Why is that so disconcerting? Seriously, if he misbehaves with one, why would he behave with another? Just to have cred or perhaps hes bi-polar or schizo? Guys like that are usually a bit off-kilter anyway, so why would the lady he behaved with not think "dude's just a bit off" even if he didn't actually DO anything untoward. It's called spidey senses. Part of networking with other fellow hobbyists, whether in person (not something I do with fellow dudes) or on places like this, is you get a feel for a person and whether they display sound judgement or not. If the RS2K notes are not recent enough or numerous enough (or perhaps too numerous, I suppose) a lady would do well to ask for more recent references.
JM2C
I don't even know how to bring this up. I feel a little idiotic.
I just got a call from a past guest, pretty sure I had seen him at some point but I don't keep info that long and it had been over 6yrs. I didn't have his info anymore, his description was accurate but almost too spot on considering how long it had been.
I needed to recheck him with a current reference and the 1st thing that pops out of his mouth is that he isn't a cop, LOL, that is not my worry in this case. It is making it home in 1 piece since I have absolutely no idea who this is on the other end of the line aside from knowing exactly where my old location was and what I used to drive. I had to walk away because I still didn't have any idea who he was specifically and he could not supply me with a current reference to visit.
My question to you guys is..... Why? If you are going to wait 6-8yrs to revisit a provider why not have a current provider reference ready? Alot of things can happen in that long. So fill me in on what I am missing.
BTW, he was very polite and understanding on my decline so likely he would have been fine but I am just to careful for my own good I guess.
That would seem like the route to go. I suspect that you have others that don't use "provider references" for use in screening. I know I don't ever use a "provider reference" as a screening tool (but I am RS2K verified...and that is all I use).
And so far no ladies have seemed to have an issue with the information that I provide her. And I've yet to have a lady come back and ask for additional information.
Given how long you have been at this game, I am a bit surprised that you didn't offer this "prospect" other screening methods so that you "would feel comforatable seeing him".
LOL, RS2K is the same as a provider reference and he did not have it. When I ask for a reference that is what I mean, RS or provider ref. Anyone who knows me knows that, and it is my limits. I don't do work verification, and am ubber picky on references from providers.
And so far no ladies have seemed to have an issue with the information that I provide her. And I've yet to have a lady come back and ask for additional information.
Given how long you have been at this game, I am a bit surprised that you didn't offer this "prospect" other screening methods so that you "would feel comforatable seeing him".
If you had seen him years ago and don't have any recollection of the guy...and he isn't interested in screening, YOU take a pass as you did.
As to why guys do this...Because we're guys and WE can. Heck..that's what the gals profess when asked why they do something.
He'll move on and find someone else. I'm sure you're aware that many gals have multiple methods on screening. And guys, like your OP guy, will just keep on searching for a gal that will accept whatever he is willing to provide as info.
And you'll move on and wait for the next guy with the "screening info" that makes you happy.
Simple 
-- Modified on 8/28/2011 2:14:30 PM
I would simply say what you said here, say that you'll be excited to get to know each other again, but since it's been such a lapse in time you need a full new screening on him.
in regards to RS2K...I require provider references always along with RS2K, p411 and Date-Check...
I have cleared previous clients with RS2K alone, and they have shown up and been chumps, or tried to pull something tricky or dishonest. RS2K lets me know he is who he says he is, it doesnt speak on a clients character.
And so far no ladies have seemed to have an issue with the information that I provide her. And I've yet to have a lady come back and ask for additional information.
Given how long you have been at this game, I am a bit surprised that you didn't offer this "prospect" other screening methods so that you "would feel comforatable seeing him".
additional references?
As I posted earlier, that has yet to be the case. But if that is part of your screening process and you would need a provider reference, more power to you.
But that would, in all probability, knock me out of the equation. I am sure that most of the gals I have seen would have no qualms on giving me a "thumbs up", but I can't imagine that unless you knew a gal that I had seen that her "thumbs up" would be of any real value. Again this would just confirm that I am who I said I was. It would, in no way, confirm that I wouldn't be a "chump", try something tricky or dishonest or be a "bad customer". I could still be all of those undersirables, and you wouldn't know that until I was already in the door.
Keep in mind Olivia, all we (guys screening) have to go on are reviews. Some are good, some not so much. And we, like you, can only hope that the "good Olivia" is the one that will be behind that door. What I did find interesting is that a number of the gals who confirmed me thru RS said that they were surprised at the "comments" on RS (and they are supposedly good ones), as they don't see that terribily often. But could a guy change his demeanor, absolutely.
Always do the screening that YOU feel most comfortable with.
Play smart and stay safe.
And I know quite a few ladies who do. It's true...RS2K tells us you are who you say you are- with an ID at the door. But...it does not say that you have had successful dates in the past with reputable providers who can attest to your gentlemanly ways. These are the same reasons I don't take employment screening. When I have broken that rule in the past, it has been a headache and a half for me. One gent was even the first and only to be asked to leave because his behavior was so rude.
Not only do we want to know that you are a legit human (and not an LE robot), we want to know that you know how to behave yourself. Most gents do, but it is the rare rude gent that makes us upset for days to come.
I have rarely have gents NCNS, cancel, or behave in less than gentlemanly ways. I attribute this to doing my homework and not settling for less. Much as the gents should and do with us ladies.
Screening makes us all feel safer, IMHO.
Kisses,
Veronica Sweets
As I posted earlier, that has yet to be the case. But if that is part of your screening process and you would need a provider reference, more power to you.
But that would, in all probability, knock me out of the equation. I am sure that most of the gals I have seen would have no qualms on giving me a "thumbs up", but I can't imagine that unless you knew a gal that I had seen that her "thumbs up" would be of any real value. Again this would just confirm that I am who I said I was. It would, in no way, confirm that I wouldn't be a "chump", try something tricky or dishonest or be a "bad customer". I could still be all of those undersirables, and you wouldn't know that until I was already in the door.
Keep in mind Olivia, all we (guys screening) have to go on are reviews. Some are good, some not so much. And we, like you, can only hope that the "good Olivia" is the one that will be behind that door. What I did find interesting is that a number of the gals who confirmed me thru RS said that they were surprised at the "comments" on RS (and they are supposedly good ones), as they don't see that terribily often. But could a guy change his demeanor, absolutely.
Always do the screening that YOU feel most comfortable with.
Play smart and stay safe.
As I posted earlier, there are notes in my RS file. Why wouldn't that work from a gals perspective in screening. I can only assume if I had misbehaved a lady could contact RS and note that as well. And the next gal that checks out my RS info would have that info so she could make a decision.
I find it a tad disconcerting that a guy will give you (or any gal) a provider reference. And my reasoning on that is he will only give you a "good" reference. Unless the guy is so incredibly stupid to give you the gal that he misbehaved with. This is similar when I interview prospects and they give me their "referrals". If that candidate was so ambivalent to give me a "bad reference", then that is someone who will just wander through life aimlessly.
But as we both agree on...you ladies can and should do whatever gives you the most comfort in seeing a guy. And if this method is giving you that comfort...more power to you!
I personally find it disconcerting that you would refuse to give a lady a reference. It's a pretty standard way of verification. Ladies do NOT update RS2K every time something happens. And you would be surprised at the references I get. No, they are not all good.
You are assuming some things that you have no knowledge of. Unless you have been on the side of a provider and screening gents, I hardly think you know what we are looking for or need to feel safe. It's true it's different for all ladies, and I don't pretend to know what a gent's fears are beyond their personal info being leaked somewhere. I am not in their shoes and have not been on that side of the fence.
I applaud the ladies who screen and better yet, screen hard. We should all stay safe and make sure what we do is enjoyable and fun for all.
I've had a lot of gents tell me that my screening puts them at ease. It shows that I care about my safety and will, hopefully, be just as diligent with their info and time.
Stay safe!
V.
I find it a tad disconcerting that a guy will give you (or any gal) a provider reference. And my reasoning on that is he will only give you a "good" reference. Unless the guy is so incredibly stupid to give you the gal that he misbehaved with. This is similar when I interview prospects and they give me their "referrals". If that candidate was so ambivalent to give me a "bad reference", then that is someone who will just wander through life aimlessly.
But as we both agree on...you ladies can and should do whatever gives you the most comfort in seeing a guy. And if this method is giving you that comfort...more power to you!
Why is that so disconcerting? Seriously, if he misbehaves with one, why would he behave with another? Just to have cred or perhaps hes bi-polar or schizo? Guys like that are usually a bit off-kilter anyway, so why would the lady he behaved with not think "dude's just a bit off" even if he didn't actually DO anything untoward. It's called spidey senses. Part of networking with other fellow hobbyists, whether in person (not something I do with fellow dudes) or on places like this, is you get a feel for a person and whether they display sound judgement or not. If the RS2K notes are not recent enough or numerous enough (or perhaps too numerous, I suppose) a lady would do well to ask for more recent references.
JM2C
better to be safe than sorry. I think the guy must be hobbying very rarely...like once in six years (LOL). At the very least he should get an rs verification if he wants to get back into the game
and had an itch and remembered you and thought you'd remember him. Because he hasn't been around he's back to square one and has to start building a reputation all over again. Bummer...
You did the right thing though and I'm sure he'll find someone to see him. If he's smart, he'll write a review and start building up his rep again if he intends to stick around this time. I can understand why he wouldn't join RS2K if he really wants to stay UTR.
Guys tend to remember everything about every woman we've ever seen. You ladies see many more hobbyists than we see providers so sometimes we hope you'll remember us. Unfortunately, the reality is that sometimes you don't. Oooh, big kick in our fragile egos, LOL...
but I can barely remember every girl that I have slept with for the last month, as a matter of fact if I had to name every woman I have had sex with in just the last month, I could name maybe half, and I barely drank this month. lol
Of course not every guy is any where near as shallow as me. lol
I don't necessarily agree with her attitude about this guy, but it's her business and she has the right to run it the way she sees fit. I will say that I have been hobbying since way before the internet, I don't belong to any screening services, nor will I supply provider references except on the rarest of occasions, and I almost never have any issues seeing the providers I am interested in.
I will confess that the providers that list a whole laundry list of prerequisites required before they will entertain an appointment never get a call or email from me, so maybe filtering out those type of providers increases my odds? Who knows, but I see perhaps a dozen new providers every month without any major drama, so why should I mess with success?
I know of two sisters in arms that have revealed this similar complaint. I have always stayed in contact with my donors over the years. One has married though he spoke highly of me and referred me to a G- associate. The second passed away....Here's a tip..Always screen in your normal fashion. In my Black book I have details about my donors just encase..that will always spark my memory(hobbies,etc). I pride myself on my instincts...Bringing up LE to a sister....graphic details/foul language,,,interrogating tactics/pick your brains for details wil quickly cause me to disconnect!....Pass on that prospect.! Who knows what this gent has been up to over the years. I avoid potential donors who explore the narcotics lifestyle. They will turn on you like a rash----seriously. This is august and Vice sweeps are happening all over....best of luck...stay safe..
In the past I have had gentlemen swear they have seen me when I am sure they have not. I think they feel that if they sound convincing enough, you won't check and they can bypass screening. One I even found on the blacklist.
If a gentleman is on the up-and-up, he will do what it takes to get prescreened.
I think Tabu of Florida said it best. There are guys that start out as good clients. Something changes and they become people you would not want to see. They will use old references (from a time they were behaving) or try to reconnect with ladies from the past because they feel that these ladies will trust them and not re-screen them as they have seen them before. That is why it is important to get current references and why many ladies will not provide references for gentlemen they have not seen in a long while.
I recall a gent I saw many times without a problem. He then saw and stiffed my friend Geministarr for the entire donation. He has also been blacklisted for doing this to several other ladies. He, of course, tried to book an appointment with me saying he had seen me several times years ago. I re-screened him and then turned him down. He had a change in his circumstances as he lost his job, and not his desire to hobby He would either not pay or would throw some singles in an envelope and hand it to the lady as he rushed out the door.
This is not a "pick on hobbyists" response. 99.9% of the Chicago men are wonderful. I cannot think of a better community. We also cannot let the bad ones influence our perspective of the community as a whole. But, we also need to protect ourselves. This is not a hobby for the ladies. If it were, this would be a swingers site. This is our livelihood.
A gentle reminder of the important of having current references and cooperating with prescreening, even if you have met a lady in the past (if its been a long time) benefits everyone.
As long as the guy is RS2K verified or is a TER member, that should suffice
This is often a very discreet business. Just as I would not want a woman giving out my name for a reference, many of the women I see feel the same.
Getting a phone call from a stranger saying, "Hey, Mr. X said he saw you as an escort, and I just wanted to confirm that.." WTF?
Screen his job, background etc.. but I never use a woman as a reference. Its not fair to me or her.
You talk about being discreet. How is providing work info being discreet? Why not provide your social security number at the same time? Also, there is a good reason why ladies don't accept work info in the Chicago area.
If a guy is not RS2K, TER whitelisted, P411, or DC, how is the guy supposed to get screened genius? Also, the guy should ask a provider if it is okay to use her as a reference. If she says no, that's cool. Her decision should be respected.
No screening method is 100% perfect. But to say that using provider references is ridiculous just shows us how little gray matter is between your ears.
As I have said repeatedly, screening is a personal matter. Not all ladies require RS2k membership. If they did, many of the visiting gentlemen would never see a provider as most do not have any idea of what RS2K is when they travel to Chicago.
As far as many of the ladies you know feeling the same way about cooperating with reference requests, did you take a poll or are you extrapolating based upon the comments of one or two ladies or your own discomfort with references? References are a key component to screening. Knowing that John Smith works at ABC Company says little about his character. It does not say whether he is a violent person, when he is a short change artist, whether he books a one hour appointment and has to be pushed out the door in two hours. It also, frankly, does not say whether he is LE. Verifying employment means simply checking that someone allegedly works at a company either by phone or other methods. I'm sure it would not be difficult for LE to have a "cover" so to speak.
Ladies in this industry take their own safety, as well as the safety of others, seriously. We all work together to keep each other safe by; a) cooperating with requests for references and b) sharing info about dangerous clients. Ladies who won't cooperate with reference requests are more than likely trying to keep their clients from straying, rather than being inconvenienced by the request. It happens! I've had clients provider a reference, who I then contacted, and then tell me that as soon as the provider received my inquiry, they were offered an unexpected "special" by the lady.
When a lady asks for a reference, she does not ask the particulars of your visit. What she asks is; a) were you timely, b) were you courteous, c) did you respect the ladies boundaries, d) were you "right on the money" and would the lady recommend seeing you. She does not ask about your favorite position. about your sexual prowess or any specifics of your appointment.
Room service is a fantastic verification service. However, even Cathy encourages ladies to also ask for a reference, especially in the case of new members. All she can verify is that they are who they say they are and not the character of the individual.
TER membership is great and a useful tool. However, without a whitelist and the gent also contacting the lady from the PM system to prove he is the gent who is whitelisted, just being a member says very little. It matters little if the guy appears to be a pleasant chap on the board. He could be entirely different in person. It may interest you to know that a good portion of the guys on the blacklists have a TER identity. So T.E.R. membership and $3.00 should buy you a cup of coffee.
Remember, when all is said and done, its the provider who is in room alone with the client. She needs to feel safe and secure. No system is 100%, but she does whatever it takes to assure herself that she is meeting with someone who is safe to be around.
If a gent does not approve of a lady's prescreening method, its simple "move on." Don't try to bully the lady into changing her screening just for you. Simply find someone whose screening is more in line with whatever information that you are comfortable with providing.
And, however well intentioned (as I am sure you post is), please do not presume to understand the screening nuances of this industry as there are factors that we consider that you do not begin to understand and this is not a lesson in prescreening.
RS2K verification is great, but unless all previous dates are keeping up their end of the bargain and providing feedback on the gents, it's about worthless in terms of knowing what kind of person Mr. Hobbyist really is BCD. You apparently have no concept of how reference screening works. It's really nothing different than if you were applying for a job. The guy decides he wants to visit lady a. He's already seen lady b. Lady a requires a provider reference. Guy emails lady b to ask her to be a reference, JUST LIKE FOR A JOB REFERENCE. Lady b grants said request (or not). Guy provides reference info to lady a. Lady a calls/emails lady b, and lady b presumably tells lady a what a great guy "guy" is and then, as long as she's comfortable with the info from lady b (IOW she feels she's trustworthy) lady a confirms the date with said guy. It ain't rocket surgery.
but it sounds like you wish you didn't have to pass up the opportunity to see him. Maybe he will get in touch again when he has the necessary screening info. Then you can see him and feel comfortable and have an amazing date! Versus being a little sketched out because you weren't able to screen him to your comfort level.
In his defense, it never hurts to ask
Kisses,
V.
I posted because this is not something rare, I have had guys stumble when asked for added info/current screening. This one just seemed fishy to me because he KNEW my old location as well remembered what I drive which are both things that are hard for most to remember from that long ago. That struck me as really odd.
I do regret having to turn him down, he was very sweet. His demeanor was exactly what I crave as a desired guest. But with the spidey senses tingling I had to walk. I learned long ago to listen to my gut, because any time I have ignored it there has ended up being a problem.
To the gent that commented that references are ridiculous.... REALLY? Proper way to use a lady as a reference is to ask said reference first if she minds providing a reference to XXX provider. Some ladies do not provide references, some are unwilling to provide references to shady providers. There are alot of reasons and ways for references to work. Not only do traveling gents not have RS but some traveling providers don't have it either, so how do you propose they screen? References.... Ding ding ding
Lastly, I really thank everyone who wrote. I knew what I did was right for me, and it helps to hear I am not the only one.
I remember certain aspects of certain dates, and some dates I could tell you exactly how it all progressed down to little details that both would remember, perhaps. I only know the rides that maybe 3 of my past dates drive, and that was just because we walked to the parking lot together afterward. Interestingly enough, one was a white Explorer, another other was a White Suburban. Once upon a time, I went thru a list in my head in chronological order of all the ladies I'd been with, how much it cost, including hotel and transportation, and realized I could've bought a car with all that money. That was about 3 years ago, and I would be hard pressed to do that today.
I'll preface this by saying that your safety must come first and you have to trust your instincts, so I think you did exactly the right thing. That being said, in the guy's defense, I hope I remember every detail of our date for the rest of my natural life (and at the moment I still do). You have that effect on people.