do you believe there is a possibility for happy ever after with a monger/provider or shall i say ex-monger/ex-provider??

can one forever get rid of temptation to hobby/provide?

It's harder though, but possible. My honest opinion is that you have to be prepared for him to ask you at some point to give up escorting. Id u meet him while providing and then you move to civvie dating. It's hard for sure. But I would never waive someone out for the possibility of real love just because the circumstances in which I met that person.  

I have developed feelings for clients, providers, became very good friends with some of them. Heck one of my dearest friends who I met while providing introduced me to my therapist. I will always be eternally grateful for the friendships and relationships that if I wasn't an escort I never would have been exposed to.  

The temptation to provide/hobby will always be there I think. U just have to deal with those urges. Or have an open relationship with your SO.  

 -- Modified on 1/27/2016 10:38:42 PM

is something to be expected if not hoped for. Best of luck

If you are both serious about leaving the hobby it's possible.

I think that anything is possible as long as the monger accept that the provider job as it is,just a job,and of course he will have to be in love with her to accept that.

i am flattered  

thank you

who knows what is in the cards? but i want to find mutual love and retire..what girl does not....independence is overrated)  

 

And having both parties involved in the hobby doesn't make it any easier.  

The hobby is partly based on lies, deception, and illusion, and certainly, that is not a good foundation for any relationship

i'm flattered, but i insist we go dutch!

i prefer guys with smaller dicks,sorry

did you say you wanted to try dutch oven? i am known for being kink friendly lol
 

Clever banter!  Haha!!!!

thank you

Just seems like a lot of drama. Also temptation/trust issues of the other person still going back to old ways....

I'll speak for myself.  We dated, got engaged and were in the midst of planning on the big day.  Nothing fancy, just immediate family and a few friends.

Why it lasted so long was that I was willing to deal with the fact she was a provider.  She didn't have to, but I didn't mandate she stop.  That has to be a decision she made on her own.  She knew my feelings about it.  But I also knew the person from the persona.

As with any relationship, it has to have a solid foundation.  Trust, honesty, open communications are paramount.  Sadly, some of her actions caused me to lose trust and that was that.

I dated a provider once who I'd seen a number of times in her professional capacity.  It was an intense affair, but didn't last - not because of the provider history but because of our life situations.  I still wonder what ever happened to her, and one of my biggest regrets in life is not having been able to keep in touch with her.

As clients we are conditioned from the start to NEVER utter the word "love"  and we are taught that
Providers will stop seeing us if we show any signs of "unprofessional behavior"

Certainly, both parties would have to get off TER to start.  

Could it work? Sure. I think so. I would hope so.  
 Would it last? Civi relationships don't last so I don't know - maybe
There are certainly a lot of issues that would take communication and a whole lot of it.  
Major.  
Temptation? Sure but sex isn't love ,,,

Pros:
-Unlike with most civvie dates, you'd already know if he has bedsmarts or not at the start.
-He already knows the most scandalous thing about you (I assume ) and vice versa.
-You'll both understand each other's ambivalent feelings about this addictive world.  
-The pendulum arcs are wider in here: the assholes get on nerves you didn't even know existed, but the good hobbyists are astounding.

Cons:  
-If you fear your family ever knowing and he is not in the same boat, he'll always have that advantage. You never know what will emerge if things get ugly.
-If he wants you to stop, you'll need to decide when. When you get out before you're ready, it starts to nag at you some.
-The sex is different.  Not immediately, but the human elements that we often banish start to turn up. Sessions are planned, partnersex is less so.  It's a form of intimacy, but feels weird to those of us who like to feel perfect.  That first spontaneous sex with the unwaxed legs....:-0. Lol

-- Modified on 1/27/2016 9:08:05 PM

an even playing field to me.  Who can find fault with whom?  If there was a possibility of that becoming an obstacle.

a friend. I could only wish you the best. You're an amazing young woman. You didn't ask for advice (lol) so I'll answer. Yes I do.

Are you trying to tell me something ...

But hey anything is possible. I just can't imagine it being without major pressure to stop providing, maybe not  immediately. I can just see all of the issues and insecurities...  

Like even with just regulars, if I am asked if I'm available and I say no but I can in an hour... It is assumed no matter what that I am fucking someone else. Not that it matters either way or is anyone's business. Getting casually asked " oh so you have an apt" or piquing for that info is just rude. But it matters

Now if it were a boyfriend waiting to spend some time with me and I wasn't available... And I honestly wasn't "working" I think he would still assume that at some points. Of course that would hurt an ego.

What man wants to dance around and deal with that on a daily basis? I assume a man can only hear " I would but I have an apt" so many times

It' may be irrational and unfair but I truly think that would be the case with a lot of relationships.

END OF MESSAGE

END OF MESSAGE

Which is a whole 2 attempts. Well, 2 1/2 if you count my most recent debacle (won't go in to that here) ...

I think it's very difficult for the hobbyist to trust the intentions of the provider / former provider. My personal experience with providers is being sold on a fantasy. The quote-unquote "girlfriend experience." The better they are at providing that fantasy, then the more satisfying the experience ... from the point of view of the client/provider experience.

But try to make that transition IRL and it becomes tricky. My biggest hurdle, personally, is being able to just trust her when she's being "real." My first instinct is always to assume that she is hustling me, or selling me on some sort of extended girlfriend experience.

For that reason, I truly think the cards are probably stacked against me so I might best be served in the civilian world. I'm learning there is a lot about myself I would need to change. Until I can start learning to just trust people more, then I think the challenge would have to be on the provider (or former provider) to go out of her way to assure that she is being genuine, and that her interest is real. And that might be an unfair responsibility to place on her.

So I think the answer is most definitely "yes," but you have to commit yourself to it because it will take twice the effort.

Octavia, I think you seem about as genuine as they come, and I have no doubt that you can have whatever you want and whatever you set your mind to. Good luck in your search if that is what you want!


-- Modified on 1/27/2016 9:26:06 PM

fold it in half!

i am not retiring...why everybody is saying goodbyes to me lol  
nor did i find mutual love

END OF MESSAGE

girl, you said it)

somebody actually proposes to me in an old-fashioned manner and  puts a big diamond ring on my finger and asks me to sign a prenup lol ...

ll of what you're saying is true.

Just like with a married person, you're starting out with kind of a heavy burdon of proof placed on you in terms of expressing your sincerity.  

I happen to believe the biggest denominator is kids/family. it's actually not all that hard to step away from an unhappy marriage or relationship when there are no kids involved. But throw the kids in to the equation, and now you're looking at an unbelievable hurdle.

A family is obviously a hard thing to break up. Just like a career is a hard thing to leave (assuming that is what is being asked).

An attached person with no kids though ... not so much. I think you're starting on a pretty even playing field. Each has a huge burdon when it comes to expressing their sincerity. But at least you're both starting out on a fairly even playing field with roughly the same number of chips stacked against you on either side of the equation

Sometimes that gets boring. Not only for ex-providers and ex-clients, but for ordinary knights and princesses. Then they become the clients and providers yet to come.

Of course, the feeling of finding happy ever after is a rush, and if you feel that way just go with and enjoy the ride as long as it lasts. When it ends you'll have another strong emotion to explore.

"How long is forever when forever is forever gone?"

I'm dating a provider I'm seeing. So far it's still great.

I don't believe just one woman can make a man happy.
Also if a person does go down the road of having a relationship.
Just set the terms of what each person wants out of it and enjoy yourselves with no regrets.

If you follow what other people do in a traditional relationship.
Then both parties might not be happy in the long run.
The last thing is anything is possible including dating in this hobby.

 

This is sort of what I was trying to get at.. If you guys have both met at an apt and its worth it for both of you to try to be " together" il say 90% if the time, its probably cause its percieved to be even harder to find love with a "civie".. Even subconsciously. It implies that your self confidence is pretty low.  

And I can tell you from the clients I used to see (and maybe this is just MY previous experience with the shithole that is backpage, I used to mainly use that) I have literally felt every single one of them has just wanted to make me their " trophy", obviously can't find love anywhere else and must have emotional problems (not that I don't probably have a plethora of them myself but I feel a provider has to keep those lives separate.) Enough to be able to convince himself he's in love with a "hooker" that he's met 1-3 times. If that's love then the bar is pretty low.  

I always think a man claiming to have feelings for me just feels like im a good fuck that would look great on his arm. Or I am some of the only intimate contact he has with a female and is confused on what a relationship it.

I could be wrong on so many levels, I'm really not sure.. This is basically my thought process on the subject.

She was very popular.. she stopped almost two years ago.. she hated it..

+1.  Everyone deserves happiness!

Good point.

but I started dating a provider, it worked out, we got married, and the story continues.

The truth of the matter is that dating a provider is not so different from dating anyone.

There are ups and downs, and you never know exactly what the future will bring.  The real wild cards are the people themselves, and their ability to work out problems and enjoy the relationship

...but if you're willing to indulge some type of open arrangement with agreed-upon parameters, then YES! Keep in mind that a lot of customers are here because, for various reasons, the sex dried up at home.  

You'll also have more success if you let go of the "happy ever after" fairy tale. Maintaining a satisfying LTR requires constant work for "ever after."

Yes it is possible.  However it is going to take the right person and the right level of maturity/security.  There was a time in my life I would not have been able to date a provider.  Now I would have no problem with it.  If I met the right person and we clicked.

A key is going to be honesty.

and has a passel of kids.  

 
In all seriousness, it's up to you as a person to decide if you want to make concessions to be happy with someone(s). If you feel you can give up activities which make you happy and you feel make up who you are as an individual for...love, then by all means aim for the stars honey.

It's all about chemistry, really. You either have it or you don't.

I mean, what you're saying is entirely possible. But when you meet someone that you just click with and the chemistry is instant, it can be a pretty powerful thing. Has nothing to do with whether or not he is "desperate." Maybe you just make him feel a certain way that can't be described.  

He could have any woman he wanted, but he has more fun and feels more at home with you than the others. It's a biological thing ... we just gravitate towards those who make us feel comfortable.

is a long ass time.

times and people change.  long term "love" has nothing to do with
whether you or me or someone else is addicted to sex or not.
maybe....

I think, no, I don't think, I know it is on both parties shoulders to be sincere and put extra work into the relationship, and this is any SO relationship not just one involving ex-providers/providers and ex-hobbyists/hobbyists. I think what kills most established SO relationships is one side or the other fails to put in the effort.

Now here is the big thing in this game with a real relationships with current/former players of this game: Honesty. Honesty is important in any lasting relationship but doubly so in the hobby. Trust will be hard to earn knowing both sides have used the hobby before. Both sides have provided a fantasy in a sexual relationship.  And lets be honest for a second both likely have lived a double life. Little lies hurt more in that context.  

And who risks the most it depends on the individuals. But it isn't just on any one side to earn trust and put in the work. One thing though you should never seriously date a person married to another. They really aren't on the market. If they are seriously interested it means they are playing someone and odds are they are playing everyone. You know they are not being honest with someone and they might not be being honest with anyone. It is of little wonder your relationships with them haven't worked. Always wait for the divorce papers before trying to make it work.

The hobby isn't partly based on lie. It's all lies. Your provider persona is not the real you regardless of how many times a client repeats.  

It can work if you want it to work. I met a man right here on TER. We are not married by choice but we are intimate friends and have been 5 years now. Octavia is a young woman. Perhaps that's why she has a more optimistic outlook and speaks of happily ever after. I've been married and divorced several times so I'm quite content to stay single at this stage in life. Had I met this man before kids and divorce, I would have married him in a heartbeat. He's been my biggest cheerleader and more generous and supportive than any civvie dipshit I ever hooked up with or married.  

irst off, no. Not married. Sorry. Not me.

Secondly, I'm saying it's a 2 way street.

Both sides have to work extra hard to prove sincerity. It's a 50-50 thing. In my case the burdon has to be on the provider to prove sincerity first.

And the reason for this is because first and foremost, she is the one who fucks people for a living. Most often my regular provider is the only person on the planet I happen to be sleeping with.

If you can't understand why that places an extra burdon on you, then it's no wonder you haven't had much success with this

Agreed.  In my case, having been unsuccessfully married once, I now realize that human beings are polyamorous (whether our culture will admit it or not).  From here on out, I will never be a one-woman sort of man.  I know that there are women out there who understand this concept, and I'm pretty sure that the provider world has a higher percentage of these kinds of women.  So, while I'm not expecting anything but great sex from the ladies, I'm always open-minded, in case opportunity knocks.  With the right mindset, a provider and client could very well become a happy, polyamorous couple.

I am glad you are not retiring. , I may have a trip to Boston later this year!

Maybe the hobby would be a more honest place.

I had a provider who wanted to date me, but I didn't feel the same and it ended badly.  On the other hand, since my divorce I have been with a few providers and a SB who I could imagine dating, but never acted on it.  Its a delicate situation with many factors involved.  I could see myself dating the right provider and if it got serious, I would commit myself to providing financially for her for selfish reasons.  I was in a committed marriage for over 10 years before partaking in the hobby and can do it again for the right woman, regardless if she is a civie or provider.

Wow what a great attitude and perspective.  Julia will you marry me??

I've dated hookers, both active and retired, and I have no problems being faithful when in a committed relationship.  

Not all whore mongers are liars and cheaters and not all hookers have the desire to go out and fuck strangers when they have a boyfriend or husband at home. Quite the contrary, the last thing many ex hookers want to do is go out and fuck random strangers after finding "true love" I would say many ex hookers are the least likely to cheat on an SO after retiring

A John who has either a wife or a GF and is still seeing hookers has proven himself to be a cheater and the "burden of proof" most definitely falls on his shoulders, not hers.

When I am in a "committed relationship" I treat that commitment seriously, just because I can get out of a relationship easily would not make me any less of a liar for breaking that commitment.

I can speak only for myself, but there are two ways to not be a cheater. One of course is to "not cheat" the other is not promise not to. It takes a lot to get a promise of monogamy out of me, but once that promise is made, I live by it.

When you have two people.

And one of those people is regularly getting her knees pinned behind her ears while having her pussy randomly plowed by cocks ... the other person needs at least some assurance that he is not just another in a long list of random cocks.

I'm sorry GAG. I would agree with you wholeheartedly if we were talking about just a regular gal who's daily routine does not involve getting up, brushing her teeth, swallowing cum, getting jerked off on, and having her pussy pounded by random cocks.

There is just something different about this that can't be spun or sugar-coated. It's not the "usual" profession and it requires a certain type of an understanding. To deny that is to ignore reality.

END OF MESSAGE

The tricky part is the "ever after" proposed by Octavia. Hell, I've even had instances of being faithfully monogamous as a client to a hooker because I had no desire to see anyone else. Tell me how you feel about monogamy after fucking the same person for 10..20..30 years. (Granted, it's a spectrum/bell curve - sure you can find examples of couples that manage to stay happily sexually exclusive over the long term, but I'm making a general statement here).

When I am in a "real" relationship with a hooker, she is giving me for free what she charges all those other men quite a hefty fee.  

Unless she has a BF or husband unaware of what she is doing she's not cheating on anyone. You OTOH are self admitted liar and cheater. Are you seeing hookers with the blessing of your wife? If not, you have ZERO right to the moral high ground here.

Your words make me believe you really can't get over what these women do for a living. It's not my place to try to convince you otherwise, but it's plain you are the type of guy who should NEVER get into a real relationship with a hooker or even ex hooker because I guarantee you, you are the kind of guy who will eventually throw her past back in her face and that's is something a guy like me, perhaps one of the biggest assholes ever to grace these pages, would NEVER do.

Is it more likely that a man or woman who had already been with hundreds or thousands of other people might be "ready" to be monogamous than two high school kids who got married to the person who broke their cherry and who never got a chance to "sow their oats"? I don't know, but a case could certainly be made.

END OF MESSAGE

-- Modified on 1/28/2016 10:56:18 AM

Go back and read the part where I alluded to my expectations probably being best suited to civilian existence.

My one positive experience was a beautiful Asian. And her subserviant nature was what put me at ease. Sorry to use such an obvious stereotype. But she would regularly buy me lunch on her dime. A drop in the bucket compared to the things I bought her. But it was the little gestures like that which made me feel like I was more to her than a regular John.

And no, I never brought up what she did. I felt like she was invested in me, and in return I gave her everything she could have wanted in a friendship.

Thanks for your concern though.

My "number" is also well into the thousands. I 100% agree with your point.

looking forward)

but the one thing I am NOT is a hypocrite. Nor do I look down on the women who do this for a living.  

It appears as there are three main types of guys here. The guys who look down on hookers as unclean and immoral. The guys who look up to you as "Goddesses", guess those guys have never been laid without paying for it.  and lastly the category I fall in, which are guys who look as you as equals, equals to us, equals to other women. Just women who happen to sell sex for a living, no better and no worse.

Ok, now I better make some kind of comment about old fat broads before you start taking a liking to me. lol

Do they have a special type of cleaner for that?

Tide Stick perhaps?

-- Modified on 1/28/2016 12:38:04 PM

The ladies who do this get to be with a lot of married men and what is probably the number one complaint?   Life in the sack gets really boring or it becomes non-existent.    I would think that when you have a relationship between two people who have engaged in this little adventure of ours, there would be more open communication and awareness about how important sex is to keeping a relationship in good working order.  I would think that would be a huge positive factor.  

As for having been a john or a provider, yeah, there is baggage but we all come with baggage.   I would think it would also be a huge relief to be able to be honest about each other's past and not be judged for it

I am not sure if I agree about the BSU's who refer to you as Goddesses having ever been able to get laid in the real world, but I will agree it's still away to dehumanize you "broads". lol

I think a lot of times if I was the "second" in line, I'd always be compared to the first.

Which has happened to me before Lol!

Unfortunately, those considering me for the future couldn't handle my hyper sexuality. While in the beginning, they would say "My ex wife stopped having sex with me, so it didn't work." I would say "My bf stopped having sex with me too, so it didn't work."

The guy would say "Yeah, but over time, women just stop having sex."
I would say, "I guarantee you I won't have a problem in that area."
Then he would say "We'll see about that."

Poor guys didn't realize who they were challenging, and by the three month mark, they were still unable to keep up - to the point where they started saying, "You know, relationships aren't about sex. That's just added." This would be after pursuing them for a week.

Now if a guy wants it 7 times a day, yeah he needs to find someone else. lol.

-- Modified on 1/28/2016 3:19:38 PM

Not all Johns are cheating on someone.  

Yes, I have been married and yes I have been in committed relationships, but NO I don't see hookers when in such relationships. If those relationships aren't working, I get out of them and then once again I am no longer is a position of being a liar or a cheat. I am not trying to make moral judgments for others, but I don't like myself very much when I try to live my live as a lie. I found that out when dating a married woman oh so many years ago and I have ZERO intentions of ever doing so again.

As anyone who has been here more than forty five minutes knows, I have had a lot of relationships with hookers and ex hookers. I was faithful in every one of those relationships where I promised to be faithful, obviously "open" relationships don't count. So not ALL men cheat, or have double standards where it comes to sex. I have even been faithful to active hookers, but I have insisted that if I were to be faithful she would cut out overnight, dinner dates and  any kind of friendships with her clients.

rom my angle though, I'm not asking for the fucking world.

I don't ask anyone to change their fucking career or to give up chunks of their livelihood. Fuck that.

All I want is a sincere gesture. Roxanne H made a great post last week. She said basically "If I like you, you WILL know it." That's what I'm talking about.

Now with that said, I'm not expecting someone to go as overboard for her BF as she does. But Roxy is on to something

it's easy money.  I am a bit jaded.

If anyone can do it Octavia, you can.  You seem very genuine in my interactions with you and believe that if you decided to pull back from the hobby, you could do it.

Good luck.

There is always therapy for that kind of problem, not to mention Mr. Hitachi.   Even with that specific situation, I think that there is a bit of an advantage for the former participants in the hobby, because I think those of us who partake in this are more likely to be a bit more open minded.    For example, one lady had the fucking cojones to ask me what I would think if my W put the horns on me, and my answer, though purely theoretical, I think anyway, is that I would not mind it if she still loved me and it was not a question of her no longer being attracted to me.    Bottom line, I think these kind of sexual issues are more likely to be resolved to everybody's satisfaction between a john and a provider.    Notice, I am just talking likelihoods.

BTW, how many times a day are we talking about here?  Lol!

Respectfully yours,

Chocolate Dick

passel of kids...lol

that is too funny but true

it is not easy money...it is high risk, high return....it just seems easy at the first glance...but thank you

i think i am strong enough to give up providing for the right guy  
 

Ok, for the record that chocolate dick has nothing to do with me, as there is no "inlet" at the "outlet".

Chocolate dick. hehheh

Times per day, you mean you don't remember? LOL - With certain participants I can get a little aggressive. ☺️

It can't be all day, every day, if you want to get the "poom pam pow" effect. So in any actual SO thing, I can see the need to back off for a bit so the private parts don't go numb. But with a person if you're doing extended anything, you have to speed up the process by going to do something boring where you can't touch each other. Like a mani / pedi or something... idk. then go back and fuck like monkeys. 🙈

What I think is happening though, based on my very limited experience in LTR's by the way, was the game stopped. Once someone stopped playing the game, the other became disinterested. If I couldn't get laid by someone who stopped playing the game, I'd deck out and take them to a bar. They'd watch to see who in their caliber was checking me out.

If other guys looked at me, or tried to talk to me while they were in the restroom, compliment me, etc. They'd complain at "how rude" the guy was, when all I was doing was sitting and looking pretty. ☺️  

I loved it, because I knew when we'd get home, I was gonna' get fucked with some serious testosterone and territorial man-ness lol. (In a healthy, natural sense not verbally communicated.)

BUT it's the other way around with me. If a guy hits on women, or talks to other women in front of me, but doesn't give me the ability to seduce him back, or chase off other girls, I go flirt with guys to make myself feel better, and to show off for him.

If they fight back for me, and get jealous, but stay, they're back in. If they say they want to go home, (which means I over-played what they could handle,) I'll go, but I then deny them of sex that night. They need to step up their game lol.  

If there is a problem that is a huge turn off, I always communicate it. But if the guy doesn't want to listen to what the problem is, or fix it, (i.e. which is usually compliments, gifts, little public kisses, attention, and eye contact throughout the day,) then they're not getting pursued.

That - again - is if they are not paying me haha. If someone is dishing over the dollars, they've fast-tracked to the sex part lmfao. Sometimes you get both around here, which is really nice.

In an ongoing "fling", there's something about the game where you're challenged to keep them. It's a territorial thing. But there's a balance in the demand thing, because somehow, you have to make the mate think "Yes, I'm in demand, but you're the only guy in the world that I can see you hot bastard."

There's a little game to play, and if we don't keep the game going, (without telling them there's a game,) everyone gets bored and stops playing.

But please divulge what "Put the horns on me" means someone... lol.

-- Modified on 1/28/2016 7:13:41 PM

Some women are able to turn their back on it and never look back without any issues at all. I know many of these women who while they don't regret having done this for a living, certainly don't miss it even a little bit

and then I see another review pop up.

hahaha. Damn sobering of "Hmmm, maybe I"m not their one and only ATF" hahah.

But yeah, I've heard of some stories up to even a 25 year difference in age, now still happily married. It was "just private stripping" and "no sex" of course! 😅

And then I got into the AE industry and figured out that - hmmm - she was banging him. lol. So yeah, it happens, for sure.

If I were going to meet a dude via this venue, he's going to be taking care of me financially, and hiring me gigilos. Because, as much as we want to love someone and trust someone, - come on. He's gonna' keep banging the ho's. Especially as he gets older.

And if he starts talking about kids - that's a huge financial savings premium for me to invest as "fuck you" money in case he decides he's going to drop me for another provider he fell in love with. LOL.

Unless I become rich myself by hitting a song in a movie or something. Then I can take care of myself. LOL

I hope this helps a little:

That's a decision he makes for himself. The same with women.  You have no bearing on it.

If they can look themselves in the mirror and not be bothered by it, don't know what to say. I'm with GaG on this. I've never cheated on anyone when I'm in a committed relationship. I may get a hall pass now and again, but that's a different situation.

I think it is certainly possible, for the right guy and gal. There definitely seems to be some guys on here who are looking for more than sex. They may not even realize it themselves, but you can see it in their posts. I think it really comes down to respect.

For me, I don't think that I will ever commit to a monogamous relationship again. I don't believe that it is really the healthiest situation for most people. I do however believe that commitment can be found outside of monogamy.

-- Modified on 1/28/2016 9:35:40 PM

Glad to know that I have a following on here

Oh, and good for you darling.  

I truly believe that is possible with the right  chemistry and commitment

It has happened before and it will happen again.  

So say we all

^^^^ This.

END OF MESSAGE

amazing article really