As a younger man I observed much of what went on behind the scenes. I noticed that some guys would hand out money to stripper/whores like an ATM machine. That's why the girls called them 'ATMs."
Still most of the guys really only overspent for a night of cheap thrills. They were not all lonely. They just wanted sex on demand. The ratio of mongers to total saps was probably 20-1 thirty years ago.
Here in 2017 I'm starting to wonder if we have reached an even ratio or do the lonely saps outnumber the whoremongers?
An alarming number of guys seem to be willing to pay for more than just sex. Some will pay to watch them eat at dinner dates. Some will spring for overnights to watch them sleep. A few will pay for vacation trips.
Whatever happened to "Pay em to leave?"
Is the extended date a new social phenomena brought on by the socially inept Millennials or is it a sign of true loneliness that some poor bastards are desperate to cure?
What do you think?
-- Modified on 8/10/2017 10:19:34 AM
....you have a one dimensional view
Furthermore, if anyone doesn't share that same flat dimension with you, they are a 'sap'
You need to get out more...
but it's also true that many of the johns really are lovesick "saps"
I don't know if I agree that it's mainly Millennials, they do say "there's no fool like an old fool" and I can think of dozens of old fools posting on this very board about "I've fallen for a hooker and I can't get up" lol
...what OTM presented are the extremes. Sure they exist, but there is a lot of space in the middle for each of us to choose how we play and when and with whom. There is no one way to play.
If some guy wants to spend his money and time on extended dates, that's his choice and who are we to judge? If OTM wants to play the game his way, that's his prerogative. But IMO, he shouldn't judge the rest of us who play it differently. But then he wouldn't be the lovable guy that he is. 😎
For all of you who want to do it your way...
they say, "I've fallen for a hooker and I can't get IT up."
...he's not the only one
One dimensional views are boring though on any level...
the second time today. I have coached literally hundreds of millennial guys by PM on breaking into the Kgirl scene. Many of these guys had never had sex before because hey have no social skills. Where there are good arguments presented from time to time for starting your whore-mongering at an early age, and many of the guys here did, with these younger guys, its ALL they've got. They don't know how to seduce a civvie woman into their bed. Consequently, they fall in love with providers and become easy marks to get taken advantage of. I wish I had a dollar for every PM I've gotten from young guys that got scammed because they didn't understand how they were being played and that the feelings they had for a Kgirl were not mutual. She may be working a dozen other young guys at the same time.
So to answer your question directly, I agree that as the percentage of millennials increases among the total hobby population, the ratio of guys looking for sex versus young guys looking for RL love with a provider will reach parity sooner rather than later.
...Because of his life experience, he should know better. Not for nothing is it said: "There's no fool like an old fool."
They want somebody that's fun and comfortable to hang out with when they're off work and decompressing. Often after several (or sometimes just a few) OTC dates, it evolves into FWB, but you should never think it's more than that.
If you don't have a page here with reviews of all the tricks you've turned...why in the phuck are you babbling as if you're some kind of authority on sucking cock? Now what you do in your personal life sucking cock is none of my business...not that I'm judging.
You really don't take yourself seriously...do you?
So how about it junior....care to share with the class how YOU can speak for "most" of the hookers in the world?
what the ladies themselves said about this topic on a few threads within the past week. You were probably still in adult day care, and your kids hadn't picked you up yet. I know they make you take a nap there and that's why you missed the discussion.
You're welcome to call me junior, as can be seen from my reviews, I can still get it up. From what I hear about you, not so much. I'm not judging either, we all have to play the hand we're dealt. Guys like you are always bluffing with two pairs.
You're a riot...thanks for the laugh today 
I fit this category. No social skills and a life with out relationships. I didn't have popular friends and was always lower middle class, so super hot chicks were never in my orbit. I always felt it condescending when pros acted too nice...too interested...It's disingenuous. That has never made me feel better being alone. It only made me feel more so. I always could attract big girls but never wanted them. I don't even see them. I turned to pros at a young age, because I'd rather bang hotties that fatties. I personally never felt connected to a pro because I knew it was not genuine.
I can see how young guys who can't get girls, or don't want to settle for what they don't want, can pine for a pretty companion, but guys that have never been in a relationship don't understand their feelings. Infatuation isn't love and p4p isn't genuine reciprocation. I don't lie to myself and believe I'm paying for companionship. I'm honest with myself and understand I'm paying to have the woman I chose physically and simply enjoy a nice personality and a warm smile. These lonely guys are young and hope to feel what it's like to be with a woman, they just haven't figured out yet that spending 3-4 hours with a pro doesn't help fill that void and it isn't at all what a real girlfriend is like.
the second time today. I have coached literally hundreds of millennial guys by PM on breaking into the Kgirl scene. Many of these guys had never had sex before because hey have no social skills. Where there are good arguments presented from time to time for starting your whore-mongering at an early age, and many of the guys here did, with these younger guys, its ALL they've got. They don't know how to seduce a civvie woman into their bed. Consequently, they fall in love with providers and become easy marks to get taken advantage of. I wish I had a dollar for every PM I've gotten from young guys that got scammed because they didn't understand how they were being played and that the feelings they had for a Kgirl were not mutual. She may be working a dozen other young guys at the same time.
So to answer your question directly, I agree that as the percentage of millennials increases among the total hobby population, the ratio of guys looking for sex versus young guys looking for RL love with a provider will reach parity sooner rather than later.
Wait a minute...what does income level have to do with the attractiveness level of women? I was lower middle class, and I had hot women all over me.
It's an unintended consequence of the women's rights movement. Young women nowadays are taught to believe that they are the same as men. So they think they should fuck like men (who naturally want to fuck anything that moves) and spread their legs for anything that moves. Why would millineal guys want to settle down when the pickings are so easy nowadays (paid or unpaid). Smart younger women go with the flow and spread there legs for the boomers for cash.
Back when I started you either picked up a SW or went to a cathouse. So it was less possible to fall for a girl, though one did for me. Now, with GFE, they act like your girlfriend and some fools believe it. It makes sense the percentage would go up.
I have had a lot of "real" relationships with hookers and I pride myself as being a pretty good judge when a girl is faking it or if there are some real feelings involved, but I will confess even I get fooled every once in a while when the sex just "seems" so off the charts and that ever elusive "chemistry" just seems so real and then she walks you to the door, kisses you passionately and tells you to be sure to call her booker to make another appointment. lol
Nothing like a dose of reality to bring you back to Earth.
A good GFE session can certainly put me in lust. There a few girls I've had a little nostalgia over. That is not the same thing as believing you have a real relationship.
...Al Swearengen's whorehouse in Deadwood.
What are you, 75? 80?
Toothless.
...I was in diapers then...just like you are now!!!
If you see a bevvy of gals, all whom are good at GFE, then you can enjoy them all without worrying about falling for one since you wouldn't be able to select just one to fall for.
Of course, I'm one to talk, aren't I?
... not "pay 'em to leave"--assuming that's what you like to do? If not... why do you care?
Or are you being forced to pay for these so-called "saps" to see "strippers/whores"? If not... why do you care?
I have to wonder why it seems to bother you so much that some guys pay providers for dinner dates, overnights, and vacation trips. Don't you have anything better to do other than bitching in a public forum about how some people like to spend their money on activities they enjoy?
Have you ever tried macrame?
Are you by any chance a millennial?
I think you need look no further than mirror.
With some exceptions of those that consider themselves lucky ( like Gag ) life is much different than 20 years ago. In people living longer. People live longer, are healthier longer, so the fun. You just spend 20 years having somebody to chat at dinner, or shop or watch poop or sleep as others say. Now you don't. For many they miss that. When they were married they would "hit it and forget it" then go home to wife and family. Now they are older, wife left them, kids grown up and move, wife pass away a host of other reasons. They hit it and go home to empty quiet home.
People just get lonely and willing to pay to not be lonely. Of course some people like being alone so they don't understand how some people hate it. I never have young clients who want to create relationship. But have had a few over 50 that would be happy to create it or even pay for a brief time acting it.
Do not expect the "hobby" to be the same today as was 20 years ago, anymore than expect the hobby to be same in 20 years as is today. People and their expectations changes.
Christine
and all that rot.
I think things are not too different than in the Book of Genesis.
The more things change, which is the first line of an expression, the second and final line of which is: ...the more they stay the same.
My comparison to the book of Genesis is regarding the story of Adam and Eve, the first sexual interaction between man and woman. If you'll recall, things started out looking pretty good, but went downhill pretty fast.
Is it a lower rate to watch you poop? How about if you watch me? I can't really say it's one of the things I miss, but if it's part of a GFE package I guess having a little reality would make it more like the real thing.
Before you start feeling sorry for older single guys just remember that "quiet home" means no more kids are there. THAT kind of quiet is a good thing. Lol
Rate to watch me poop same as regular rate with discount base on time. Sorry one hour minimum I do not do HH. Sort of no difference than to watch me orgasm. How you really know I orgasm or poop for real or fake?
Rate to see the poop after is extra. Rate to play the poop not available. Even I draw a line.
Rate to see me sleep is on my website, rate to see me sleep naked extra, rate to see me sleep in something you call sexy and I call uncomfortable double.
Christine
an EXTENSIVE menu! Everything is on the table except playing with poop.
I don't always know an orgasm when I see one, but I know one when I make one. As for the poop, it was just a hypothetical question. Not really into that myself. Lol
Its ok, It was hypothetical response. We agree for sure not into that. And I expect my time in the CR to be private always.lol.
Christine
Crap!!! If I knew that I was lonely, I would have gone to the asylum for some company.
I enjoy fucking! And I enjoy the pre teasing and titillating that comes with time with a beautiful, talented woman.
And most of all, I really enjoy living by myself.
I guess the guys that don't understand the pre and post time with women, don't enjoy the endorphins from the fore and after play. The beauty of p4p is that I know I will get laid. Compared to the rest of social interaction, there is just the possibility. It's in the knowing that I get the thrill.
I guess I'm just an old man with an immature (millennial) mind.
One of the magnificences of a paid play-date is that you (the gent) can ask for - and get - whatever it is that makes your day. Whether it's snuggles or testicle-trampling or a good sweaty fuck, it's nobody else's business what your desires are, or how much you are paying for them.
My question is: why do some of you gents get so emotional about what other people are doing?
Who would want a good testicle-trampling is Mick, and if you wore stilettos, you might even get him for an upcharge.
I pay $100 extra for 3" heels, $150 for 4" and $200 for 5 inch heels. I pay more for the 5" heels because it takes real talent to stomp those things accurately.
Between job issues, divorce, mobility if families, social media etc......people are more isolated than ever. So if this world m makes someone happier. Great. Wonder what it will be like in 20 years.
Living & Loving.. Just do whatever makes You Happy, I like the one or two hour, and Yes when I have the opportunity to spend more time, with someone, enjoying each others company, I love The Las Vegas Nightlife, dinners shows, and playing Hostess and making more real friendships too, whatever You the gentleman wants.. Watch me eat or sleep OK
For extended dates, they're paying for predictability, structure, discretion and someone who is experienced bcd. A lot of the feminine arts are things that are skills and for the regular civilian hottie, they are skills that aren't really needed to get quality dates in today's world. To find a high caliber woman with a similar level of comportment...well she's not likely to just give it up easy for any guy and she's probably going to want serious investment and commitment, which is where professionals come in. The idea of a woman with impeccable manners and a very erotic attitude is appealing to many men. That's why it sells.
I'm surprised by all the cynicism here. This is true love.
....... till Melania.
The Cryptkeeper had his own TV show. He was famous.
As a young college student, the temptation to provide is prevalent. This lifestyle is not as taboo as it used to be. I do believe that the culture of sex and companionship has changed. More and more individuals are hooking-up instead of remaining in long term relationships. Divorce rates are high, and many married baby boomers are seeking relations elsewhere. Since the current relationship trend is a constant stream of hook-ups, we are seeing an influx of individuals seeking meaningful relations with providers. Possibly it is because mongers miss the real intimacy of women. I know that I enjoy my experience more if the monger is sensual and intimate with me. (I also just enjoy the company of older men in general).