I am unsure about what KristiKane is speaking of in regard to anyone becoming upset over a favor she did for me. An individual has ripped me off (this week) and I did not want another provider to be ripped off by this guy so I wanted it posted. But, I did not want to be the one to post it. I do not see where she has told me that others are upset with her, perhaps the posts have been deleted. To whomever was upset with her, please accept my apologies for having asked her to place the Rip Off Artist on the boards.

Thanks,
Mandy O'Hara

Mandy, thanks for coming forward and explaning yourself.  All-in-All, you didn't have to come forward, but since you did, I'm glad.  You are not a familiar face around here, but your rep speaks for itself--you're welcome here anytime.  On the atlanta public board, we enjoy information and sharing information, and would have been happy to have Kristi bring this type of information.  We can all grow from each other's experiences.  But, Kristi published: a name; a phone number; and a company name;

Now you've been around Mandy (I've met Heidi and she speaks highly of you and I respect Heidi), I don't have to tell YOU or lecture YOU about the implications of publishing a person's phone number.

Mandy, I know you consider yourself a professional--said information was gathered by YOU during YOUR session!  A lot of guys complain about how quickly information moves when "the man" makes a move; or in this case, rip-off occurs and then all of a sudden our personal info is published for the world to see.  That's one thought.  

TER is a commerce site--a business.  That's another thought.

Let's say I believe you, your rep is such that I know you have no reason to lie!  What about the rip-off guy.  What if Kristi's act exposed a personal life that brings trama to his life (loses a girlfriend or wife) and he decides to come after you, Mandy!  That's another thought.

There are endless thoughts that can occur for such a foolish act--well meaning, but still pretty foolish!

I personally had Kristi un-moderated as a valued member of the atlanta community and personally feel betrayed by this move.  I can only imagine how this hits you, Mandy????

That's why a lot of guys don't feel comfortable in giving out info.  Even though by the accusation, what he did is wrong.  If it were a lady who was less reputable, and he gets his info published like that with out getting to defend himself.  If we get ripped of as a customer, all we have is a "work name" and cell(usually).  Quite a bit different from having your real name and real contact info.  

LD

I was one that was taken aback when I saw the post and I commented immediately.

I would never pull a stunt like that guy did, but, like Joey and Lucky Dawg said, Kristi posted his real name phone # and place of employment. This could have been handled by posting something like:

ATTN: Ladies, email me for info on a RIP OFF!!!!

and then a little info in the message body. Then handle the private  info through email/backchannel.

This guy might be a lunatic, and if he saw that message may try to do something worse.

Oh, no apology needed, just be safe.

This is a response to Mandy's negative incident that occurred on Tuesday, May 13th. Mandy had a session with a new client. The client said that he had to go to the ATM. Mandy said she would drive him there. As Mandy was getting dressed, he bolted.

Mandy consulted with me about what she should do.  We both agreed that we needed to inform other providers by posting on the boards.  I thought that Mandy was going to post it herself.  I left for yoga.  

Mandy emailed KristiKane to post for her so that she could be anonymous. KristiKane posted the information at Supreme Referrals and at the Ladies Only Board. She emailed Mandy back informing her of this and Mandy wanted her to also post it on the public boards. KristiKane emailed Mandy back telling her that the "mod's" (moderators) would remove the post because it was giving out too much information. Mandy then emailed her back to place just generic information on the boards. However, all of the specific information was somehow posted on all of the boards.

Mandy feels that she should not have used the word "generic." Mandy should have been more specific in how she wanted the post worded. Essentially, this was a miscommunication. Mandy or myself  would never give out any information about established clients. Our work is confidential.

Sincerely,
Heidi Mueller

of why you should always handle things yourself and NEVER ask anyone to post for you.

Your name and reputation depends on it.

... of why you should not give out personal info. If you can't work it out with the lady, do without or try someone more reasonable. They don't give YOU their real name and phone number, I think it works both ways.

Joey,

I agree with your views and everyone else's. Here is may personal 02c.

I have met both Mandy and Kristi. IMHO, both of them are GEMS.Having met Mandy and after reading Heidi,s post, I completely believe the incidence happened. I think, I did mention to Mandy, that she is too trusting, sincere and honest, so is Kristi.

I think, when Kristi heard about the incident, she was mad and made mistake in judgement. We all do that occasinally and who hasn't.

A jerk is jerk is a jerk. IMHO, he is the one who should be punished. I understand the part about his protecting his privacy and personal life etc. It takes two to tango, one is equally responsible for protecting one's privacy. if one behaveslike Gentlemen, I don't think any of our ladies do anything. On the other hand, if one commits a crime (this is theft in my opinion) he is criminal and loses his right to privacy. If this person has held up bank or convenience stor per say say, his pictures will on the news and will be in open court. In this case, can't do that.

I for one, always concerned about the ladies, they are putting themselves in danger whenever they meet someone they haven't met before in more ways than one. We hobbysts should always remember and treat these ladies accordingly.

Enough of my rambling.  I guess I was late reading it and I was equally mad when read about the incident.

But still, it's enough to make me not to want to see said ladies.  There have been enough loose cannon types through the Atlanta scene in the last few years who made unjustified claims and blasted hobbyist.  The sad thing is, the sychophants automatically side with the ladies.  I'm NOT saying that is the case in this instance, but still, it could have been.

No way I can justify posting that type of personal information.  It goes aganist everything that this board is about!



Joey

In most cases all of the comments of the sins of posting personal info arrising from an unverified dispute are valid.  But in this case, once the victim has been identified to be Mandy, anyone that knows her, knows her version of events can be taken to the bank.  There are none in Altanta of less undoubted creditability than Mandi and Heidi.  They are precious treasures who significantly enhance the community.  When a local scum-bag harms them, the community should rally to support them and ostracize the perp on all levels to preserve and protect the environment that allows the exceptional treasures Mandi and Heidi represent to exist.  How many would have been as trusting as Mandi to accept post-payment?  An honor system violator is among the worst, and ruins it for everybody else.

In simple terms, Mandi good - Perp bad.  Harass, threaten and out the little puke till he pays her, and pays her double!  Paraphrasing Chicago, HE HAD IT COMMING...HE GOT WHAT HE DESERVED!

nmnmnmnmnmn

I wonder why a provider would be untruthful about being ripped off. Two things come from posting about being ripped off. I know this from posting previously about being ripped off a few months ago. One thing is other providers are made aware of the individual that is a Rip Off Artist (ROA). This is usually the only thing positive that can come from the negative experience. In the last case, another provider (unsure if I should mention her name), knew that ROA. I actually received payment from that ROA that he sent to my PO Box. So, in that case, two positive things came from the negative experience. Since I posted that info on that ROA (his first name and last four digits of his telephone number), there have been a few ROAs that have been by to visit with me. So, I wonder what motivation a provider could possibly have that would make them want to "blast" a hobbyist for ripping them off if it were not true. Do these alleged providers enjoy being ripped off so therefore they want to lure in ROAs?

This last posted ROA that I encountered last week was different from the others. If he had a girlfriend or wife to lose from such post, then that would worry me yes. This guy makes me want to get another dog with a mean bark like my last dog had. However, I think that will infect healing wounds for my last dog by having another dog in my life. I fear that this guy will surface again whether something was posted about him or not. I
hope that he does not learn the whereabouts of other incall locations. He knows that providers cannot turn to LE for help. It is sad when that gets taken advantage of. Providers that are caught providing have their name in public records for life. There is a lot of risk a provider takes when they are providing. ROAs take away from the beauty of the work itself. Aside from
not being paid for the sessions with all of my ROAs, they were good sessions. I am thankful for that and am glad I did not ask for the money up front. There have been individuals that have a ROA that also hurts them, steals from them all the money on them, and have heard of much worse cases that entail fatalities. Who would want to lure in any guy that has (in my opinion) a criminal mind in the first place and is far more likely to hurt you than a non-ROA? I guess wait a few months and see if the provider
that posted the ROA ever posts again.

I know I did not want to ever post again after the few visits I had from ROAs after I posted the first time about the ROA another provider knew. I did have an unpaid for session prior to that first ROA. I forgot to ask for the money and the guy
(whom I had seen once before) made no effort to mention it at the end of the session. I worked for an agency back then and paid the agency its share of the session. No reason for the agency to take a loss due to my being forgetful. I did tell
the person that operated the agency about it, he called the regular hobbyist to never get a response back from him. I find this to be as much my fault as it is the hobbyist. If not maybe I am more at fault since it is me being paid and should remind him. The posted guys literally ran out the door like someone
robbing a bank would do. I felt disgusting afterwards because of that. The most disturbing part to me, is that these two guys know where I work at and I fear ever seeing them again whether I would have posted anything or not in regard to them.

I asked KristiKane to do the post since she has retired and not at risk of luring in any ROAs. I am very thankful that KristiKane did the post for me and would hope that anyone who posted her real name and attacked her for my miscommunication to her, would be human enough to apologize to her. She is a most kind and sweet person to have undergone such a public attack. She did not hurt anyone, rip anyone off, bad mouth anyone,
but simply tried to keep all providers she could reach from having the same fear that I now have that makes me want to get another dog. When I posted before a different ROA, I only posted his first name and last four digits of his phone number. This recent one uses many different phones from the same company and the only way I got his cell was because he had to dial me up before getting the apartment number. I think he was too much in the mood to stop and take up more time by using a pay phone. He was quite energetic during the session is why I assume that. Even though his energy was negative, at the time I did not know it and did enjoy the energy he had, but he left a very bad and fearful feeling with me the way he darted out my door. The way he planned it makes me feel more upset. I also think that he thought that we did not have caller identification to get his cell number. I wanted the information (as much as possible) to be posted on boards where ladies go only. I emailed ladies all the information I had (for the ladies that I know well enough that the information would be cared for). I think KristiKane sensed my fear and this actually made her scared when she posted on the public boards. It was never my intention to give out all the information on the public boards. KristiKane even forewarned me that moderators would remove the post from the public boards from what I had sent to her. I then asked her to post just generic information. I thought it would be most simple to write that rather than explaining what I assumed she must already know. I kept stressing to her that I wanted to let as many providers know as we can about this guy. Maybe she thought that meant that I wanted her to post all of the information anyway. At any rate, KristiKane should not have been attacked the way I think she was. I never got to read the post(s) attacking her, but she did tell me about them. I am hurt that I put her in that predicament and would be less hurt if whomever attacked her would apologize for having done so.

Mandy O'Hara

Mandy,

Even thouggh we have only met once, I completely believe you becuse you treated me so well and you are very friendly and trusting person which, some idiots like to take advantage.

I have met Kristi on few ocassions socially and otherwise and the same goes for Kristi also. Kristi is also very friendly and always tries to see the godness people. If some idiot hobbysts pulls of these kind of stunts, this will make it difficult for Providers and Hobbysts. Remember, hobbysts and providers are community and we should all treat each other with respect, coursey and politeness.

Nothing wrong with getting the Bad Apples out. May TER should consider having section for Ripp Offs just like bad providers and provide access only by subscription. How is that for a business idea?

Mandy and Kristi, you both keep your chin up, and just remember that there are lot of nice and gentlemen hobbysts in this board.

Tell me something.

How would you or Kristi like it if your REAL NAME and EMPLOYERS NAME (if you have another job)  were posted on a public internet board?

I realize this scumbag ripped you of but, there are other more professional ways to handle a matter of this magnitude. Your professionalism is shot, Kristi is retired so she has nothing to lose, but you my dear, have lost a lot of trust. Anyone that has been reading here, and thinking about seeing you will have some definite concerns about the personal info they give to you.

And as far as the guys patting you on the back, they are probably very concerned about their personal info right about now.

I have to agree with the men on this, though what the client did to Mandy was unforgivable this should have been posted on the ladies section of TBD or send emails letting other providers know his name and other info...I have always stated that clients give WAY TOO MUCH INFO to the providers...Providers may not agree with me but bottom line is u give enough personal info to the wrong provider and she will bury your a** if u piss her off...I have been told about this on certain occasions...Works both ways regarding discretion and respect for the provider and the client.....Just my 02

Terri

"...they are probably very concerned about their personal info..."

You have got to be kidding. I have absolutely no concern whatsoever that Mandy is going to post anything about me or anyone else she has seen before. That implication is damning and absolutely untrue. YOU now owe Mandy an apology, sir.

NO ONE who has no malice or ill-intent will run afoul of Mandy and Heidi's screening or appointment process. They are top-drawer providers and will remain true to that and their chosen profession. The implication you make is untrue, unfounded and a cheap shot - period. Any of the parties concerned have NEVER posted such info before and won't - unless someone bears them ill-will or has bad intentions.

While I might not have spoken up prior to now, and while I was somewhat taken aback by Kristi's original post declaring the RIPOFF ALERT, all of my concern was eliminated by the details that have come out subsequently.

Bottom line = play FAIR, safely and have fun.



-- Modified on 5/18/2003 6:31:23 AM

-- Modified on 5/18/2003 6:32:26 AM

ATLGUY770 says...
Any of the parties concerned have NEVER posted such info before and won't - unless someone bears them ill-will or has bad intentions.
_____________________________

Are you quite certain of that? I am not willing to take a chance like that. I don't condone what he did, but, the way they handled it was completely unprofessional!

And no I do not owe anyone an apology that manipulates others to post for them when they know exactly what the outcome is.

And do you suppose they would like their real names posted for all to see?

This is the last I'll say on this subject.

Be safe.

I agree with ATL Guy 100%. Not seen Heidi but have seen Kristi and Mandy and I am certain Heidi and Mandy run a Top Notch Operation (Kristi Now Retired, so did she).

I don't really understand the concern about one's privacy when the concerned is not playing fair and is a ROA.

Truth and Honesty will always goes a long way.

I hate to be the bearer of bad news but, if I remember correctly, Kristi said she was very heistant of posting names and numbers but did so per Mandy's request. Kristi said Many wanted everyone to know who had done this.

Diva stated that Mandy wanted everyone to know.  Please don't kiss up.

Dear rustproof:

I am sorry to see how upset you have been with me on the board.
I never wanted all of the individuals information posted. I take it you
did not read clearly what my entire post had prior to posting. Otherwise,
you would have understood better prior to your posting. Please (if you
have time) read the entire message because you missed my point entirely.

Good Day,
Mandy

IMHO, enough said on this subject. Everyone has an opinion and a view and no one is going to change it (including me). No one is right and no one is wrong. Futile effort on anyone's part to try and change someone elese's view.

Those who got hurt feel emotinal and those who feel privacy is paramount is passionate. A basic Stand-Off.

May be it is time move on!