I spent time in a church today. It would have been Dad's 78th birthday and the last time I'd set foot in one was for his funeral. I wasn't there by choice as much as to appease my mother for something that was important to her. It dawned on me that day that it's about making people feel that there is a point to life when times are tough. So, today as I looked around at all the people sitting, standing, kneeling and repeating some mantra like a herd of sheep, it dawned on me that the unwashed masses have a need to be lied to. Tell me to hop on one foot, give money on regular occasions, and turn over my young boy to be sodomized in the name of some legendary creator.
Now, don't get me wrong. I'm not saying that religion is a farce. OK, I am but that's not the point. The real point is that there is a tremendous business opportunity here for the taking. People laughed at the Mormons and Scientologists. Jonestown was just some faraway place until it hit the news for serving Kool-Aid. I'm sure that if we put our heads together, we could create the next great money laundering scheme, er, religion. I have no desire to control the virginity of young boys, but perhaps we could pick up some fast cash in exchange for eternal something or other.
with me will make for an eternal smile. 
I am all for fast cash as well, and I have often had the same thoughts as the OP. Unfortunately I am just not a good enough liar to "sell religion" back in my younger days I recognized the potential to make a fortune by selling fairy tales, but even an "evil oil baron" like myself was too honest to make a living selling snake oil to suckers.
I figured you for the perfect bullshit peddler, lol
It is the perfect "business" after all. You have zero product cost, at least in this lifetime that is. You collect billions, if not trillions of dollars and get to wait till the next lifetime to pay off. What could be better?
At least bullshit peddlers give the buyer something to use as fertilizer, that's more than any preacher has ever delivered. lol
the average run of the mill clergymen dont do it for the money.
I've contracted a lot of work recently for churchs and these guys and gals are not the least bit wealthy nor are their congregations. these guys never get the attention because they just go about their business but deserve to be acknowledged for the good they do "just because".
they are the ones manning the homeless shelters, foodbanks, and nursing homes. giving comfort and company to the dying and neglected while their family members runoff pursuing their own selfish interests.
wholesale condemnation is not an intelligent method of analysis.
Just like Churchholady, I don't need the threat of some red monster with a pitchfork to make me a decent human being.
Good people are good people without coercion,. People who do good because their religion tells them to are either, good people with or without religion, or phonies that are only "acting" good to stay out of hell.
by pitchforkman. i realize that is how "he" is portayed but what he really represents is the selfish side of man. the destructive, greedy side. but even then the people i've come to know are not negatively motivated. rather, they are motivated by the sense of satisfaction they get from doing unselfish acts. that was the real lesson jesus was trying to teach when he talked about the pharisees and praying in the open vs. private. leave it to a dumbass like willy to have the takeaway be that christians should shut the fuck up. indeed, the admonition was to not make public the work you do for the sake of taking credit because that in and of itself becomes a selfish act.
kind of like the libs like john edwards that publically proclaims his concern and care for the poor but spends his time running a hedgefund for millioniares and suing doctors on bullshit science. he'll work night and day for the poor and downtrodden SO LONG AS he is elected to public office and can stuff his face at the public trough. otherwise, its "go fuck yourself..ive got a mistress and a bastard to support!
My church functions in just such a way. We have at least 90 on-going community service projects going at any one time, support the elderly, feed the homeless folks who walk in, and contribute to the community in many other ways. Any church worth it's weight is operating in the same capacity. The idea is to be profitable in order to serve the community and not be self serving. Our church is getting ready to add a building on our campus and the funds have to be raised by pledge and are not sitting in a bank account somewhere.
I can possibly get and still be alive: No more regulars and no more casuals. Bleh, unfortunately, that means no sex. Am I really alive if I'm not having sex?
I've a new site for those who want slow and steady and LTR, but no takers yet. It's in the direction I wanted to go in the first place, but got too impatient for fast cash!
I tried to fade away, but this lifestyle is still too fun! So, while I didn't make a BIG splash about retiring, I guess I fall into that "I'm going away" but came back a few months later. Meh... what're ya gonna do, rip me a new one? I can take it!
And, I can still tease up a storm in the meantime.
-- Modified on 6/27/2011 5:52:21 PM
I prefer to think of it as a blind spot. It's not like she's alone in that delusion.
you're the one with the blindspot. You would'nt be the only one with myopia.
Now, don't get me wrong. I'm not saying that religion is a farce. OK, I am but that's not the point. The real point is that there is a tremendous business opportunity here for the taking. People laughed at the Mormons and Scientologists. Jonestown was just some faraway place until it hit the news for serving Kool-Aid. I'm sure that if we put our heads together, we could create the next great money laundering scheme, er, religion. I have no desire to control the virginity of young boys, but perhaps we could pick up some fast cash in exchange for eternal something or other.
If you look at the history of humanity, people would attach gods and myths around those things they did not understand or feared. Like before science told us earth revolved around the sun, people gave credit to sun gods, like Ra.
But over time science has been able to explain a lot except for a couple of things: Death and Suffering. Most modern day religions have well thought out and complex ways to explain these two occurrences in order to easy the fear surrounding them.
Death is constant, and no one can escape it, so many religions offer an afterlife of paradise for those who are good. Suffering is often seen or portrayed as a test to see if you are as good as you say you are. Or in some cases, suffering is punishment for bad behavior, (ex. karma). Just think, one of the greatest religious figures in history, Jesus, demonstrated this clearly. He basically told people not to worry about suffering and persecution on earth because the "Kingdom of God" was waiting for them. All they had to do was believe in him. So controversial at the time because it required no money/tides, no special diet, no belonging to a certain group/family, no acting a certain way (as all sins are forgiven no matter what). All one had to do was believe. What an amazing and powerful thing to tell someone who struggled and suffered his/her entire life.
So to sum it all up, religion in it's purest form (before corrupt people try to exploit it and it's believers), is a mechanism people use to cope with the unknown, death being the most significant as death is the one thing none of us can escape and no one has truly returned from to tell us what to expect. Well, no one but Jesus, and he promised paradise.
What makes this so dangerous however, is the faith aspect - Belief without questions. One should believe and never question anything otherwise, they will miss out on the opportunity for heaven. This makes exploiting believers easy. Such a shame.
Disclaimer - I consider myself Catholic, even though I am well aware of the history of the Catholic church.
My theories are all my own and in no way reflect the views and/or opinions of The Erotic Review.
Kisses,
Vanica
-- Modified on 6/27/2011 2:47:43 AM
It is totally western euphamism for Karma. What you say may correct for western religious evolution not so for Eastern rekigious evolution whatsoever. Actually, eastern religion is philosophy and way of life. It became religions when westerners encountered people following a philosophy and didn't understand how that can be, so the called it a religion.
I know darling. I did use the word "karma" and it's common western meaning to make understand my point more clearly. Thanks for making this point.
Karma is a complex theory with slightly difference connotations based on a person's discipline of belief.
As for as my definition of religion - "philosophy and way of life fits" to a tea. I do not feel a deity, leader or church are necessary.
Kisses,
Vanica
You are as much as a believer as the guy on his knees in front of a painting of X, Y or Z. You just don't know it.
All people believe in something they can't prove. If I spent an hour with you I would find out what it is. Some people believe people are basically good. There is no way to prove this and it can lead to social policies that are misguided because they are based on belief, not reason.
Some people believe that most human behavoir is caused by economic circumstances, as in poverty causes crime or breakdown of family or >>>
Of course, this can't be proven, but they enact huge social programs motivated by that fact.
Some people believe in "what goes around comes around."
Even "scientific people" who believe in global warming are believing that the computer projections are right. A million words would be writen of the flaw of computer programs, and how a factor of 1 degree of can wipe out the entire projection. GIGO.
But Al Gore, in his non-religion, has absolute faith in the computer projections.
As I say, I don't know what you believe in, but you do.
Now to answer your question, people have a need to believe.
Of course you get it all wrong. You comment on priests sodomizing boys. All that proves is that people are not perfect.
And I say all this as a person who is not religious.
Now, don't get me wrong. I'm not saying that religion is a farce. OK, I am but that's not the point. The real point is that there is a tremendous business opportunity here for the taking. People laughed at the Mormons and Scientologists. Jonestown was just some faraway place until it hit the news for serving Kool-Aid. I'm sure that if we put our heads together, we could create the next great money laundering scheme, er, religion. I have no desire to control the virginity of young boys, but perhaps we could pick up some fast cash in exchange for eternal something or other.
to find an equivalent between believing in God/Religion and believing in anything else. How can it be that if I believe in a rational, scientific approach to inquiry, that is equivalent to believing in any version of god? In the first case, I simply require rational inquiry. Why? Because it generally works, to the extent our science can deliver an answer. In the second case, one must believe a deity has created things that are beyond our understanding and answers must be taken on faith. Two different things.
What I am saying is that everyone accepts some things on faith. That is what they believe. It is not based on rationale thought or anything else.
Science cannot say whether man is basically good. Nor can observation. But some people believe it. Their belief is as rationale as believing in God, or in Willies's case, god, or the Easter Bunny.
You may say you believe in a rational approach to scientific inquiry, but are you telling me that everything in which you believe has been proven by science?
Again, people just believe in stuff - different stuff.
of course everybody accepts some things on faith. But there's a big difference between, say, believing that because life evolved here on earth under certain circumstances and given the size of the universe, that its probable that life exists elsewhere, and a belief in god. That's where I think your comparison fails.
It really isn't that big a difference. They both involve the believer accepting something as true that is devoid of any rationale basis.
In the case of someone believing people are good, to use one example, it is something they heard or were told.
YOu see an endless universe and conclude there must be life out there. Some believes that people are good in spite of the USSR, the Killing Fields, Uncle Adolf, and Syria.
Why is your irrational belief better than his?
It's pointless to debate about the single example I chose. Let's pick something less cosmic. I believe medical science will ultimately cure cancer. Why is that analagous to believing in god? There are many more, but, why bother? I think we'll have to agree to disagree.
Predicitng science will cure cancer is a cop out. Neither of us will be around to say, "I was right" or "You were wrong."
There will clearly be advances, because there are every few months. But "cure." ??????/
If you are good at future beliieves, who will win at in the fifth race at Santa Anita next Tuesday.
I also believe most religion haters have'nt quite thought it thru completely with an OPEN MIND. Otherwise they would have to include in their analysis all the good that flows from religious practices. You never see acknowledgement of the stability these "beliefs" bring to society in everyday practices as pointed out by John below. Only the carping about people on their knees.
Right now, there are millions and millions of people in this world doing incredibly kind loving acts towards people in dire need anonymously, for no credit, or pay. They do it because of the very "religious beliefs" that some here mock as silly. I say, what is YOUR contribution to mankind? How does your mockery and derision advance anything?
Frankly, I think the mockery and derision is based in fear. Fear that some ultimate arbiter does exist and the mocker is afraid of that proposition so instaed of dealing with it, he mocks as a form of denial. Like a child in the dark, afraid to face the unknown.
It has always been curious to me that the entire liberal agenda is based on the Christian principle of loving thy neighbor like thyself, and the idea that we are our brothers keeper so we create a huge "social network" to dispense charity. And those very same liberals deride religion. They seek to impose their "beliefs" on everyone else thru taxation and in the same breathe scream bloody murder that someone puts a nativity scene in a public park.
Curious indeed.
Now, where's my hashpipe?
I just don't need a guy with a pitch fork to keep me in line.
If you are a good person, your morals can guide you. But I know people who don't object to killing others. (I am in criminal defense.)
Why is your morals system right and why is theirs wrong?
They do what they think is okay. It is just that their inner voice says there is nothing wrong with smashing some one with a baseball bat.
And how are you to say they are wrong? (In other words, who died and made you God, to tell my clients what is right?)
By what standard of value have you decided that sodomizing little boys is wrong?
Is it because "society" has decided so? Because in the past "society" condoned burning witches at the stake and stoning prostitutes; so society's rules might change.
Whether you like religion or not, it DOES give people an external point of reference for determining right and wrong. It is certainly not always a worthwhile point of reference, but it works for a lot of people.
You would brand me as quite arrogant if I were to say that *I* am the ultimate arbiter of what is right and wrong -- yet, who better to be that arbiter if we have decided that both religion and society are quite fallible so I wouldn't be any worse than either?
Can we all go wandering around then with our own standards? What if my standards allow robbing you blind and yours do not?
Like it or not, commonality of standards of right and wrong is a necessity whenever large groups of people live together. And religion helps to provide that commonality.
And even in a world full of atheists, many of our penal codes still have their origin in the ten commandments.
Because in the natural world the only thing that matters is an evolutionary sense is whether my genes survive. Gene survival = good; and non-survival = bad. Whether my genes were propagated by knocking out women and fucking them without their knowledge doesn't matter in terms of genes.
Survival of the fittest can often really mean survival of the most violent, most underhanded and most capable of deceit. Imposing an outside set of rules is the way societies do not devolve into worlds in which most people would rather not live. Religion is one such source. Destroy it at your peril.
Since there is no man in the sky, we know that morality was created by human beings. And morality continues to evolve.
Holding onto standards of morality from thousands of years ago is no more helpful to human progress than if we were only using technology from thousands of years ago.
No one needs an external point of reference as an arbiter of their values. Without religion, good people would be good and assholes would be assholes. But it takes religion for good people to do horrible things.
Everyone, short of psychopaths, understand what is right and wrong. It's not an accident that religion took the phrase, "do unto others what you would like done unto you". So long as our brains are wired to understand the suffering of others within our own species, then morality will exist. The greater our understanding of walking in someone else's shoes, the better the quality of that morality.
Religion just fucks everything up. It is a primitive morality. It gives people an excuse to ignore what's right and wrong, and to hinder moral evolution. It is no more beneficial to us today than small pox was to the Natives. The sooner it's gone, the better.
It's easy to uncover and see the shadow side of religion. And, it's easy to reduce religious tradition to merely myths. However, meaningful myths have been used for centuries to inspire people to become something more and better than what they could imagine for themselves. Bill Moyers did a PBS special on Joseph Campbell on the matter.
I've known thousands of religious people in my life time. A good portion use their religion in a corrupt manner, at times. And, many other's religion has made them strive to be, and actually achieve being a better person, where a mere moral code would not have succeeded. They needed a myth to inspire them; to see themselves in stories and images that they could not have imagined, caring them beyond their personal limits for not only moral behavior, but also personal achievement, and stronger more faithful relationships.
And, I have found no fool-proof reasoning or logic that assures me that God can not be real. 
for example comes from the word "ligare". Originally before the "Church" started to teach their dogma, "religion" was taught to illuminate and reconnect the human will to the source of "Divine" light. It is interesting the words "religion", "yoga", and "yoke" share an entomological genesis.
Religion, despite what people have said here on this thread is not a series of beliefs, nor a set of customs; religion are teachings which constitute the very life of humankind, which urge high thoughts upon the mind, refine the character, and lay the groundwork for man's everlasting honor.
ONe can choose to follow the Easter Bunny or whatever myth that comes to mind. No matter what religion one chooses to follow; what or whom we choose to honor will determine our character.