Interesting read length of penetration and varied views few thread below.
It got me thinking. All of us (may be most of us) agree that this is hobby and it is merely an exchange services for $.
So, what if a pleasure seeker is capable and want penetration for majority of session. Shouldn't the PS allowed?
Controversial indeed but enquiring minds want to know.
Perhaps I'm coming off as stingy due to my comments in the tipping thread below, but I believe you get what you pay for. If I agree to an hour session with a lady and agree to her price and she shows up and I want go to penetration for 58 mins because I can, then damnit, I should be able to. If she disagrees or doesn't like it, she can end the transaction and leave (or he can leave).
It's important to let your provider know what you want in advance of the session, and at least at the beginning of the session. Otherwise it's non-agreement for services provided and both should move on.
As for me... I couldn't go 58 mins if I wanted to, and believe me, I'd love to! A good 15-20 mins with all the other GFE stuff thrown in is my preference.
Is her time and being with you, anything else beyond that is her discretion. Many of these fine ladies really enjoy sex and foreplay so they love to indulge in that with a willing partner. Being a courteous lover will take you far with a woman who is very willing to get nekkid with you.
The whole idea of "I will take what I want, because I gave up money" is totally wrong. Do you feel you can punch her, puncture her skin with your teeth? NO! Nor can you fuck her to the point of being painful.
If a wonderful lady wants to explore sex with you, then you can at the very least make it as enjoyable for her as it is for you.
b-
You sound like the disclaimer on every web site. What about all the extraordinary descriptions when you go past the disclaimer page?
You know what I am speaking of! If not read a few.
Yep, 90% of us who participate in this hobby may be looking just to spend time with provider. Interested in buying some land in South Florida?
I do understand the undercurrent of all provider meetings, the basic reason they are happening in the first place.
But it is the thinking that "I paid, I will take it from your body" that leads to a shitload of trouble. It is much better to enter the session with the anticipation of what the lady will do for you rather than going in with the idea of what you will take from her.
"What about all the extraordinary descriptions when you go past the disclaimer page?"--those are the things you could enjoy with her IF you are a gentleman and clean enough for her to enjoy them too.
Go back to CL and find the pimped out girls that lie there and let you do what you want then leave, because that is what you are inferring with your tongue in cheek remark about spending time with a provider.
b-
you know it is clowns like you that make it harder for everyone else, simple rule the more you treat a lady with respect and try to please her the better session your going to have you sound like some twenty something idiot that thinks good sex is to just bang away for a long as possible.you really have no clue
"Is her time and being with you, anything else beyond that is her discretion"
"It's completely untrue, but it's still a nice sentiment. I actually agree with everything else in your post. I think we all know what we're paying for, but abuse isn't included, well at least not with most providers.
There is absolutely nothing wrong with a guy wanting 58 out of the 60 minutes of total penetration. All he really has to do is find someone capable of withstanding such a marathon. Obviously from the replies below there are a few ladies that can't for discomfort reasons among others.
How does a guy find such a provider? Well, if he is creative and discreet I'm sure he will be able to communicate to his lady of choice his wishes. She can then decide if she is up for it or would rather pass. If the men in general feel that there is no reason to ask and it is their right as the paying customer, then don't be surprised when a lady stops you and needs a break or stops you period.
You will no doubt find some women who will gut it out so as not to get a bad review, but I really doubt they will see you again and if you choose to use her as a reference, will undoubtedly tell whomever is inquiring the deal.
Unfortunately, ASP's are not like an all you can eat buffet...pay your $6.99 and chow down till the restaurant closes. Limits are limits and that is why I suggested communicating your desire upfront so neither will be disappointed/physically hurt etc.
Hope this helps if you are considering this.
It put me out of commission for 3 days and nearly sent me to the hospital; my vaginal canal and surrounding labia totally bruised and constricted-I could barely bathe myself there until I healed.
Perfectly nice guy & I wanted to allow him to have his way.
I learned: you can only be accommodating to a point. Anyone who expects me to be a living blow-up doll can stop by the novelty store after work and pick one up. I am not the girl for that and should I get the cue during a session that a client expects that or anything else outlandish of me I will refund his $$$ and send him on his way.
All women do not love being pounded mercilessly for hours-and this is coming from a woman who can only orgasm from penetration.
If you want to visit a submissive or a woman who is desperate for cash surely you can find a provider who will allow you to do anything to her.
However, if you book with an upscale provider based upon persona and review history you should expect that she believes she has a word on activities in her bedroom.
Your a trooper! I'm sorry to hear of your injuries though, that sucks, I'd never want to know I did that to someone (though I've kept a couple of EX-gf's in bed for most of the day..)
I usually just read signals, I can go for a decent time, so If I sense they are running out of steam, I back off and go to an alternate means. Some guys just don't care, or dont see their causing a problem.
Good public service message though. that's what the board is for.
-M
trooper-how do you think aspiring porn actresses feel?
Need lots of practice. Send 'em this way.
I always book hour & a half with my ATF. With little time pressure, we play & giggle & enjoy our time... Oh, yes, we do sex too. We try what ever sparks us at the moment, either of us can suggest & she is eager to participate. If either of us tire & my O has not happened yet, we'll switch to manual HJ, she has the premium lub, not cheap baby oil. A HJ by her is by no means second rate & has on several occasions produced the most intense O I've ever had. (Like to have turned me inside out through my d***!)
I think of myself as a good lover (striving to be great). This is incompatible with anything less than total consideration for my companion (which she returns). God, writing this is making me horny...
The ol' "I don't care how she's doing; I'm going to get what I paid for" routine. Have at it, buddy. Word gets around.
I experienced that once! Now ladies and guys- read further before you scream....
We had gone through the first 30-45 minutes fairly normally, lots of talk, cuddle, kissing, bbbj then finally got to missionary. Now not 'pounding' as you read in some of the disrespectful reviews, just slow, enjoyable, talking and kissing during, then finally rolled over on our sides, still penetrated, and just kissed and talked and laughed for nearly an hour.
One of the most delightfully intimate and nice sessions I've ever had- my lady wasn't sore, and I smiled for days!
But in answer to your question where you raise if you've paid for the session shouldn't you get whatever you want! Hell no! Have a little respect and concern. No one has the right to make someone sore or injured for days just because you paid!
Now THAT sounds delicious.
Hell yes-bring it!!
I have weighed in on this topic as I started the previous thread Length (of time that is). After more time to reflect on this subject I don't see this as a black or white topic (either the client should get what he paid for or a provider is not a machine).
What is required is for there to be better communication and honestly during the actually session (on both sides). If I had the opportunity to relive that moment I would have definitely asked her about continuing saying I understand we have been going at it a long time already. I would be happy to do something else if you would prefer. And, I then I would listen to her answer. The problem with many responses on a board like this is that some believe they know best. Not just for themselves, but everyone else as well.
isn't it more a matter of piston travel, so to speak, than time in the cylinder?
I had a session just today - appx 20 minutes of penetration, over three seperate instances, with 2 climaxes; appx 15 minutes of BBBJ, appx 15 minutes of DFK, sensual touch, the balance spent on cleanup and catching my breath and bad joke telling and discussions of anatomical size. A great time.
"All of us (may be most of us) agree that this is hobby and it is merely an exchange services for $." I have a few exceptions to your statement. First, "all of us (may be most of us) agree." Well, you are attempting to speak for all or most people on this board. Second, "this is hobby and it is merely an exchange services for $. By using the term "merely" you are attempting to narrowly define the relationship or interaction. What you say is fundamentally true, and good to keep in mind so as to keep the personal boundaries intact. However, many hobbiest and providers report that the interactions they experience can be very physically and emotional intimate, unlike other service/consumer relationships, and with both persons having their own personal limitations. Third, "services." That is what is been debated and defined in these discussions. It is not defined arbitrarily by the hobbiest simply because money is changing hands.
Often in these discussions, I'm reminded of the dynamics and discussions between labor, in this case the providers, and management, the hobbiest. Labor says, hey, we are unhappy with how we are being treated. Yes, we are getting the wage we asked for, but the working conditions are unsafe and unreasonble given our very human limitations. Management says, tough, we are paying you what you asked, so if you don't like it, find another job.
Unfortunately, for the hobbiest and provider, this discussion usually does not occur explicitely, in the bedroom, but it is being discussed here, which I view as being a very good thing. When I have observed labor and management working out win/win remedies, it's because both sides exercise goodwill, viewing each other in basically a positive light, and leave their claims of entitlement at the door.
A few weeks ago, I saw a news story about a guy who was cut off and told to leave an 'all you can eat' buffet. Apparently, the guy ate at this particular buffet two or three times a week, and was eating them out of business. So one evening when he was on his fourth trip through the buffet, the restaurant owner told him he was cut off, and not welcome anymore. So now, apparently the guy is crying to the media because he didn't get what he paid for.
So ok, I will agree that if you paid for an all you can eat buffet, you are entitled to all you can eat (and your cardiologist will thank you). But my body is not an all you can eat buffet. No provider's body is. You are paying for TIME and COMPANIONSHIP. You don't get to dictate what I will or won't do, can or can't do.
Several months ago, I greeted a new guy after he'd passed all the screening and blah blah. Within the first minute after we said hello, he asked "so how much time do I have?" I assured him that I don't watch the clock (there isn't a clock on my bedstand), and that when I say its a full hour, I mean its a full hour. So no problem, we chit chat another 30 seconds and he's ready to go. Another minute after that, and he lets me know he's bored with the preliminaries and ready to move on. Fourty five minutes after that, I am sore, I am dry as a bone, and I am PISSED. A woman's body doesn't 'turn on' in 2.2 seconds, and even when it is turned on, it doesn't stay that way indefinitely.
I kicked the moron out of bed, told him that if he wanted to finish I'd be happy to watch, but he could do it himself. And no, I didn't hand one nickel of the donation back. After that, I contacted his two referrences, told them what a complete heel he was, and wrote him up on two blacklists. And I pity the poor girls he's seen since then.
The moral of the story is being paid doesn't endow us with superhuman abilities. We are still women, and deserve to be treated as such. Now don't get me wrong, I landed pretty hard on Transcend in that previous thread, but I certainly don't think he set out to hurt the woman involved with him. The jerk that I blacklisted, not so much. But for once and for all, some men need to get the message that regardless of the envelope, its a living, breathing woman you are seeing, with human limitations - even if we DO enjoy sex more than your average girl.
said a whole lot about why.
So he jumped on you and pounded for 45 minutes. There's a lot of subjectivity and reasonable ranges in that, and what occurs to me is, did you TELL him, HEY, how about some of this or that, or did you guide or communicate?
Did you ask, "Hey, can we take a break for some KY?"
People's preferences and abilities range all over the map, and when a guy has references, and seems to talk more than you did, I gotta ask, what gives?
If you weren't any more explicit with him than you are here (ie proactive - fix problems when they are salvageable) then I don;'t know you were fair to him.
HSFS, I was wondering why you don’t communicate your intentions during your time together with clients. I think blacklisting him for lasting too long is unnecessary.
Why not just say, hey baby - I only like to have penetration for a short time. But, I would be happy to X, Y, or Z for you. Instead of waiting until the damage is done to you and then you feel as if you must get back at him by blacklisting him later.
To compare the long laster with men who beat up, rob, or are abusive to women just doesn't seem right to me. There is a lack of intent to do anything wrong or to hurt you. But, I do see your point and telling them hey honey no boom-boom for the full hour. And, then tell everything else that is available. Wouldn't that be better for all envolved?
To both of you.....yes, I skipped over a few parts - like my subtle, followed by not so subtle, followed by VERY not subtle suggestions at slowing down, trying different positions, requests to stop to at least get some g/damned lube, and offers of switching to other activities....none of which penetrated neanderthal man's determination to pound as long and hard as he could.
So sue me, this isn't penthouse forum, and I'm not looking for your sympathy, so I left out some details. There isn't a provider out there who wouldn't nod her head and think to herself, "yeah, I think I have seen that guy" if she read this. Welcome to our world guys. Not all men are gentlemen, some of them honestly don't mean to be but just don't know any better, some of them just don't care. So given an opportunity to give those who do care a heads up, I'll take it.
HowardSternsFeminineSide, yes, I've seen that guy... and his cousin and his friend etc etc. ha. I've tried to be "accommodating" until my thigh muscles and/or forearms ached... and I was drenched in sweat.. or until I felt like I was suffocating. I have suffered from rotator cuff injuries several times over the years, joking with clients that much like "tennis elbow," I had "hand job shoulder." The truth was my shoulder hurt like merry hell and was no laughing matter. At this point, I feel like dealing with certain people like that just isn't worth it. It results in me feeling resentful and irritated...
The long and short of it is- a little empathy goes a long way. Leave the sense of entitlement at the door. I may pull out all the stops once for someone... but if they come across as a jerk I will just happen to be "busy" or "not around" every time they call to try to schedule in the future...
Cindy
PS. I should mention that I'm good at yoga and quite flexible, so we're talking EXTREME situations here...
An intelligent post from an intelligent lady (yeah, go ahead, call me whatever you want). She is simply relating an example here that goes directly to the topic. I've heard stories like this from lady's that I have known for years and you know what? It is not really about treating the guy "fairly". It is about the lady's personal comfort and safety. The blacklist is really the only discreet recourse that providers have for protecting themselves from any number of bad types of clients. Like it or not, it's not something that these ladies take lightly, nor should they.
There are plenty of CL gals and low budget providers that will let you pound your brains out for 55 minutes until you cum and then get dressed and tell you to leave...Go for it! They don't care about you, they don't care about themselves but of you want a rubber-fuck-doll experience you will surely get one. The ladies that are voicing their opinions here care more about their bodies and their own well being than they do about the money. I don't see any possible way that this could be a bad thing.
While not trying to accuse anyone one this board of boarish (boorish) behavior, I have had many women report that they have pretty much blacklisted their SO's for similar behavior. So, is it reasonable to think that such men would treat a provider any differently? And, why would the provider treat such a man differently, than their SO's?
-- Modified on 1/14/2008 4:53:07 PM
I know I make such errors, usually finding them before I send a message. But, please feel free to point out the ones I miss. I find it very helpful. Was trying to multitask.
-- Modified on 1/14/2008 4:49:36 PM
I have a physical condition as a result of a childhood injury and explain in advance to the sp the problem and show her the scar. The problem is the lack of sensitive nerve endings making it difficult to have an erection is a short time and when I get it it can stay that way before climaxing for several hours. No need for chemicals for me. I guess I've been lucky as a couple sp (about half) have been understanding and even enjoyed the challenge of getting me to finish and a couple wanted to see how long I could actually go in active duty. I've learned over the years to be slow, gentle and "read" her feelings and comfort and slowing down, resting and stopping. One, a former porn star, or so she advertised, suggested after I should go into movies. Possibly, the key is being up front with the sp as to needs and/or wants and letting the sp tailor the session to accommodate the needs rather than being pushy.
While the automotive comparison was brought up, I'll add another. You get out of a car what you put into it in terms of care, maintenance and not abusing it or pushing its limits. Abuse it and it'll only last for a sprint. Care for it and it'll willingly and reliably go a million miles and more.