is in bad taste. If you feel a need to discuss this why not rephrase the question and leave individuals out of it. Do you really feel his particpation in a church or in BDSM was the main contributing factor to him becoming a monster?

-- Modified on 8/18/2005 8:40:09 AM

And of course it's being said behind an ALIAS!!!

Dam you whoever you are Psycho Killer.

A foolish schlub's idiotic question deseves unanswering

but a VR statement should be made.

Netties dungeon converts rather easily over to a GFE love shack.....

and is way, way before BTK's time and more like Ms. Rogers neighborhood compared to the evil, horrid things you describe.

As for the BTK killer...

Just isn't enough torture for that maniacal bastard!

Jeers!

Anyone who aligns me with a serial killer has some serious issues with me. Initially, I thought that this thread should be taken down, but then on second thought it just shows how pathetic this board has become. I am not offended, nor amused, nor suprised. This is just more of the same old let's bash Netmichelle on the boards because she makes us uncomfortable baloney. The original poster of this thread doesn't know me, doesn't understand BDSM, and has way too much time on his/her hands. Bottomline this veiled attack under an alias is a waste of bandwith since its intent goes unrewarded. Go bash someone else who gets a rise out of this, or get an education and expand that small consciousness of yours.

Read this link BDSM TIMELINE (5000 BC to present):
http://www.bdsm-education.com/history.html



Further education on the history of BDSM:

The historical origins of BDSM are obscure. There are anecdotal reports of people willingly being bound or whipped as a prelude to, or substitute for, sex going back to the fourteenth century. The medieval phenomenon of courtly love in all of its slavish devotion and ambivalence has been suggested by some writers to be a precursor of BDSM. Some sources claim that BDSM as a distinct form of sexual behaviour originated at the beginning of the eighteenth century when Western civilization began medically and legally categorizing sexual behaviour. There are reports of brothels specializing in flagellation as early as 1769, and John Cleland's novel Fanny Hill, published in 1749, mentions a flagellation scene. [I have this book, excellent read] Other sources give a broader definition citing BDSM-like behaviour in earlier times and other cultures, such as the medieval flagellants and the physical ordeal rituals of some Native American societies. [Think of the modern shaman Fakir. Very graphic link, use with caution: http://www.bodyplay.com/]

Although the names of the Marquis de Sade and Leopold von Sacher-Masoch are attached to the terms sadism and masochism respectively, the question remains as to whether their ways of life would meet with modern BDSM standards of informed consent. [Quite true]

BDSM ideas and imagery have existed on the fringes of Western culture throughout the twentieth century. Robert Bienvenu attributes the origins of modern BDSM to three sources, which he names as "European Fetish" (from 1928), "American Fetish" (from 1934), and "Gay Leather" (from 1950). Another source is the sexual games played in brothels, which go back into the nineteenth century if not earlier. Irving Klaw, during the 1950s and 1960s, produced some of the first commercial film and photography with a BDSM theme and published comics by the now-iconic bondage artists John Willie and Eric Stanton. [My favorite artist is Eric Stanton. Eric Stanton, and Ditko shared a studio in New York at 8th and 43rd from 1958 to 1966.]

Much of the BDSM ethos can be traced back to gay male leather culture, which grew out of post-WWII biker culture. This subculture is epitomized by the Leatherman's Handbook by Larry Townsend, published in 1972, which essentially defined the "Old Guard leather" culture. This code emphasized strict formality and fixed roles (i.e. no switching), and did not really include lesbian women or heterosexuals. In 1981, however, the publication of Coming to Power by Samois led to a greater knowledge and acceptance of BDSM in the lesbian community.

In the mid-nineties, the Internet provided a way of finding people with specialized interests around the world and communicating with them anonymously. [No kidding] This brought about an explosion of interest and knowledge of BDSM, particularly on the usenet group alt.sex.bondage. When that group became too choked with spam, the focus moved to soc.subculture.bondage-bdsm.

New Guard leather subculture appeared around this time, which rejected the rigid roles and exclusion of women and heterosexuals of the Old Guard.

BDSM and fetish imagery has spread out into the mainstream of Western culture through avant-garde fashion, the gothic subculture, rap, hip-hop and heavy metal video clips, and science fiction television and movies.

The modern BDSM subculture is widespread. Most major cities in North America and western Europe have clubs and play parties, as well as informal, low-pressure gatherings called munches. There are also conventions like Living in Leather, TESfest and Black Rose, as well as the annual Folsom Street Fair in San Francisco. [I am going! Who wants to come play??]

The Leather Pride Flag is a symbol used by the leather community or subculture, as well as the BDSM triskelion.

-- Modified on 8/20/2005 10:20:30 AM