Can only comment on personal experience.
I have been with a provider who was putting her way thru Architectural School( for real, I am an engineer and builder, she was the real deal)
I have been with providers who were unbeleivebly enthusiastic and fun and truly seemed to enjoy the "work".
I have been with providers who DEFINATELY did not seem to want to be there.
So , to make a unilateral statement, at least to me, would be inaccurate.
So I went to my first AMP in Providence a few weeks ago, and while I had a great time, something has been bugging me ever since.
I was wondering what a rough percentage of the girls who work at these establishments, are doing so against their will. Anyone have any guesses?
While I had a fantastic session, and the girl really seemed into it, something about it has been nagging me ever since. I know there are many moral landmines in this hobby, but I really don't want to be a part of a slave trade.
I probably should have thought about this, before ever going, but again, my big head wasn't doing the thinking, and to tell you the truth, I had a great time and would love to go back, but I don't think I am going to
This was on the news a week ago, but again the media is always sensationalist!
Hos
I imagine it's impossible to know numbers, but there are enough horror stories out there that I've never gone to one. An escort who is bored and there for the money is one thing, but a girl who is there because she is beholden to someone who snuck her into the country under the auspice of being a waitress is something I don't want to encourage with my business. That's just my take.
what does amp stand for? what is it?
and while the stories of them all bivouacing at the AMPS ans cooking their rice meals on sterno (gasp!) are true, they consider themselves lucky not to be in an electronic factory outside of Seoul working 14 hour days for a buck an hour while being sexuallly abused by the foreman. (And those are the lucky ones in Korea!)
In short, the world is a miserable place for most people, and things are relative. The gals get protected by the mamasans, get to have some spending money to go out partying once in a while, and if they are smart, they save some (Also send a lot home to their families helping to lift them out of poverty.) and eventually take lessons to learn English, get a better job and lead a good life, as some of her friends (and she herself) tend to do.
It beats plucking chickens for Tyson any day.
The upright citizens brigades can kiss their asses.
I don't know man.
I used to live on the West Coast and I started doing some academic research on AMPs because there were a large amount of them around where I lived. (There also was a naval base there...)
Girls were getting driven in from a van from Koreatown on a daily basis. Between the commute and the hours they worked it was close to a 14-16 hour day. Sure it isn't a factory but that isn't exactly the American dream.
To say it is all a bit relative is bending things a little bit much. It is akin to saying that slaves had it better here than in Africa because they had better housing and clothing.
I am careful not to moralize this hobby or world too much but human trafficking and "sexual sharecropping" shouldn't be supported.
I'm with pbjohn. Good analogy to American slavery.
I avoid any provider who may be in this line of work involuntarily. It's one thing to work because you need money, (we all do that) but it's another when someone else is making you do it.
In my experience, especially from conversations with those providers with good English skills all over the country, the work is voluntary. Most Asian cultures don't have the same hang-ups we Americans have about sex work. Are deceptive practices used to get girls into the business or, does slavery exist? Probably, but I doubt its the primary MO. Many providers have told me they are happy with the work, happy about the cash they receive and, make frequent trips to their homeland.
The question poses another valid argument for legitimizing sex work, and, taxing it like everything else.
By comparison, the inner city street walker that is working to support her habit and her controlling pimp is a genuine victim.
ARG
Jesus Christ.
Can only comment on personal experience.
I have been with a provider who was putting her way thru Architectural School( for real, I am an engineer and builder, she was the real deal)
I have been with providers who were unbeleivebly enthusiastic and fun and truly seemed to enjoy the "work".
I have been with providers who DEFINATELY did not seem to want to be there.
So , to make a unilateral statement, at least to me, would be inaccurate.
Every single woman there was someone who was doing what she was going willingly. The money was great, she was safer there than some other place, and she could leave anytime she wanted.
But it might be because I went to the places where things looked somewhat reputable.
But to draw a rather interesting parallel.. Keep in mind that at legal brothels in Nevada, the women must stay there during their "shift", and cannot leave while they are "on duty". So there are similarities between the brothels in NV, and AMPs in other places.
my friend works customs at JFK and USA just open their visa restrictions to korea. I been to plenty of AMP and most girls are allow to go out whenever they wanted so IMHO i don't think most are held against their will. 2 that i knew were college students that worked part time at AMP.
Folks, I'm a little shocked by the responses here and your belief of what is written about another arm of the hobby.
If you read the article posted (and all previous articles, mainly in the Prov Journal), who attended this rally (who always attends this kind of rally) are:
Cops
Politicians (on their soapbox's)
Clergy (nuff said)
Right-wingers (dont these people have lives!)
That's it!
Politicians want face time in newspapers/on the news.
Clergy/right-wingers want everyone to live their lives as they do, guilt-ridden and repressed!!
AND newspapers/news stations just want readership and ratings, period!
This is the same rhetoric they've attacked the hobby with for years.
Being an AMP customer has allowed me many conversations with women from different parts of the country/world.
They are no different than any other SP other than the language barrier.
Yes, a lot are Korean and they tend to have a rotation of girls.
But, from my experience, there are no signs of abuse, forced employment, drug-addiction or underage girls.
To the contrary, one of my ATF's is currently on 'vacation' (AMP term for no longer working) having her "B's" enhanced to "C's".
She is having the procedure in CA, taking 2 months off for recovery, still sending $ home to her parents and paying her rent/car insurance in NY for her conv 328 BMW.
Does that sound like someone being forced or like her sister's, someone who's made a rational choice as to her chosen trade?
Yes, you are going to have instances where the girl is not into you/caught in a bad mood/realizes that this 'job' is not her calling.
It's called 'mechanical' and or bad service which we've all experienced (and have reported) and is the core reason for this (and other) site.
I do not doubt that someone has had forced, underaged girls in a house somewhere.
But do we lump all AMPs into this category?
If so, then ALL providers are junkies working to support their habits, beaten daily by their pimps and carry AIDS/other STD's, correct?
Common sense and our own 'Constitutiion' tells us to form our own opinions and not be followers.
Criticizing/condemning without full knowledge is akin to what happened to the people in Salem, MA not too long ago (by the church, no less!).
These ladies have enough people currently working against them.
What they really need is support and acceptance which I happily give to them when my wallet allows.
BTW - If I ever did suspect any abuse, underage trafficing or drug addiction, I would be the first to report them to the authorities/here.
J
on the hobby, in general, and slave trade in particular.
Of course, that's why you are there. The conversation?!! Ya, right.
You are no more knowledgeable on the subject as the people demonstrating against it.
You are naive if you don't think its possible. Perhaps its not as common place as the media would have you believe, but don't dismiss it as nonexistent.
Yes, I have spoken with quite a few ladies who speak very good english (Korean-Americans mostly from NY and CA). Haven't you ever spoken with a woman when on a date, PD?
I make no claim to being an expert, but I am smart enough to know when someone is being coerced/on drugs/doing something against their will as we all should be.
And I, in fact, do have more knowledge than the demonstrators, as do we all, through participation and observance.
As far as why I'm there and my naivete to dismiss human-trafficking/slavery as non-existant, that's just childish.
Of course someone has done this (as I previously stated); it's deploreable and the offenders should be prosecuted/jailed.
But, should the AMP industry, as a whole, suffer because of acts of a select few?
Is that what you're saying?
If so, then you are as hyocritcal and uneducated as those who condemn the entire SP industry.
-- Modified on 5/5/2009 10:02:12 AM