markus88 is an org affiliate masquerading as a monger. I haz proof.

First, let me preface this by explaining this org. This org (also known as Sam's org) is huge, and is comprised of 5 bay area orgs (Asian Angels, Klovers, Kpleasures, Kgirlsacademy, Bunnygirlsclub) and one seattle org (Kangels). They split up AA in the bay into 5 orgs because being a huge org is attracting a lot of attention. Anyway, this will allow you to follow my thoughts and how I arrived to the conclusion.

 
Take a look at this account: markus88:

http://www.theeroticreview.com/reviews/searchbyreviewerResults.asp?MemberName=markus88

 
I've noticed his reviews for BGC girls, and as usual I pay more attention to the first reviews, as they are often done by orgs to get people psychologically to think someone already did TOFTT for them.

 
I look at his reviews, and I find something interesting. Out of 10+ reviews he has, every single one is for AA affiliate. Now, by itself it doesn't mean anything, hell my 3 reviews also happen to be with those orgs. However, 10+ reviews for same org starts ringing small alarms.

The second alarm, now much louder, is that he has 3 reviews for the seattle girls, during the pandemic. And month later, has 5+ for bay girls.

Even without pandemic, seattle/bay area mongers are rare. And usually people who travel want to see other girls than same rebrands they see in their own place. But ok, by itself it's not damning either, however alarms are blaring at this point. First reviews + same org + different places where org plays during a lockdown makes it very likely that these are bs reviews.

We had 'mongers' like this on the donkey for this big org, their names were shector, rajivraj, and so on. Donkey vets know. Theyd post 'tofft' reviews that are extremely generic and dont contain any details about girls, and would have straight up lies, for all the affiliated orgs.

 

Now, let's tackle the content of the reviews. The style is similar, but there are few things there. Only one review mention girls look vs pics. All reviews are glowing yet the scores are not. This I interpret as trying to fly under the radar. These reviews content is glowing, but grade weirdly isn't. Also, almost all of them say the girls do DT. Finding kgirls who actually DT for real, is actually tough. Most of these girls don't do DT, so it's just a lie. We DT enthusiasts know which girls can DT in the bay.

At this point, I am >90% sure it's org reviews. So I go to my database and search for some interesting choice of words (diction).   And... JACKPOT ! We see two corresponding reviews on seattle girls on previous platform.

 

 
 http://imgur.com/a/npZLaJj

 

 
The review for Jo is the same review as for Hara (BGC/AA girl in the bay) on donkey. WORD FOR WORD, Hara doesn't DT.
The review for Venus is the same review as for Miko (KGA girl) on donkey. WORD BY WORD, except the 'cover' part was removed LOL. And btw, Miko never could DT either even if she really wanted to.

 

Not only is the reviewer is a lying sack of shit masquerading as a monger, he is also a LAZY sack of shit. Copy pasting a review thinking you can't be touched.  

Now, let's discuss possibilities that this isn't an org affiliate. Could be a monger trying to get easy VIP ? Nope, who write 10+ reviews for VIP, copying other reviews ? Something to consider is that donkey removed those reviews from public view in February. Unless this guy has a database like I do or he wrote those reviews, he had no means of accessing them at the time of writing reviews on TER. So no, this could not be it.

 

Could it be some real, only shill monger ? If it's a real monger, why would you copy/paste your own review for one girl to the other ? It is extremely unlikely, at all. Why would you copy the review word for word, only replacing girl name and removing mention of cover ? No, this is an org affiliate writing reviews on own girls who don't have many reviews or no reviews at all.

and no, Jo and Venus have nothing to do with Miko or Hara, aside from working for the same organization.

 

I rest my case, ladies and gentlemen. Another day, another org reviewer found on a place that was quoted as having no org reviews. What did uncle rocket say about bay orgs continuing to post fake reviews ? As usual, I know the orgs behavior better than most people on here. Sun tzu would be proud and all that

I'm looking forward to discussion. Too many people on this board starting to say I don't name names and don't point out fake ads or reviews. All you're doing is just poking a bear.

 
And to top it off, looks like donkey returned many kgirl reviews, which I can easily scrape again and compare to ter ones. I will have a great time pointing out fake org reviews.

because the second link doesn't go to anything when I tried it.  First link to reviews is fine.  

Lol, what do you mean it doesn't go to anything?

Open the link. Click on the thumbnail. The link is working fine, I just checked.

I do find it a bit odd that a "shill reviewer" would give such low grades. YES shill reviews by the orgs most definitely does exist. I have have first hand knowledge of this being done, so I am not disputing your point. BUT you would think they'd at least give themselves 8-8's instead of reviews all the way down in the 6-6 range.  

 
Are these orgs new to TER? The reason I ask is that orgs familiar with TER reviews would know that a 6-6 review is often the kiss of death for a provider as most of us are accustomed to TER's "Grade inflation" and a "6" in appearance is code for UGLY to most of us here.

 
Again let me repeat, not ALL of us deny that orgs are guilty of writing their own reviews right here on TER. This doesn't just apply to AAMPs however, There are White, Black and Brown agencies that have done the exact same thing.

It's hilarious cdl brags about using ter with VPN, but has issues clicking on an imgur link in 2020.

 

The lower ratings are to get attention away. After orgs got kicked from donkey, the pr people told them to not spam and be less obvious on here. I think you're not getting the toftt part, the person who does research sees this one review and reads it, will psychologically be more predisposed to seeing the girl than without a a review. Those reviews are glowing content-wise.  

On the previous board, peach cafe (another org) had so many fake reviews for their girls, people were asking how to look for real ones. The fake ones were all 5 bananas (four categories for face body service and attitude) So I was like, look at reviews that aren't all 5s. A week later, this org went and created all fake reviews with 4 bananas each. It was still noticeable since unlike usual rating where you can go 3-4-4-5, all these fake reviews from new accounts had all 4s. This lasted for almost exactly a month, then they went back to the previous model. So yes, by posting these I also expose my methods to orgs.  

 

These orgs aren't new to ter, but historically bay orgs have been on Red_book and then notaampmaps (rm cousin) and when fosta made newhouse close down notaammaps, they migrated to donkey. I assume they didn't spend much time on here. They are used for people shilling for them and promoting them. They thought it OK to come to a monger board (like this one) and just spam ad links instead of a neighboring ad forum. Give the orgs a finger and they'll take your fucking arm.  

 

I don't really see what white black or brown agencies have to do with anything. I don't see them much (remember, I dont give out personal info) , so I dont have competency to comment there. It's kinda like issues in USA and Sudan. I'm sure shit is worse in Sudan, but I don't have the competency to comment on something I don't know well. I live in USA and can comment on US problems I see every day. Same thing here. I've seen plenty of girls to the point I recognize half the girls in LA, I know how orgs fake review brigades work. I can smell bullshit as much as I can smell a Korean apartment from a hallway.  

If we are to trust admin and staff from donkey, some orgs even paid people on fiverr to write fake reviews from templates. And BTW, the reason why these orgs got kicked from there was precisely because of complains about false advertising and fake reviews. So, "whining" as Jensen would put it, does work and works very fucking well.  

 

Anyhow, this guy is clearly an org guy and I'm merely pointing it out. I obviously advise anyone to not trust this guy's reviews on any girls he reviewed or will review.

These scores are more likely to LOWER the average score of most Kgirls rather than raise it.  If he's a shill, he's really shitty at it.

It's almost a tradition, your reading comprehension is seemingly struggling again.  

This guy gives reviews to mostly un-reviewed girls or girls who have one review. This is something I mentioned in my post too.  

How do you "lower" scores of a girl who isn't reviewed?  

If a monger is thinking about a toftt girl but he's scared to get burned, is he more likely to see a girl who had no reviews at all OR a girl who has 7/7 review yet who is praised by reviewer as a must-see and a surefire repeat with claims of great service?  

LOL at "if" too. Keep being a blind org apologist, I guess. Unless you think I made up those Hara and Miko reviews.

Regardless of the reviews being an org, a scam for VIP days or something else if you ask me the entire set -- not only markus88 but ALL the other reviews give me a bad vibe. It might just be due to a bunch of new BA guys all coming on at the same time and using a similar scaling. Not sure though. In any case, I'm not sure I would be using the reviews as a guide to who I might see.

Rocket seems to think somehow people on TER are getting fooled. I suspect few are and any newbies (are there really any these days? That board is dead.) who have paid attention and asked reasonable questions or searched the forums would approach with caution.

I think if anyone looks at the entire picture here the result is that basically the org accomplished nothing and did perhaps really did not mislead anyone. One of the reviews with a substantial set of other reviews actually was more favorably reviewed. One of the girls was down voted by the other reviewers. You cannot really make any call on the others since they don't have other reviews on only one other review.

So the elephant in the post here is all the markus88 only reviewed girls. Did no one see them? Did they seem them and think the one review was accurate so had nothing to add? If not then their lack of speaking up (ad we are talking about review from April to June so time has passed) suggest a local problem with mongers more than with agencies. Grow a pair or use an alias for your review if you're afraid of getting BLed.

But in fairness to rocket I think this type of effort is much better than all the BS discussion about who is or is not pro-agency or pro-monger. This type of post is walking the walk and not talking about "the orgs" (or should that have an e?)

He might give it a week to see what type or responses he gets to the post. If he doesn't get much of a reaction from the community it probably means most take it as I did. Telling me what I already know but not really making a case why I should really care. In the future perhaps he might focus on cases where it looks like a lot of people (based on reviews and the relative satisfaction of the reviewer) feel they got burned and mislead. That might make people think about caring our his crusade. (But I would also suggest dropping the pedantic tone.)

-- Modified on 7/1/2020 11:07:00 PM

"grow a pair if you're afraid of getting blacklisted"?  

 
That's not what cdl and you said to the guy who asked whether he should give a girl who doesn't have reviews and whom he had a "blah" session with, an honest review. I remember well what you and cdl said. Both implying bl and making the girl/org business worse. Oh noes, a poor girl can get her business wrecked by an idiot monger! Can't have that, nah uh.  

And when I started talking about org reviews, cdl told me there are no such things on TER. You could've said something back then, that you know fake reviews exist on here. But you didn't. Apparently you already knew they do exist. Maybe you'll point more of them out and save me some time?  

 
And congrats, yet another time you blame the mongers, instead of orgs and/or girl. Now you blame all bay area mongers. Lol. But orgs are somehow innocent. And girls are purple holy cows who don't fart and don't give out bad sessions and are never at fault, ever. Yeah yeah. We heard these ducktales. Take the cape off.

PS. it seems like you still don't get it. I don't care whether or not the org tactics worked. The fake reviews are here and my mission as I vowed, is to expose them and make sure there are less of them or that there is awareness. And I'll do it wherever bay area orgs advertise the reviews. Which is here now.  

 
Everything else is just phooey. I'm here to point out fake reviews and talk about girls. But TER won't let me talk about particular girls much unless it's a review, but what if I saw this girl last year? So I talk about particular girls and give advice on other forums. Even then, I namedropped a lot of girls in rebrand thread, bay area threads and so on.

-- Modified on 7/1/2020 8:09:49 PM

Bull Shit. The only thing I have ever said was that was a risk one might take.

 
Also we're talking about a set of reviews YOU posted so it is not the case of no reviews and being the first to review. I never told anyone not to write the first review. I have said I often will not write a review off a first visit. That is not telling anyone else what to do, only what I do. If someone else wants to follow they can or they can make up their own mind.

 
And yes I know you only "care" about the principle of the thing. But most here don't really seem to care much about things that don't actually create a problem. You're lecturing everyone and twisting anything said that doesn't follow your absolute truth in advertising into a supporting such events is a bit annoying. None of us need you to save us from ourselves with your lecturing. That was why I suggested just posting what you think as facts -- and do it in a more simple, nonpedantic tone and see who really cares.

 
But since you've really annoyed me know with your continual mischaracterization of my position and statements let me pose this scenario for consideration. You're recently said you used to see K-girls but no longer are. You got BLs from the area agencies and not are on a crusade to  get even. Most of the ads you're pointing out are part of your campaign to get even. That would also fit the patter of most of what you've been pointing out and claiming is the agency done. The fact you can just find real cases of it just means it would be easier for you to hide you efforts. That would explain why you care so much about the principle rather than the results for mongers of such efforts.

In short, you keep lying about what I say so I find it difficult to believe you. Why should I not believe this revenge story about you?

http://www.theeroticreview.com/discussion-boards/k-girl-113/what-do-you-do-after-a-blah-session-with-a-k-girl-17597?page=2

"Given that I my response would be no review and then decide if it would be worth trying again in case it was a case of bad timing (her dog just got run over by a car while walking in that morning, just a low energy day for her, just had back to back difficult clients or even first day on the job type situation) and things just did not click. If she was incredibly DDG with a body to kill for I might go back just to confirm. If same results then a review might be in order if you like reviews. As others have mentioned you might also just do some back channel reporting instead.  "

The last three sentences are key here. You were advising a guy to do one more session and THEN (only then !) do a review "if you like reviews" or even do "back channel reporting" (ie, pms) instead. Why not just let him to do a honest review and let others (like you claim) do conclusions themselves ? What is so bad about a public review vs pm review besides visibility ? Funny how your action there diverges from what you yourself preach. The only two reasons here is to either protect the monger from being BLd (which is not a "grow a pair" response) or protect the TofTT girl business. We all know what your motivation there was. It ain't hard to tell.

 
"You got BLs from the area agencies and not are on a crusade to  get even. Most of the ads you're pointing out are part of your campaign to get even. That would also fit the patter of most of what you've been pointing out and claiming is the agency done. The fact you can just find real cases of it just means it would be easier for you to hide you efforts. That would explain why you care so much about the principle rather than the results for mongers of such efforts."

This is nonsense. I haven't seen ANY working girls since shelter in place took effect in California, and I've been pretty open about this. Just before s-i-p happened, I had a usual 3-girl night. I take COVID seriously because unlike usually, the responsibility is also on me if I bring it to someone who has weak immune system or health complications, such as my elder relatives or small children. As opposed to usual inherent risks associated with mongering, which only affect me.
It's been a tough time for a sex addict like myself, but I held up so far. I COULD go and schedule right now, but at what cost ?

I have not been blacklisted from any org, yet.

My position was exactly the same on last board I was on. How would I get blacklisted and still put out reviews ? Lol, even on TER, I have reviews of the same orgs as the one listed in this thread (or that thread with same girl advertised as multiple girls). These all happened this year.

Ask anyone who knows me from another board if I ever put false information in my reviews, minis or general info. Your theory is nonsense and further trying to detract from my post. If I was on mission to get 'revenge', why would I give glowing reviews to some girls in these same orgs ? Is it maybe because I consider them excellent product that I am comfortable to recommend to any monger looking for service, regardless of org practices ? girls >>>>> orgs .

Revenge for BL is petty. I actually dont mind BL by orgs for anything other than subpar reviews/feedback. If they think a monger is dangerous, etc. it's always better to err on the safe side. I know mongers who come visibly drunk get BLd, and I don't have any problems with that. So once again, by not taking the occams razor, you've arrived at the wrong conclusion.

Also, you keep accusing me of lies.

Let's recap.

You said, in this thread, essentially that you're aware of org making fake reviews, and you don't care as long as no one is misled. Is this a lie ?  

You said, in this thread, that those who are afraid being BLd should grow a pair and write an honest review. Is this a lie ?

You said, in another thread, that nothing, including reviews or 'whining' on forums will affect the org cash flow. Is this a lie ?

You said, in many threads, that newbies should be responsible for researching reviews. Is this a lie ?

You also said, in many threads, that you don't think the reviews as the end of it all. Is this a lie ?

I hope I didn't twist anything that you said.

Now, the question. If all of these arent lies, why are you advising not to write a review here ?  

"Given that I my response would be no review and then decide if it would be worth trying again in case it was a case of bad timing (her dog just got run over by a car while walking in that morning, just a low energy day for her, just had back to back difficult clients or even first day on the job type situation) and things just did not click. If she was incredibly DDG with a body to kill for I might go back just to confirm. If same results then a review might be in order if you like reviews. As others have mentioned you might also just do some back channel reporting instead."

 
it cannot be because you're protecting mongers from being BL, because you just said, "grow a pair".
it cannot be because you think newbies will be misled, because you say it's newbies' responsibility to do research themselves without handholding
it cannot be orgs biz, because you said nothing will affect their cashflow
it cannot be because you think review will be misrepresenting, because you just said its newbies responsbility to do research and they arent the end of it all

so why tell the guy to not write a review and even if two bad sessions keep it on pm and not write a review ?
it makes zero sense given what you said. what would make sense is if you just told him, eh write a review as is and mongers will figure it out.

oh right, theres only one reason that remains. This was my postulate from day one and it slowly grew to me being convinced I was right from day one.  

The GIRL, her REP and her BIZ is the reason.  This is further evidenced by you always dodging directly blaming the girls for service and always blaming mongers instead, as well as stating that you've never had a bad session or a session where you were misled so much you felt cheated.

Tell me where I'm wrong here and where my reasoning is wrong.

I'm only wasting my time on two things you say.

First you take things out of context in your first quote. Yes someone was asking the board for advice. Saying "My response" is saying "Well, this is how I would handle the situation." That IS NOT telling anyone to do that unless they thing it make sense to them.

Since you have ) credibility with me at this point why the fuck should I believe you are not seeing K-girls because some law says stay home or that anyone near you might be at risk.

Unlike Gag I am not saying the following as any expression of affection or agreement. go fuck yourself, eat shit and die. I'm not playing your silly game anymore.

Your advice is what you would do, sure. It's an advice. Obviously, no one on here can make anyone else do anything. And your advice implies withholding information from others and not posting negative feedback. How the hell is it out of context? I literally posted the entire thing, within the very context.

You literally advised someone to not post negative feedback and instead use back channels, saying that's what you would do. And why would you do that, as opposed to actually dropping a truthful review ? The only logical explanation is that you'd want to prevent the girl from getting negative feedback as her first review. Your old profile has reviews, so its not like you don't write em. There is literally no other explanation I can think of.  You said you would write no review.  

Such advice is worse than what orgs do. At least they're getting money out of it.

 
Thanks for ad hominems, they really make your point a lot better.

 
You don't have to believe me. I have no reasons to lie to fellow mongers. Make up any lie about me, sure. People who knew me on the donkey know that I championed the same monger rights for more than a year there, actively seeing girls. I also vehemently defended the mongers rights to post std rumors too (yes I know its against TER rules), because health of even a single monger is more important to me than any girl or org reputation (and let's face it, they don't have much rep left). It has nothing to do with any revenge. I don't really care whether or not you believe me.  

You have a good day and a happy Friday.

-- Modified on 7/2/2020 8:33:06 PM

"If we are to trust admin and staff from donkey, some orgs even paid people on fiverr to write fake reviews from templates. "

The donkey site seems to have more than its fair share of cut-and-paste contributors, although IMHO there are plenty of losers willing to plagiarize the bodies of other guy's reviews and just change the name of the provider in order to get VIP access. Not that I'm discounting your argument that there are shill reviewers out there, as you seem to have done your due diligence in the research department. However, given that the donkeys is another child of a certain Mr. Newsome AKA Mongo who also mapped his rubs on another site, his reputation precedes him, as he often looked the other way when reviews on RM were ripped off from elsewhere, even when presented directly with proof...

With your permission Rocketbro,

Cue The Doobie Brothers' 'Takin' It To The Streets'...

Don't be a snitch, but ok to look out for your monger brothers.  That's my stance.

Which brings up the age old question --) am I my brother's keeper?!  

Rocketbro is a legit monger. I've not met him personally but his threads and reviews back at Nuerotic Donkey made me come to this conclusion.  And I am of the opinion that Rocketbro's ethical position is that he feels he needs to look out for his monger bros against the deception of the orgs we patronize.

He is very steadfast in being pro monger.  I'm thinking his definition is different than mine.  I'm a get along kinda monger and good manners are my keys to Wonderland.  And outing fake mongers, aka org shills, imo is not snitching.

I was taught never, ever snitch to 5-0.  Ever!  Just my style and life choice.  I'm not here to judge anyone including Papa babo.  Judge not lest ye be judged.

My monger bro, Willy, recently wrote a review for Lucy where at the end of the review he called her 'Ruby'.  Honest mistake I say.  What say you Rocketbro?!  Is Willy lazy or an org shill?!

YMMV

-- Modified on 7/26/2020 5:14:06 PM

Well, I'm not saying they should be trusted, but Id take the words of their admin over words of kgirl advertisers. Yes, their staff has turned a blind eye to profile fakes and fake reviews and scammers and that bit them in the ass eventually.  

BTW, a couple of months after donkey kicked off kgirl profiles for publishing fakes, they also rescinded their free access for review policy, so it's now just like mub raps.

Twoon, not sure what your question is. A typo mistake does not make one a shill, no. I think it's fairly obvious.