With all the intimacy involved, I'm sure that there's been times when a client falls for a provider.  Do you think girls get uncomfortable when that happens?  I'm just curious how often that happens and what's the aftermath of when something like that happens....

if you go by the posts on the Erotic Highway and the General Discussion Boards.  I think of it as the "Dixie Chicken" problem (Little feat), and feel really bad for the ladies and gentlemen that experience the worst aspects of it. That turns out to be most, if not all.

I spent some time reading a lot of posts from before I joined TER, and I was surprised at the number of Dixie Chicken posts.  The one general thing that they all had in common is that the aftermath was sad and bad rather than anything positive.

What's Dixie Chicken posts?  Maybe, I haven't read enough of hte board to know what you're talking about.  How do proivders usually react to their clients falling for them?

It's normal and healthy to have a crush on a good provider, I've got crushes on all my favorites.  The problem is that some guys will start to act out on it and become stalkers and threaten the very person they claim to love.

Then again, some providers get the same crushes on a client sometimes and stalk them (This happened to me once, and it's downright scary.)

On the flip side, sometimes clients and providers hook up, even get married and live happily ever after (or some part of it we hope), so there's a lot of ins and outs to this question.

from the dating scene. That is a problem for some  providers, and unwanted.
Enjoy them for the hour or two, and treat them right. Then let them go.
There is nothing wrong with having an ATF, or a friendly relationship, but it's normally best to keep the boundaries in check.

There are a few variations. Sometimes you get a gent that has a 'caretaker' personality and wants to rescue us from all this. That happens more often than not. When it does, I will tell him I am absolutly perfectly happy with my life. If that doesn't work, that leaves no other option and I will let him know I will no longer be seeing him. Then, sometimes you get gents that just will not stop....they email or call everyday. Usualy, it will taper off and stop. If not I suppose I'd have to get my husband to go break his legs. Just kidding. Maybe just his fingers. J/K

Great encapsulation of the crisis, rayjjr!  For those scratching their heads, here are the lyrics of the Little Feat song.  You have to keep things in perspective.

I've seen the bright lights of Memphis
And the Commodore Hotel
And underneath a street lamp, I met a southern belle
Oh she took me to the river, where she cast her spell
And in that southern moonlight, she sang this song so well

If youll be my Dixie chicken I'll be your Tenessee lamb
And we can walk together down in Dixieland
Down in Dixieland

We made all the hotspots, my money flowed like wine
Then the low-down southern whiskey, yea, began to fog my mind
And i dont remember church bells, or the money I put down
On the white picket fence and boardwalk
On the house at the end of town
Oh but boy do i remember the strain of her refrain
And the nights we spent together
And the way she called my name

If you'll be my Dixie chicken I'll be your Tenessee lamb
And we can walk together down in Dixieland
Down in Dixieland

Many years since she ran away
Yes that guitar player sure could play
She always liked to sing along
She always handy with a song
But then one night at the lobby of the Commodore Hotel
I chanced to meet a bartender who said he knew her well
And as he handed me a drink he began to hum a song
And all the boys there, at the bar, began to sing along

If you'll be my Dixie chicken I'll be your Tenessee lamb
And we can walk together down in Dixieland
Down in Dixieland, Down in Dixieland

First, INTIMACY??? In a nut-shell, intimacy deals with feelings of closeness, safety, trust and transparency among partners in a collaborative relationship. It is both the ability and the choice to be close, loving and vulnerable. Intimacy is not as much about being sexual as it is about sharing desires with your partner. (Hardy figured out how to use Wikipedia...consult there for more details on the subject)

Are you frickin kidding me? You think this hobby is about being intimate?? At its very core, the hobbyist/provider relationship is business...A payment of a fee for companionship/time (okay, I'll cut the crap, it’s about getting laid). That's all it should be. When your time is up, you need to end the little fantasy world your living in and go back to reality. Once you walk out the door, you should forget all about the provider until your next PAID visit. Do not bother her unless you are setting up an appointment.

I've heard all the arguments how we are dealing with human emotions and feelings, and when these things are involved, people fall for each other. Give me a break. MEMO TO HOBBYISTS: When you see a provider, she is acting; her affection towards you is the same act she has perfected 1000 other times. If you accept this little tidbit of information, then you never allow yourself to get caught up in the drama and emotions. You fall in love with the provider for the hour you are there. Then, get over it.  

Besides, as a hobbyist how would you ever REALLY know that the lady liked you for who you are and not for what you represent; namely the proverbial cash machine. Why would one ever presume that the provider has a genuine interest in taking the relationship any where beyond what it is. The provider views you as a source of income. Ask yourself, once the cash stops, does she really care about you?? I doubt it.

If you want, take it a step further. Ask yourself are you falling in love with the FANTASY of the provider, or the REALITY of who the provider is. Look at the lady without the make-up and cocktail dress, without the eyes that are glued to you for all your time there. Instead, see the provider as a woman in sweat pants and a T-shirt and a myriad of the same real world problems that we all face. Do you want to be with the provider just as much? Probably not.    

And I ONLY blame the hobbyists for trying to start relationships with providers. In my 10 plus years of hobbying (including periods when I was completely single and available), I have NEVER, NEVER had a provider offer me a free session (heck, not even an unannounced discount), call me to just talk and shoot the breeze, want to go out to dinner or see a movie off the clock. NEVER. And these are providers who I have seen on multiple occasions, Providers DO NOT start relationships with hobbyists. They DO NOT presume that hobbyists would want to see them socially. They respect the boundaries and limitations.  

I LOVE spending time with providers, but I seem to be in the VAST MINORITY of hobbyists (or at least those who choose to vocalize their opinions), who plainly see the hobby for what it should be... A payment of cash for sex. Period. Enjoy your time with the provider, live out whatever fantasy you want to, but when your time is up with the lady, YOUR TIME IS UP. Go back to reality. Respect the boundaries that SHOULD ALWAYS exist amomg hobbyists/providers.

If you want to find someone to fall in love with, in this day of the internet it’s really not that hard. Whether you are single or married, there are 100's of web sites to visit to find the lady of your dreams. The provider should NOT be one of them.
   

     

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and thanks for providing the lyrics.  I was posting from my phone earlier and couldn't get the lyrics to post.  I have sung this song in my head almost every time I have seen a provider that curls my toes before I'm ever even touched.

Ray

And all this time I thought the guy was singing about his favorite restaurant.  

Sex feels better with an emotional aspect included in it, even if it's BS.  That's the core value of a GFE; she's both the sex and the illusion of a real relationship.

From a fantasy perspective, I think the lady in sweats & T-shirt adds to the sense that I'm not on a first date, but rather someone that's comfortable enough being around me to show her real self.  I recall an extended date with a special friend where we began the date by me picking her up at her home, and she was wearing a comfy pair of jeans and a dorky t-shirt.  We talked about all kinds of things, mundane and mesmerizing.  Later, we had wild sex in a public place and I dropped her off at her home.  Now, this is a lady that I paid, had paid before, and will most likely pay again.  She has used the "L" word more than a few times, and within it's context it may even be true.

To mrfisher's point above, it's not about whether or not it's real or contrived, but about how it's acted upon.  We appreciate what each other brings to the deal, and don't have expectations beyond that.  I've been to her residence, know her real name, have met some of her family members and friends outside the hobby, but I know that I'm not her boyfriend....and never will be.

OK, now that you've gotten you through all this, do I get to stay on the debate team?  I miss the Hardy attacks of old; you've become downright reasonable and I don't like it, LOL.

What works for you, works for you, Hardy. Why do you insist that your experiences absolutely must be shared by everyone else? My hobbying experience has been a complete 180 from yours and that has worked incredibly well for me, but that's only for me. You don't see me posting that everyone should find loving intimacy with someone in the hobby because EVERYONE IS AN INDIVIDUAL AND HAS THEIR OWN INDIVIDUAL EXPERIENCES. Why is that so difficult for you to get?

Most often they fall in love to get free sex -

Anyone can fall in love in an hour or two..


but can they stay in love for a year or three ?

Most run from that because of the messiness that would entail. I've been lucky enough to establish a very close and caring relationship with a now retired lady. Are we in love? Not in the 'normal' sense of needing to be with each other but I have very few other relationships that are as close and in which the people care so much about the other. That meets my definition of love.

No, falling in love with a provider does NOT happen to many people. Just because you have paid THOUSANDS and THOUSANDS of dollars over the years to buy (I mean establish) this so called close and wonderful relationship with a provider, do not presume we have all done the same. Just because you have fallen hard for a provider, we should now automatically follow your lead? Are you trying to insinuate that we should all hobby the Wormwood way????

What works for you Wormwood works for you. Don’t come here preaching how you are so much in love with this provider and share such intimate and special moments with her. Very few of us choose to go down that path. It's not for everyone so don’t try and sway us. But you are obviously blind and fail to see that.    

Just because I choose to hobby differently, and to never get involved on an emotional deep level with any provider I see, doesn’t mean my way is wrong. EVERYONE IS AN INDIVIDUAL AND HAS THEIR OWN INDIVIDUAL EXPERIENCES. Why is that so difficult for you to get and grasp? Nobody really cares how you choose to hobby. Go fall in love with every provider you meet.  

Last time I checked, Wormwood, this is a discussion board. All VIEW points are welcome (including those you disagree with). Apparently, you fail to grasp this concept as well.


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I was hoping to provoke you into returning, but I obviously missed the mark.  Kudos to Wormwood for hitting a bulls-eye.

Calm down guys...I was only asking this as a hypothetical.  It just occurred to me that when two people get physcial together that sometimes the client might fall for the provider...I was just wondering what usually happens in that circumstance, how does the provider feel about it, what's the aftermath....  I was more curious about the stories behind such real life situations.

at all about what anyone SHOULD do. I merely related my own experience and, according to what's posted on The Erotic highway, the experience of a number of others.

own way of referring to the idea that we have to keep things in perspective.  We are not the only one who is with this wonderful lady, and we won't be.

The ladies will react however they each want, but most will freeze you out, some will take advantage, and some will reciprocate.  There is no real way to predict, but the odds favor the deep freeze.


-- Modified on 1/31/2008 1:20:24 PM

While we often disagree, Little Phil, you have always done so with respect and professionalism. Wormwood, on the other hand, has chosen to be overly critical about my comments and has responded quite harshly towards my views for awhile.

The hobby is what it is...people with different experiences and ways to enjoy. I always assumed all view points were welcome, not just those that people want to hear.

She tells me so at the end of every session when I hand her the envelope.

Personnally I think anyone who thinks that "love" is to be found in the hobby has watched too many movies or has emotional issues. Why anyone could expect this or conclude that a girl is "falling for them" is on some serious stuff.

The gal is getting compensated for an experiance and I would never imagine that it is anything more than that, an experiance for the time agreed to. I feel bad for any girl who runs into a dude who cant seperate that reality from their fantasy.

I mean are any ads headed with "looking for a guy looking for GFE and marriage"..lol

It is an act, but that said, what's the problem with that?

When Sir Laurence Olivier makes an audience weep while playing MacBeth, people don't criticize and castigate the audience for showing emotions  because, after all, it was just an act.

Instead that shower Olivier with copious amounts of money and praise, as well they should.

The same can and should be said for our wonderful providers.

You write "I think anyone who thinks that "love" is to be found in the hobby has emotional issues".

Congratulations, you've figured out a huge percentage of the hobby motivation.  Normal, good looking, well-adjusted guys with confidence in their worth don't NEED the hobby.  Certainly, a few of us are here anyway, but the driving force behind guys paying for poon is that they have to.  Surely, you know some guy that meets all kinds of women, has sex with them and moves on.  The "I pay them to leave" comments don't really address the majority of hobbyists.  In fact, it's my opinion that many guys would be tickled shitless if the lady came for the hour, and stayed for the week.

So, now why do you think so many guys are so gaga over the lady that grants them pleasure?

There's a sick, twisted part of my psyche that loves when you go off on poor, unsuspecting, fools.  Lately you've been so well-behaved and I feel it short changes the banter that newbies need to get a grip of before they venture off to some of the other boards.

Not to get jazz upset, but a little drama can go a long way every once in a while.

I do appreciate your kind words, but can't we fight about something....anything???

I worry about the "in lust" factor which can be misconstrued as love.

mrfisher.....I think that's one of the best analogies I've ever heard. Thank you


PS....if you read that word 'analogies' reaaaalll slow, it kind of looks like anal orgies.


Meow

Yes it should be a concern to all Providers and in rarer instances to Hobbyist.  This hobby in its PERFECTION should be all about acting out a fantasy only.  We get in trouble when we failed to distinguish loving the role from being in love and love from sex. Perfection as in other endeavors does not exist in this hobby and all should be wary of the potential consequences.

I got to be doing something wrok then. My reg Sp I see before her hours and she does nto put on the makeup for me. I've seen her put it on 1 time after while we drank tea. I prefer her without but thinks she needs it for the business.  As for the t-shirt, etc., yep seen that too.  I like her to feel comfortable when we're together and she prefers not acting a role with me that she does for others. Is there love between us, no but there is a mutual feeling that we like to around each other and we have both a sexual and nonsexual arrangement. As for discounts, not asking for money, etc. since after the first few times together it has only come up a few times when she actually has asked that I not pay her b/c the time together seemed to her more than that of an sp and customer.  

She is getting out the hobby at the end of Feb as she sees not future in it for her and has discussed with me about still wanting to see and be with me when she does. Is it love, probably not but simply we like each other and she enjoys my company as I do hers.

If there is a down side to this, it is that as she is my first reg, it has created an expectation that I will need some time to lose before seeing others other than on a 1 time basis so I do not end up with the expectations not being met as they are distorted.

Can't turn a hoe into a housewife.

some of the ladies here are housewives, and I'm sure that even more of them that aren't, don't appreciate being called a hoe.

I think that's demeaning to say the least. Even though I'm a newbie, the ladies I've met except 1 all are pretty much normal ladies who either enjoy sex and have not found a single man capable of satisfying them and hence we are inadequate, are in financial difficulty and not willing to walk the streets or live on them or worse, a few are actually paying for an education, etc. My ATF is leaving as she sees is not happy thinking it would be more exciting that it is. She laughingly says that most of the guys seem to have gone through the same 2 page training course. She also feels isolated most of the day cleaning, waiting, most guys not even asking her if she is alive. The cleaning up, washing up, making the bed, waiting, cleaning - I think I'd get bored to death now that I am reading this.  We are arranging to continue the relationship we developed that has evolved beyond the usual sp/client. I've seen her cleaning, tasted her cooking, watched her iron and listened as she spoke of what she'd like out of life and it is more home oriented than many of the professional (i.e. lawyers, accountants, etc.) women I've worked with. Many of them will never turn into a housewife.  

An oldie in the profession has told me the lifespan is about 18 months for the ladies she knows. They leave for various reasons but many site the inability of the men to stimulate and satisfy them.

As for love, maybe I'm a romantic even in my old age but, I believe in it. I think the writers here are mixing up love and being in love. I love my ATF and more than likely would not see here weekly if I did not but I'm not in love with her; only my wife have I ever been in love with.

Insightful comments there lit phil...I would have never thought this..lol...I thought most were just guys that were married who really didn't dig their wifes anymore...Never really figured that a majority were just desperate and unable to get it on their own. I figured that the money most hobbyists make alone could get them something outside of the hiobby...

Myself, the reason I got into the hobby, I am still fairly new is for basically 2 reasons.

1- Very shy on the approach when meeting a girl at a bar or nightclub. I dont know what it is, its not my personality, to be shy, I just always feel as if I am going to bug them. Plus you cant really even hear in most of those places. My idea of a good introduction is not repeating your introductory statement 3 times...lol

2- Number 1 doesnt really matter because of the fact that I live in the absolute worst place to be single, the worst place to meet or hook up with women...Cincinnati...lol

Dear CarissaBBW:
I was wondering would you say that they hobbyist would somewhat be like Tony Soprano's Character when he is attracted to Dr. Melfi?  Also would you say that because the way that the provider treats them and is permissive and consoling towards them that could be misconstrued as love as well? I also wondering if you have had any clients or colleague that had clients that would see the phases of how romantically involved and obsessed the hobbyist has become with the provider over a month to three month period?