I'm brand new to the hobby - I've literally never been able to schedule an appointment before.  I've sent a few e-mails to a few providers to schedule an appointment but never heard back from any of them; not even a "sorry, I don't take newbies" e-mail.  The first two were not "newbie friendly", which I didn't even know how to search for until I also registered for a P411 account.  I did offer to submit to any screening they desired and even offered to take them to lunch on me for the same price as a normal appointment in a public place for them to get to know me.  

The third provider hasn't responded and it has been a week.  I'm either doing something terribly wrong or I've just gotten unlucky.  Can you guys look over these messages and let me know what I'm saying that is keeping them from even responding to me to say "no"?

(Provider),
My name is (used real name), and I am a 30-year-old white male who would like to schedule a session on Tuesday of next week during the day.  I'd rather be up front with you about anything that might otherwise disqualify me - I am a newbie, so I don't have any references to give nor do I have any reviews for you to check.  As you know though, the only way for me to get those references is to meet with providers, and you are definitely the provider I want to see!  I can supply whatever verification information you need, but if you don't normally accept newbies, can I offer an alternative vetting process?  I could meet you for lunch on the day and in the location of your choosing (except Thursday, I have jury duty that day), pay you for your time and let you get to know me.  If you're not satisfied with what you see, then we both had a great lunch and it's over there.  If you are, then we can have our session on Tuesday of next week and hopefully you'll be satisfied enough then to provide me with a reference!  Please let me know what the next step is; my number is (used my real cell number).  I look forward to meeting with you soon!

 
I also sent this one to the most recent provider:

(Provider),
My name is (my real name), and I would love to meet you next week while I'm still in Dallas, or the week of the 24th when I return.  Your P411 page indicates you accept clients with no provider references, and that's the boat I'm in right now since this would be my first ever appointment.  I initiated my P411 Basic screening on Wednesday so it should be complete by tomorrow at the latest.   (I sent her a followup PM through P411 when this was completed) With that said, I'm happy to submit to whatever additional screening process you have so that I can qualify to be on your short list of clients.  My number is (my real number); could you please get back to me and let me know what I need to do to qualify?  I greatly look forward to hearing from you, and have a great Friday!

You have only contacted ONE girl who you even had any real possibility of seeing. Being zero for one is nothing to worry about.

 
Only contact girls that are advertising they would see a newb. The other girls think you are wasting there time or you aren't good at noticing details from their profile.

 
No need to lead with your real, full name. Just start with your first name as no need to expose yourself more then necessary. No reason to mention the lunches either. Let that come from them if they feel the need.

 
When they get back to you, they will tell you what you need to provide and then you have to determine how much info you want to give out but you have to provide info to someone at some point, most likely.

That would include home phone and address, and work phone and address.

 
Also, don't suggest a meeting where either party can walk away if not happy for no money.   That will be seen as a turn off.

I see you got a P411 account which is great and you know of the newbie search. I started out the same way as you did and happen to not hear back from my first few emails.  

You can book direct through P411.  

Here is how I do it through email.

HI "name". My name is "______" and I live in the "where you are from or closest major city."
I would like book a date with you time and date. Below I will provide you with my verification information

"First Name" "Last Name"
"City you are from" "state you are from"
"cell phone number."

Myself I have two verification sites  

I give my P411 Id and my RS2K Id

Hope your day is going well and thank you for taking your time.

Warmly,
"your name here"

I hope this helps I will pm you a xxxprovider who has a template just like this I use everytime.

There is no reason to give all of your real personal info in your first intro message to a provider. Many here will say to never give it.

Look for newbie friendly providers and let them suggest the alternate screening methods. You don't need to mention the lunch meeting. Interestingly enough there are some providers who use that as a method of screening, (Public meeting for a fee), but it's usually at their suggestion.

In any case I think like Jack said, it's just a numbers thing. You've been unlucky, or just messaging the wrong girls. I don't see anything in your message that would automatically put you on an ignore or DNS list.

-- Modified on 7/20/2017 11:53:22 AM

Are you actually telling a newb to give out his HOME address AND his employment info BEFORE she even gets back to him?????

 
Come on bro, its our job to look out for these guys, for fucks sake.  

 
I would have expected only 1 of the 3 girls to get back to him, and the one girl may just be on vacay, slow to her email responses or a million other reasons other then his initial contact to her was not enough info.  

 
You are reading WAY too much into only ONE girl not getting back to him.

 
The girls who do get back to him may not require all that info, so I don't see how tossing all that highly personal info out there from jump street is even remotely wise.  

 
Again to the OP, just keep contacting newbie friendly girls and some of them will get back to you. Always be polite and friendly, as you seem to be doing and maybe be a bit less wordy, and you will be fine. Just give it some time.

 

 

These girls are used to working with new guys and they will guide you.

Come on fish, you know better than that.

 
Offering up information that personal is a matter of personal choice and should NEVER be suggested to a newbie as if it is a requisite to getting a date. You, or even I might be that cavalier about providing enough information to ruin the life of a married man or a man with a sensitive job or a morals clause in his employment contract, but to suggest that a newb who you know nothing about should do so is horrible advice and you of all people should know better.

 
The OP should send a polite letter of introduction, let her know he's a newb and ask HER what she needs to make HER comfortable enough to see him. Then he can make up his own mind as to whether or not he wants to take the risk in order to see her, knowing exactly how much information she is going to need.

Thanks to all.  I'm glad to know that I'm not breaking any unwritten rules and that it is common for girls to not e-mail back a courtesy "no" if you don't meet their criteria.  I'll wait to hear back from that third girl; it's entirely possible that she's on vacation.  There aren't that many providers that meet my criteria on the "newbie friendly" list, and I'm not made of money so I'd rather wait to hear back from this one and get exactly who I want.  If I never hear back, I'll relax my criteria to get some references and then be able to look at the girls that only accept people with references.  

END OF MESSAGE

if you get anytime to DC,MD or VA... do not hesitate to contact me... I do meet with new gentleman.

What are they going to do with the info?

 
At least you are bowling them over with a show of good faith, and this worked well for me when I was a newbie.

 
But, if people are reticent to offer such info, then that's OK.   They will just have to wait longer.

that you should post on your local board that you are looking for newbie friendly providers.  A lot of guys do that and seem to get a fair number of responses.

if you are requesting a specific date and time rather than "during the day". Since you are a member of P411, I would also send a request through the P411 site.

One thing going against you is your age. Some providers do not want to see anyone under 35 and sometimes 40. Maybe you could phrase your request as "I'm a mature 30 yr. old . . ."

Good luck.  

The world has changed since you were a newbie. A LOT.

 
There wasn't the ability then to send your info around the world and back in the blink of an instant. Lives and reputations couldn't be ruined in minutes back then by a simple pressing of a button on a keyboard or phone.

 
I don't even know what to do with your "What are they going to do with the info?" question. The naiveté and ignorance of that question boggles the mind.

 
Do you believe all the stories you have read and heard about just here, on TER, of guys saying a gal ruined him with his personal info are ALL lies?  

 
Yes, Fish, it is unlikely that seeing any gal with an ad on BP with no or reviews will get you busted, but does that mean its ok to tell the newbs the risk of that is "minimal?"

 
The goal here, on the NB, is risk MITIGATION, knowing full well risk ELIMINATION is not possible.  

 
To give advice to someone BRAND new in this business to send out highly personal information, and to do so unsolicited, without fully instructing them of the incredible downside of doing so, is staggeringly reckless and possibly quite dangerous.

 
With respect to you Fish, and all your time here, I really wish you would stop doing so.

I think there is a demonstrably greater risk that newbies will seek out gals without reviews who will see them with no personal info, some of whom will be ROBs and others worse.  

 
But I seem to be alone in this view, so I'll accept your wisdom.

There are many such horror stories, but most of the guys who have been outed, just like most of the women who have also been outed, fade away and are never heard from again as most/many of their lives have been completely turned upside down.

Most of us can remember a lot of old members here who were outed by a BSC hooker, or by someone else who got their personal info and have never been heard from again. I personally have been outed and all my personal info splashed all over the internet. Fortunately I was already "out" and no harm done, but the fact of the matter is, I was outed and there was a definite intent to do me harm.  I guarantee you, if being outed could ruin my life, I would NEVER give a person the opportunity to ruin my life over something as petty as a NCNS or subpar review.

 
Newbies should see ONLY "well reviewed" providers, but that doesn't mean they should trust them with information that could ruin their lives without at least being made aware of the risks of doing so.

of ridiculous  advice you are going to give now! What are you thinking? You are well liked and respected around here. People look to you for GOOD advice.  

I am totally on Jack and Gambler's page on this, and can't even believe what I'm hearing from you. 🙁

I have suggested my plan to give out this level of information to newbies or others having trouble meeting up with a fine gal.  And, I have not heard from anyone saying that a well reviewed provider compromised their information.  BSC hookers, yes, but not well regarded ones.

 
I don't recall any invective from those times.

 
I have given out this very information to probably 2 dozen gals over the last few years, and never had the slightest problem.

 
But as I said, I'll refrain from uttering same again out of respect for the body politic.

From a providers point of view, may I make a suggestion?  
I appreciate that you're trying to offer multiple options for verification, but I would totally cut out the suggestion of a "meet and greet" screening. For whatever reason, that is a favorite line of those who don't want to be screened, or are "lookie-lous" wanting to see a provider with no intention of a paid date. I think having that line in there is going to set of alarm bells for 90 percent of the women you meet, and they will assume you don't want to screen and simply not reply. Especially since you only include your name and no other screening info- which I get, just saying.  

My suggestion would be a nice email such as your example above, with a specific day/time/appointment length that you're looking for. Ask if the lady is willing to see newbies who do not have references, and tell her you're willing to provide neccessaaey real world screening info if she does. You could also ask that if she doesn't, if she knows of any ladies who do that she would reccomend.  

Best of luck

While I've had newbs voluntarily send me photos of their DL's or links to their work place websites that show a photo of them and their job title, without me asking for it. Newbs have to be careful with their judgment and not do something that will lead to a possible disaster.  

Even thou JD won't agree with this, I ask for real names and work info from newbs if they have zero references and aren't on P411 to even be considered for a date. Of course they don't have to give it to me and we can agree to disagree and not move forward. Darling, try to keep in mind that you started this endeavor when this biz was truly the wild wild west! The internet is a good thing, however it makes it very easy for people to find out EVERYTHING about someone with just a few pieces of info to go on.

Also keep in mind that like when you were married, a lot of these guys have families and work for companies that the knowledge that they are in the P4P world could prove to be a disaster! While you are happy now, you sure weren't during the not so happy years that you've discussed on the boards when the ex caught you. Unfortunately not all ladies in this biz are nice people, just like not of guys in this private world here on TER are nice people. Things can and do go wrong here sometimes.

Often Newbs become impatient when seeking out ladies here and make "newb mistakes.. While your heart is always in the right place, maybe reconsider *some* of what you have said here.

The best advice I would give the OP is to try to establish himself, join P411 (which he has), don't get hung up on seeing one or two gals that he REALLY wants to see in the beginning, and like you said only seek out well reviewed ladies AND get VIP so he can read reviews and get a better feel for the ladies he's interested in. Sometimes you can avoid ladies who have not been on the up and up with some clients. Reviews are not just for checking out a gals menu. They are also to check for any BSC behavior that might have occurred with her clients during or after a date with her.

You are seasoned and know what's what in this world, newbs are NOT and have to lessen their chances of something going wrong right out of the gate.

Some things to consider darling...

Steph xoxo

-- Modified on 7/21/2017 5:04:03 AM

Your first message made reference to paying her for her time, and made too much of the fact that you are newbie. Never mention anything about $ in an initial communique...that comes across as being possibly from LE.  Simply referencing that you had checked her website will usually be enough for her to ascertain that you are aware of her rate structure.  I would have simply provided her with the info she requested for screening, made reference to where I had heard about her, had checked her website, and proposed a time to meet, and for how long.  Your statement about providing additional info if requested was appropriate.

Pretty much the same commentary on the second message.  Just give her the info she requests, forget about the blurbs about being a newbie.  If she needs additional info for screening, she will let you know.  

Home address and land line phone number?  That should never be needed for screening.  Work phone and address?  Phone number, maybe, if she requires that for screening, and I feel comfortable providing that based on her reputation.  Name of employer and address?  Not in an initial communique...I would pass.

Providing her with the info she requests should be good enough.  If not, move on.  And never mention $ explicitly unless she initiates that topic.

But just for clarification, I don't ever "disagree" with your, or any provider's, verification system. In fact, I routinely take on guys here and bc that they should not pressure a girl to change her methods, as she is doing it for self preservation reasons.

 
Seeing a newb is a higher risk event for a gal, so taking the precautions you need to take will never, ever be questioned by me.

 
My issues is from the guy's perspective. Most have to give up some personal info to some person or some verification site at some point. My point is to not give MORE then is requested and to also know the potential downside of giving out any identification.

 
Not everyone has the same risk tolerance and some people have more to lose then others. I am saying lets give the newb our collective best advice that protects him or her to the best of our ability,  and make them aware of the risk, so at least they will have made an informed decision.

 
Each case is different as well. The OP here only contacted one girl who could have seen him, so that is not a big enough sample size to draw any conclusions from. If he gets back to us after contacting 15 newbie friendly girls and none of them respond back, well, my advice may change, pending other factors.  

 
But just to be clear, every lady has the right to ask for any piece of info from a guy she deems necessary, and in turn, every guy has to consider if what she is asking is within his risk tolerance. If it is not, he should NOT badger the girl about her methods one bit, and he should just move on to the next girl on his list.

END OF MESSAGE

according to his post. And I've also seen you you talk about ladies here trying to "indoctrinate" newbs to do things there way. You usually try to get these guys to see it YOUR way. Still luv ya thou and thanks for the positive words from you about my post.

Steph xoxo

-- Modified on 7/21/2017 7:11:36 AM

But 2 of the 3 are not newbie friendly so no shock as to why they didn't get back to him.

 
The "indoctrination" I have talked about here has nothing to do with how ladies screen. There were several girls here, and you know them, who were trying to tell the newb guys certain things that just happened to fit their business model at the time. I have never seen you do that as you are a professional who cares about others, be they guys or girls.

 
One notorious escort, who didn't have any reviews here at the time, was telling newbs here it was perfectly fine to see girls with no reviews.  

 
That is the type of "indoctrination" I was criticizing and certainly was not directed at ladies who have a more rigorous screening method then most. Tobi would back me on this 100%.

 
And of course, If I think someone is giving horrendous, selfish and potentially dangerous advice, why would I not want them to see it MY way, bc my way may keep them out of jail.

in the nice, professional way you wrote those ladies, I would at the very least respond back. But that doesn't mean every lady would do the same! :-/

I think you are going to do just fine in the :P4P world.

Steph xoxo

I too am currently trying to get setup with my first meeting. Just curious if you were able to.

Do you know anyone who has ever been busted?  What do I need to make sure NOT to do?  Here's what I plan on so far...

1. Bring cash in an envelope, leave on the counter in the bathroom, never discuss anything of a sexual nature so that the donation isn't tied to the activities and I never suggested anything of a sexual nature would occur as part of the appointment
2. Leave my driver's license on the counter next to it - this is the one that worries me the most

I did have to give my real name and employment info to a booking agent, as though the providers say that they all P411 members are welcome, they wanted me to have a year in the hobby and 10 Okays through P411.  The fact that I'm easy to locate on the internet with my company name and real name made this easy for them to verify.  Probably just the cost of doing business before you have references.

Any advice would be helpful - I do have a morality clause, so I absolutely cannot get busted.

1. The envelope sounds fine, and many providers request this method of handling payment. But at some point early in your appointment, it should be okay for you to talk about sex, so that you can ask for specific things, like a bj or a specific position. The suggestion to avoid talking about anything of a sexual nature usually only applies to communication before you meet a given provider for the first time.

2. Do not leave your driver's license on the counter next to the envelope. It's okay if the provider wants to look at it if she screened you via P411 and/or some personal info instead of references from other providers. But there is no reason why you should be leaving your license out like that, especially if you are seeing a low-price provider from BP. It's rare, but even a well-reviewed provider might succumb to temptation and take that license. Or more likely, you forget to retrieve your license later on. Just leave it in your wallet.

A provider requiring 10 okays from P411 sounds really excessive to me. She must have a lot of regulars if she can afford to turn away that much business, and would probably be better off just charging more money instead of requiring so many okays.