Students do get graded by teachers. Even though a student's work gets "reviewed", there's a credential for all of that work.
In this light, your suggestion makes sense but only if you are running a "training academy", especially for prospective male providers. Unfortunately, the newspapers have historically had a field day with any "training academy" of this variety, and I don't think times have changed that much in one hundred years.
Seriously, once you find a male provider, feel free to review him. Although admittedly, the market is small enough that you might not find someone to your taste. If you review a client, ask yourself what's in it for him. When a provider is reviewed, her business usually improves. You may actually find a client who wouldn't mind getting reviewed, but your review would give other ladies an idea of how good he is -- in other words, your review would put him into the position of becoming a provider for a female clientele.
How knows? You might like to tell other ladies about the big bad wolf, but remember, the big bad wolf isn't likely to pay for collect calls. And not many people involved in theatrical productions go out of their way to write reviews of their audiences...
Whether a client is good in bed or not isn't much of an issue. But if he's disprespectful, nasty, offensive, violent, or dishonest, I'd like to know.
I think it's a great idea to review clients. Sure, discretion's an issue, but discretion goes both ways. And just as you'd like to know if a provider is an absolute nightmare, I'd like to know if a client is dangerous, or if he's know to scam providers. Great clients are coveted - providers will drop everything for them; bad clients are, and should be, blackballed. Reviews could save a lot of providers from bad situations.
Last thing: you might want to check that arrogance. When accepting work, providers always have a choice.
called you for an appointment and said "Hi, my name is smartfucker?" You'd get annoyed, but I certainly couldn't give you my real name, because you might use it in a review! So, I'm curious - how would you get around this? No-one could see you for outcall except maybe if you could get up to a hotel room without any sort of checks. You certainly couldn't come to my apartment building and ask for Mr. Smartfucker! Sure, you could do incall and review clients that way, but then there would be nothing but reviews for "John," "Joe," "Bob," and "Bill," with an occasional "Kevin" or "Jeff." Perhaps more of a procedure than you thought, eh?
Have you considered how much work goes into a provider's screening process? You're seriously underestimating the complexity, smartfucker.
You're worried about your own identity/info being compromised. Same applies to providers. My own clients wouldn't post a detailed breakdown of my identity because they'd like to see me again; I would never compromise their identity for the same reason (as well as mutual respect).
If a client were to become dangerous, I would have no trouble burning that bridge if it would help other providers. Word already gets out about bad clients. Problem is, not all providers can access that info.
Back to your question/comment: what you're really suggesting is that I don't pick my clients from a message board. I'll bear that mind.
a client would reveal his identity without getting to REALLY know a provider? If the answer is no, and of course it is, you have yet to tell me how this review list could possibly get off the ground, again without it just being a bunch of Johns, Joes, Bobs and Bills.
As far as picking your clients, I never suggested anything. Indeed, I was assuming they picked you!
judging from the posts complaining about not receiving call backs, etc., I would suggest it's very much a two way street, especially for those providers who monitor these posts.
I can see this thread is going nowhere. Bye-bye!
-- Modified on 1/16/2005 6:17:21 AM
-- Modified on 1/16/2005 6:26:18 AM
Flea-brain.
-- Modified on 1/16/2005 3:35:53 PM
I'll stop the flame right here, since your leaving is too good a thought.
/Zin
asked about "Why do I always get SMELLY men that try to rob me ?". I encouraged her a month back to find another job.
I'll refrain from doing so due to lack of time and interest.
It is guys like you that give all hobbyists a bad image. I have a suggestion, drop off all review boards that you are a member of and go back to matching wits with ripoffs and upsellers every time you want entertainment, you deserve nothing less.
What you could have done to the lady's post about bad clients is give useful suggestions about how she could go about finding better, more gentlemanly ones. Oh, sorry, you would not know what better, gentlemanly, or even manly is. So how could you give suggestions about either? My bad.
I'd say your handle reviews your opinions already. I'll put them in the nearest toilet.
Your not even smart enough to form a question like-- "why do I keep on fucking streetwalkers with AIDS?"
But I'll give you credit for truth in advertising.
/Zin
-- Modified on 1/16/2005 1:00:38 PM
-- Modified on 1/16/2005 9:53:05 PM
the guys that see me smelly and when I drive to see them, they try to rob me?" She later stated that her experienced mentor was having the same problem. Her mentor is obviously no Mensa member either. She should CLEARLY be doing something else for work!
How strange that you'd accuse her of being an idiot for something like that. Makes you look a lil' defensive. If women have a problem with your body odor, just tackle the problem head-on, at the source.
The men I've met all smell great. Dunno what you're doing wrong.
I see no reason to insult her in favor of bad clients who you don't know, haven't met, and in which, presumably, the only thing they have in common with you is they also have a dick.
You may think this might not be exactly either/or, but there you are mistaken. One could ignore an unintelligent post-- and intelligence is not a prerequisite for posting here. But in the world where we make our living, a thief or a stinkbag is impossible to ignore, and not easy to screen always. Why take a complaint about something legit like that and respond by attacking her, even if she's not a Ph. D?
So, if you are going to respond at all, why respond to insult her? Unless you somehow identify with her smelly, ripoff clients?
/Zin
Eh? I guess that was supposed to be a joke.
I generally assume that providers keep blacklists of bad clients. That has been a standard practice for generations. Many providers also use references, although there are limits to how much that works. And clients who are disrespectful, nasty, offensive, violent, or dishonest do get reported on the boards. It may interest you that there are towns where some men can only visit touring providers because the sisterhood has put out the word.
Sure, good clients are valued among providers. And let's say, for the sake of argument, that there's some system for reviewing clients. Let's say it has the effect of improving client behavior tremendously. Then, here comes the kicker -- the market pressure for getting a great client would be so strong that providers would essentially be put into a bidding war for him.
Good students are valued among professors. Really good students often get scholarships. They sometimes don't need to pay for their classes at all! Now, should providers create "scholarships" or "fellowships" for clients who are complete gentlemen…?
Is reviewing clients possible? Sure it is. A man who lives by the review can die by the review. A man with an internet record of making reviews could theoretically be reviewed without revealing his home address, phone number, license plate number, et cetera. Still, a board for client reviews wouldn't make much sense unless one is a dungeon mistress. Dungeon clients might not mind getting reviewed; the grading system could even be incorporated into their experience.
Although dominance therapy isn't my taste, I do thank you, Chiara Scura, for your kind words. Thank you so much for your high compliment of my personality!
The ONLY thing I have going for me I've since heard is not somehing ladies like in a client.
Goodness. What is that????!!!!
...shaved head and dashing good-looks, silly girl. What did you think I meant? 
-- Modified on 1/16/2005 2:02:32 AM
...with a drawbridge at one end that's usually out of service.
No provider with whom I've been pleased has ever declined to have me back; two, who had temporarily left the business, called
me to let me know they were back.
Still, I'm not a young guy, or even middle-aged, so I'm pretty sure I'm not on their ATF lists. . .
There is a ladies board on TBD(The Big Doggie) of dubious credibility which was supposedly created to allow ladies to post about dangerous clients, rip offs, flakes, etc. In addition there are other boards where ladies can post about dangerous clients.
On TER you are not allowed to post general reviews of clients. That tends to make sense. You are the person who is selling a retail product called entertainment to the general public and as such have posted advertisements on web sites and escort malls. Just like a movie which is being marketed to the public you may be subject to review by movie reviewers and audiences. Seldom is a patron of the movie who has paid his $10 to see the movie subject to a review unless he yells fire in the crowded theatre in which case he may be arrested, put in jail and not allowed to pass GO.
Those movie audiences don't come in direct contact with the actors, directors, casting, production people etc. during the performance, and rarely do you find out that the $10 for the ticket left in the envelope was actually just a one dollar bill instead, or that the audience member got rough with the lead actor who is present only through a projector (and even if they did the only marring would be to the screen), or did things expressly forbidden by the movie's crew or performers, or any of the other things that could and sadly do happen to some providers.
Actually the analogy is pretty good and the line about yelling fire in a crowded theatre is the same as the hobbyist that is dangerous or rips you off. I don't think anybody has a real problem with warning reviews about rip offs and physically dangerous clients but normal everyday garden variety clients should not be the subject of personal reviews. Posting reviews about normal clients is a violation of that story you tell us about how discreet you are when you ask for all of our personal information.
Quote: " Actually the analogy is pretty good and the line about yelling fire in a crowded theatre is the same as the hobbyist that is dangerous or rips you off."
Not exactly, the audience member that yells "fire" in the crowded theatre, puts at risk the fellow audience members, and not the people involved in the movie.
That would be more akin to false reviews here that would put fellow hobbyists at risk (ie: a review that claimed a good time from rip off so that other hobbyist got ripped off as well), since I can only assume the hobbyist is the audience in the analogy.
_______________________________________________________
Quote: "Posting reviews about normal clients is a violation of that story you tell us about how discreet you are when you ask for all of our personal information."
Huh?
I told a story about being discreet?
I ask for personal information?
I am quite sure I have never asked for anyone's personal information, hobbyist or provider.
I design and maintain websites for providers.
I never have contact with clients other than those I have met when at an incall location to take pictures for the sites, talk to the providers I work for, and even then I ask no questions. *grin*
________________________________________________________
This idea of reviewing clients has come up a few times on TER, and each time the men become very protective and almost paranoid about being reviewed.
At the same time though there are posts that come up wishing the referal process could be streamlined, and there is always the statements of concern for the ladies well being.
All of those things could be resolved througha client review of sorts.
If a system of client reviews were to put in place, it really wouldn't have to be what I think a lot of the clients are thinking.
It could be as simple as a sort of questioneer listing the provider that filled it out (perhaps done with a php script).
With a place for a client's:
first name (and initial), or handle,
basic physical description,
location (by city,state, country, providence, regoin, etc.),
date and time of appointment.
Then check boxes with options of "yes" or "no" for:
On time
No Show
Repeatedly reschedualled
Paid in full as requested
Tried to Haggle or Barter
Was respectful
Got violent or rough
Clean, well groomed
etc.
Further details or information could be then be back channeled if another provider thought that she was being contacted by a reviewed client.
It could streamline the referal process for good clients, and keep bad clients from being able to repeatedly offend.
Nothing about looks or performance would need to be openly shared. If the providers wished to "gossip" about a client's skills or abilities, they can already do that, they don't need a place set up to do it.
All that would be necessary is for a provider to ask any new client if he has seen another provider (if so who: to ensure the reviewer matches), and what "name/handle" did he use, then look him up in the database, see that he was: well groomed, on time, considerate, respectful etc. (the physical description would be used to try and keep a client from using another client's review to get appointments in the event he has been "blackballed").
The sign up process would require a link to the providers site or ad, and email/phone contact from the admin of the site to the provider wishing to join to ensure it isn't a client wanting to write his own reviews.
The site could be relatively hidden from search engines and the like, and all access to the database would require being logged in.
Hell, if I had any free server space, not earmarked for other projects, I'd look into setting it up myself.
good, some guys just strut in, stink like shit, want to stick their tongue down some girls throat they'd have no chance with without the cash, and the girl has to spread her legs and pretend this is the best thing that ever happened to them? So they are looking for a little outlet, thats all.
just a little saturday eve two cents.
I understand why ladies would want to "review" certain clientele. I know I hate it when a guy gives his name and all the other info I ask of him and then "No Shows" or the guys that call and whack it while they talk to you. That takes away from a guy who wanted the same time, but got ahold of me after I already booked the session. So I am just stuck losing out and so is guy #2? The point is I would like a place to put up a phone number or an e-mail address of a guy who consistantly flakes, causes problems, etc. Not every client just the "bad" ones. You know the "Pond Scum" of our lovely little community. I don't think we should review our "Good Guys" I think they have earned the right to remain anonymous. When a Rip Off provider is found she is slammed and her info and aliases splashed across the boards so all you guys know to avoid it and save themselves the time, frustration, and hard earned cash. Well a problem client's info should be subject to the same scrutiny. How many times have you wanted to see a provider a little short on notice, found she was unavailable? Just think if she was sitting there fiddeling with her little thumbs because some moron "No Showed" on her. Couldn't you just kick the guy for taking your time? I by no means have all the answers and couldn't begin to figure out the logistics of such a board, but I wish someone else would. Ladies Only access of course... LOL
Just Another Point of View...
To be honest, I really did think that another board did have facts that you girls could post about any problems had with a call. Is this not the reason for this type of board? Are we not both wanting to be as 'secure' as we can be doing this?
Fair is only fair. Only once have I ever blasted a girl here and boy did she deserve it. It was by reading the boards, and emailing you girls that I learned "how to" and enjoy the services offered. I would have no problem with the ladies giving info on problem types to protect themselves.
When I am with a provider, I try hard to see to it that she also is having a good time. By nature, I am rather an old time romantic...and woman today will not allow me to do this. They are 'to independant' and will not do for me what I do for them.
If a provider is having a good time...she is more likely to not see the clock (if she has the time) and allows for me to take my time...slow down (this is needed due to meds I must take) for me to relax and enjoy sex. I have much respect for the woman I have seen....all have been VERY understanding of my medical problems, and have all taken the time to allow me to relax and enjoy myself. More then I can say about civi woman.
I think staff should look into this and offer the same "VIP" service for the woman. Fair is fair. As far as reviews go for "ozzy335" I hope they are full of good news!!!!!!! (wink)
Good post Angel
xxx/ooo and one more x/o for good luck....
oz
Publicaly posting reviews on clients could be a double edged sword. One just what sort of information should be posted. Should this be only posted on bad clients or both good and bad?
When it gets down to it on bad clients there should be a place to keep a concise list of bad clients searchable bye both name and geography. On these reviews certain details should also be included such as: he is bad because he scheduled 4 times and never showed up even once, He shorts on donation and does not make it up, he snuck into your purse and ripped you off when u went to the ladies room, and of course the biggy he is physicaly violent. On the first two maybe rate them as simple bad clients and provide screen name real first name email and contact info for reviewer for in the event more info is needed though by this point he is not getting on my calander, on the other two label them as rip offs and dangerous respectively. On these two types they should be outed fully with full name contact info general physical discription etc.
On good clients if nothing personal is revealed except say his user name on ter or what other board and email addy it could work well for both clients and providers in much the same way as references do. As far as details, performance is out unless it is to warn of his right hook. (see bad client)the only other thing that might be acceptable is an answer to a simple yes no question, "Would you be willing to see him again?" and again the reviewer's info (screen name and contact info) In addition if such a board exhisted one should never list a good client unless he wishes for you to do so.
Also if such a board exhisted it would have to be private to ladies only but at the same time when new reviews are added an email with copy of the review be sent out to the client on those for good clients that the review has been submitted and if he does not wish to have it posted to please reply with a subject line of do not post. This would allow good clients the final say so without explaination of any reviews posted on themselves yet at the same time would protect the provider from retribution from the bad clients should they find out that she has reviewed him in an unfavorable manner.
There one inherent problem with posting information about clients. That is, if a client is "good", that person's identifying information should never appear anywhere. In short, "good" clients should never be reviewed for any reason.
As far as ripoff, unhygienic, physically violent, or grossly arrogrant clients are concerned, I could care less what happens to such people, all of their personal information could get posted on a city billboard for all I care, they deserve it. A review site to out bad clients would be useful, but as I stated, no information on good clients should EVER appear on such a site.
A person that is providing can start a website that reviews bad clients and provide discussion forums such as this board provides for hobbyists and provider members. There is no restriction against starting such a board, other than the will to do so. Making such a board work as intended has many drawbacks, including the faithfulness of the providers that the site was designed to serve (a few bad providers gaining access to the site can ruin it for all).
client? For instance, what if a provider decides that a client who does not tip is NOT a "good" client? I would agree very much with your comment that "good" clients should never be reviewed for any reason, but, as you know, shit happens, and a perfectly "good" client could very possibly wind up on somebody's shit list for the wrong reasons, which in my opinion has disturbing ramifications.
A "good" client is one that shows up on time for the appointment, has the agreed upon fee, is hygienic (fresh breath, properly showered, hair well groomed, ect) and observe whatever rules that the lady has, even if he feels that they are confining. A "good" client does not have to be happy about the session after it is done, but he resolves this by not choosing the lady again.
Just like reviewers that post false reviews, providers that put's a "good" client into a "bad" client database will be outed and dealt with. But this area is where your concern has great substance. A hobbyists that was a model client for a lady should not end up in a position where he has to prove that he did nothing wrong during a session with a lady.
Quite simple
good client
good hygene respectful follows any rules and limits shows up with proper fee no more no less required
additionaly as i stated before he is even posted as a good client the form is submitted to him in an email and only gets poste if he oks the posting thus it basicaly works as an affirmation that he saw the provider posting his screen name and two he was clean respectful and payed propper fee
no embelishments allowed each point a yes no question
Yahoo groups, or maybe even actual websites. You just have to ask the right ladies about them. There have definitely been guys here who have complained of being "blackballed."
I've always assumed these exist.
/Zin
I've seen a few deserted boards - I'd love to know if there's an active one. Otherwise, I rely on the people I know. When I've heard about men being blackballed, it's because they've been shut out by agencies. But I'm not sure how independents get that info.
no one else seems to use it in my part of the country. Not to mention it does cost $24.99 or something close per month. If you are still interested... it is called My Hobby Horse... LOL doesn't that bring some images to mind? LOL
One provider's ideal client may be on another provider's shit list. I think there is a lot of subjectivity involved here due to YMMV and compatibility. One thing for sure is that an intentional ripoff on the part of the client should definitely be grounds for him being outed. However, factors pertaining to YMMV and performance are not grounds for being outed.
What if the hobbiest gives a provider a bad review(deservedly) and she in revenge puts him up on this theoretical site as a bad hobbiest?
On the other hand what if the hobbiest as a preemptive strike puts up a bad review of a GOOD provider because he knows HIS behavior was poor and he wants to cast doubt on what she says about him?
Who do you believe?
I hate to say this but while back channeling isn't perfect...currently it's the best way for providers to weed out the bad hobbiests...it would be even better if you could ensure more ladies kept each other informed
I wonder if it might be a good idea for providers take the list of bad hobbiests they already know about and send this list to other providers that are working the same general locations and ask for the same in return?
I know this is a competitive business but surely you all at the very least wouldn't want to hear about another provider hurt by a client or ripped off would you? Especially if the person who hurt one of your sisters in spirit was someone you already knew was a risky client
I suppose some might not return the favor but some almost certainly would and every little bit helps I'd think