Was talking to a monger bro and he told me about a recent experience of his where he was talking to another monger online about a girl both of them had seen previously. When he told the monger that he was going to see her in a few days' time, the monger told him to say, "Hi" for him in a specific way, as she would recognize who he was referring to. After the visit, my monger bro found out that the monger already had her KT and was in regular communication with her and had also seen her during that time period. When asked on a review he posted after she left, why he had waited to review her, he said it was because "he wanted to keep her to himself".  

Was curious what your guys' thoughts were on this. Sounds like someone getting too emotionally attached, in my opinion.

I get what you're saying but to me it sounds more like greedy behavior than clingy. But then if he starts following her around on the internet I'll concede the "clingy" description.

 
I've never heard anyone say that is what they were doing themselves, waiting to post a review to keep others from seeing the lady,  but have heard some speculating about that type of behavior. Doesn't make a lot of sense to me. Does the guy think his review would start a stampede and constantly full bookings? I cannot image a case where the woman is that desirable but NO ONE else saw her and started spreading the good news. I think at best you get a day or two.

 
It's also something that might backfire on him if he get recognized as the guy who is delaying reviews in order to keep business for the girl slow. I would also think some her -- myself included -- might think a good bit less of the guy for not sharing for the reasons stated. Then again, it's not really much different than not reviewing so. . . .

And it has been happening ever since I can remember.

 
Fortunately, most mongers grow out of it as it represents a rather naive view of how this market works. Unless the girl herself - with the cooperation of the org she works for - is limiting her business there is just no way a single monger not writing a review will have an impact.  

 
Now, if the girl is going, or has gone UTR, that is an entirely different story. And not what the OP is talking about as I understand it.

If he thinks he is really keeping her all for himself, that's just stupid, IMO!

And, if his actions do keep guys from seeing her, he is only hurting someone he cares about!

Now, if he doesn't care and only wants to exclusively have sex with her, well that's a real dick move!

Hurting her business and only caring about what he wants, that's selfish!  

its definitely immature and short-sighted.  If they really like a particular Kgirl, this is worst thing they can do.  The number one reason girls leave a city they are working in is because business is slow.  While one of these love-struck puppies may think he should keep her to himself, if he recommends her to his friends, she is likely to stay around longer, which benefits him as well. If you want a girl to stay where you are for a long time, "keeping her to yourself" hurts her business and you are shooting yourself in the foot.  Help her build her business by getting the word out that she is worth a visit.  She will appreciate that more than anything else you can do for her, and it's the best way to become someone "special" to her.  

I thought lack of reviews is supposed to imply mediocre quality?

Now we're learning that indeed, a girl without many reviews can actually be good

 
So how do we distinguish such a girl from a girl who people dont like but do not write negative reviews on? ("if you say something let be it nice or not say anything at all" school of thought)

hobbyists write reviews at all, so you cannot make any assumptions about service when a monger sees a girl and does not write a review.  I have many friends in the hobby that do two or three sessions a week and have never written a review.  Some guys are regulars, have seen a girl 50 times, which means she is good, and have never reviewed her.  You may be just now learning this, but the other 99.9% of guys here already knew it.  Many mongers who have a lot to lose if their participation is discovered stay as far under the radar as possible.  There is no way to know what they think of the ladies they see other than by networking and PM.  I seem to recall you saying over a year ago that you don't really believe in networking, so  you're not likely to ever hear about these girls who are good but sparsely reviewed.

Jensen is on record as saying that in his area, rather than writing negative reviews, mongers simply don't write reviews for that girl and everyone supposedly knows that few reviews equals = bad reviews.

 
Well, I then asked how do you distinguish between a girl who had no reviews due to her being bad or someone like in this thread, who has good reviews intentionally held.  

 
This is imo yet another point for writing subpar reviews and not witholding them. There is zero ambiguity with them. Bad review =bad. Good review = good. Unknown =unknown.  
Instead of unknown =bad/unknown/sometimes good.  

 

I do have this hunch that this guy is from around nova area too. But I might be wrong.

Had to make another post for this, since it will have a patented rocket rant.

 

Its not that I don't "believe" in networking. I don't LIKE networking precisely because of how effective it is and how it diminishes meritocracy. When "who you know" becomes more important than "what you do" and "who you are", it's a big problem to me. When a more qualified candidate gets passed up for a less qualified candidate who has ties/connections, it's a big problem to me. Nepotism, cronyism and networking are all closely related imo. When someone says I know a guy who knows a guy who can help/vouch/whatever, I roll my eyes.  

 

If one's goal is simply to gain self-interest, networking  is the way to go. And it's a shame, because it contrasts  starkly with the whole "American dream" mantra - - which is admittedly faker than silicone boobs when things like networking and lobbying exist.  

 
To get back to your point. I'm aware many people just exchange pms or are on private channels. I myself am in some private channels, even though I may have joined them reluctantly. And yes, I see the info that is passed around there. And yes, Id want nothing more than sharing some of that backchannel info with others publicly. And I do. Do you think my knowledge comes only from reading public boards? Obviously not.  

 
I believe in power to all people, not just elitist people or those with specific connections. I don't like groups like "the league", and their affinity to protect girls (as opposed to mongers) and advertise girls was (and is) pretty disgusting to me. But I'm sure the league was effective at getting its members what they wanted and people loved what they were getting out of it.  

 

Rocket rant over

-- Modified on 11/29/2021 1:16:51 PM

how many times you contradicted yourself in a single post.  Congrats.  

Looking at his subject headers, it appears he’s turning this into some sort of political discussion now. Seems very odd.

Why don't you enumerate where did I contradict myself. Saying I contradict myself doesn't actually make it so.  

My points I thought were quite clear.

 
1. I think networking is an extremely powerful tool

 
2. I think it's way too powerful where it dwarves everything else and it gets you into too many doors for all the wrong reasons.

3. A lot of networking opportunities prioritize behavior which I disagree with. Such as brown-nosing or making "friends" just so you can use them in your self-interest.  

 
4. As a result, having connections and "friends" in high places often matters a lot more than actually having a skilset. I was in awe back in the day when my actual friends who were getting mbas told me the academic part is a joke. It's all about drinking and being buddy buddy with future hedge fund managers.  

 
5. It's quite ironic in a capitalist society which tells you that it's a meritocracy, but it really isn't.  

 
6. I dislike elitism whether it comes from class,  money, privilege or all of these.  

 
7. Despite all of this, I do still network a tiny bit in this hobby, which probably does make me somewhat of a hypocrite. Even then, I try to make sure info I get is dessiminated publicly as I think an average Joe monger should be entitled to info about the hobby.  

 

I don't really see any contradiction here. My position is crystal clear. Please do tell where I contradict myself and I'll gladly address it. Thank you for reading my post btw.

given your propensity to twist anything I've said out of it's context an into whatever frame you currently want to force it.

 
What I *was* saying -- what, nearly two years ago? -- was that if a girl is in the area for a week or more with only a couple/few reviews that is not normal. That raises a flag and most just then just seem to think the risk/reward trade off is not that great. In other words, those who decide to see her generally not really basing the decision on the reviews but essentially TOFTT.

 
And, that was in the context of pre-COVID and to a large extent pre FOSTA/SESTA period as I was largely inactive between 2017 and late 2019. so really is not timely at all and hardly some type of universal, time invariant claim as you want to, after getting it wrong, make it sound.

Fair enough. Then I was wrong and sorry for misunderstanding.  

 
Since this was a specific timeframe you referred to and not a universal claim,

 
then may we all agree that withholding negative public reviews... as well as positive ones -- whether its for trying to protect the girls biz or for your own self interest of having a girl all to yourself - - is ultimately severely detrimental to fellow mongers who rely on public info and nothing else?

You have just admitted you are a hypocrite when it comes to your views on networking, and you have admitted that you can't be trusted to keep private messaging private.  This latter one I already knew from messaging with you in the past, and that's why you can no longer message me.  

 
Networking is not one-sided, it's a quid pro quo.  Guys that take information are also expected to supply information, whether its individually or within a networking group.  Since you have taken a hiatus from the hobby (which you posted about several months ago), it's doubtful that you have any current information of value to share in a network.  Using hearsay info gleaned from others will be quickly exposed in a network where guys are sharing their personal experiences with Kgirls.  If you have no personal experiences to contribute to a network, why would anyone want you in their group?  Combine that with you outing yourself that you will publish at your own discretion whatever info you learn within the privacy of a network, you make yourself a leper of sorts in the eyes of other hobbyists.  You may get away with it for awhile, but usually the guy who shows up with a group just to get free drinks and never buys a round is quickly ostracized.  

I was waiting for contradictions that you said my post had. So, so far, none. Great to know you were just kidding.  

 
Moving on.  

 
As you can imagine, I don't like quid pro quo either. However, I do honor people who explicitly tell me to not divulge the info, and I've yet to divulge that info. Even if its people who stabbed me in the back, I keep my word. All you have to do is ask for the info is not to be distributed. Most people who I ask, are OK with info being distributed as long as their name isn't attached to it.  

 
I took a hiatus, yes. And? I don't get what private groups I'm part of have to do with this convo at all. Are you implying I'm gonna be ostracized from the groups? I doubt it. But if so, then I'm fine with it. My contributions speak for themselves and if they think they're bad, then so be it!  

 
You have some very skewed view of private groups too. Not everyone expects you to produce first-hand info. When I joined some of the groups during my hiatus, I explicitly stated that I don't monger currently and will be glad to leave if they think I don't participate enough. Like I've said, I joined rather reluctantly.

 
But I get it, as someone who always advocated networking with bookers and becoming fiends with them and playing golf, you must view every networking as a way to use someone for your self-interest. Hence why I don't like networking, lol. I always  give info without asking for anything back. Even giving rebrand info to people fast enough is pretty appreciated in my experience.

 
Unlike you, I don't care nor am I proud to be a part of some secret society. My goal is to make sure every monger is treated fairly and has enough information to make good sound decisions with their money.  

 
If I wanted pure self interest in getting the best pussy for myself and getting the dibs on the newest hottest girl, perhaps I'd do what you do. But because acting in self-interest has never been my goal, and I consider fairness, truth and elimination of double standards far beyond any vagina in the universe, yeah that's not gonna happen nor do I want it to happen. Of course, this is something you seemingly can't comprehend on baseline level so you're probably going to assume dumb shit like I can't get into orgs or that they BLd me, which isn't true at all - but feel free to make dumb assumptions!

current first-hand info about Kgirls, then all you have is a circle jerk of guys bullshitting each other, which I know you are no stranger to.  Your attempt to justify your lurking is laughable.  

 
Guys here should take note that PM does not mean "private" to you, unless they specifically ask you not to tell anyone, and then there is still no guarantees if you think divulging the info will make you look important to someone else. I think conventional wisdom is that if you send someone a PRIVATE message, there is an implication that it's not for public disclosure.  Maybe you think PM means "Public Message?"

 
As far as self-interest, I give out about five times as much info as I ever ask for, so spare me your speculation that I'm doing it all for myself.  I PM with like-minded Kgirl mongers who I know will NOT be rough with the girls.  By "rough", I mean guys that are just there to give them a "good pounding," like you.

I don't know what you mean by lurker, and I don't really care. You haven't pointed out any contradictions yet, which is what I started on. You somehow transitioned into discrediting me, including some dumb shit about being rough which has NOTHING to do with the convo at all.  

 
Again, something as easy as tracking a rebrands pics can be done without any first hand info. And many people will be quite thankful if you are able to pinpoint new rebrands for them. But I get it, you think rebrand info should not be disclosed unless the girl herself wants it to be known. Of course.  

 
Anyway.  
My point is I dislike networking. Hence why your little relationship with booker and advice to newbies to make relationships with bookers versus girls, always elicited a snarky remark from me. Making an artificial "friendship" where the sole purpose is getting better treatment and better pussy, or any self-interest for that matter, is quite disgusting to me. But again, this is just me. I don't deny that brown nosing "friends in high places" can take some, ahem, skills, but the act is simply too disgusting morally for me to ever consider.

 

I'll just say this. When people are too scared to bite the hand that feeds them because they are scared to get hungry, it is quite evident. Even when the hand not only deserves to be bitten, but maybe cut off altogether.

The vehemence and lack of reasoning with which he condemns the orgs does tend to make one wonder if he actually is affiliated with an org or orgs.  

 
That would actually explain all of the chest pounding and the panicked denials of org affiliation we have gotten from him for so long.

 
Still, just conjecture. But, if it looks like a duck…

quaking in their boots at the thought that you might cut them off altogether and they will never see another dime of yours.    

Um, that's not what I meant. When I said cut off the hand, I mean an act of punishment. Not merely not giving the money. That's a slap on the wrist and a drop in the bucket. Publicly exposing bad practices would qualify, though. Of course, you wouldn't understand as the last thing you'll ever do is throw your golf buddy under the bus.  

 
"You play by their rules". Yea sure. That's what people in Nuremberg said. "I just followed the rules and played their game. I could not say no! " but at least there it was survival on the line. Seliing out for pussy... it's just low to me.  

 

Anyway, I believe I expanded enough on my dislike of "networking", why I dislike it and so forth.

I’ve been doing my best to refrain from responding to the Little Rocket Felcher’s posts, but as I read his most recent colloquies with cdl, useyrhead and Jensen in this and other threads over the last day I’ve had an epiphany: How lucky, truly fortunate, are we to have such a caring, thoughtful, sensitive, altruistic whoremonger among us like our own little Felcher Boy. Really, a true White Knight. An egalitarian, socialist, whoremonger. A true one of a kind. Our own self-proclaimed “Capt Save-a-Monger.” And here he is, freely sharing his (hearsay and made up) wisdom with us! Every time I read his tomes I’m reminded of Martin Luther King and Mahatma Gandhi advocating for their disadvantaged people like he does for the poor, disaffected mongers who follow him. How blessed are we?

 
So I’m thinking. TER has had a Miss TER award for many years. She (now they) are recognized on the home page of TER, and their stories are told. What if we collectively asked TER to also establish a “Little Rocket Felcher” of the month/quarter/year award to recognize TER VIPs who, like Felcher Boy, share their wisdom with us and keep our collective monger souls on the straight and narrow? Maybe even have Felcher Boy as the first recipient? Seems like the least we can do for him (I’m assuming he’s a man?) after all he has done and continues to do for us.

 
What do you guys think? Wrong answers only please.

I'm not a socialist. I'll tell you as much. I do like the name change and I like your use of sarcasm much more than usual name calling. If only you could drop "fletcher"... can a bro dream?  

 
I would point out that you, just like others, always claim to refrain from reading or responding to my posts, yet you still do it. Methinks ya'll should work on discipline.

 
But-as I've said before, unlike others you actually aren't afraid to call spade a spade, so you have my respect there. And always will. I do dislike that your disdain for me is bigger than your sense of truth, but obviously I won't let go of my beliefs in order to appease anyone on this earth, you included. You're my fellow monger and Im glad we had good conversations before you got fed up with me. Happy mongering sir!

My point about his behavior was less about his withholding a review, and more about his asking a stranger to say "Hi" for him. I found it to be like an attempt to exercise a perceived sense of status.

Okay. Yeah, I didn't get that from your post and thought the lead in was to the bit about the review behavior.

 
I don't really see much to the "Say Hi from me" bit but then that might depend on just what the exchange between me and that other guy was.  But I suppose I get what you're saying with your explanation here. Could be about one-upping the other guy or trying to imply a higher status (both in the she knows me better and you can be my messenger sense).

The first time a monger said that to me I was puzzled. It simply made no sense.

 
How is a monger going to say “Hi” for a monger who is anonymous and only known by his board username? Kgirls don’t generally know their customers by their handles (no, not that handle).  

 
After that first experience, I started noticing how mongers who had been around for a while responded to the “say Hi for me” line. They generally came back with some sort of snide response like: “But she won’t be able to reply with my dick in her mouth.”

 
In other words, typical locker room banter.

 
So, ever since then I have taken it as a joke. Though, as you say, it could also be taken as a way of asserting status. But that would be a jerk move. If there’s no context to indicate the guy is being a jerk, I will always assume it is a joke.

-- Modified on 12/4/2021 12:05:14 PM

As I understand it, my monger bro was asked to say "Hi' in a specific way, making reference to something that the girl would recognize as referencing the original monger. This monger also freely discloses her touring dates and locations, which, apparently, she's not a big fan of as she uses different aliases. Coupled with his attitude toward reviewing her, I took his behavior as being more of a problematic one, but I could be in the minority.

That is a sleazy, jerk move and deserves both no response and no follow through.

 
Fortunately, though it does happen, it doesn’t happen often. I always recommend keeping a careful distance from people like that. They end up causing trouble for themselves and anyone close to them.

Adding those comments, and not saying this is the case, one could see that as problematic. In fact it could even be stalker-like. Getting the other guy to take a message saying "See, I can even work though the guys you see."

 
Just points to the reality that one not only needs to use some care in selecting who they session with but who they associate with on these boards or for information. Again, not saying that is the case but just that the last thing someone wants to do is identify themselves as being associated with some creepy stalker with the lady. May come back to bite pretty hard.

When I was a noob, I mentioned on a discussion board that I had a session scheduled with a particular Kgirl.  This guy, which I only knew from the board, told me to say HI to her for him.  I didn't know any better, and thought mentioning his name might get me better service, since it was apparent that he had seen her multiple times.  When I arrived at the incall, and told her "joe" says Hi, she completely lost it, and went into a rant about how she had to block him for being an asshole.  When I said I only knew him casually from a discussion board, and we were not friends that hang out together, she calmed down, but it put a chill over the entire session and pretty much ruined any thoughts I might have had about repeating with her.  She was always going to associate me with this guy she hated, because I brought up his name.  

 
Lesson learned . . . . Don't mention other customers you may know see her, especially ones who ask you to say hello.   There's probably a reason that he cannot tell her hello himself, so being his surrogate will tattoo you with whatever sins he committed.