Las Vegas

Re: If...
MrTwister 3 Reviews 1425 reads
posted
1 / 26

I've seen several websites, and now just saw an ad, that basically says (paraphrasing) "If you cancel you owe me xxx".  

If you haven't prepaid, how do they intend to (hate to use the word, but...) 'force' you to pay?

It seems fair to me to request some form of compensation for the cancellation, and I gladly would, just not sure how they collect it?  

Beyond asking, and then I suppose threatening....what are they suggesting when they say that? And how do they pursue it? I guess I mean in the event the person cancelling doesn't intend to comply with that request.....

 



-- Modified on 1/15/2014 1:15:31 PM

CarlyCrawford See my TER Reviews 814 reads
posted
2 / 26

First off cancellations happen, they really suck especially if you only see 1-2 clients per week but plans change because meetings run long, flights get canceled and business partners insist on buying you dinner... For a girl to threaten you that you owe her if you cancel is pretty ballsy and a bad business practice (especially if guy wants to see you the next time they are in town). I have had clients send me an amazon gift card or paypal when they had to cancel but it was always their suggestion/idea and obviously very kind but never expected.  

I imagine the only way a provider could extort (and yes I would consider it extortion) money from someone is to by threatening to use the personal information you gave her on the screening form against you to make you pay...  

Part of the dual accountability that TER/Screening offers a provider is the comfort knowing a client won't harm us or rip us off because we have a certain amount of personal information on you (First/Last name, hometown, where you work)... Meaning we believe you aren't going to beat us up because we know where you work and could send the cops to your office and press charges. It is sad there are some girls out there who are using this good faith giving of information to do this kind of harm to clients...  

P.S. Just had a funny thought because sometimes it's the girl who has to cancel the date, if that happens are you supposed to mail a BJ to the guy? lol
Posted By: MrTwister
I've seen several websites, and now just saw an ad, that basically says (paraphrasing) "If you cancel you owe me xxx".  
   
 If you haven't prepaid, how do they intend to (hate to use the word, but...) 'force' you to pay?  
   
 It seems fair to me to request some form of compensation for the cancellation, and I gladly would, just not sure how they collect it?  
   
 Beyond asking, and then I suppose threatening....what are they suggesting when they say that? And how do they pursue it?  
   
   
   
 
-- Modified on 1/15/2014 1:28:11 PM

MrTwister 3 Reviews 771 reads
posted
3 / 26

Actually..she offers extra time, or a discount. It seemed fair to me! And a nice gesture...because cancellations DO go both ways.

Heathergfe See my TER Reviews 781 reads
posted
5 / 26

as does my hair salon, massage therapist and my nail tech. Just like I have to pay for a missed appointment I also expect the same courtesy from my clients. My policy says less than 24 hours notice and 50% is required, 100% for NCNS. Now, in reality only upstanding gents  ever pay this to me. So the majority of the time I cannot collect. It is a gentleman's agreement so that a gentleman knows what is expected of him. He checks a box on my site that he agrees to this cancellation. They are able to make compensation electronically or by mail or any other agreeable situation.  
I know I have had many guys pass on seeing me because of this. I also offer that if I have to cancel or am late I make up the time to him, gratis.  
All this being said, our hobby life is supported by our reputation. My reputation would be tarnished if I canceled and did not follow up with a free or discounted date. Although I would never use his personal information to extort payment I will follow up with his references to let them know that they are giving a good reference to a bad client. I feel justified in saying he is a bad client because he could not make the date with me unless he agreed to my cancellation policy. In the case of a NCNS I will also put his name on as many blacklists as I can find.  
If I give a reference for a client and then he is a bad client I would hope that the lady would contact me so I could make note to either refuse him references or at least include that information to the next lady who asked.  

Posted By: MrTwister
I've seen several websites, and now just saw an ad, that basically says (paraphrasing) "If you cancel you owe me xxx".  
   
 If you haven't prepaid, how do they intend to (hate to use the word, but...) 'force' you to pay?  
   
 It seems fair to me to request some form of compensation for the cancellation, and I gladly would, just not sure how they collect it?  
   
 Beyond asking, and then I suppose threatening....what are they suggesting when they say that? And how do they pursue it? I guess I mean in the event the person cancelling doesn't intend to comply with that request.....  
   
   
   
 

-- Modified on 1/15/2014 1:15:31 PM

MrTwister 3 Reviews 854 reads
posted
6 / 26

Makes sense. I think what you said here is typical.

Alyssa Marie See my TER Reviews 752 reads
posted
7 / 26

If you're going to "quote" somebody, please use their words, not your interpreted made up version.

You men back channel. Us ladies back channel.

That's just life.

jgoodman222 14 Reviews 828 reads
posted
8 / 26

Well, I know to never make an appointment with you

Alyssa Marie See my TER Reviews 734 reads
posted
9 / 26

Somehow I didn't even see the part where she wrote blacklist..

Sorry about that...

So many topics lately where they are just bound to bring confrontation..

Can we just go back to having fun and keeping this underground world of us a little more street and drama free?  

That's all.

Edit: let's keep the Vegas board fun. The general discussion board is where people can go if they want to get involved in back and forth banter. :)

-- Modified on 1/15/2014 3:23:43 PM

Heathergfe See my TER Reviews 784 reads
posted
10 / 26

Do you NCNS? Then I appreciate that you never make an appointment with me. I have never done that so it is not part of my repertoire.  

Posted By: Uptonogood11
Well, I know to never make an appointment with you.  
   
 

jgoodman222 14 Reviews 764 reads
posted
11 / 26

In ten years of hobbying, I have not NCNS'ed once.   A NCNS can happen for any number of perfectly benign reasons.  A simple misunderstanding regarding date and time, a lost phone number or malfunctioning phone.  Under your theory of customer service, the poor schmuck who made an appointment with you is going to be on "every blacklist you can find".

Thank you, but I think I'll pass.

oralconniseur 10 Reviews 780 reads
posted
12 / 26

provider that has that policy. It sounds like a threat, so it does not matter how hot she may be; I will pass. I am looking to enjoy their company and have a fun time. I do not need the drama.

Heathergfe See my TER Reviews 672 reads
posted
13 / 26

It does amaze me that it is not common courtesy to show up as promised and make up for it when you cannot. Anyway, I am sorry that I responded in the first place. I want this to be a positive environment  and not a hate fest. I really didn't know what I was getting into. I do want to clear one thing up because I am afraid that there may have been a misunderstanding.  
First of all there is no reason to blacklist nice guys who happen to get lost on the way to an appointment. They are not a NCNS because a nice guy will eventually call to explain himself.  
NCNS means no call/ no show. It is when the guy stands you up for an appointment and then never contacts you again to apologize or anything. For instance, recently I exchanged 40 emails with a client planning his date. He told me all his fantasies and requested 5 wardrobe changes. I also had to get the hotel room for our meeting. We were in constant communication up until about 30 minutes prior to the date. Then he doesn't show. I leave messages. Maybe he is lost or running late. I email him asking if I should wait around because he is running late. He NEVER responds. He turns off his phone and never, not the next day, not the next week, but never contacts me to explain why I got all dressed to see him and paid for a room and he didn't show.  

This is not the same as a guy whose car breaks down and his cell phone dies so he has no way of reaching me but then calls or writes the next morning so very sorry for missing our date and could I please reschedule or let him make it up to me some way.  

This is also not the guy who says "Hey, my meetings will be done at 8pm. I cannot commit right now, but if I text you at 7 and you are still available would you want to come over for a date when I am though?" Obviously this is not a NCNS or a cancellation.  

I know that a lot of guys will pass on seeing me because of this. That is OK. I don't really want to see guys that wouldn't want to make it right when they don't show up for a date

jgoodman222 14 Reviews 736 reads
posted
14 / 26

Heather, you miss the point.

There is a saying in customer service, "The customer is not always right, but the customer is always the customer."

Your "policy" sounds like a threat and while your essay is well written the statement "put him on every blacklist I can find" comes across as threatening and vindictive.  It is what I and everyone else who reads your post will remember about you.  I have a client who owes me over $5,000 dollars.  Have I sic'ed  a collection agency on him?  No, I know he is good for it.  Even if that weren't the case, I still wouldn't file a collection action.  The damage to my reputation among potential clients would cost me more than what he owes me.

You may be out the cost of a room from getting stood up, but your posts here are going to cost you a lot more than one room.

MrTwister 3 Reviews 820 reads
posted
15 / 26

For her sake, I am sorry I asked the question. As much as she admitted she was sorry for answering it.

I think in fairness she is just venting her frustration when it happens. Maybe it happened recently and she feels particularly burned by it. I agree with her post about the tone of the board. I certainly didn't intend to stir up any sort of venomous tone, but unfortunately, have. I just thought it curious having seen it a couple of times on websites, and then very recently on this site in a provider ad. Again, for me? It seems reasonable. I just wasn't sure if there was some common means to collect, and if it was more of an extortive thing, then that would be something to be wary of for those providers who advertise it. And I passed on one BECAUSE of that notation on their website. Not knowing for sure what they meant by it, or what they intended to do, because frankly, the odds of a no show can be fairly high when you're trying to schedule things tightly and the variables surrounding the time are out of your control.  

The one woman who stated her feelings and methods pretty much answered it for me....and I was relieved to hear it mostly comes down to future referrals. That makes sense. Especially for NCNS.

I hope you collect your 5 grand buddy...it's definitely a fine line, deciding how to deal with that end of the client spectrum. Those customer's in my book are fringe, and at some point you have to cut them loose.

jgoodman222 14 Reviews 699 reads
posted
16 / 26

I don't think tone of the board was venomous.  She stated a position and several others disagreed with it and pointed out potential consequences for her business.  

She has gotten feedback regarding her business practices.  I worked with a guy who was fond of saying "there is no such thing as negative feedback."  Comments regarding business practices provide data points that can assist in making future decisions.  She is free to ignore this data or incorporate it into business practices.

My policy as a consumer of her services is that a provider who would blacklist based upon NCNS is not worth the risk.  My sense is that most hobbyists would agree with that assessment.

oralconniseur 10 Reviews 707 reads
posted
17 / 26

I understand that it is a business and the main source of income for most providers; and when a hobbyist does a NCNS it may cost them in lost income. But I think a better way would be to have a policy that future appointments will not be made if someone NCNS (without a legitimate reason because life happens); rather than advertising a cancellation fee policy which will turn away potential clients.

I own my own business (and several other previously) and sometimes you do not make money on every project, but owning your own business is not for everyone; because if it was no easy to be profitable on every project then everyone would have their own business. The key is to ensure that you are profitable more often than not.

Because I own and understand business, and the time and effort that goes into it, I am always on time and never a NCNS

Alyssa Marie See my TER Reviews 704 reads
posted
18 / 26

I know what you meant.:)

I'm pretty sure what Heather wrote was taken out of context.. We know the difference between a NCNS time waster and a person who made a mistake. Most of us are mothers, older sisters, etc and we have bs radars..  

I'll say it again, I wish these topics would stay on the general discussion board. Vegas is a place that we move to for the fun and excitement. Vegas is a vacation people decide on to get away from all of it. Let's keep Vegas the wildest city in america and let the Vegas TER board reflect that.

Ishootcraps 27 Reviews 646 reads
posted
19 / 26

Heather d'angelo is an fantastic provider and receives my highest recommendation, ESPECIALLY for a long date, and here is why.

A long date many time involves going out to a show. For that you need a girl who is EXTREMELY committed to being on time. Having $300 worth of show tickets and a late provider who is not in regular contact with you is really nerve racking. Heathers policy, which maybe stronger than other providers policies, goes both ways.  If she NCNS she gives you a free date. If she cancels with in less than 24 hours you get a discount the next time.  So while her policy is tough, she is willing to take the same medicine as you.  

Other points I'd like to make here are:

Reporting someone as a time waster or NCNS is not exactly the same as being "black listed". That status is reserved for people who are dangerous. It may be called a black list board, but it's not the same as "being black listed". From what I've heard Date Check allows providers to rank client in some format.  

Many providers that have to cancel also try to assist you find a replacement. That's is very helpful.  

I think discussions like these, while not the same fun stuff, should be encouraged on the board.  The issue is can we, as a board, have discussion where we disagree but still respect each other, and simply agree to disagree. I believe these discussions help to shape and rethink all our policies, provider and hobbyist alike. Personally I think the GD moves to fast. Beside, we know each other, we are a tight knit community.  Where better to have them. IMO we don't need to avoid these discussions, we just need to learn how to have them.

Alyssa Marie See my TER Reviews 709 reads
posted
20 / 26

The board could have discussions where people could state their thoughts without people jumping down their throats, then ok..

Can you let me know when that happens.. ;)

Ishootcraps 27 Reviews 708 reads
posted
21 / 26

Not coming to the appointment, not calling in advance if you have problem or need to cancel, AND not calling afterwards to explain your self.  

The risk you are taking is the risk of your own behavior.  

The 50% 24 hour cancelation fee is a little more risky since it involves other people's behavior, work, family, illness, blah blah.  But I always know what I'm doing the day before, so 24 hours is not that bad. Also the date length is an issue. Canceling an hour is one thing, canceling an overnighter is something else.  I would take that risk with Heather, not certain about someone I didn't already know.  

As far as NCNS, I have the opposite problem , I email them too much in advance of a date. (Sometimes too much afterwards as well)

Ishootcraps 27 Reviews 666 reads
posted
22 / 26

I think this one came very close, much better than others

Beside it's only a day old, maybe by the time it reaches the bottom of the page everyone will kiss and make up.

Alyssa Marie See my TER Reviews 705 reads
posted
25 / 26
Shaunna See my TER Reviews 835 reads
posted
26 / 26

Ok having read what has been said i have something to say.

What most of you guys probably are not aware of is that unfortunately there are quite a few 'clients' that make it their job to book dates and send constant emails prior to the meeting and then on the day completely disappear.

Now imagine you had 4 appointments set up for one week and turned down other potential clients because of this.  You've probably spent 2/3 weeks of your time replying to lengthy emails to each client and then you pay (out of your own pocket) a substantial amount to stay in a 4/5* hotel.

Out of those 4 clients only one turned up, one cancelled and two you never hear from again.

Now imagine having this going on for 2/3/4 years.

Are you telling me that you wouldn't have some sort of reimbursement clause on your website to try and filter out the time wasters to the legit ones?

Clearly not every girl has this clause, but just because some do it does not mean they have any bad intentions towards a legit client, this is aimed only at NCNS clients, and they have the right to list him as an NCNS.

And the fact Heather also states that she will reimburse you if she has to cancel screams that she respects your time as much as you should respect hers.

Yes we get frustrated, so would you, this is our lively hood, not a game.

Shaunna from across the pond who had something to say :-)

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