The way that most of the M&G's operate (at least the ones I go to), there is an entry fee for the gentlemen and ladies get in free.  Usually they are cocktail type parties and no play happens.  

I am fine with that.  Nothing illegal at the party makes for a safe and enjoyable time.  But sometimes I wish there was a little more in the area of adult entertainment value.

So, I was thinking there might be a way to spice the party up a little without adding the danger of illegal activities.  Maybe give a little more incentive to the guys to pay the entry fee.

How about having a raffle.  Put all the guys names in a hat, and pull one out.  Whoever wins gets a free 1 hour session with the girl of his choice who is at the party.  Or, if it's a really big party, do it a few times.  Say 1 raffle for ever 20 people at the party?

All girls coming to the party would have to agree to participate, but hell, it's free food, free drinks, free exposure to new clients, and assuming 9 other girls at the party, only a 10% chance that it will be you.

I think that the exposure the girls get from the parties is very valuable.  I am not asking them to pay to get in, but this seems like a nice way to give a little back to the guys who are paying for the party.

Thoughts?

While I appreciate the thought of wanting me and the other "boys in blue" there, you might want to rethink this.

It's no more illegal than any bachelor auction, or "key party".  No money is changing hands and whatever the guy and the girl choose to do at their date later on is their own business.

All we are raffling off is the exchange of contact info.

You're turning M&G organizers into pimps, essentially- instead of just hosting a party they are directly facilitating sessions between hobbyists and providers- and getting a benefit from it (an admission fee).

Thanks for making my job easier!

You are funny, but clearly not a cop, nor a lawyer.

There is still nothing illegal happening at the party.  No one is having sex at the party, the girl is not getting paid at the party, or at all, in this case.

In fact, the hookup between the guy and the girl would probably be the only legal one to result from the party.  

In fact, who's to say that they don't use the 1 hour for a dinner date?  

Show me the illegal part of that.

Note, I am not a lawyer, and would happily welcome the opinion of anyone actually in the know.  Even if it proves me wrong.  Ok, I wouldn't be happy to be proven wrong, but I'd accept it.

But let's see some actual info, and not speculation.

I think two hats would be a better idea, one for the guys, and one for the ladies. Draw two names, and they're a match.

That was my initial thought, but then I realized the problem.

There are some girls at these things that I wouldn't fuck with Fuzzy's dick.  

I wouldn't want to offend some poor girl by picking her out of the hat, and then having to reject her because she wasn't my type, or whatever.

And before you scream at me that it's a double standard, and the women don't get to choose.  Well, yes, that's the case, but that's how the hobby is.  While women in the hobby do get to choose their clients, most of the time, that's a screening issue.  I've never met a girl at a M&G who wouldn't have rejected any of the guys that were there.

LOL -- Clone if you had my dick you'd get "lucky" more!

I DO however like your idea !  It would certainly spice up M&Gs in a big way to raffle off pussy!  

I also agree with you that I wouldn't fuck 90% of the girls at most M&Gs even if I won them in a raffle.

Toys, & swing club donations/memberships are other things that could be raffled.

but were done by a specific provider and tickets were sold separately.  That way, the hobbyists buying tickets knew who they might be winning time with.

I agree, everyone has their own tastes and there are several women at any party that I wouldn't want to touch.  And it would be embarrassing to turn them down.

But there are many women at these things that do avoid some of the hobbyists there.  And for different reasons. That is why they won't raffle off themselves for fear of having someone they have been avoiding drawing the winning number.

NYC does have some stupid gaming laws on the books. My attorney had also told me to forgo the raffles while in a public setting.
Personally I don't feel comfortable raffling off a provider anyhow.
The NYC Mixers are designed to be parties, nothing more.
I said once before that The Mixers may not be as exciting as the Vegas events, but I am comfortable running them this way.

Thanks for the suggestion, Waterclone. If you have any other ideas, feel free to shoot me a PM, or via private mail.

The winner gets to go home with the pole of her choice.

You mean Fuzzy hasn't make a comment yet?  He must of been kidnapped!

Waterclone, that wouldn't work for mine but your thoughts here:

"But sometimes I wish there was a little more in the area of adult entertainment value."

Just book someone after.  What advantage you have is that you get to see what she really looking like and talks like before booking.

((((If someone goes to a trade show at Jacob Javits Center say to see the boat show. If someone came up with the idea of having a raffle to give one lucky person a boat..... he would be walking the  plank a few minutes after his suggestion!))))

You are right, we go to M&G's to make hook ups. I almost never leave a M&G alone. I already give up income by attending a M&G. When I go to an M&G, I will clear my schedule starting in the afternoon, so that I can get ready to go and then head for the party. Then I will spend 2-3 hours at the party itself, rub elbows, get to know people, then gracefully take my leave, generally with a gentleman in tow. I can expect to see the one and only gentleman I meet at the M&G that night. So I get paid for the 1 or possibly 2 hour date that follows. On any other night though, I might have taken 2 or 3 appointments that afternoon and evening instead. But, the benefit of getting to know my community outweighs giving up an afternoon and evening of income.

But you think that I should just give up any income at all for the evening, so that you can feel like you are getting something for your $20 cover charge. That makes total sense from my perspective.

Yeah, good luck with this catching on. Most of the M&G's I've attended tend to have considerably fewer women than men attending them. Can't help but wonder how many women would show up when they know they are going to be raffled off for free at the end of the evening.

How in the hell do you possibly plan on persuading a lady into doing a FREE session with some random guy drawn from a hat??  Regardless of it being a party to network, I don't think anyone needs to give away free appointments in order to go to a M&G or get guys to pay to go to M&Gs.  Who gets the money from the NYC M&Gs anyways??  Cause I heard they were in public venues with cash bars?  It's only hearsay so who knows.

I think I will stick to Vegas and LA parties.  Where if you don't like paying the entry fee, you don't go.  Or they don't mandate an entry fee which usually makes more people willing to pay anyways.  And parties where I won't have to agree to give away a FREE one hour session in order to put money in the host pocket.  Free sessions don't pay our bills.  Would you go to work for free?  I doubt it.

This has to be a joke right??

Geezzzz,  if you are so cheap that you are not willing to pay the entry fee for the door to have free drinks, free food and be in the company of 30-40 beautiful ladies, then you need to go somewhere else.  

Anytime any type of raffle, talk of $$, any sexual activity, it is the Host that will get charged with pandering or other crimes.  

Most of us do not make a dime from M&G's , well most of us I said, and I have lost many $$$$ having these affairs.  There are guys who feel $50-60 is too much to have drinks, food and company and will not come.  So be it.

I have been asked to not have food, not to give drinks and just charge less, that does not work as if it is in a nice place, then the restaurant/hotel/etc will charge a minimum fee for the room, so then I would have to charge 20-30 just for the room and then no food or drinks for the ladies and then the fine ladies would not come.

But if anyone else wishes to do the next, HAVE AT IT!!  Maybe I am getting too old to do it anymore anyway.  JPW

so one of the guys at the party should have dropped to his knees and licked my pussy till I came a few times.

---No comments from Fuzzy LOL---


(Drinks bought for self by choice as I arrived at an odd time)

My meetings in Atl are usually 50/50 mix or more ladies than men at times.  They are very secure, and the ladies know me and know I will not allow any unwelcome touches or activity and my invites always are very clear to the effect. We have a great time and meet many fine ladies and gents.

 The next one coming up, I have more ladies attending than men. 34 Ladies. So maybe times are too tight for the guys to attend, IE, door fee, then the NEED to see a lady he cannot resist at the party. LOL LOL  

Party on and best wishes to all.   JPW

The only person who gets FREE pussy or even a bj is my SO (in this case, my husband).

Everyone else pays for it! I stopped giving for free when I got into college and I have been very busy with 5 to 6 appointments EVERY DAY with gentlemen who never had to step into a M&G, where guys goes just to evaluate how a lady looks in person before spending money on her.

I don't think the M&Gs are to make friends, they're more for the guys benefits.

The ladies have to take a whole day off to get themselves ready for the party, lose their income for a whole day & evening to - MAYBE - get one or two appointments from it.

Now you are saying they should be raffled, auctioned like cattle in a country fair?

LOL this is the most outrageous fucked up suggestion I ever seen on this board.

"Auctioned like cattle at a country fair" ?

You said it,  not me !  lol  

Honey,

Why would you post this? Seriously think about it.

... at almost all boat shows or car shows I have attended. There are raffles everywhere; just toss in your business card or fill out a ticket with your name & contact info. But their real intent is to get that contact info and send you martketing materials for future events or targeted advertisments.

Back to WC's original idea, if the raffle is FREE for anyone to enter, I don't see how it could be illegal.

L2K

Waves above the crowd to WaterClone

I've got a blue moon for ya.

You still miss the point. If the money isn't going to MY hands, why in the ever loving hell should I give it away for free?

Now, if the original poster had said that the woman would be reimbursed her full donation by the M&G organizers, that would be entirely different. But this idiot thinks that just because the women get free drinks, one of them is supposed to give it up for free? Hah, fat chance.

Most of the ones in NYC are $100/person.  Not $20.

If I go to every one there is, just in my immediate local area, that could come to over $1k/year.  For that kind of money, I thought it might be nice for a little added incentive.

As for your argument about income lost because of attendance at such a M&G...  If you are working regularly and have enough business then you don't really need to go to a M&G, except for your own enjoyment.  The main reason for a M&G, for women, is to be seen buy potential clients and hopefully expand their customer base.

It makes sense to give up 1 evening's income if you can get 4 or 5 new clients out of it.

But if you don't see such benefits from a M&G, then it's probably better for you to just take the appointments and not go.

Some of them are in public venues, but they are still private parties.  The host of the party books the bar, pays a certain amount/person to the place for the food and open bar.

Some of them are in private venues such as studios.

And there is an advantage to the girls to participate in such a thing.  First of all, such an incentive makes it more likely guys will keep coming to the parties and paying for such.  As long as the parties keep happening it's a venue for them to meet new potential clients.  Plus, free food and drinks all night.

Also, a the guy who wins might pick a girl he has never seen, really like her, and end up as a regular client.  She could make thousands over the long run, from that first promotional giveaway.

People post looking for BBFS, complaining about girls high prices, begging girls to lower their prices, etc, and you think my idea of a promotion is the most outrageous fucked up suggestion on the board?

You really think guys are the ones who benefit the most from the M&G's?  Because we get to meet girls that we could find on the Internet anyway?  

Don't get me wrong.  I like a party as much as the next guy. Probably more.  I go to almost all the NY parties and have been to them in Vegas and LA as well.  But it's the women who generate business by attending the parties and meeting potential new clients.

If you have 5-6 clients a day, then congrats.  You don't need to go to a M&G to get new clients.  But lots of girls are struggling.  I know some girls who sometimes are swamped with business, and sometimes can barely make ends meet because times are hard.  An opportunity to meet potential clients is a valuable thing for anyone who wants to increase their business.

I am not trying to be an asshole, but since you think this is such a wonderful idea.

Plan a meet and greet with this as an incentive for everyone to attend, and let us know how that works out for you.

..........kisses

You aren't getting it either. I said $20 as an example. The point is, I ain't a friggin Christmas turkey, and access to my vajajay is NOT yours or anyone else's to give away. Is that message more clear? If the girl is being fully compensated for the time being raffled off, fine, its all good and go have your fun. But why the hell should the women be expected to give away their service when they are not the one organizing or benefitting from the M&G?

Furthermore, even at the $100 cover you mention, you are talking about women in a market where $$$$-$$$$$ is the norm. You really expect to be given the opportunity to spend an hour with a lady at a cost that represents only about 20-25% of her hourly rate? Give me a break.

And as to the value of networking as an offset to giving away the golden goose for free, sorry fella, but you vastly overestimate the value of an M&G to most women for networking and increasing their clientele. M&G's are fun, that's why I go, and why I don't mind missing out on a little bit of income in order to attend one. Myself, I spend more time talking with other providers alot of the time. Its nice to hang out in a social setting with the few women in my life with whom I don't have to hide my 'secret identity'.

Frankly, your idea comes across as the height of arrogance, and utterly disrespectful of the fact that providers are WOMEN, not raffle items. Turkeys are raffle items. Sex toys are raffle items if you want to have an adult theme. Get it? Sure, I've seen so-called 'bachelor' and 'bachelorette' auctions. They can be fun for charity. An M&G is not charity. Someone is making a profit on the affair. Women make a profit when they go home with someone at the end of it. But you are expecting the woman to give up what money she would have made just to make things more interesting for YOU.

How many more women need to pile on this thread and tell you how stupid your idea is before you figure out the idea is NOT one that floats among providers?

Some flaws in your logic. We can assume that the girl in question has ads up, and we can assume she has enough reviews in order to get access TO the meet n greet. If the lucky fellow who wins hasn't seen her by that time, who says he will now? Why hasn't he seen her before on his own dime? Was she priced out of his price point? Probably. So what are the chances he'll see her again as a paying client? Slim. What did she get for giving away a $$$$$ service for free? A few free watered down drinks. Yay for her.

Dollar for dollar, M&G's are by far the least lucrative avenue for meeting new clients. I think I have two regulars who I first met at an M&G. Since the majority of my customer base is made up regulars, that isn't saying much. I can almost always count on slipping off somewhere privately with someone following an M&G, but that does not always guarantee the gent will be a regular. My experience has been that the men who attend M&G's tend to be men that place a premium on variety. Hence they like to spread themselves around and won't be seeing the same woman every other week. The men who tend to be the most consistent regulars aren't at M&G's. They look for a small number of providers that they can rely on, and when they find their ATF(s), they are done looking. They aren't attending M&G's to look for new dates. Maybe they go to socialize, maybe they don't.

So for the women, it just comes down to, there is no incentive to participate in some sort of raffle. None. Unless the host is reimbursing her for her hourly rate.

First of all, it's just a suggestion and no one (Provider or Hobbyist) has to do anything they don't want to do. A raffle is not the worst idea in the world. For starters, the organizer can simply ask the ladies attending if they care to donate a one hour lunch/dinner meeting in a raffle. If they say no then that is that. If they say yes then that is their choice and whatever happened (or didn't happen) after such lunch/dinner is also the choice of two consenting adults. I've organized many events that have involved raffles and/or auctions and many have involved lunch with an actor/actress, workout sessions with a trainer, dance lessons, etc. It's really quite simple, if enough providers donate a meeting then it might be worth it and a little fun to add it on to a M&G. Again, for those ladies that don't need to donate their time to get additional bookings and just want to actually meet and greet old friends and see who is in the hobby these days then good for them. A raffle can happen with or without their participation if enough of the other ladies choose to participate.

Secondly, a hobbyist should not be compelled to buy a raffle ticket, but should be given the option to buy one for a certain fee. Or perhaps a raffle ticket is given to each hobbyist that pays the entry fee and he has a chance to win the above-referenced lunch/dinner with a participating provider only.

To keep things on the up and up the proceeds raised from the sale of raffle tickets or a portion of the entry fee paid would pay for the lunch/dinner. It is very easy to give an Amex/Visa gift card to the winning hobbyist and let him and his "prize" pick where they want to meet. Whatever happens between them beyond that is totally up to them.

I think Waterclone's heart was in the right place but maybe his execution was a little off as it seemed that he was forcing ladies to participate. I think if you look at it like a charitable donation it looks very different. Don't beat the guy up for trying to spice things up. After all isn't this the place where we bounce ideas and topics of each other in the interest of making this hobby fun and safe for everyone?

Maybe I'm dumb or slow but I don't see how the hell it would be of any benefit to me to give away a free appt to a guy who paid YOU to come to YOUR party?  You think by giving away free appointments we are going to gain more clientelle?  Yeah I think you're REALLY wrong here to say the least.

If a client really wanted to see me, he wouldn't wait until he had a shot at a free appointment to see me.  And such men that wait for free anything, usually don't repeat again unless......it's free.  As for free food etc, I can and do gladly feed myself every day 5-8 times.  Free food and drinks sounds like the type of guy who books an appointment once and then constantly ask a provider to go to lunch or dinner with him off the clock.  We can pay for our own things.  

A lot of the more successful hobbyist might actually look at something like this as desperation on the ladies part.  If you are so concerned with how much money you spend to attend such M&Gs, maybe you shouldn't attend them any longer?  Spend that money on a provider or a new TV or something?

We are women, not slabs of meat or raffle prizes.  Raffle a 40inch flat screen if you want the men to participate more.  Hell, then maybe they could have a legitimate reason for the SO to leave to if they came home with such a prize.

You know I adore you WC, but no matter what you say, I will never agree that it is beneficial for me or any other lady to give a free hour.  Essentially we make the parties. Without ladies, do you think guys will actually attend?  And why should we have to pay 4 times the amount the men are paying to attend what is suppose to be a social gathering??

If you want the guys to participate more, then change the venues up a bit.  Do something to attract more ladies to the parties.  Stop doing the same thing over and over.  More ladies usually equals more men.  

Here in Vegas, we don't raffle ladies off, we don't ask them to give up income to attend our parties.  But we do different things.  Bbbq's, pool parties, mansion parties, bar parties, SuperBowl parties, March Madness.  Change the party style up.  Instead of a bar, rent a house with a pool.  Guys love the though of a women in a bathing suit much more than a woman in an cocktail dress.  Do a costume party, do a themed party.  Change the shit up if you want to attract more ladies.  Remember again MORE LADIES=MORE GUYS.

If I were in NYC, I'd drink and eat until the raffle was announced and then go pee and never return LOL.

I have known waterclone for years. His intentions are good and he was simply making a suggestion to add a little excitement to a M&G. Nothing more! He has always been respectful to providers and his fellow hobbyists.

I think a couple of you need to have a M&G with a Jack Daniels and happy pill and go back to your corners.

So the organizers get paid. One lucky guy gets laid in addtition to network and the "food and drink" that we seem to think is so valuable on this thread.And the ONLY one giving up anything is the lady????
I ask, "why are  can't the organizers give the donation?"

I would NEVER ATTEND any party that expected me to give it away to, "whomever".

If ther eis an issue abouteh cover charge then that is another story. I'm way happier to pay $100. tehn give it away.

Wow.  This has been an adventure.

I made a simple suggestion.  I welcomed advice from people who had actual legal knowledge.  I thought I was fairly polite in the way I presented it.  

Among other things I have been accused of exposing of to the world, posting the most fucked up suggestion on the board and being a cheap bastard who probably tries to nickel and dime everyone he sees.

Let me say that I am grateful to everyone who responded in a civil manner.  Some people saw merit in my idea.  Some disagreed with it vehemently.  Some thought it was a joke.  In any case, there were a number of men and women who participated in a constructive manner.

To those who were less than civil, well, I won't say what I am thinking because, quite frankly, you aren't worth it.  Good luck to you.

Hey Beautiful.

I appreciate your mentioning that you'd be happier to pay the entry fee than do this.  This would be cheaper for you, though.

Remember, if there were at least 9 other girls there, it would only be a 1 in 10 chance that you would be the one.  More girls, even a smaller chance.

Just from a mathematical perspective.  Over 10 parties, you would give up 1 hour valued at $500.  As opposed to paying $1000 to go to the 10 parties.

Of course, if you would rather pay the money than be the prize, that's a completely valid opinion.  There are other issues at hand besides financial.

Not that it matters.  Clearly from the response, this won't be happening.  I was curious to see what others thought of the idea, and I got my answer.

the option and some were in and some were out by their own choice that would be a way to make everyone happy and ad a new fun spin on the event.

So this is what you got for free. Thats a lot more than you wold get frm them on your own.
Its not a dating site, these women are in business. They are donating their time. thats it.
Want free pussy...go pick someone up in a bar.
these are women not bullshit to be raffled off. Thats rediculous.

I'd like to point out to you that M&Gs in Phoenix AND Houston where acts of prostitution/solicitation/pimping were allegedly performed were the ones that got raided by my fellow officers. (Oh, and consider that prostitution constitutes offer and acceptance- you don't have to be doin' the Wild Thing for the popo to give you some complimentary stainless steel jewelry and a free car ride).

Really, it's VERY simple: the way to keep M&Gs safest for participants is to avoid committing crimes at them. Anything where you can plausibly connect a) money changing hands and b) people having sex as a result of a) needs to be FAR FAR away from a M&G.

I don't want to beat a dead horse.....

I like the creativity exhibited by Waterclone.  There are way too many problems (and in particular in NYC) with the notion.  It can easily be viewed as a form of unlawful conduct and it is better to play it safe.  If nothing else, the recent post-party issues on the aspd bd tells us that.  

I do think we should find a ways to make to the parties a little more exciting and interactive.  (This from a guy who tends to hide in the corner..)

Peace/Out

I agree!  Allow me to do the pleasure!!!!  My pleasure as well as yours.  LOL   Can you come to Atlanta tonight? (G) JPW

I know girls who have raffled themselves at their own parties and that's cool.  But I'm not leaving myself open to be the "chosen" one just because I attend a party.  

Love ya WC, but if you want the entertainment beyond the party itself - pay for the entertainment beyond the party itself.  And I know you do contribute to the hobby machine but at least then the provider will have some choice in the matter.  See you soon over a drink  E

an idea like that. I truly doubt any provider would agree to  give away for free, what she always gets paid well for. A meet and greet is just that, a place to meet and greet. If you want to spend time with a lady, then you need to make an appointment with her and pay for her time. For us providers, this is a business. If we wanted to give it away for free, we would go out to a club and pick out the gent ourselves to take home and not choose to be raffled off to the guy who pulls our name out of a hat. Nice try, but highly doubt it would ever fly

You never met a girl who:  wouldn't turn any of the attendees down or would weed out folks met at a meet and greet.

Not sure what you meant but we do meet guys at meet and greats that we won't book or see...  Many many times over

Raffle off a TER membership!

Clone, if you ever decided to throw a party alongthe lines you wanted, i would love to attend.

Good luck, you've read all the feedback here, AND there

As I recall, the lady had volunteered for this, and presumably was comped beforehand.  

Also, I don't think many of the ladies would go for this, as some have afterparty arrangements made in advance.

If you want to spice things up, the ones that occur in private venues have been known to have some crazy things happen...

to free pussy...
LOL

My thoughts were /are along the lines of raffling off a dinner date...no $ exchange, unless agreed upon in private. Maybe even a nice theraputic massage. Just something nice and easy. I for one would be willing to share a small amount of my time for this.

I understand some will find this disturbing, but i have always had a giving nature and believe in what comes around goes around.

One of the other reasons for this idea is to just liven up things a bit. Not in any kind of illegal way...just maybe some fun party games to break the ice. These partys can be nerve racking experiences for all involved  Lets bring some fun and ice breaking ideas to the table.

I for one dont go to get business, just to have a ball and meet new friends.

have to put my clothes in the dryer now...thoughts welcome!!

Blissfully yours, Belle.  PS- Bond...i love ya!!

Yes the NY M&Gs are parties at private areas of public venues, but it is open not cash bar. The entry fee, which is only being paid by the gents anyway, pays for all the free food, hours of free drink, room rental, security and possibly music, which in NYC is all very expensive. So now you know who is getting the money from the NYC M&G and you don't have to rely on completely wrong hearsay anymore. Happy to help.

As to the idea of the raffle I agree with you it's a bad idea for several different reasons that have already been explained here.

How about reduced rates being offered to the guys who attend.
This can be done via raffel or by the individuals.

In the hobby, there has to be a meeting of the minds between hobbyist and provider before a meeting takes place.  Sometimes, a few e-mails work, other times, meeting and talking at M&G will, too.  It all depends on the comfort level each side establishes under whatever conditions prevail.

With respect to Clone, his intentions were not evil, cheap, or out of bounds.  Bad idea?  Maybe.  Cheating any ladies who agreed to participate?  No, but I still think it is a bad idea.

Herr Doctor, you should kill this thread once it has run it's course...it's poison on a board that's supposed to be fun!

and the party went off with out a hitch.  The tickets were sold for $20 each for 1 hr of their time.  I don't know about the legalities but the ladies did not appear to have trouble selling enough tickets to make it worth their while and it was their IDEA.
Doc

I could see a pre-arranged "show" perhaps but a random raffle isn't fair for reasons mentioned already.

But the problem of course is if you have new people coming in you don't know who they are and that's the risk. A pre-arranged party (orgy or whatever) implies everyone has been pre-screened and the lady or ladies involved are okay with that.