"I understand your cynicsm, however, believe it or not there are more than a few honest business people in Nigeria. I know, I met several here in California while I was going to school. To automatically brand an individual, even if he is a stranger, corresponding from Nigeria as a scam artist, or some other type of criminal is like saying all african americans sell drugs,or all latinos living in the US are illegal, etc."
You are wrong. Anyone from Nigeria who insists on paying with a cashiers check is setting you up for fraud. Honest business people from Nigeria will understand and pay you some other way. The entire system there is rife with fraud and it is organized with the help of government officials. How many US government warnings do you need to understand this? 5 years ago I spent 2 months there (in Lagos) on business and it is one of the scariest places I have ever been to. Our compound was assaulted by men with semi-automatic weapons, the streets are filled with burning garbage, their telephone system barely works (maybe 1 hour per day if you are lucky), 2 of our group came down with typhoid, and there is pretty much a state of civil war between the muslims and everyone else. Believe me, they have no honest way of getting a hold of US cashiers checks.
who handles False Arrest.
I know that I could look to the LA County Bar Association, and I will if it comes down to that.However, I would like to keep it in the family if I can.
The facts are as follows.
I am in the process of starting a very small informal business exporting vintage and otherwise obsolete computers and parts overseas.
As of right now I only have two customers, both of whom pay their invoices without question.
About two months ago, I was solicited by a third individual who claimed to live in Nigeria. Before, you say anything, I know about all the scams and other horror stories. This individual wanted to pay by cashiers check. I insisted on using pay pal. I finally relented as it was a substantial sale. I did insist however, that I would not ship until the check cleared.
I received the check, and went to the bank it was drawn on. I specifically told the tellar that I reason to believe that this check might be a forgery and could they please look at it and let me know. I then told the tellar, that if, and only if the check was a valid document would I wish to have it cashed. Had I wanted to just cash it I would have walked up to the booth, and laid down my id and told the tellar I wanted to cash it, after signed it. I never signed the check nor, did I tear off the stub.
Anyway, apparently, all the tellar, and then later, the branch manager heard was that I wanted to pass a forged check.
The police came, I was arrested, and after a harrowing 4 or 5 hours was released after finally convincing the Detectives that I wasn't connected with whomever forged that check.
My contention is that if the tellar and the branch manager had listened to what I was telling them, the worst that would have happened is that they would have confiscated the check. To tell you the truth, I expected the check to be bad. However, if the person on the other end had been on the level, this would have represented a very substantial sale for me. That is why I approached the bank on the off chance the document was genuine.
My PI attorney seems to think that I have a case against the bank for false arrest. He admits though that he does not do this type of law, nor does he know anyone who does. In addition, he isn't certain how to measure my damages in an instance such as this.
He suggested that I contact either Gloria Allred, or the Cochran Firm. Now we all know that this, assuming that I have a cause of action at all won't be sexy enough for either of these firms.
Therefore, can anyone refer me to someone who can advise me.
As before, my pm is still down. So please respond either on the board, or at [email protected]
As before, and always thank you for your help.
I'm only going to comment on one aspect of this story: How could you honestly believe that selling ANYTHING to someone from Nigeria who pays you with a cashiers check would be OK? You've heard and read about the scams - you admit that you have. You set yourself up to be given grief. Now you want to sue the bank? You brought a forged check there knowing full well that it was a forgery. So what if they didn't listen to you? Maybe they did but still decided to call the police? Geez.
-- Modified on 4/30/2005 1:22:28 PM
I understand your cynicsm, however, believe it or not there are more than a few honest business people in Nigeria. I know, I met several here in California while I was going to school. To automatically brand an individual, even if he is a stranger, corresponding from Nigeria as a scam artist, or some other type of criminal is like saying all african americans sell drugs,or all latinos living in the US are illegal, etc.
I admit that there was a POSSIBILITY that the check was a forgery. The only way to determine that would be to step forward and ASK!.
I appreciate your response but I still contend that I approached this correctly, and if the bank did listen and call the police? That seems all the more reason for me to sue.
As I requested previously I would appreciate a referal to someone willing to discuss this with me, free, or for a fee either way.
Thank you
"I understand your cynicsm, however, believe it or not there are more than a few honest business people in Nigeria. I know, I met several here in California while I was going to school. To automatically brand an individual, even if he is a stranger, corresponding from Nigeria as a scam artist, or some other type of criminal is like saying all african americans sell drugs,or all latinos living in the US are illegal, etc."
You are wrong. Anyone from Nigeria who insists on paying with a cashiers check is setting you up for fraud. Honest business people from Nigeria will understand and pay you some other way. The entire system there is rife with fraud and it is organized with the help of government officials. How many US government warnings do you need to understand this? 5 years ago I spent 2 months there (in Lagos) on business and it is one of the scariest places I have ever been to. Our compound was assaulted by men with semi-automatic weapons, the streets are filled with burning garbage, their telephone system barely works (maybe 1 hour per day if you are lucky), 2 of our group came down with typhoid, and there is pretty much a state of civil war between the muslims and everyone else. Believe me, they have no honest way of getting a hold of US cashiers checks.
Your post has convinced me that Lagos would be a wonderful place to take the family. Which travel agency did you use? Should I book in advance or just arrive and hit the ground running? LOL.
You can try Typhoid-Paradise travel agency. I guarantee that you will have a gut wrenching good time.
I should think the bank should know better at this point ... keep looking for an atty and I am sure you will find one.
xo Lisa
"I should think the bank should know better at this point"
Actually, it's the person who tries to cash the counterfeit check, knowing that there was almost a 100% certainty that it was that should have known better. Banks are under no legal obligation to negotiate with customers who bring in counterfeit checks. In fact they are under a legal obligation to notify the authorities. The cops are the ones who made the decision to take him to the station but he will not have any luck at all suing them since they broke no laws. He admitted possessing a counterfeit check.
Super9's thread about Nigeria is interesting but it doesn't answer your question.
False arrest means that the police (or whever actually arrested you) knew you were innocent. The facts you recited don't suggest that the police had such information. and the fact that they released you after a few hours suggests that they let you go once they understood the facts.
You can't sue the bank for reporting you to the police, since police reports are privileged.
If the bank itself had detained you you could sue it for wrongful imprisonment, but your question makes it sound like the bank called the police quickly and says nothing about the bank holding you captive. If I read these facts correctly then you have no case against the bank, either.
Even if you had a case, an ordeal of a few hours in custody probably would only be worth several thousand dollars at most. If the case was against the police there would be no chance of punitive damages. If the case was against the bank there would be a chance of such damages but the chance would not be great. Even if you could get punitives the most you could possibly get would be ten times your actual damages, but even that is unlikely; two or three times the actual damages would be more realistic.
Winning such a case would involve a lot of work by an attorney. Even being optimistic your judgment would be something like $40,000 and the lawyer's fee would be just 40% of that. This would leave you $26,000 from which you would have to pay costs and expenses (which could easily be more than $26,000), leaving you with a very small return and a lot of time and aggravation along the way. And even this assumes that you can win the case.
You might have a simple negligence case against the bank, but it would be worth even less than the case I just described. The case would be easier to litigate but I still don't see how it would be worth pursuing.
Maybe someone else will see things differently, but I think you should let this go. Stupid mistakes happen and sometimes they cause a lot of grief, but this one just doesn't seem like a big enough deal to get excited about.
Police reports are privileged? Objection your honor, my client (Officer Illbedamned) is invoking the police report privilege! lol.
What evidence, civil, or penal code are you referring to?
I don't mean privileged in the sense that they can't be used as evidence. I mean privileged in the sense that the person making the report can't be civilly liable for doing so. It is precisely analogous to the litigation privilege and the official acts privilege, among others.
All of these privileges are contained in Section 47 of the California Civil Code. The pertinent portion of that section says, in part:
A privileged publication or broadcast is one made:
***
(b) In any (1) legislative proceeding, (2) judicial proceeding, (3) in any other official proceeding authorized by law, or (4) in the initiation or course of any other proceeding authorized by law and reviewable pursuant to Chapter 2 (commencing with Section 1084) of Title 1 of Part 3 of the Code of Civil Procedure . . . .
California courts have long held that filing a false police report cannot form the basis of civil liability. Since you seem skeptical, I refer you to the following line of cases going back over 20 years:
Navarette v. Holland (2003) 109 Cal.App.4th 13; Beroiz v. Wahl (2000) 84 Cal.App.4th 485, 494-496, 100 Cal.Rptr.2d 905; Cabesuela v. Browning-Ferris Industries of California, Inc. (1998) 68 Cal.App.4th 101, 112, 80 Cal.Rptr.2d 60; Dove Audio, Inc. v. Rosenfeld, Meyer & Susman (1996) 47 Cal.App.4th 777, 781, 54 Cal.Rptr.2d 830; Fremont Comp. Ins. Co. v. Superior Court (1996) 44 Cal.App.4th 867, 876, 52 Cal.Rptr.2d 211; Passman v. Torkan (1995) 34 Cal.App.4th 607, 616-619, 40 Cal.Rptr.2d 291; Hunsucker v. Sunnyvale Hilton Inn (1994) 23 Cal.App.4th 1498, 1502-1504, 28 Cal.Rptr.2d 722; Cote v. Henderson (1990) 218 Cal.App.3d 796, 806, 267 Cal.Rptr. 274; Williams v. Taylor (1982) 129 Cal.App.3d 745, 753-754, 181 Cal.Rptr. 423; Johnson v. Symantec Corp. (1999) 58 F.Supp.2d 1107, 1108-1113; Kashian v. Harriman (2002) 98 Cal.App.4th 892, 927, 120 Cal.Rptr.2d 576; Wise v. Thrifty Payless, Inc. (2000) 83 Cal.App.4th 1296, 1303, 100 Cal.Rptr.2d 437; Cruey v. Gannett Co. (1998) 64 Cal.App.4th 356, 368, 76 Cal.Rptr.2d 670.
If you're still skeptical, by all means read any or all of these opinions. You'll see that I'm right.
And this isn't just some quirk of California law. I believe all fifty states have similar code provisions, as does the federal government.
Since you have so often posted as if you actually know the law, I'm surprised that you would challenge me on something so basic. Every law student knows you can't sue for making a false police report, but evidently this is news to you.
To quote you -- WTF!?
-- Modified on 5/1/2005 11:34:12 PM
-- Modified on 5/2/2005 8:41:07 AM
I cannot imagine anyone ever bothering to read one of your posts again much less take it or you seriously.
Sidone took a great deal of time to rebut your position. You should be grateful someone cares enough to do that. Instead, you respond with invective, and modified invective at that.
I actually didn't spend that much time responding to WTF!'s post. I had recently read Navarette v. Holland (the first case I cited) for my own reasons, and the rest of the citations come from that case. Most of them came from a single paragraph. Reading WTF's post reminded me of the Navarette decision and I quickly found it online. I then copied and pasted some of its text, and then edited it to make the list more presentable.
I don't know what invective WTF! might have used, since I didn't see his original post. Rodmewell evidently did, and so may several other users. I am curious about what he said, so if anyone knows I'd appreciate a pm.
I just read what happened to the provider at the top of the page. After reading her story, I am wondering whether or not I too might be subject to rearrest as a result my incident.
To recap briefly. I was taken into custody for attempting to verify the authenticity of a check that a "client" sent me.
Prior to being interviewed by the detectives, I was read my Miranda rights, and after being asked by the detectives to speak with them anyway, I agreed.
In the course of the interview, I was asked to fill out and sign a small post card size form. This form essentially was for me to provide next of kin information, etc.
An hour or so later the supervising detective told me that they were going to take a "worthless document" report, and then allow me to leave. Aside from this last form I mentioned, I was not asked to sign, nor was I given any other form, or citation requiring me to appear in court, or anywhere else. After reiterating their advice to not let this happen again, I was escorted from the building and allowed to leave. So,this leaves me with two questions. First,since none of the police personel involved, either uniformed, or detective expressly, or implicitly stated that any charges were going to be filed against me, is this the end of this disaster, or might I be subject to rearrest at a later date?
Secondly, presuming this is the end of this affair, what reports if any will be generated by the police, and can I get copies? I am refering to the LAPD.
As always thank you for your help.
Yes. The police may have forwarded their case info on the the DA. His office will make the final determination on whether to file charges.