, I'm a guy who cheats on his wife for whatever reason; so you should keep that in context. But I'm also a guy who through 20+ years of monogamous relationships never cheated.

My own situation is unique and not at all represented by what follows. But what follows truly represents the situations I have seen a couple of dozen times.

I know a lot about this because I am a former (former, not current) ordained minister who talked to married couples about such things for years and learned a great deal; plus made special study of the matter.

In my opinion, you should NOT become familiar with any aspect of the details of his intimate encounters with other women. Period. I KNOW you have a "need to know," but let me be straight with you: the more you know of the details, the more damage it will do to your ability to preserve the relationship.

Heed me. Really.

You do NOT need to know if he got a BJ, did whips and chains or had 6 girls piling on him at once. Once you know this, the images will haunt you and put up serious barriers to future intimacy -- if not today, then a couple of months down the road when it all finally solidifies.

Besides, no matter how much you dig, you'll never know the whole story, even if you find the escorts involved and question them directly.

What you are going to get from your husband is the details he feels will be least hurtful to you -- period. They may be accurate, they may not be. He doesn't want to say things that could add insult to injury by hurting you more than you've already been hurt.

You do not need to know WHAT he did. Forget that. Really. What you DO need to know is WHY.

WHY is the answer to preserving and even improving the marriage and putting this behind you; or letting him go.

This is the tricky part.

I am going to assume, for the moment, that your husband is a relatively normal guy who is normally honest and reliable in daily life. As he was only seeing escorts a handful of times yearly; he probably doesn't have some sort of urgent need of a strictly sexual nature. If he did, he'd be seeing girls more often.

For the same reason he will abridge what actually went on with an escort in order to hurt you as little as possible, he will not directly and immediately give you the whole or even real reason why he cheated without it being dragged from him with a great deal of effort.

The reasoning for this is bizarre but is real.

A man who is not having his needs met at home doesn't feel comfortable telling his wife about it because he is afraid of hurting her feelings. Those needs could be for affection or whatever. In this twisted reasoning, he feels he is doing his wife a FAVOR by not hurting her feelings and having her go out of her way to accommodate him, and instead having those needs met elsewhere.

It is stupid, and it is tragic. But, remember -- a man's wife is a centerpoint of his universe. She's the standard by which he judges himself. Approaching the wife with "I really need super nasty oral sex" is like profaning the virgin Mary. Telling her "I need you to give me 4 evenings a week free of bitching about X" is absolutely unthinkable. In many cases, from the husband's perspective, the wife has become such a martyr to deal with him at all (because she always has an endless list of unmet needs and desires) that he feels unworthy of her attentions. The list of aspects of this goes on and on.

Wives seldom know the proper care and feeding of husbands. They know how to give long lists of a man's failings, or long lists of needs he hasn't met; but they don't know how to make him feel confident, desired, like he is successful with them, etc. Wives who know how to do this can make sure tehir husbands DO ask them about oral sex, etc. Because many wives don't know how to do this, in most cases where cheating ensues the husband lacks confidence in his standing to deal with his wife as an equal.

Feminist theoreticians notwithstanding, in most cases (not all, but most) of men cheating of the type you are describing, the man feels he is the inferior of his wife in worth and in power. (There is another type of cheating caused by power differentials in the other direction. I'm not dealing with that here.)  He doesn't feel like he has standing to say "You know, I really wish you'd say you love me more often." On top of this, he feels he must appear STRONG to you to maintain what little status he has, and revealing an intimate need would reveal him as somehow weak.

It is irrational and stupid. But it is also very real because I have heard it from at least two dozen men.

The bottom line is that men don't talk to their wives about their wives' failings. They should, they really should -- but they don't. There are a huge number of places where men, in marital relations, have gone very far astray -- and women as well. And you are seeing the results.

And once this has developed into cheating; the man feels so entirely unworthy and debased that he can't imagine ANY complaint he ever might have had about his wife as having had any validity whatsoever.

In addition, he will agree to conditions to continue the marriage that are outrageous and prevent him from being able to walk with pride as a full human being. For example, being GPS tracked as though he were a child molestor.

Wives have to be EXTREMELY CAREFUL not to actually exacerbate the root causes for what caused the cheating in the first place. While such measures may be temporarily useful to give the wife some confidence, they should be continued no longer than necessary because they continue to emphasize the husband's moral inferiority and thus make him continue to be less likely to bring up problems.

One way to put this in context was that if he accidentally killed his wife, he'd be out of jail in about a year. Don't make him "do more time" than if he had killed you before you consider his "debt to society" as having been paid.

This is the long way of telling you that marriage counseling is certainly an important thing; but you REALLY need to figure out what need of his wasn't being met. WHY is way more important than WHAT.

In my experience, most marriage counseling is useless and seldom helps to really preserve and strengthen marriages. There are a lot of reasons for this I won't get into. But SOME marriage counselors work near miracles. They cut past the guilt and get to the core of what is really going on, and help people create marriages that were stronger than before.

You should stop worrying about the escorts; and do some real research on finding marriage counselors with a track record of success. Marriage counselors where half the couples who saw them are still together 5 years later.

That is what you need.

The last thing you need is an indelibly imprinted image in your mind of your husband involved in physical intimacy with any other woman. You already know way more about that than you need to.

And if, a year from now, your husband is still being GPS-tracked like a child molestor -- your marriage is doomed.

And, by the way, using your husband's guilt to get a 4 carat diamond is interesting -- but let it stop there. HIS best interests are YOUR best interests. If you plan to stay with him, any harm you do to him (or vice verse) is harm upon yourself.

That's my opinion, and it can be taken for what it is worth.

I know you are a nice lady, and I wish you and your husband all the best.

Thank you Johngaltnh. Just as an FYI, the ring was a gift he wanted to give me for our anniversary on June 4th...We decided to combine it with my birthday, in October...subsequently I found everything out in July...Glad I didn't get the ring in June, it would mean nothing to me now.  Maybe receiving it now/later will be our symbol for a new committment, hopefully.
I was going to put the GPS on later this month, before I return to my day job. Don't feel the need to have it now as he is with me 24/7...He is in the sports world and will be doing all game traveling together from now on, at his invitation. I may reconsider the GPS after your advice. Thank you again.

I wish you and yours all the best!

I don't even know why I do what I do but I am starting to get a better understanding.  I like the intimacy.  I like not having to initiate the play.  I like not having sex tied to how I have behaved at home for the last few days.  I do have power issues with my wife at work that hurts our intimacy.  I have not shared all fantasies and curiosities with her. She and I do have a good sex life.

I do not want to blame any of my actions on my wife.  I know hobbying is a poor way to handle some need I obviously have. I am not even sure exactly what the need is.  

Maybe I am just reading into this too far.  I have cash and recently I realized the Internet offers me a big candy store.  I never could resist a good piece of pie. The total package is not as good as my life partner but it is new, fresh and exciting!  For an hour I just don't care if she makes good financial decisions or deals well with my friends.  For a lifetime I do.

I try to rationalize my behavior in ways suggested.  So far I have had to just consider it a personal fault.  I try to make up for it by being a better person to my wife and others in different ways.  I know I never can compensate enough for this sin.

Hello. I am an outsider to this whole hobby world like Speakprice, and I'm also a woman. I am 30 and have been married a few years. I wandered onto this site because I have severe problems with low libido but want my relationship and sex life to work; and I have found that reading various online reviews/chats and other material can help get me more in the mood.  

I am similar to Speakprice too in that I am a somewhat sexually conservative and unfailingly monogamous woman who likewise struggles with overcoming some disgust/discomfort with certain sex acts. It's hard for some of us civie women to enjoy some of the more hardcore stuff that naturally turns us off. We want to be the women of our man's dreams, but we also want to thoroughly enjoy sex! Imagine doing something you undoubtedly dislike on a regular basis just to please your wife (some things readily come to mind, right?), and now imagine having to be convincingly ecstatic while you do them. You can see where resentment could form if you're not careful, regardless of how much you love your partner and want to make her happy. I can't speak for providers of course, but if they truly enjoy some of the more hardcore stuff as much as some of them claim, I envy them and beg them to go into a much needed business of sharing their advice and wisdom with civie women. If I could feel a man's sex drive for even five minutes of a single day in my life, I can't imagine what I wouldn't pay.

I agree that most women need to do more to please their signficant others in the bedroom. I also agree that men's minds are wired differently when it comes to sex, and often they don't invest love or profound emotion when seeking and enjoying extramarital sex.

However, when it comes to the feelings men and women experience when a partner cheats, we are not very different. Evolution cannot so easily explain the deep hurt and pain we women feel when our partner cheats, even if for meaningless sex. Women have essentially the same feelings men do when learning of a partner's infidelity, and they have an equally hard time trying to be intimate with that partner once again. So to hear the justification for his behavior - that it's not necessarily her fault and that it likely has nothing to do with his love for her - does very little in the way of comfort.

So Speakprice, please put your own mental and physical health first (if you do, his love and happiness will follow, should you choose to stay with him). By that I mean allow yourself the time to heal. Stop digging for details; quit with the surveillance; and be careful not to be too desperate to satisfy all his sexual cravings all too soon. The details will bring you more pain, like others have said; checking up on your husband will only exacerbate discontent and distrust between you; and trying too hard to be a porn star at this moment may further your resentment by denying yourself the natural anger you probably have toward him right now.

While we women often have shortcomings when it comes to satisying our men and their desires, the reverse is likewise too often true. Often we're both to blame. Speakprice, be honest about your own needs too - it's nearly impossible to fill a man's love tank when yours is running on empty.

My heart goes out to you and your husband. I hope that you are able to work things out. Regardless, you will heal just fine in the end, and the pain will one day go away.