As I alluded to already, I think its endemic to guys STARTING their hobby life with Kgirls instead of making the transition from indies to Kgirls like many of us "K-fanboys" did. Most of the Kgirl veterans on the Kgirl board started with indies like I did and then moved over to Kgirls once they discovered that market. You almost NEVER hear this group of Kgirl converts complaining about price increases. Of course, most are in their 40's, 50's and 60's, so they're a little more savvy about economics in general than the younger ones who complain a lot about price increases. The market has not been static at $250. There are still a few at that price, but in SoCal, they are mostly at $270-$300, and $300 is the standard rate in Las Vegas and on the East Coast. There is usually an upcharge for BBFS which brings the rate to $380-$400. I believe the lowest average prices are still in the BA, and ironically, some local mongers don't seem to appreciate the value they are getting and still complain about prices.
I never buy anything based solely on price, and that includes pussy. While indies "started" at $300 back in 2008, the price range of the girls I was seeing were $3-500. I saw a few at $1000/hr, but quickly disabused myself of any thoughts that you get a better experience for that kind of money; often more beautiful, but not better service. There is nothing a $1000 girl can do that a $500 girl can't do. Since then, I mostly see indies in the $500 range, plus or minus, when I'm in a city with no Kgirl agencies. FYI, just because I favor Kgirls for the VALUE we get does not mean I also buy hot dogs at Costco. Lol
-- Modified on 10/21/2021 4:06:20 AM
Yet K-mongers bitch and moan about price increases today when the prices haven't changed very much (until recently) in THIRTEEN YEARS.
Guess what? If the price of that hot dog changes now, people are going to be upset. Never mind that it was the same price for 35 years.
Stayed that way till about 2 years ago...But back to the subject. When I was into the whole K-Girl scene, say around 2005 or so it was $250 in LA...what is it now, 260?? By the way, best hot dogs are at Costco, buck 64 for a dog and drink
Taco Bell was 5 for a dollar, but only lasted for about a year. Now, on Taco Tuesday, I'm eating a Kgirl taco at $260-$300. Lol
Back in the Gold Rush days, Asian prostitutes would shout out the windows of a brothel: “Two bittee lookee. Four bittee feelee. Six bittee doee!”
So, back then it was 75 cents to have an Asian (usually Chinese) taco.
Just in 2020, all inclusive kgirl menu in the bay area, including bbfs and 2 pops was 220
In 2021, such menu rings up at 280+40+100=420 at many orgs.
Thats a steep increase any way you look at it.
The same is true for LA, all inclusive menu is 420+
Silk aka Sky was offering bbfs+bbfscia at 220 in the bay circa 2019. Asshole wasn't extra, although it wasn't guaranteed either.
She now offers it for like 600+ lol.
Whether or not the girls deserve it is another question. Even with price increases, many kgirls are more than worth it value-wise.
Man.
Jack In the box... I don't think I've eaten there since I was an undergrad. Those spicy chicken sandwiches were pretty good after night of clubbing and debauchery tho. Lol.
Hope this isn't too far off track, but do any of you guys eat Jack in the box tacos? Do you think they taste the same? I had some a few weeks ago and didn't think they tasted the same!
I cannot compare how they taste today to how they did in 1972. But, I do like 'em. And, they are 2 for 99 cents!
I wouldn't eat a Jack-In-The-Box taco from 1972. It would probably be pretty nasty by now...
SLAmpVIP
I lived near a 24 hour Jack in the Crack in 1972. I finished all the tacos I bought. But maybe they would have lasted at least as long as some other fast foods:
http://www.today.com/food/mcdonalds-burger-fries-shows-no-sign-rot-after-6-years-t60026
McDonald's burger and fries show no sign of rot after 6 years.
We're all getting older, but some of us show the years more than others. Then again, some — like a certain McDonald's combo — don't seem to show the passing of time at all!
I wouldn't eat a Jack-In-The-Box taco from 1972. It would probably be pretty nasty by now...
SLAmpVIP
in the world that some man cannot make a little worse and sell a little cheaper, and those who consider price alone are this man's lawful prey. ---- John Ruskin
And up until recently if the Lakers held the opponent to under 100 points, everyone got free tacos.
You probably had the Super Tacos..those have too much fluff, not the same as their regulars.
No, I only get the two for $1.00. I'll try a different Jack in the box and see how they are.
No offense to these guys (photo), but the pink is supposed to be on the INside.
Have you ever heard of a "loss leader?" Costco loses money on their hot dogs. They also lose $30 to $40 million a year on their $4.99 chickens. The low prices on the hot dogs and chickens are used to get the customers in the store.
A better comparison would be if an org had one girl at $250 for thirteen years. The org would use her to lure mongers who hopefully would see the org's other girls at higher prices. But K-mongers are not like Costco customers; K-mongers would expect EVERY item in Costco to be the same price it was THIRTEEN YEARS AGO.
http://getpocket.com/explore/item/the-enduring-enigma-of-costco-s-1-50-hot-dog-and-soda-combo
http://www.snopes.com/fact-check/costco-rotisserie-chicken-cheap/
-- Modified on 10/15/2021 2:05:41 AM
Whether or not they're losing money is irrelevant.
The point is consumers getting used to the stable prices and thy will not like the prices going up.
Youre now on some quest to show only kmongers expect prices to not double up in a spike. Whereas it's a natural reaction of most consumers to a good/service that was priced at a constant rate.
What you're saying about hot dogs is equally applicable to K-Girls. K-mongers are used to the stable prices and they will not like the prices going up. What you're saying is that K-mongers don't care that the rent on K-girls' apartments have increased probably 50% since 2008. They still want to pay $250.
Rent is only one factor. I'm sure you can think of many other costs that have gone up in THIRTEEN YEARS. Who is eating all those increased costs - the orgs or the K-girls? Apparently, K-mongers don't care, do they? No sir, as long as
K-mongers are happy still paying the same rate they did THIRTEEN YEARS AGO, that's all that counts, right?
Did it ever occur to you that K-girls have to see twice as many clients per day than they did THIRTEEEN YEARS AGO? If the split has remained the same and the rent and other expenses have increased significantly over that period of time, how will the orgs/agencies/bookers make at least the same amount they did THIRTEEN YEARS AGO?
I think youre mishearing - I'm saying ALL consumers and buyers dont like sudden spikes in prices, no matter how justified they are. Be it hot dogs, be it tuition or rent control suddenly disappearing. Whereas consumer is far more likely to be OK with gradual price change.
This isn't just kgirl mongers. Your attempt to say only kmongers are "cheap" is poorly constructed. I would even go so far as to say that calling any buyer "cheap" is a form of peer pressure and a lazy justification for value that is deemed suboptimal by buyers.
If the prices haven't changed through decades and you're paying 200 for a good or a service, the expectation is that youll continue to pay that amount. The entities that set that expectation were the sellers. If they raised prices every year by 10 bucks, expectations would be different.
You say "...rent control suddenly disappearing." FYI, rent control in California only applies to apartment buildings built BEFORE 2005. I seriously doubt any K-girls live in apt. bldgs. built before 2005 so their apartments are not rent-controlled. And even if they do live in older buildings, their rent would have been subject to annual cost of living increases of 3 or 4% over the last thirteen years. That would amount to at least a 40% increase over a period of thirteen years, assuming the orgs kept the same apts. through the years (which of course they didn't).
Also, thanks to the Costa-Hawkins Act, there is "vacancy decontrol" which means apartments can be brought up to market rents when there is a vacancy. Every time an org goes to rent an apartment, the landlord can ask the new tenant to pay whatever the market will bear.
I ask you again - how are agencies and orgs absorbing all the increased costs of doing business over the last THIRTEEN YEARS if the price and split have remained the same? Why didn't they increase the price by $10/year over the past 13 years to avoid the dreaded "spike" you're so afraid of? What kind of lousy businessmen are these orgs and agencies?
Um, the loving rent control part of my argument was meant to illustrare a sudden spike. It had nothing to do with kgirls.
"how are agencies and orgs absorbing all the increased costs of doing business over the last THIRTEEN YEARS if the price and split have remained the same? Why didn't they increase the price by $10/year over the past 13 years to avoid the dreaded "spike" you're so afraid of? What kind of lousy businessmen are these orgs and agencies?"
I don't know why you're asking me that.
My point is that there are goods that remained steady in price. And if you raise the price of such a good via a spike, people will be very unhappy despite any justifications offerwd.
Here's another examplw.
The cost of a AAA video game has remained exactly at 60 dollars since early 90s. However, engineer salaries, amount of people working on such projects, and the cost of making such a game have risen exponentially.
And yet if you raise the price of a video game to 100,guess what will happen? Exactly.
I simply retorted your suggestion that this line of thinking is somehow only related to kgirl mongers. No, it isn't.
And it DOES have something to do with K-girls. Agencies have to rent apartments and they are paying a lot more than they did thirteen years ago. How are they able to do that if K-girl rates haven't increased?
I don't know very much about video games but I'd say the reason the price of video games hasn't increased dramatically is the same reason K-girl rates haven't increased - they keep the price the same by making up for the rising costs with increased sales volume. They're selling many more video games than in the '90's and K-girls are seeing more guys per day than they did thirteen years ago.
It's like they used to say on the late-night TV commerials:
"How do we keep our prices so low? VOLUME, VOLUME, VOLUME!!!!"
I brought sudden ending of rent control as an example of a price spike people won't like.
As far as the rest, looks like you've answered your own question. Not sure how accurate that response is - as I think it was a combination of things, but volume is definitely one of the main reasons imo.
Costco prices are always low since they don't make money on items that they sell. They make over 3 billion dollars yearly on their membership fees. The cost of chickens and hot dogs may go up but it doesn't matter. They make up for it with the increases in their fees. To compare sex workers fees to the prices in Costco is like comparing life style in the U.S. to Haiti. Just plain stupid.
Have you ever heard of a "loss leader?" Costco loses money on their hot dogs. They also lose $30 to $40 million a year on their $4.99 chickens. The low prices on the hot dogs and chickens are used to get the customers in the store.
A better comparison would be if an org had one girl at $250 for thirteen years. The org would use her to lure mongers who hopefully would see the org's other girls at higher prices. But K-mongers are not like Costco customers; K-mongers would expect EVERY item in Costco to be the same price it was THIRTEEN YEARS AGO.
http://getpocket.com/explore/item/the-enduring-enigma-of-costco-s-1-50-hot-dog-and-soda-combo
http://www.snopes.com/fact-check/costco-rotisserie-chicken-cheap/
-- Modified on 10/15/2021 2:05:41 AM
Well let's talk about fees.
Costco raises fees roughly by 5 dollars every five years.
You know exactly what's coming. Gradual, constant rate of change. No spikes. Whereas if hot dog was to go to five bucks right now, there'd be ri-ots as some people who are unfortunate to have money, feed themselves via these items.
If escorts raised feeds gradually, there'd be no issues.
My point is that no consumer is ok with sudden spikes.
-- Modified on 10/15/2021 11:37:31 AM
No consumer likes sudden spikes, but I think it's willfully ignorant of mongers to expect prices to remain artificially low compared to the rest of the country. Yes, market conditions differ based on location, but how long did they think agencies would hold back price increases knowing that the majority of mongers would pay them? Is there any actual anecdotal evidence that it's become easier to book girls due to decreased demand?
If you're a 1 pop guy, at $260 (a price increase of $20-$40) you're still saving $60 compared to most of the US and $100 compared to Seattle.
May I ask, who is responsible for prices being "artificially low" throughout the years and hence setting certain expectations? Pretty sure it's not the mongers/buyers.
Expectations are built off the past, not the future or even the present. That's how human minds work.
Costco fees go up by five doars every five years. They're easily predictable, are constant and even though prices are rising, consumers don't have an issue. But if they raise prices of the hot dog which hasn't risen in price since Costco inception, then there will be many unhappy people.
No consumers like spikes and no matter how justified they are, they won't like them. Everyone understands that a price of sixty dollars for a video game when an average programmer makes 150k with a team size of 100 with four years of development, is usually not enough to recoup losses. Yet people will get mad af if a game costs 120.
And yes, in some instances the consumers inability to accept justified price spikes, hurts them. In case of video games it means devs have to resort to shitty practices such as pay-to-win, questionable micro transactions and cannibalizing game content for the future add-ons they charge money for.
All I'm arguing for is that consumers have not, do not and will not *ever* like spikes. They will be OK with gradual changes tho.
I think the issue of responsibility is irrelevant to my point because how can an economic "expectation" continue to be valid 10+ years after its inception when every other good has risen in price?
As we've both seen on the local boards, most mongers are decidely NOT ok with any increases. Bay area mongers started freaking out when prices were raised by $20 to $240. That's a gradual increase. You (general you) can try to argue that a 9% increase is not gradual, but in the context of this business, you're arguing over peanuts. You (general you) can try to argue based on principle, which I can accept, but you'd also have to admit that you're cheap, which very few will do.
Huh? I just told you that expectations are a byproduct of historical data. If a hotdog cost 1.50 when you were born, and is still 1.50 right now, the expectation, however irrational it is in terms of economics, is that it will remain 1.50. And if price ever jumps people will be unhappy. Whereas since Costco fees have been rising up every five years by five dollars, that rise is both expected and taken in stride. The responsibility is on seller to set expectations. If you think "we do what we want, and you take it as it is and do what you can" is a valid two-way business partnership, Idk what to tell you. There's a reason why there are things such as rent control, to prevent spikes in prices.
The 20 dollar jump would be a gradual change of it was 20 dollars every year. However, that is not what happened. Full menu kgirl service went from 220 to 420 in many places.
I usually don't mind terms, but I don't like the word "cheap". It reeks of peer pressure and salesmanship. Let's change it to "understanding value". I don't believe in this hobby being a luxury hobby, because imo sex is a basic human need. Hence theres nothing wrong with value-based selectiveness. When prices rise, some borderline goods/services get priced out. My atfs still worth a boatload, but toftt offerings and borderline mediocre offerings that don't have skillet or attitude are not worth the value, and that is fine.
I would go as far to say is that understanding value is a very good and handy trait.
...you also seem to be equating getting this basic human need fulfilled ONLY through this "hobby." If you want to satisfy your basic human need without paying, get yourself some game, go to a club and pick up a civvie. Then you won't have to worry about the "spike" in price.
I am not equating that at all. And I don't see what it has anything to do with spike in prices, tbh. Just because it may be possible to get a $1.50 meal elsewhere, will not make people any happier about their 1.50 hot dogs spiking in price. Our whole convo is and was in the context of the hobby.
like it was for us coming of age in the 70's and 80's, when pick-up bars were the preferred way to get some short-notice sex for both men AND women. It was a skill you had to learn quickly if you wanted to avoid taking matters into your own hands, and I think pretty much an art that is a little lost on subsequent generations. As you know, we learned to "read" women quickly to know which ones at the club or bar were there for sex and which ones were only interested in having free drinks. Its like riding a bicycle. Once you learn, you never forget how. When they are trying to score women on the internet, or by texting, you can't read them as well, and these yutes of today end up wasting a lot of time with girlsl who are not really prospects to hook up THAT night.
ok James Bond. You are so smooth that you didnt have the need or desire for a provider. Handsome, check. Ultimate male date, check. Actually ALL WRONG.
You are now a self proclaimed sex worker expert, writing hundreds of reviews out of thin air. LOL
I knew you were back trying to get my attention because I already got some PM's asking, "Who's the dick-head that is stalking you?" A great way to start back, don't you think? You're irrelevant here, so post all you want.
Your words, "You're still on ignore".
Its time to simply do what you say.
I must admit its been so enjoyable watching you the past month as you followed my specific instructions to pick up the pace with posting more fake reviews. I told you and you did it! I imagine that it is hard to keep all of the dates straight as your posted reviews are all over the place. LOL
$250 was a quite of leap from $150 AMP pricing when apartment incall business model was introduced in mid 2000s. Therefore $250 stayed for a long time. Now with inflation/North Koreans coming with BBBF/covid/less competition from white girls caused prices to spike to $280-340 no BBBF or $300-$380 with BBBF.
You see KMongers discussing pricing here because this is a forum dedicated to KGirls. Spend some time over at the General Forum and you’ll find plenty of complaints about pricing in general.
Either you have P4P, where you get right down to the action or you are meeting and dating women to work your way into a BCD situation! They both take money to get to the end result and sometimes dating/pick ups can be expensive without the desired happy ending! Just sayin', ain't nothin' free!
That quote should be the last word in this thread. It was said by a very highly respected K-fanboy. If HE believes K-girls are underpaid and if HE is okay with the increases, then the rest of you K-fanboys should also be okay with the increases.
Also, fallacy of association.
If you want a more serious discussion, aside from the current one where no matter what people won't like hikes....
One of the flaws in the agency system imo is pricing superstars and those-who-are-on-their-tenth-name about the same or maybe with a 10% difference. Of course eventually the superstar will be fully booked and the latter girl will be onto her eleventh name, but tier pricing (not per service, per girl!) could help out mongers. Like I've said before, my atfs are/were worth a ton to me. Whereas, some toftts were of such quality that I wouldn't be paid to fuck them. Time is money. It's a two edged sword because this system does help some less fortunate mongers enjoy some top girls at an affordable price, but I'm a firm believer in meritocracy. Some of these girl are service stars who run laps, sometimes literally, around three-week tour mediocre offerings. That they are priced the same is almost an insult to these stars. Imo.
-- Modified on 10/18/2021 10:46:07 PM
Im new to kgirls - started the hobby a couple months back with some normal providers and I could not believe how the former charges 500+ an hour vs the 260 for the kgirls, and I thought the latter did a much better job with services/attitude. I don't think I can ever go back? And on top of that they have an agency that takes a cut? It seems criminally low to me (at least in comparison) to my first 2-3 visits hobbying.
that I found on "That Mall." Unless you have had experience paying $400-500 for an hour session, I think its difficult to appreciate the VALUE in a one-hour session with a Kgirl. Less money and better service 90% of the time, IMO. I still see indies to keep my references up for other indies I see when I'm traveling on business to cities who have no Kgirls, but I only see one for every 10 Kgirls I see because of the difference in value. That's why I have no problem with modest periodic price increases.
..."indies" were $300 and K-girls were $250. Today indies are $500 and K-girls are STILL $250. You may "have no problem with modest periodic price increases" but most K-fanboys rend their garments and tear their hair out at the thought of a modest price increase even one time in 13 years. Why do you think that is? (Please don't use the $1.50 Costco hot dog as an example. rocket has worn the shit out of that argument, lol)
As I alluded to already, I think its endemic to guys STARTING their hobby life with Kgirls instead of making the transition from indies to Kgirls like many of us "K-fanboys" did. Most of the Kgirl veterans on the Kgirl board started with indies like I did and then moved over to Kgirls once they discovered that market. You almost NEVER hear this group of Kgirl converts complaining about price increases. Of course, most are in their 40's, 50's and 60's, so they're a little more savvy about economics in general than the younger ones who complain a lot about price increases. The market has not been static at $250. There are still a few at that price, but in SoCal, they are mostly at $270-$300, and $300 is the standard rate in Las Vegas and on the East Coast. There is usually an upcharge for BBFS which brings the rate to $380-$400. I believe the lowest average prices are still in the BA, and ironically, some local mongers don't seem to appreciate the value they are getting and still complain about prices.
I never buy anything based solely on price, and that includes pussy. While indies "started" at $300 back in 2008, the price range of the girls I was seeing were $3-500. I saw a few at $1000/hr, but quickly disabused myself of any thoughts that you get a better experience for that kind of money; often more beautiful, but not better service. There is nothing a $1000 girl can do that a $500 girl can't do. Since then, I mostly see indies in the $500 range, plus or minus, when I'm in a city with no Kgirl agencies. FYI, just because I favor Kgirls for the VALUE we get does not mean I also buy hot dogs at Costco. Lol
-- Modified on 10/21/2021 4:06:20 AM
i have no interest in going back to indies for a while cus the value is such a large gap IMO, and i love the korean milfs they might be older but their bodies are still very banging. i am curious of one thing though, is it more or less risky going to these places? my first visits were in a nice condo type location but im worried that some orgs might not be as safe or might be more prone to LE?
The only reason I still see indies is to keep a few current provider references in order to be able to get some pussy if I'm in a smaller town on business, which I usually am at least once a month. I agree that indie pussy isn't Kgirl pussy, its its still better than NO pussy. Lol
How about you give us a few links to reviews for indie pussy that is not asian?
I couldn't find a single review that you created with a White/Caucasian, Black, Latina or Mexican pussy, so I look forward to your reply for a few of those.
my alias, you moron. This is your one response for the month.
"Since then, I mostly see indies in the $500 range, plus or minus, when I'm in a city with no Kgirl agencies."
Provide us with the review link to one:
-$500 girl
-Caucasian girl
-Latina/Hispanic/Mexican girl
-Black Girl
-Jewish Girl
LOL
You seem to be too fixated on hot dog portion of the argument to understand that my argument is simply the following :
When people are conditioned that the price is constant over many years, they aren't going to like it when it eventually changes. It's basic consumer nature. It is the sellers responsibility to adjust the prices gradually or at least mask it as an upgrade corresponding to the price change. You seem to want to accuse the mongers of being "cheap". And my argument is, who set those expectations? The sellers. If you're going to sell some amazing steak for 25 bucks for years, people will get comfortable. And when the price rises eventually, people will be unhappy no matter what. Even if the place operated at a loss to get customer loyalty.
And, I'm with cdl here. Value is a very real thing. If I can get Michelin star food/service at a place that is half priced from other places, why would I go to other places? It's logical and perfectly rational. Now, I think there are plenty of caveats here between kgirls and non-kgirls, but you get the point.
This is for Big Papa San, but I'm attaching it to Rockets post because I believe Rocket is simply saying nobody likes an increase in anything they are buying!
Now BPS, you are saying KMongers complain about price increases! There is a thread on the GD Board now, and I'm sure everyone has seen it (why you all pay so much), some the posts are about price increases & being too high! I'm pretty sure most of these guys are talking about indies, by the price range they are using!
So, it looks like guys across the board don't like and complain about prices going up and being high whoever they see, Kgirl or indie!
Rocket I hope you don't mind that I used your post.
Not at all, badger.
I completely agree that price complains aren't exclusive to Korean or even Asian girl mongers. It isn't even exclusive to this industry.
I can't speak for anyone else, but I see them because that's who I'm attracted to!
I pay what is asked and I believe they are worth every penny and more!
And, I agree that the Increases are very modest!
The cost of everything always will go up, it's just how it is!
.. the golden days when you got $160 FS at AMPs from beautiful K-girls at a dozen establishments within walking distance of my office. Yes I've been spoiled.
But I still think the K-girls (now ncluding a lot of J-girls and C-girls) remain a good value and don't begrudge them at the 300-400 rate, especiially since a lot of the others have gone from 3-400 to 6-800.
No doubt about it, and it's because of consistent baseline "floor" for service.