I am fairly familiar with the YMMV term, so there's no need to get into the definition of that.
What pisses me off is the provider's lack, if not complete abscense, of professionalism by providing YMMV service. I AM your client/customer, and YOU are a service provider. End of story. You do NOT offer certain people GFE or borderline GFE for "personal" reasons, and not the others. I've worked with customer for several years, and I dare not play favorites, or display of moods. Oh, and everyone (providers & hobbyists both), please don't insult my intelligence with the, "this is a different kind of service", or "there's intimacy involved" etc. etc. If that's the case, then each type of service should have seperate rates.
Lemme break it down for ya:
- Provider decides to go the 'extra' mile, purely based on attraction; hence the BS YMMV, then the rate should be different than the ones they don't find attractive.
- Or be staight and make sure you let the potential client aware, that YOU do certain things for a certain rate for a certain "type" of folks. Here are the discounted rates for the rest.
Bottom line, a true professional would never provide service with YMMV. Pure bullshit, and that's why if I sense even ONE instance of YMMV, whether it's caused by favoratism, or plain ole moodiness, you are NOT seeing MY money!!!
The clients are expected to conduct themselves in a manner that respects the fact that providing is a business - but the ladies often do not relate to what they do at the physical level in a business like fashion. I suppose that is understandable - it is an intimate and vulnerable thing to do. Providers often post decrying being treated as a service person or an object. In their shoes I would feel likewise.
The client has no recourse during a session other than to ask politely. If whatever it is is not forthcoming, or if one is unhappy with the quality of the experience, there could be many reasons including reasons particular to the individual client. However that does warrant a review that mentions the specific YMMV issue, so that others may not have the same problem.
As a hobbyist all of our recourse, other than turning around and walking away before the session, is after the fact.
The ones you are complaining about probably don't WANT your money....
Providers don't go the extra mile based on attraction. They treat good customers who are respectful, clean and generous with good service. Guys who show up late, refuse to shower or brush their teeth, complain about rates, are abusive verbally or too rough get treated differently and often wind up on a Do Not See list after one visit anyway.
YMMV is reality. It has much more to do with the client than it does with the provider.
It is not about attraction, chemistry, or "plain ole moodiness", as you put it. Most [well reviewed] ladies are professional but the term "YMMV" still applies. If you are respectful and clean, you will receive great service and, if you're not, you only have yourself to blame for a less than satisfying experience. My advice [from reading your angry and rude post]... check your attitude and your time with providers will get much better.
Do NOT confuse straight forwardness with rudness. Get your perceptions aligned!!!
Hmmmm...lemme see. I bust my ass to make the fucking $$$, and I decide to get some, and that's IT, and I am expected to put EFFORT into our non-sexual encounter for your comfort's sake??? Please shoot me the day I PAY someone to "attend" to me, and "listen" to my thoughts/feelings!!! LOL
My social circle is wide enough for me to NOT feel the need to have to pay for it. Oh and if I really wanna pay someone to talk to, who actually in return WILL do me some good perhaps(e.g. Psychotherapist), that'd be more justifiable.
Again, READ my post before you make assumptions.
Maybe you should stick within that social circle where you don't "need" to pay for it... because many of us ladies here are very turned off by you post.
I don't give a fuck how much money you have. If you don't approach me in a respectful fashion and realize that each encounter with each individual is it's own experience... that YMMV for many reasons... AND that you as the customer are not "always right"... then a pass is preferred.
Perhaps you can stop being so defensive and reread your own post to see why it is so offensive. Your response to the constructive criticism says a lot...
.02
and IS a different kind of service.
i am sure that it is the same with any personal / professional service.
chemistry plays a role in every professional service whether it is that of a personal companion, lawyer, or doctor. it isn't about making 10 million identical widgets.
I can see where you're coming from. Some guys feel slighted and I'm sure the YMMV caveat has been used as a get out of jail free card.
But try this little experiment...you write down all the sex acts you will do for a lady and then have someone you don't know pick out random women and you have to do every single act you have written down regardless of health or hygiene of these women. Then come back and let us all know how many times you lost your lunch or dinner doing so...because dude, if I can smell skank there is no way I'm doing anything in that area...PERIOD. So consider that my reason for YMMV. And that's just one very valid reason for that.
And keep your money to buy jack-off lube, because knowing how you feel will more than likely preclude you from many a fine ladies list.
Oh and how close to you get to your customers? Is your nose anywhere their asses? Oh and I do have separate rates for guys like you...it's called the I'm eternally busy rate.
I can speak only for myself - and admittedly these are very rare instances:
I have been declined kissing because of my very short neetly trimmed and softened mustache and beard
I have been declined bbbj because I am unaltered - even though I am meticulously clean
In these cases I have mentioned this in my reviews so that others who share one or more of these traits might be forewarned of the likelihood of YMMV.....
But I do consider it highly unprofessional.....
and
for reasons unknown to me, providers have in a very few instances not provided certain services to me that are listed on their profile and are common in their reviews, even though I am meticulously clean well groomed respectul and fun. And of course the opposite is true as well. Chemistry I suppose.
YMMV is real. Of course a provider is not going to accomodate rudeness abusiveness uncleanness and terrible grooming. I would not expect her to. However getting naked with another human being is a one-off, not a production line affair. There will be variables and intangibles. Clients need to be aware of this and accept that intimate "service" will never equate in terms of "quality control" with a production line.
You have 9 reviews posted ... the most recent ones are basically 30-minute visits (per your review), there is a 15-minute one in there, and most are somewhat in the past. Exactly what was the experience that made you pissed off?
I think the point that you may wish to consider is that just as YOU, as a hobbyist, prefer a certain type, so does a provider. The difference is that you may have an idea of what she looks like from an ad, her web site, etc. And with all due respect, perhaps trying to "get to know someone" in these short sessions of yours may also be a damper. I notices one review where you said you were not attracted to the provider and sort of "pushed her away" in the beginning, and were then disappointed at her attitude for the rest of the session. Gee, I wonder why she felt slighted!
Perhaps asking each provider to list, in detail, all of the exceptions, rate variances and conditions of her sessions is a bit much ... so perhaps you should study and research more, ask questions in the beginning, and have longer sessions so someone can get to know you. YMMV is a valid issue in the hobby ... the more YOU give, the more you will receive ... kindness, being a gentleman and courtesy go a long way.
is it really possible to get GFE in a 15 or 30 min. appointment. Sounds more like lick, suck, fuck, & run to me. Not really Girl Friend Experience, at least for those of us that are out of high school.
Wow, talk about scoring some serious brownie points. Or maybe YOU are the type of person who becomes obsequious when he sees a provider. But, to each his own. i.e. more power to you.
None of my reviews have anything to do my reaction to my YMMV-BS theory. This post stemmed from having read seveeral reviews, over the years, and other intelligent observations (yeah, I've done my research). Also, there was a personal encounter with a provider.
Why I don't have a review on her? That's because we never went beyond hello. It neither qualifies as a ripoff, nor as a mediocre service. i.e. I think it would be rude and disrespectful for me to actually give her bad ratings based on almost nothing. Here it goes, I walk up to her room, and one of the things she reveals is, no kissing. According to her site, she's 'full' GFE including DFK (it WAS listed). Please do not ASSUME that KISSING is really important to me. It's the deception, and/or in this case YMMV BS that ticked me off. Without being disrespectfull (people have their own definitions of that, which requires a completely different post, so let's not go there), I simply said sorry, I don't mean to be rude, but I'd rather not go beyond this, and simply walked away. It felt good, 'cause unlike a good majority of reviews I've read where they "take one for the team", and end up paying for SHIT service, since it's almost always rationalized by the hobbyist being either horny, and lost his ability to THINK, and/or "she seemed nice..." etc.
Now, let me elaborate a bit more on the above rant so I don't leave any room for ASSumptions. The ONLY reasons I could think of her giving me the YMMV-BS (I'm starting to like this term) were either because she was ONLY into certain races (No, I am not playing the fucking race card. A good majority of people have racial preferences), the hair, skin color (non-racial) etc. i.e. purely superficial shit that a true professional would never conform to. I am an athlete, so I "look" fairly decent, AND because of that, I actually shower twice a day.
I am NEVER rude with ANY of the providers. I might be aloof, am just not the talkative type? Perhaps. But you deny my SERVICE THAT I AM PAYING FOR(the key word here, read it over and over again) maybe because I wasn't "nice" to you??? I hate to say this, but go fuck yourself!!!! I have seen certain providers who are true professionals, and I HAVE been their repeat client. You must be joking with the more you give the more you recieve philosophy right??? AGAIN, I am NICE to a reasonable extent, and I should get the SERVICE that I was PROMISED for the $$$ I PAY THE PROVIDER!!!! If I want to get to "know" a provider and become her best friend, I am NOT PAYING MY HARD EARNED MONEY FOR IT!!!! Keep in mind, that's purely MY principle. Maybe some of you might not see it that way, but I like to be a bit more realistic in my life.
Why don't you advertise in CL as a male provider and see if YMMV is BS. Just make sure you see all kinds of women and report back. Easy to say anything if you're not in their shoes, so try being in theirs for once. As a client, one doesn't have to be good looking/attractive. Being clean, neat, respectful, warm, sweet and friendly goes a long way. Just MHO.
Nice try, with the use of twisted logic. I would actually LOVE to, and I actually HAVE the balls to go with it. But, I'd NOT do such thing for personal reasons, and the biggest reason in the world that in good majority of the cases women do NOT need to pay for 'company'. CL has enough degenerates instilled with desperation, for women to choose from. I've had my share of the females, like the degenerate men, too on there.
When, as a provider, I encounter someone who is not clean/neat, I have the option to politely as him to go get cleaned up. Now, respectfulness, warmth, etc. is very debatable. I, as a hobbyist AM polite, yet straight forward and to the point. I am NEVER unfriendly. I PAY the provider, it's NOT the other way around, to provide ME with services "promised"; hence the term professionalism.
I refrained from posting earlier because I felt that the previous responses were pretty clear. In reading your later posts I thought I might be able to clarify a YMMV experience that is not based on assumptions. While I completely agree with you that professionalism is always something that a client should expect, a provider is unable in some cases to perform a miracle. Your treatment of me made it completely impossible for me to provide you with that which you’ve suggested that you seek. The lack of warmth that you refer to is an understatement based on my experience with you. I say none of this to be offensive, but in an effort to explain why you may not be getting all that you wish from a lady.
Professionalism IMO is showing up on time, well groomed, and being ready, willing and able to provide all available "services". I welcome straight forward men who know and are not hesitant to communicate their needs. I even find it arousing. Condescension however is a completely different animal.
and with that attitude, you probably get a lot fewer MPG!
QED
Wow with that kind of attitude I doubt you would make it past my screening.
roflmao
We shall kiss your feet !!
Looks as if you are in the habit of seeing Backpage girls/cl girls / and free ads that are fed from CL to CV - and TOFTt -
Step up YOUR game - and maybe you won't be so disappointed and have to give reviews such as : Ok if you're drunk "
TER system works if you utilize it correctly
-- Modified on 2/12/2009 11:32:03 PM
"We shall kiss your feet !!"
ONLY if there is no foot fungus or toe jam.
: P
I don't recall giving a "Ok if you're drunk" review.
No don't kiss my feet (read my response and you'll see it's NOT due to personal experience. Obviously, you have resorted to assumptions. Sad), just do what you're (not as YOU so don't ASSume again please) being paid for.
Well then I suggest the ladies take Sins advice and drop those thngs off the menu that might have a YMMV attached and only give to those they feel like it..then you would have nothing to worry about because those things will not even be offered.
Couple of questions for you sparky....
According to my reviews and my profile, I'm fine with digits in my hoo-hoo. So if you show up with ragged fingernails caked with grime, am I supposed to let you stick them in my privates?
According to my reivews, I like to kiss. In fact, according to some of my reviews, I am an exceptional kisser. So if you show up with a meth mouth (meaning extreme tooth decay), and breath that smells like something you just found in a crypt, am I supposed to allow you to shove your fungus covered tongue down my throat?
Also according to my profile, greek is something I rather enjoy. Does that mean that if a guy who could qualify for guiness book of world records for biggest schlong shows up, I am supposed to allow to him, in the most literal sense, to rip me a new asshole?
YMMV exists because its our bodies we are talking about, not some product on a shelf.
Ok, we can play it your way. I will take kissing, fingers in my va-jay-jay, greek, and BBBJ off the table for ALL guys, simply because these services are NOT available to SOME guys due to their own hygiene issues, or some other issue that would cause ME pain, injury, or illness.
PS. If I happen to connect on a personal level with some guy, and a 1 hour session turns into a 2 hour session, that is none of your damned business. My free time is exactly that - my FREE time to spend how I choose and with whome I choose. Just get over yourself.
I had a client yesterday who was drop dead good looking, incredible body, etc etc. Well, Im down south doing my thang and he's moving around and I notice he is attempting to force my head down lower to do a little rimming. Now, rimming is not something I "offer" on a regular basis, but some people have an ass meant for it, some do not.
This guy had more hair on and around his ass and there was no way in hell I was going to touch it with a 10 foot pole, let alone, my tongue.
Did he get mad? No. Did he cop an attitude? No. Did he come and post a snippy thread about how YMMV is BS? No.
Moral of the story? YMMV is just that. Y M M V.
I love to kiss. If you suck at it, I dont kiss and go on to something else. I occasionaly rim. If you got a jungle down there, I wont and move on to something else. I love DATY. If you have no clue what your doing or your hurting me, I move on to something else.
Are ya seeing a pattern here???
Favoratism, moodiness and looks have NOTHING to do with it.
If a guy is clumsy at day but shows enjoyment, how about a litte training? We'd all appreciate that. And - I have experienced a wide variety in terms of how much pressure or how direct a clitoral stimulation ladies like. A little communication is good for both of "us".
And - since I do have a short but well groomed and softened mustache and goatee and am uncut (but meticulously clean), do you consider it professional of a lady to decline kissing or bbbj?
Its one thing for a lady to have her preferences in a lover. However, when envelopes are being exchanged I consider that kind of YMMV to be very unprofessional....
If you're uncut and are having this issue, why not subtly mention this in your communication...and I mean subtly and maybe you won't be turned down.
According to the responses here, my mileage may vary, but yours, it would appear, has just been reduced to public transportaion. You'll find it in most major cities, on selected street corners.
“Bottom line, a true professional would never provide service with YMMV”
Oh…horse hockey. Grow up. YMMV is a fact in all areas of life.
Professionally, I deal exclusively customers who are having some kind of problem. If everything is good, they have no need to talk to me. And with every customer, regardless who that is, or what the problem is, I am a “true professional”. I will do whatever is necessary to ensure the problem gets fixed.
But, for the customers who go out of their way to be gracious under less than ideal circumstances; customers who treat me with respect, customers who recognize this is simply a bad situation and I am genuinely trying to help them, customers who go out of their way to be NICE---YOU BET there is a YMMV aspect.
For these customers, not only will they get professional treatment, I will go above and beyond what is simply ‘required’ to get a problem fixed. I may offer to help them in ways that cut into my personal time. I may do a little extra behind the scenes negotiation to expedite things, l may call in personal favors, etc….
And these customers I also remember. Which means, in the future I may pick up the phone and call them for no other reason than to just to say hello, and see of there is anything I can help them with---that is not a ‘requirement’ of my job. That is YMMV.
The remainder [even the occasional assfarts who could not be more wrong about what they believe they’re entitled to] get my time. They get “true professional” treatment. They get their needs addressed. But it is all business as usual. Everything by the book. Nothing more, nothing less.
Sounds like you’re deliberately looking for the ‘business as usual, nothing more nothing less’ experience. Personally, I think you’re overlooking some of the finer aspects, but it’s your $. Seems like a fair request. But that said, in my biz while I may, figuratively speaking, do some ass kissing, it is never the case that anyone expects me to “literally” stick my nose up a customers ass.
If you’re finding some ladies less than enthusiastic about some particular activities---there is surely a reason. And based on your post, I have a good guess what might be driving part of that.
Some hobbyists have the "I'm paying for it, so ..." approach, which is their right, but it is also a providers' right to say "I reserve the right to decline service" if there's a concern or a problem.
Restaurants do it, Hotels do it, airlines do it, etc. The feeling that there has to be an all-encompassing and universal "meaning" to certain terms in the hobby is ridiculous. And, if I read correctly, the "lady" in question posted a comment that explains "her side" of what happened.
In a reply to my post, this Hobbyist said that (paraphrased) "that his rant was not due to experience (other than 1), but from reading other reviews and his "research." I guess the term "believe everything you read" has just taken on new meaning.
I don't mind someone being critical of my comments. I post, knowing that it won't be accepted by some. When you make a comment that is critical of a provider, are critical of the hobby or some aspects of it, but then state that it's not due to your own experience but from what you have read from others, the term "living vicariously" takes on new meaning.
I wish you luck, and stand by my original comments that 15 or 30 minutes may get you a fast "in and out" session, but I doubt it will achieve what you feel you are entitled to receive. And, as most have stated here, YMMV is a fact of the hobby. Accept it, or move on.
I think your right.
I got curious and decided to check out his reviews. For someone wanting full blown GFE, I dont think this cuts it...
30 minute appts.
no talking and gets straight to business
receives bj
does doggie
out the door
Glad Im not in Washington.
A customer service scenario - different industry:
Nail Client #1 is stand-offish, jerks her hands away during the service, does not respond to small talk, let alone say thank you. BTW, Client #1 left a 35% tip.
Client #1 receives a professional, but perfunctory service. i.e., everything advertised for the service was delivered professionally.
Nail Client #2 is polite, engaging - a general joy to be with. The nail tech actually looks forward to her time with Client #2. Client #2 usually leaves the standard tip.
Client #2 not only receives the advertised service, but every time Client #2 comes in, she receives something a little extra - a hand massage, free nail art, etc.
I know you're a guy, but you gotta know where I'm coming from here, especially if, as you say, you've been in customer service for several years.
Bottom line, the customer service industry, especially those services where close, personal contact is involved has a LOT of YMMV.