I’m convinced that a lot of hobbyists here have a well honed approach to picking up a civvie woman at a bar. I’m also convinced that many guys haven’t a clue about landing a new SO at a bar.

If you’re a provider with an active civvie life, please advise this naive hobbyist on how to improve his civvie pickup score:  

In your own civvie life, what are the one or two key attributes of a guy’s pickup style that make all the difference to you? And what are the deal breakers?

Hobbyists who believe themselves to be successful at ‘the game’ should feel free to chime in and offer tips

In finding an SO or forming a relationship unless she is a provider.  

I love the relationships I have with providers. LOL

Picking up civvie girls in bars requires some degree of conversational skill, decent looks and a bit of luck.  Hiring an escort requires that you be willing to give a woman enough information about yourself that she will be willing to let you pay her to have sex with you.

Boston gay I love your postings .. you formulated it EXACTLY
 1. equires some degree of conversational skill.. as to looks .. who cares .. women do not  care how man look but how he hold himself and treat her ..

 man as e say in Europe    have to be a bit more handsome then monkey is  but please woman all ways she desires . so .. fellow americans  you do not have idea  how sad and ridiculous look american ales in europe   seating alone on company of  amle freinds looking around as they  do fear  something but yet in their eyes.. youc an see this desire ..of have fan and  girl; seat next to him  as soon as girl will try - he will start complain that here a lot of drinking and a lot of  dancing and that he is hardworking hard playin american man with belive in  J Christ OMG !!! as you can imagine this way are most American males  even not those who are on TER  

 and on TER  here more even LESS social   males then others  
.. that you come here there is a reasons  and this reason  not always  that you want be dsicret but just you can t  convince woman to love you ...
 
if  not your money .. do not know who made you feel that way .. may your american women .. it is not just your fault that you are soooo insecure  with no your assets.. with no your house no your money you feel as you are  ZERO ....  
 trust me .. no there is nation in the world  in which it is more then in america - out dollar value on human  reatinship on relatinihsip between man and women especially .. you are males totally  fine .. when your  wives admit - I never would notice you should you  have no money when we met .. wives have guts to say so ..  
if not money  you have I never would date you .. how you feel??
 a ?? you took it up to your ass poor american man .. and even smiling and making jokes on that .
 while any other  man just will be unhappy with such statement ..a s .. ah.. Iam not good enough to love me with my my house ??  
with no my boat  car  etc ,. and as result man feel so insecure and as they are zeros ..
 of course it is not only comes from women   treat of you you are here also not an angels .....I do  not care because I not planning  to marry in states should he have money  or not .. both ways be wrong money make people become  horrible ... ..
lost last human traits  as .. as think about lover separate from his her bank account and house he she lives in .
 Oh sorry .. I  changed the subject . so I was trying to  tell you  that all nation here has to go to therapist to lean normal ways  to socialize   out ..
not seat and watch sport TV in bars or if go on girl go on her the way she would ran from you  hard workers hard players you are. americans  ah ah ah a!!  
 fact is that yes ..  
if you see 4- 5 men  seatign alone in the bar with no  women there - it be fellow americans ..
  and you on TER even more ... shy .. it is escalde who posted here tons of posting admitted once -  and  when I be  brave enough to gave her my bussness card and invite to the room ..
 but who knows.. your women .. may be   they will report you as sexual predator  
 sad sad sad..  country  as to  love relationship true values sex ..is SCREWED  and I m not here too but I at list can escape  time by time to keep check and  balnces.. what are your check and balances  system on how to stay active adult >> TER ?? DC ?? P 411 ?? coomooonnn ..ha ha pm me who want here more ..
 but Boston man I LOVE HOW YOU stated about TER and Dc and ETC  
 you need give her your personal info so she feel comfortable let you pay her for sex  
 ca not be  nore clear  
 same with wives I hope  I hope they do marry you because they feel good about you and able let you pay for her ... but  you know here hookers can be more honest then wives .. seh can  see or not to see  if she not likes him she would not lay with him anf your wives doing it   or not ?? or they are decent women ah ah ah .. O guess they are .. they are decent ... or we be here not busy at all  
Kissess sorry for not perfect englis

-- Modified on 7/16/2013 9:39:04 AM

That you american males totally  afraid women in real life (  who s fault it is yours ?? or  females do not know but  know that  cheerleader can sue a boy  saying he pick up under her skirt).. seriously ..  fascism in this country on its way  .. you people not realize it  hard working hard playing  afraid to  make connection in real life  seating alone in  bars and restaurants and  coming here  

to socialize ..
 good for americna women !!! now I am also one ..hmm american woman ..a nd ask money to see me ah ah aha  
 you do ot have idea how rest the world hook up with pretty women and hot men and how they have fan
 and you know . when European men comes  to states I heart and  providers soooo glad to get fucked finally not just suck your dicks  
 FUCKED !!! WELLL .. you know how ??
 let me show you may be ??
 ah any way I not see any of you .. you are not make my iving who able say  
 WTF on serious problem  

 you know - I am not one of you ,and it is my country as well as yours  yes Iam a citizen  and yes I do have kids and yes I do not want them ended up as you are .. so I making step ..a nd you ?? what you do  to make i better ?
 at list talk as a human with no F words .
  we are all in same boat which is  
 "USA"
  I just can change it some can not -= so it  is YOU have to be aware what  country  you live to  YOUIR KIDS  
 my can be here can be ou

END OF MESSAGE

Some of you might be having trouble interpreting Serafima's dissertation on American men (above, sent 7/15/2013 6:45:05 PM). As the instigator of this whole thread, I felt the responsibility to put on my copyeditor's hat and make her treatise a little more readable.  

I do think that what she has to say has value and ought to be read, even if not everybody will agree with it.

The post directly below will be the result of my editorial efforts. Therein I will delete brackets that indicate interpolation.  

If you'd prefer to read a version with brackets, click on the post following that one.

Please do comment on the substance of Serafima's offering, as well as how you perceive the accuracy of my edits. Believe me, this was a real challenge. And remember that I'm only the messenger.

QUOTE

Bostonguy, I love your postings. You formulated it EXACTLY when you wrote, ‘Picking up civvie girls in bars requires some degree of conversational skill ...’  

But as to looks, who cares? Women do not care how a man looks but do care how he holds himself and how well he treats her.  
 
As they say in Europe, a man has to be a bit more handsome then a monkey but, more importantly, has to please a woman in all the ways she desires. You Americans do not have any idea how sad and ridiculous a visiting American male can look in Europe: sitting alone in the company of male friends looking around as if he fears something. But yet in his eyes you can see his desire to have an attentive girl sit next to him.  As soon as a girl will try, he will start complaining that in Europe there’s too much drinking and dancing and that he is a hardworking, hard-playing American man who believes in Jesus Christ. OMG!!! As you can imagine this is the way most American males are …  
 
And on TER in the U.S. there are a lot of males who are even-less social than males in general.  There’s a reason you come to TER, and it’s not always that you want to be discreet but that you can’t convince a woman to love you.  
   
If it’s not your money, I do not know what else (or who) made you feel that way - maybe your American women. You are soooo insecure worrying about your assets. With no house and no money, you would feel as though you were a ZERO.  
 
Trust me: no nation in the world other than America puts monetary value on human relationships - between men and women especially. You males are totally fine as long as your wives tell you that you are.  As for me, I never would notice if you had no money when we met.  Some wives have the guts to say, ‘If you hadn’t had money, I would never have dated you.’  How should that make you feel?  

You’ve been taking this stuff up to your ass, poor American man - even smiling and making jokes about it. Meanwhile, any other man would simply indicate unhappiness and say to his woman: ‘Am I good enough that you would love me even if I didn’t have this house and didn’t have my boat?’ Without his boat and his car, an American man would feel very insecure and consider himself a zero.  

Of course the problem comes not just from your women but from you men, too; you U.S. men are also not angels.  But I don’t care because I’m not planning to marry any American man, whether he has money or not.  Either way would be wrong.  Money makes people become horrible and lose the fundamentally human trait of thinking about one’s lover separately from bank accounts and fancy houses.
 
Oh, sorry, I changed the subject. I was trying to tell you that everybody in the U.S. has to go to a therapist to learn normal ways of socializing: they need to get cured of sitting and watching TV in sports bars and of hitting on girls in ways that make them run away from you hard-working, hard-playing Americans!  Ha ha!  

Fact is that in Europe if you see 4 or 5 men sitting alone in a bar with no women there, they will prove to be your fellow Americans.  And you on TER are even more shy. It is Escalade, with tons of postings on TER, who admitted once that he was brave enough to give a woman his business card and invite her up to the room. But who knows?  Maybe one of your women will report you as a sexual predator. [‘LOL’ assumed. -Ed.]
 
Sad, sad, sad country. Love relationships, true values and sex are all screwed up.  I myself don’t live here, but I at least can escape from time to time to keep my checks-and-balances.  How do you keep your checks-and-balances and stay an active adult? TER?? DC?? P411?? Come on! PM me if you want to hear more.  

But Bostonman, I LOVE what you wrote about TER and DC, etc.  You said you need to give a provider your personal info so she’ll feel comfortable letting you pay her for sex! Could not be any clearer.  

Same with wives. I hope your wife married you because she feels good about you and is therefore able to let you pay for her. But here a hooker can be more honest than a wife. She can choose to see the hobbyist or not to see him; if she doesn’t like him, she would not lay with him. Are your wives doing it or not? Or are they decent women, ha ha ha? Oh, I guess they are ‘decent,’ or we [providers] here would not be busy at all.    

Kisses. Sorry for my imperfect English.  

UNQUOT

QUOTE

Bostonguy, I love your postings. You formulated it EXACTLY when you wrote, ‘[Picking up civvie girls in bars] requires some degree of conversational skill ...’  

[But] as to looks, who cares? Women do not care how a man looks but [do care] how he holds himself and [how well he] treats her.  
 
As they say in Europe, a man has to be a bit more handsome then a monkey but [more importantly] has to please a woman in all the ways she desires. You Americans do not have [any] idea how sad and ridiculous a [visiting] American male can look in Europe: sitting alone [in the] company of male friends looking around as [if he] fears something. But yet in his eyes you can see his desire [to] have [an attentive] girl sit next to him.  As soon as [a] girl will try, he will start complaining that [in Europe there’s too much] drinking and dancing and that he is a hardworking, hard-playing American man who believes in [Jesus] Christ. OMG!!! As you can imagine this is the way most American males are …  
 
And on TER [in the U.S.] there are [a lot of] males who are even-less social than [males in general].  There’s a reason you come [to TER], and it’s not always that you want to be discreet but that you can’t convince a woman to love you.  
   
If it’s not your money, I do not know what else (or who) made you feel that way - maybe your American women. You are soooo insecure [worrying about] your assets. With no house and no money, you would feel as though you were a ZERO.  
 
Trust me: no nation in the world other than America [puts monetary] value on human relationships - between men and women especially. You males are totally fine [as long as] your wives [tell you that you are].  [As for me,] I never would notice if you had no money when we met.  [Some] wives have the guts to say, ‘If you hadn’t had money, I would never have dated you.’  How should that make you feel?  

You’ve been taking this stuff up to your ass, poor American man - even smiling and making jokes [about it]. Meanwhile, any other man would [simply indicate unhappiness and say to his woman]: ‘Am I good enough that you would love me even if I didn’t have this house and didn’t have my boat?’ Without his boat and his car, [an American] man would feel very insecure and [consider himself] a zero.  

Of course [the problem comes] not just from your women but from you men, too; you [U.S. men] are also not angels.  [But] I don’t care because I’m not planning to marry any American man, whether he has money or not.  Either way would be wrong.  Money makes people become horrible [and lose the fundamentally] human trait of thinking about one’s lover separately from bank accounts and [fancy] houses.
 
Oh, sorry, I changed the subject. I was trying to tell you that [everybody in the U.S.] has to go to a therapist to learn normal ways of socializing: [they need to get cured] of sitting and watching TV in sports bars and of [hitting on girls] in ways that make them run away from you hard-working, hard-playing Americans!  Ha ha!  

Fact is that [in Europe] if you see 4 or 5 men sitting alone in a bar with no women there, they will prove to be [your] fellow Americans.  And you on TER [are] even more shy. It is Escalade, with tons of postings on TER, who admitted once [that he was] brave enough to give [a woman his] business card and invite [her up] to the room. But who knows?  Maybe [one of] your women will report you as [a] sexual predator. [‘LOL’ assumed. -Ed.]
 
Sad, sad, sad country. Love relationships, true values and sex are all screwed up.  I myself don’t live here, but I at least can escape from time to time to keep my checks-and-balances.  [How do you keep] your checks-and-balances [and] stay an active adult? TER?? DC?? P411?? Come on! PM me if you want to hear more.  

But Bostonman, I LOVE [what you wrote] about TER and DC, etc.  You said [you need to give a provider] your personal info so she’ll feel comfortable letting you pay her for sex! Could not be any clearer.  

Same with wives. I hope your wife married you because she feels good about you and [is therefore] able to let you pay for her. But here a hooker can be more honest than a wife. She can [choose to see the hobbyist] or not to see him; if she doesn’t like him, she would not lay with him. [Are] your wives doing it or not?? Or are they decent women, ha ha ha? Oh, I guess they are ‘decent,’ or we [providers] here would not be busy at all.    

Kisses. Sorry for [my imperfect] English.  

UNQUOT

Providers see me I think due to my hand holding skills.

Love Serafima's "Post" more importantly love her passion on a date.

I am shy and have never been to Europe. If I do I certainly know now not
to drink alone. I will try to strut my stuff and hold me head high. LO

what I was trying to say .

Sorry for chaotic and disorganized writing .. it is even not about English ..
 it is about  how I do think fast and want  say all at once - again passion ..
 O yes I am passion creature ..
 and you know - I do love the fact that with age , and I am now  40 ..I become more  calm then I was ..
 but still seems so much  for many ... .. but it  only those who not met me - those   say " you are too much I afraid you " but those who met me .. those LOVE me absolutely and I did not harned them in any ways
 kissess to all good american men
 and please understand me - I posted it from concern about  men here ..
Man should not loose his hunting spirit.. it is evolution - the best will survive and you know it is  fany .. as female and I did travel a lot  and know many different  countries customs .. so - everywhere men/man if he like woman - he trying to  send her signals one way or other ... sometime it is funny -
but male is trying !!! it is  .. quite as min .. adn woman will notice him .. that way he got his fan he seed his sperm.. he is living .. having fan etc ..  
. but not in states .. why ?? here you need make a contract first and  ask her - your wife - honey it is ok I now to .. you know..  f : k you ..
 I know in CO it is illegal to wake up person in middle of night .. how true it is is that your wife can sue you that you disturb her sleep ?? may be it is not a truth .. but seems everybody follows this rule  

signal her - I LIKE YOU !!  
 do not be shy ..
help her too .. she is also wants yo

You did not strike  me  as you are shy man .. yes you are pretty easy to please and for an hour twice .. s and can I get away secreets?  
You are very good looking man .. women will go with you just for look if not talk about cock.. what you are shy about ?? can t get it ..
LOVE YOURSELF

I admire  your help and fixing .. you read it all as I  felt anf wanted to write  
 Thank you again  
It means a lot to me to be understood  

I even do not know what it is  with me in states ..- language barrier or cultural and educational and you are  living prove that intelligent men always  would read o to me correct ways  
Thank you  for making it easier for others to read .. when I get passion and want get my points across I   may  make mistakes and  speaking my  native Russian .. it is about mind set up and peace of mind abiliites to proofread not hurry and have cold mind but hot heart  

My love to you
 thanks