With society becoming more permissive, feminists and churchies need to keep the limelight on the profession. One way to do that is to claim there is trafficking around every corner. Most of the women that I've had the opportunity to actually communicate with will tell you of their comings and goings.
The Chinese women I've spoken with usually have 3 choices for work when coming here. Laundry, Restaurant or Massage. It might seem stereotypical but it's true. They typically are older and divorced or seperated with children back home, most of the money they send back home and may try to get their kids to the states. The Thai crew that comes around.. Those girls usually stay around for a year then go back home. One of the last women I was with was Skypeing her mom at the end and telling her she was a maid.. The only place I suspected was possibly "trafficking" with the indentured servitude type arrangements is one of the Korean parlors that has had a couple locations in town. Speaking to one of the women that grew up in the states, she assured me she would work for a month or two straight then go back home to Cali and take 6 months or more off. And as far as the Chinese not coming here.. Yeah there is a group that uses different phone #'s, will advertise a "college" age chick just to be some lady in her late 40's waiting behind the door. If this were a problem as rampant as the media might have you believe, I might be in agreement. Their life might not be what they expected or their first choice, but, as far as I've encountered it has been their choice. Nothing forced on them. So with that said, I will continue to enjoy their company.Asian girls wandering into the prairie seems to be a topic of perennial interest on this board.
I wonder if I am alone in my discomfort with roadshows that seem like obvious venues for trafficking in women. I've traveled extensively in the East, both Near and Far, and enjoy the "foreign" experience, but I find it difficult to believe that these travelers are entertaining entirely of their own free will. Maybe some hobbyists with better Mandarin (or whatever) than I command could clear up my confusion in short order.
Trafficking is bad for everyone in this community and we should not condone it in any shape or form.
P.S. The Mandarin I do know, for this subject anyway, is mostly limited to 太贵了 (tài guì le) - "too expensive". In a culture where pretty much every price is negotiable, haggling is not taken to be offensive, though not haggling might be --- definitely different than here. But, that's fodder for a different thread
If you are commenting on the Bloomington women, they are Thai. I've been to Bangkok where women of legal age work in beer bars and go go bars of their own free will. They can come and go as they please. There's no coercion. The Thai women that travel here are making the kind of money a high price escort in Bangkok makes, except in the USA the time limit is an hour usually and the "menu" is more limited. In Thailand you can spend several days with a woman if you make a connection for the price you're paying for one hour in the USA. As far as Mandarin, I rarely see Chinese escorts traveling to Minnesota. Thai, Korean, Filipina, Japanese, and several Hmong ladies usually.
Your discomfort is unfounded IMHO.
I wonder if I am alone in my discomfort with roadshows that seem like obvious venues for trafficking in women. I've traveled extensively in the East, both Near and Far, and enjoy the "foreign" experience, but I find it difficult to believe that these travelers are entertaining entirely of their own free will. Maybe some hobbyists with better Mandarin (or whatever) than I command could clear up my confusion in short order.
Trafficking is bad for everyone in this community and we should not condone it in any shape or form.
P.S. The Mandarin I do know, for this subject anyway, is mostly limited to 太贵了 (tài guì le) - "too expensive". In a culture where pretty much every price is negotiable, haggling is not taken to be offensive, though not haggling might be --- definitely different than here. But, that's fodder for a different thread.
With society becoming more permissive, feminists and churchies need to keep the limelight on the profession. One way to do that is to claim there is trafficking around every corner. Most of the women that I've had the opportunity to actually communicate with will tell you of their comings and goings.
The Chinese women I've spoken with usually have 3 choices for work when coming here. Laundry, Restaurant or Massage. It might seem stereotypical but it's true. They typically are older and divorced or seperated with children back home, most of the money they send back home and may try to get their kids to the states.
The Thai crew that comes around.. Those girls usually stay around for a year then go back home. One of the last women I was with was Skypeing her mom at the end and telling her she was a maid..
The only place I suspected was possibly "trafficking" with the indentured servitude type arrangements is one of the Korean parlors that has had a couple locations in town. Speaking to one of the women that grew up in the states, she assured me she would work for a month or two straight then go back home to Cali and take 6 months or more off.
And as far as the Chinese not coming here.. Yeah there is a group that uses different phone #'s, will advertise a "college" age chick just to be some lady in her late 40's waiting behind the door.
If this were a problem as rampant as the media might have you believe, I might be in agreement. Their life might not be what they expected or their first choice, but, as far as I've encountered it has been their choice. Nothing forced on them. So with that said, I will continue to enjoy their company.
Media reports are full of claims of trafficking but when you look at the stories on actual busts, seldom do you see anything more than general claims.
The only place I suspected was possibly "trafficking" with the indentured servitude type arrangements is one of the Korean parlors that has had a couple locations in town. Speaking to one of the women that grew up in the states, she assured me she would work for a month or two straight then go back home to Cali and take 6 months or more off.
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with many women here illegally and working both at the restaurants during the day and being trafficked in the evenings. They live in a boarding house situation and the bulk of the money goes to the handler. I was told that every single waitress in a number of restaurants have this life and get paid very little themselves. It's a problem. The very pretty ladies are brought over from China under duress and they will do everything they can to protect their families. I hear this from an attorney that handles these cases for Hennepin county.
Feminism has a very long road to go in China... do women even have a chance there?... I won't hold my breath. The irony is catching up to them as far as lonely men though. They killed so many girls and women that now there aren't that many to marry. What a disaster. Then they send the pretty ones from poor or desperate families and traffic them here. Oye. I am grateful I was born here. If they are "caught" here it's not like their lives improve; unless somehow they can stay. Wanna marry one of these pretty ladies? As usual, I go on a tangent.
-- Modified on 8/13/2013 7:46:01 AM
Another place is at the nail shops....I'm refraining from a tangent on why people should try to get to know these ladies & how to tell what's going on with them just from a simple conversation.
Yes, there too!!! I hear this as well.
60 to 80% of nails shops are owned by Vietnamese in the U.S. The Koreans are next largest group, mostly in LA and NY. Chinese are a bit player. I am in the nail biz and we do not have trafficking for the most part. Honestly, our set-up and public access is not friendly to this type of activity.
Chinese have the rub and tugs. It is here you will find the trafficking as I am told by some of the Chinese providers I know/frequent. As Elan has pointed out indirectly, it is not one World.
For those that are really bothered, do not frequent "Asian" rub and tugs. You are supporting the rabbit warren-like existence that many live before they are cycled around to the next place, in or out of town
100 percent BS. I've dated a few and watched a few open their own stores after working at a R&T for a while. The story is primarily the same. Divorced/Seperated/Widowed woman with no way to provide a living back in China. Not sure what your agenda here is PersonX with your alias. But, it's obviously just to spread lies, supposition and fear. The women also know the risks involved. There are plenty of Chinese parlors here in town that stopped giving HE cause they don't want the risk.
Chinese have the rub and tugs. It is here you will find the trafficking as I am told by some of the Chinese providers I know/frequent. As Elan has pointed out indirectly, it is not one World.
For those that are really bothered, do not frequent "Asian" rub and tugs. You are supporting the rabbit warren-like existence that many live before they are cycled around to the next place, in or out of town.
It appears we both have the market cornered on truth. When a Chinese provider tells me she is moved around the country from rub and tug, to rub and tug - and she's not only one - am I to assume she is BSing me? Perhaps the MT that you frequent and date are not the folks off the boat, but more established folks. Imagine a Chinese person of limited English skills opening a shop after a short time here. I know in this time you will have already met, seduced and dated such a person to be able to form your universal opinion.
What you can accurately say is that the providers you meet do not fall into this category. My experience is different. It only takes a small number of these folks to be trafficked for me to be right. You on the other hand must run the table. Do you really want to take the position that human trafficking does not take place in Chinese AMPs? Really?
No agenda here. My post was mostly about keeping the Vietnamese nail salons out of the discussion.
What you can accurately say is that the providers you meet do not fall into this category. My experience is different. It only takes a small number of these folks to be trafficked for me to be right. You on the other hand must run the table. Do you really want to take the position that human trafficking does not take place in Chinese AMPs? Really?
No agenda here. My post was mostly about keeping the Vietnamese nail salons out of the discussion.
I know 3 laoban's of shops, and gone out with two of them, would love to go out with the 3rd but, she's married with kids, so I've had to settle for her workers. The two I've gone out with both worked at multiple shops in town. Sure doesn't seem like women being passed from one handler to the next.
My select group of Chinese R&T's in town is probably every single one of them. Make a connection with one of the ladies and she'll treat you like a King.
I would love to have the same in with these Nail ladies as I do at the R&T's, but, I don't speak a lick of Vietnamese. Guess I'll just have to settle for staring down their shirts as they give me a pedicure.
Trafficking is real and it's in MN. Some busts have made the paper. The hallmarks are younger, isolated women, low prices, high mobility, and a very active handler. That isn't to say every low-priced Asian is being trafficked, but when I see these girls appear with TGTBT prices and looks, with no review history, poor language skills, and an "agency" they set off alarm bells and I stay away. I just assume they are all given a cover story to reassure prying customers who, of course, really want to believe it's voluntary anyway. And maybe it is.
with many women here illegally and working both at the restaurants during the day and being trafficked in the evenings. They live in a boarding house situation and the bulk of the money goes to the handler. I was told that every single waitress in a number of restaurants have this life and get paid very little themselves. It's a problem. The very pretty ladies are brought over from China under duress and they will do everything they can to protect their families. I hear this from an attorney that handles these cases for Hennepin county.
Feminism has a very long road to go in China... do women even have a chance there?... I won't hold my breath. The irony is catching up to them as far as lonely men though. They killed so many girls and women that now there aren't that many to marry. What a disaster. Then they send the pretty ones from poor or desperate families and traffic them here. Oye. I am grateful I was born here. If they are "caught" here it's not like their lives improve; unless somehow they can stay. Wanna marry one of these pretty ladies? As usual, I go on a tangent.
-- Modified on 8/13/2013 7:46:01 AM
t likely "voluntary" when they are that young and working for agency. It's China and there are dire consequences otherwise. They're screwed.
Where are these "young" Chinese you speak of? Most of the ads for "young" Chinese women end up being a lady that is probably at the youngest 45, most likely in her 50's.
One of my first of these girls didn't like it, but, didn't tell me until afterwards. She did it for one day and was going back to LA to work at a Rub & Tug. Sounds like a person with options to me.
Not likely "voluntary" when they are that young and working for agency. It's China and there are dire consequences otherwise. They're screwed.
Élan, the Derp dude is right. These are not young women by any stretch of the imagination. The fake photos are hot, but for the most part, the actual ones are not. Nice folks, but nothing like underage, exploited as you may have been lead to believe
They ask for help and get sent back or they risk so much to stay here. So do"we" support them in the hobby??
Of course trying to figure that out is easier said than done. If all this were legal, it would make it easier to figure out.
In which case, we would still be seeing the same ladies we are now in much the same fashion.
I see little difference between someone who is trafficked and a girl being managed by a pimp; you could also consider those driven by substance abuse. If you hobby long enough and travel far enough you'll eventually encounter some questionable situations. At the end of the day you never know the full story. You can avoid some of this locally by seeing women that are asian-american (for the most part), independent and well reviewed.
