Newbie, here.  I try to be very careful.  Maybe I'm a bit paranoid.

I'm wondering about the security implications of the various ways we exchange verification info--email, phone, etc.

I joined P411.  I haven't booked any appointments yet, but I've been emailing with a couple providers, working on getting them my info so they can verify me...  (I want to schedule with both--at separate times, I won't "double-book" myself.)

I totally get the need for these girls to verify that we are who we say we are...for many reasons.  In fact, I appreciate it because of that.

However, when I give my personal info to someone, I want to make sure that it stays between just us.  I'm not comfortable sharing it in such a way that it will be stored and retained by a third party for longer than I/we direct...which generally means I don't want to email it.

Of course voicemail is out, but I figure a phone call is good.  I suggested that to one provider, we set up a time to speak.  Cool.

The other only operates via email.  (Yes, she has good reviews.)  So, after I (probably) pissed her off with a bunch of questions--most of which she didn't really answer...I got an idea for a compromise.  So I put my info in a text file, zipped it up with a password, and posted it on drop.io (with password required).  I then emailed her the url & passwords.  I can delete the drop when done, and drop.io's privacy policy seems pretty good.  ...Haven't heard back from her yet, but it hasn't been that long, so we'll see.


So:

1.  I bet some will say to let this one go, and move on.  And I'm interested to hear why you think so.  But it will be tough to do, since she's been #1 on my list since I started looking.

2.  Hobbyists, *how* do you give out your personal/verification info?  Do you hesitate to give it via email?  Why / why not?

3.  Providers, do you limit your methods of communication, whether always, or only before you meet a client?  Why / why not?

4.  Do verification requirements change when a gentleman has references?  I'm sure this varies for each provider, I'm just looking to get an idea.

5.  Anyone:  other thoughts?


Thanks for reading my long post.

Pick a girl with several solid reviews on TER, then just give her straight up information in the format she asks for.  I'm fairly new, so just the other day I wrote a provider an email giving her all the info I could--I only had one reference, but I do have a date check verification and a review on TER.  I made sure the email was respectful and polite.  It worked and we're meeting.  You pretty much have to do the screening their way, or at least as much their way as possible.  So far I have used independents, since I've read from the more experienced guys on here that LE often likes to go after big agencies.  If you're doing your homework and following all the rules in the FAQS above, I think you'll be ok.  But in the end, it is up to you.

Since you are a member of P411, you will find some ladies who will accept just your verification there, and some who will want other information, or references, in addition. Once you have a few referrals under your belt on P411, it will become easier to set up dates. You just need to get through those first few, so that the ladies feel comfortable with you.

After you have referrals on P411, and some ladies who you can call for references, it will be much easier, and you should never have to give out personal information again. That's what verification sites are all about. You only give your personal information to them. They do not share that information, only that they have verified you.

That is, no response other than to say "sorry but I don't think we're going to be compatible". If anyone (newbie or not) makes it difficult or confusing for me to verify him, I'm probably going to pass. You already have the fact that you're a newbie working against you, which puts most ladies on guard already. Even from non-newbies, anything out of the ordinary sets off alarm bells. If it's from someone without references, even moreso.

Anyway, after she's read it on the securest site  or talked to you on the securest phone line, what's stopping her from copying your info down and storing it in her own email or on her hard drive or a little black book? Once you give her your info, it's out of your hands. I understand and respect that you're concerned about discretion and your privacy. However, if you've done diligent research, the lady you're contacting is going to guard your info extremely well. Better than most businesses, I'd say.

Question 3: Many ladies are flexible about how you contact them (phone/email/PM/carrier pigeon) and what info they'll need to verify you. Me, I'm a little on the strict side. And if you don't want to be screened the way I want to screen you ... well, there are lots of ladies out there you might be more compatible with. My way or the highway, take it or leave it, etc. Also, I hate talking on the phone, so my phone number stays private until after I've screened someone. And if you want to talk to me, you'll email me. Good luck getting in contact in a reasonable amount of time another way.

I know this makes me sound like a hard-ass. I'm not (it's really soft). I'm just take my safety and security very, very seriously, and while I am concerned about that of my clients, my own takes precedence. And, no kidding, I *really* hate talking on the phone.

Question 5: There comes a point when, if you really want to participate in this, you need to take a risk -- you risk either your info with screening, or you risk your safety if you see someone who doesn't screen. If the thought of either is intolerable to you, you might want to reconsider this.

-- Modified on 12/29/2009 6:02:11 PM

Wow, a response from Carrie Hillcrest!  I've seen several of your posts elsewhere, and perused your website...I think you are an exceptional woman.  


"That is, no response other than to say 'sorry but I don't think we're going to be compatible'...."

Kinda felt like I was headed that way...thus this post, I guess.


"Anyway, after she's read it on the securest site or talked to you on the securest phone line, what's stopping her from copying your info down and storing it in her own email or on her hard drive or a little black book? Once you give her your info, it's out of your hands.  I understand and respect that you're concerned about discretion and your privacy. However, if you've done diligent research, the lady you're contacting is going to guard your info extremely well. Better than most businesses, I'd say. "

It's not that I don't trust her to guard it.  However, there are some conditions under which e.g. a large email service provider might divulge otherwise private emails to some third parties, even after they've been "deleted".


"Question 3..."

Thanks for sharing your thoughts on this.


"I know this makes me sound like a hard-ass. I'm not (it's really soft)."

LoL.  Did I mention how I wish you were located in my area?  


"I'm just take my safety and security very, very seriously, and while I am concerned about that of my clients, my own takes precedence."

I was trying to do both.  Didn't work so well.  


"Question 5..."

More great food for my thought.  Thank you so much.

If you want to see her cooperate as best as possible.  It is a very rare situation when a lady outs you to the public.

Hey Tiger,

Of course she is being careful.  I'm cool with that.  I trust her.

But sending an email is about as secure as sending a postcard--lots of potential for it to be seen by others.  Worse, really, since it is usually retained on the email service provider's servers for a while even after the user deletes it.  This is the sort of thing that gives me pause.

Thank you. Sometimes after I type a long-winded reply like that I realize it really was long-winded and get poster's remorse. Glad you were able to wade through it.

Before your post, I hadn't thought about emails being stored on a third-party server -- and you're right, most are archived for a limited time/forever even after being deleted. It's not something most people think about (or know about?).

Do you know of any particular email providers that *don't* keep residual copies of emails? Hushmail maybe?

"Thank you. Sometimes after I type a long-winded reply like that I realize it really was long-winded and get poster's remorse. Glad you were able to wade through it. "

Are you kidding?  Did you read *my* posts?    Well...clearly you did...looks like we have something in common.  

"Do you know of any particular email providers that *don't* keep residual copies of emails? Hushmail maybe?"

I think because of the way they use multiple servers, and have to keep backups for reliability, that--practically speaking--the messages have to stick around for at least some minimum amount of time after deletion by the user.

As to how long that info sticks around...that can be tricky / tedious info to find.  I have (had?) the impression that hushmail was one of the better ones, but I can't find any info on their retention period.

I think using PGP/GPG would be a technically superior solution, but it's a PITA, and it doesn't magically solve all trust issues.

Trust can be a difficult thing to establish, especially when some are trying to subvert it.

Here are a few pages I found that seem relevant, but mostly without directly answering the email retention question:

http://www.hushmail.com/about/technology/security/
http://mail.google.com/mail/help/about_privacy.html#data_retention
http://www.tomsguide.com/us/Yahoo-Document-Spying-Law-Policies,news-5281.html

hi i am back and do not have any new reviews but someone saw my ad who i do not know if he is new to hobby or seen providers. should i screen him first before i let him know i do not have new reviews but old ones here or? thanks any suggestions i would appreciate
kim