When I realized that being married to the woman I was with was likely to make me as miserable as many of the men here, I got out, and I got out fast.
Maybe that's why I have no hard feelings towards my ex, I got out well before she could make my life a living hell, and I suppose before I could ruin her life in return. and yes, most of the people my own age might as well be of a different generation. I really don't mind listening to them bitch about their horrible marriages, it only reminds me just how happily divorced I am.
I am okay with idea that only way I can date desirable women is by paying them. Win-win as far as I am concerned.
What does bothers me is that my pending divorce may take that ability away. May have to pay 1/3 of my income to a bitch that treated me like crap for the rest of my life.
Thanks to Virginia civil laws, I may be returning to celibacy soon.
Perhaps the only reason I was born was to support someone who could not (or would not) support her self.
Even though I had to give money to my ex, I found out quickly that she spent much more than she made. I found myself with an extra $2000 a month or so after all of my expenses. Guess what I spend it on?
In my pending divorce, what my lawyer says I am supposed to pay, and what her lawyer is demanding that I must pay are two different figures that aren't even in the same universe. My wife refuses to support herself too.
Her favorite hobbies these days include sitting on the couch all day long, while eating ice cream and watching tv. So if anybody here is interested in marrying a woman like that, let me know, I can hook you up. I will even throw in the couch for free.
-- Modified on 11/7/2015 8:46:48 PM
Ah, yes…a ‘woman like that’. But, apparently, you and the OP were interested enough in marrying a woman “like that”, that you actually married one.
I have a friend---known him all my life---he married a woman who fit right into his ideal of what a wife ‘should be’. She was cultured and poised (and hot) and always well dressed (a considerable amount of those hot clothes where paid for, by him, during dating and early marriage days). She loved to drive nice cars (he thought this was sexy---and, early-on, gave little thought to buying these luxury cars for her to drive).
Basically, every behavior that completely pisses him off now was a behavior that he, not only loved about her at one point, it was one he actively supported and encouraged.
On a more important note: when they got married, she agreed to consider her college education an “MRS. She did not pursue a professional life. She stayed home and did the mom thing; raised 3 kids, grocery shopped, kept the house spotless, had dinner on the table for him when he came home, pulled out the expected social graces when interacting with his professional contacts…. blah and etcetera….
Fast forward 20 years. They barely tolerate each other. Not a new, or even remotely unique story—here on this board, or anywhere else. And when he gets off on tirades with me about this situation, in some effort to be supportive, I say nothing.
But, here’s what I don’t say to him: A traditional “wife” is EXACTLY what you wanted. When you knowingly take-on a traditional marriage arrangement you don’t just get to walk away without significant financial culpability when the shit hits the fan. Got kids? ouch.
And (to you and the OP), if you think it’s only men getting screwed by these types of arrangements when divorce is on the table, you would be very wrong. If your wife(s) had been the primary breadwinners throughout your marriage(s)….she would be the one in the financial hot-seat
Of those that receive alimony only about 3% are men, yet the main bread earner 40% of married households are women. Sorry but women rarely get to pay alimony even if they would be getting it if the situation was reversed. Sorry men get the shaft when it comes to alimony.
-- Modified on 11/7/2015 7:27:24 PM
UT, and this is a big but, the number of households in which a husband/father now stays at home and takes on the more 'traditional' role of "wife/caregiver"----with or without children---while nearly unheard of 25 yrs ago---has increased significantly over the last 10-15 years.
And, in the situations in which the man in a marriage has taken on that role, it is increasingly the case that the woman/wife/primary breadwinner becomes culpable for spousal support.
The primary point being---in a traditional marriage arrangement the primary breadwinner, who has an existing a reliable income, will be held 'more' financially responsible in the event of a divorce; as opposed to the partner who (possibly for 10-15-20+ years) has had "0" income for those same years, and may have significant difficulty now acquiring an adequate income for survival (much less an ability to maintain a lifestyle even close to what sh/e had within the marriage).
Not about gender. Its about who has been the primary breadwinner.
(And, if you really want some interesting factoids, take a look at stats on how many women end up in poverty after a divorce---in contradiction to how many men pay alimony)
Even in cases the woman is the sole bread earner men get less money for shorter time and often don't get anything. It is about gender. Divorce court favors women. Sexism is real and women aren't the only victims. In the areas of custody and alimony men are the big loser. The stats are extremely plain on this.
Whoever came into the marriage with the most loses the most. All other things being equal that is. And MANY rich powerful women have had to pay hefty sums to their boy toy hubbies.
Steph xoxo
Until you see what those rich,powerful, women look like ...
Unless men feel too emasculated to even ask for it...
http://www.forbes.com/sites/emmajohnson/2014/11/20/why-do-so-few-men-get-alimony/
Other than that....times are changing.
http://www.forbes.com/2007/03/13/women-paying-alimony-lead_cx_pink_0313alimony.html
http://abcnews.go.com/Business/role-reversal-wives-angry-paying-alimony/story?id=8662940
http://www.divorce360.com/divorce-articles/alimony/information/women-who-pay-alimony.aspx?artid=1065
http://wtvr.com/2015/02/16/battered-wife-must-pay-abuser-alimony-thats-still-the-law/
http://family.findlaw.com/divorce/spousal-support-alimony-basics.htm
And over the years when women did not work it had to favor them, how in the hell was a woman with no job and kids to take care of back in the day, supposed to support themselves.
And it is not about what a person has between their legs, it is about money and the dispersion of such so the rest of the family was not on the streets while the guy toddled off.
As hotplants mentioned, as roles are changing and the money pit is not always with the male, the females will now get a taste of the same thing IF hubby was the househusband and she the primary bread winner.
There is a great deal of judges discretion in alimony cases. There has been multiple studies showing in simular cases women get awarded alimony more often. It is simular to how blacks see more jail time than whites. The law is color blind but judges and juries aren't. Alimony laws are gender blind but judges aren't. Old broken stereotypes die hard. In America women are the main bread earner in 40% of households yet only 3% to 10% depending on state of all alimony awards are male. That is a huge discrepancy not explained by just men not wanting it. The problem isn't the law but in it's application. Only about 17,000 men are receiving alimony while about 400,000 women are. Remember about 40% of the time women are the chief bread winners and these marriages have a higher divorce rate.
The raw data doesn't lie our family courts are broken favoring women. Our criminal courts are broken favoring whites. This is reality. So take a dose of reality. Should it be this way? No, but it is. It isn't the laws fault, it is old stereo types that die hard. Things are changing for the fairer but things are far from fair. In 1980 number of men receiving alimony was just above 0% now it is just above 3%. That is progress but that is not equality. Not even close. Equality given the income gap would be about 40% of alimony recipients should be male and it isn't even close.
In most cases that appear before a magistrate maintenance is never an issue. Over the past few decades women have become equal wage earners to their male counterparts (in deference to what some may wish to believe). Rarely would a magistrate order one party to pay the other. However, in many cases the issues surrounding custody and child support will be visited. Especially to a custodial parent who now may need to pay for child care and reduce his/her net take home pay.
Generally the maintenance issue arises when marital assets are difficult to separate. This is often due to a business that was the primary income producer. And the valuation of that asset can and is often "argued". Not to mention that rarely will a Family Court have the authority to order the business to be "sold". Frankly...if some judge wants that ordered, (s)he has no interest in the adjudication of that case.
Remember scoed...rarely will skewed statistics reveal the underlying issues.
It's a pitiful world that some weave. And quite often the recipients of their disdain for life are their children. Who in most cases are innocent.
Frankly the whiners here who lament over the women that they divorced is pathetic. Last I checked both parties agreed to whatever in the beginning...then over time someone (likely the whiners here that keep on posting) feels like they got some short end of a stick.
If those "real men" were real men...they'd just move on to the next chapter in their life. No different than being involved in a shitty investment/shitty partnership. Nope...they come on this (and likely other) boards and whine about it...endlessly.
The raw data doesn't lie our family courts are broken favoring women. Our criminal courts are broken favoring whites. This is reality. So take a dose of reality. Should it be this way? No, but it is. It isn't the laws fault, it is old stereo types that die hard. Things are changing for the fairer but things are far from fair. In 1980 number of men receiving alimony was just above 0% now it is just above 3%. That is progress but that is not equality. Not even close. Equality given the income gap would be about 40% of alimony recipients should be male and it isn't even close.
Something is broke in our family courts and that's my point. This doesn't affect me for two reasons. First my wife was a jaded on marriage and had us sign a prenuptial agreement mostly to protect her given her assets was worth over twice what mine was and she earned way more than me. My bussinesses grew and hers died reversing who the prenuptial agreement protected. It plainly states I get to keep my bussinesses and she gets to keep hers and neither party is entitled to spousal support, everything else should be separated evenly. Second neither my wife or I am planning of divorcing. I am not bitter or whining, I am just stating facts. Fact is results of divorce favor women in custody and alimony. The why can be argued.
The prenup sets out the assets PRIOR to marriage. As you discussed you had zilch and the spouse had something more than zilch.
Now...the marital estate is the issue. The valuation of YOUR business has increased over the term of the marriage. And your spouses dissolved. Without knowing what type of assets your spouse brought in to the marriage...those assets would be HERS upon dissolution based on the prenup. That was/is the purpose of outlining in the prenup those assets.
As for the language in your prenup...I'd need to see how it was drafted to comment on whether you are entitled to your businesses without regard to the marital estate. I doubt that...however you would likely retain the ownership component...the valuation during the marriage would then be determined as the compensation in a dissolution.
As I had posted earlier...generally when there is a business that is the primary (or sole) income production towards the marital estate that is the only time that maintenance may become an issue. Hence...in your case you would really need to revisit the verbiage in a prenup as well as understand that you would also be subject to paying the soon to be ex-wife monies from the business valuation.
Of course having a CPA who knows that you are looking at a divorce not far down the road can greatly assist you in devaluing those assets....or so I've heard 
Life's a game...know the rules and you can play. If you don't know the rules...you likely will lose.
And back in 2010 my wife and I was near divorce. We both did things that deeply hurt the other. The papers was even drawn. I had a team of lawyers and my CPA go over the prenuptial agreement and they concluded given the document clearly states under no circumstances if both parties are healthy should ether receive any form of spousal support be granted and clearly states my bussinesses ownership and income remain with me regardless of future growth and should not be counted as a marital asset (same is true in reverse) that it now protected my interest over hers. But she would gets the house and the cash value of what her business was worth, and half of all other assets which are substantial enough.
Anyway we worked things out and I feel we are both happy to be married to each other. I have zero desire to get a divorce. I think my marriage is the best thing to ever happen to this lucky bastard rough parts and all.
Still you concur that the prenup was/is a formal contract that you, your attorney(s) and CPAs believe would and should be enforceable.
Where I do believe you would have trouble arguing to the court would be that your business valuation not be considered a marital asset. Perhaps the wording in your prenup states this...likely not however. And even with the wording your wife's attorney's would likely argue that no valuation was established on the prenup and that the businesses were now material to the marital estate.
As I posted elsewhere....better to have this in writing (as you smartly have done) versus just "beg the court" to disregard the plaintiffs assertions.
Not sure why your wife would get the house and then you go on to say "half of all other assets which are substantial enough"...as that was the thrust of my comments regarding a business valuation.
Hopefully you haven't erred in having a business valuation for Estate purposes as this would counteract the valuation for Marital estate purposes LOL
Best case scenario...you live happily ever after and never have to really argue this case. That's how folks like me make a living however...but to "us" it's a game. Divorce planning has also become a rather lucrative business over the past several decades.
Anyway we worked things out and I feel we are both happy to be married to each other. I have zero desire to get a divorce. I think my marriage is the best thing to ever happen to this lucky bastard rough parts and all.
Women get equal pay for equal work. Then I might have some sympathy for this inequality.
Don't let facts get in the way of the illusion.
Guess you can stop your whining too!!
I've never heard of a man getting Alimony IRL. I've heard of the concept, but never seen or heard of it IRL. I've also heard of the concept of a Unicorn, but never seen or heard of it IRL.
Let's be real here for a moment, the courts side with the woman automatically, no hesitation. I have a friend who's ex absolutely should not have custody of her kids, she's a worthless druggie, a terrible Mother, the only reason she wants custody is to have some semblance of control over my friend. If DSS were to investigate the home and her they'd be jumping through hoops to get those kids out of her custody and probably wouldn't allow her unsupervised visitation. Yes it's that bad. But the Judge was lazy, she gets custody, slam the gavel, next case. My friend's children are doomed, the things they witness everyday, the environment that they are growing up in, no child should have to bear that. I mean be honest, the divorce court is stacked against the man, period.
It is however worth it.
If you honestly think the ex-wife is a danger...get off YOUR ass and file a report with DCFS. It's anonymous BTW.
And with EVERY report DCFS must check this out.
DCFS doesn't give a shit what some magistrate/judge ordered either.
Or just sit there and whine with your friend about how life is so unfair!
Let's be real here for a moment, the courts side with the woman automatically, no hesitation. I have a friend who's ex absolutely should not have custody of her kids, she's a worthless druggie, a terrible Mother, the only reason she wants custody is to have some semblance of control over my friend. If DSS were to investigate the home and her they'd be jumping through hoops to get those kids out of her custody and probably wouldn't allow her unsupervised visitation. Yes it's that bad. But the Judge was lazy, she gets custody, slam the gavel, next case. My friend's children are doomed, the things they witness everyday, the environment that they are growing up in, no child should have to bear that. I mean be honest, the divorce court is stacked against the man, period.
It is however worth it.
My friend did however ask DSS to investigate, two things, first they think he's butt hurt and two there aren't enough investigators. You might think, or have been told that they have to investigate all claims, but reality is that there are too few people to investigate the situations. We don't live in a perfect world, most people, like you, think that every claim must be investigated, but reality is that there are many people who fall through the cracks. If there isn't physical evidence (lacerations/bruises), they get put on the back burner.
Reality, what a concept.
If you believe that something is not right in your friend's ex-wife's house with her kids....YOU can report this....ANONYMOUSLY!!!!
But since you now admit that your "friend" has filed a complaint or ten...DCFS did investigate. And I guess the result was to confirm that YOUR friend is just a whiner like you are. Yeah...there's plenty of that type of shit going on wasting social service resources.
Maybe quit your pathetic whining about what you know nothing about. And maybe ask a few people who actually work(ed) in that field on how the game is played.
Knowledge is power.
Reality, what a concept.
It's just how few guys here tell you to "mind your own fucking business" when you butt into their personal lives with out a clue to their personal situations. Not that I don't enjoy the ensuing train wrecks, but it constantly amazes me just how many guys will try to "explain" themselves to somehow justify themselves and their actions to you instead simply telling you to fuck off.
Does this surprise you as much as it surprises me?
Of course it doesn't surprise me....not in the least LOL
And when I have to listen to the whiners...I give the full hour. None of this 45 minute shit that the shrinks sell as an hour
Does this surprise you as much as it surprises me?
she sounds like Peggy Bundy
Im coming up to the end game of a divorce after 30 years married. Here is my take. You are supposed to combine your income, assets and liabilities with a party that not too long ago was a total stranger. You then are expected to share equally (at least in California ) everything that was accumulated in the past 10 to 30 years plus no matter how much either party contributed. And this agreement is done with the full knowledge that there is a less than 50% chance of this clusterfuck working. Sounds pretty stupid to me. Btw. There's a hi chance of shitty sex, fat sex partner for the rest of your life.
That's why divorce is worth every penny IMO alimony usually isn't for life and you will make more money. Just sleeping in the middle of the bed is worth it. Going on vacation where, and when, you want with having to debate and compromise is fantastic! I'll gladly pay for sex because it's great sex. And the blow jobs don't stop like they do when you're married. Life does go on ... And single life is far much better than living in a shitty marriage. It's amazing how much a angry, miserable, spouse can drag you down, but you don't realize it at the time. Life is short. Enjoy it.
Just sayin'....
Sorry for your trouble.
This country's Judicial system is so fucked up it's no wonder we are in the position we are in debt wise. For the guy who posted the threat, i feel for you and what you have to go through. People come from all over the world to experience the American dream, start a business and live prosperous, or at least thats what it used to be about. Now all you have to do is be a woman and get divorced and or have a child and the courts deem you deserve to be taken care of the rest of your life! A buddy of mine just recently lost a motion to have his spousal support reduced, the judge denied it deeming him "an able bodied male capable of working." So I asked and I'm sure he asked to, what about her???? Apparently sitting on your ass is a full time job now.
Merica, land of the free (to sit on your ass) and home of the... well you know the rest.
...done on mice who had an infinite supply of food so they didn't have to worry about anything. What turned out was the rats became lazy, antisocial and neglected their offspring. I find this is similar to western society where these days even with a guarantee that you will never starve or live on the streets if you work hard we have quite well off families become broken because of changing needs and wants.
All my coworkers were either divorced or sucked up to their wives. The divorced ones who married again would wisen up and eventually start sucking up to their wives. Its such a gamble these days to marry. That nice civvie girl you end up marrying might turn out to be a 50% tax on your assets in the future. That nice civvie guy you end up marrying might trade you for another chick leaving you with no income and poor dating prospects because you are then over 28.
And it doesn't help that its now the norm to date for something like 4-8 years before tieing the knot. What if in the 6th or 7th year we break up? Thats almost a decade down the drain!
It ticks me off now whenever I am at family meet ups and someone asks me if I have a gf or wife and when I say no they are surprised. Hookers and test tube babies for me tyvm!
Plus I do not want to stare at the same sack and sausage for the rest of my life or watch while he gets fat and saggy. I am with you, staying single and ready to mingle.
You can't put a price tag on peace of mind.
I take the trash out, when I feel like doing so, my house doesn't smell like trash. I mow the lawn when I feel like it, I'm not a bad neighbor, I don't bring down the value of my neighborhood by having unkempt landscaping. I collect leaves when I feel like it, again good neighbor. I don't sit in the " I'm a loser chair", you know the chair outside of the changing room at a mall store. I don't have to listen to " I can't believe Suzy wore this short skirt to work, and her blouse was so low cut her boobs were hanging out, she's such a slut". You know what, I would like to meet Suzy.
Fuck marriage, it's a lose/lose situation for a man. I didn't get to this point in life by participating in too many lose/lose situations. My peace of mind, and getting to fuck and suck the women I do are do much worth it. Life is good.
I never got married... Not even close.. Pays to be nothing to write home about or look at! Never thought being a loser would be winning!
That she owes you money for all the hookers you had to pay when she wasn't doing her marital duty.
She might be a bitch but you might be a giant bag of dicks...see, we do not have her opinion of you.
Actually there are 3 sides. Hers, mine and the truth.
Cannot understand why a guy would rather marry any chick than be on their own until they are 50 with no kids. You chose ti want to seem normal and married someone you obviously compromised or you would still be happy. You make your choices you pay the piper. See if you had remained alone childless you would now be rich and happy. Any man unless you marry someone you, you will always end up being an atm machine with no sex in return.
It's worth it.
No more nagging bitch, no more honey do lists, no more "when are you going to take the trash out? When are you going to mow the lawn". Shut the fuck up bitch. No more having to listen to her jealous rants about the girl in her office that dresses like a slut (I'd like to meet the slut).
Trust me, it's worth every penny, you can make more money, but you can't get peace of mind until you cut the ball and chain.
And the best part... When your wife asks, "Does this dress make me look Fat?"
You get to say, "No Hun. Your FAT ASS makes you look fat!"
And we had a few knock down drag out fight (not literally, I've never hit a woman). We agreed that I would not respond to those questions anymore in an attempt to keep the peace.
There is no correct answer to those loaded questions.
My ex had a very nice body when we married. By the end, she could have been a sumo wrestler.
She went from dressing very well to dressing "WTF?". Once, she had on a pair of canary yellow slacks. I don't think there's a person--man or woman--in the world who looks good in canary yellow slacks, but when your ass requires a DOT number, it's definitely a no-no.
With those slacks, she had on a black sweater with white stripes. She asked me how it looked. I really wanted to say, "you look like a fucking bumblebee", but I kept my mouth shut. Discretion being the better part of valor and all that.
A woman was standing naked, looking herself at the mirror. She was not satisfied with what she was looking at and said to her husband: "I feel awful. I look old, fat, and ugly. I really need a compliment right now." Her husband replied: "Your vision is perfectly nice!" ...and then the fight started.
This is all so sad. Is marriage really so bad? I guess statistics say "yes" but the thought of probably being better off alone forever isn't an easy one to swallow either. Where is the middle ground ?
Even when I'm alone, I'm not alone. I prefer being single than to be with someone who loaths me with every ounce of her being. Frankly, it sucks to be married and the statistics on divorce confirm that.
...if married to someone that you often spend your hard earned money on and that person is often unhappy and critical towards you, let alone contributing very little to the marriage.
When it gets this one-sided then many call it quits. Unfortunately, divorces get messy as some have expressed here.
On the other hand, if everything looks great at the beginning in entering a marriage, maybe more should think of a Premarital agreement* before taking the vow, as a safety precaution (just saying).
*Premarital agreements (also called prenuptial agreements or "prenups") are a common legal step taken before marriage. A prenup establishes the property and financial rights of each spouse in the event of a divorce
The saying goes, " Love is blind" but often, Love is dumb also. People don't think when they are in love because emotion takes over and logic takes a back seat. Pre Nups are a great idea, but they are not written in stone as any attorney will tell you.
When it gets this one-sided then many call it quits. Unfortunately, divorces get messy as some have expressed here.
On the other hand, if everything looks great at the beginning in entering a marriage, maybe more should think of a Premarital agreement* before taking the vow, as a safety precaution (just saying).
*Premarital agreements (also called prenuptial agreements or "prenups") are a common legal step taken before marriage. A prenup establishes the property and financial rights of each spouse in the event of a divorce.
It is however a legal document that would govern a "he said/she said" argument as basis.
I strongly recommend to clients to use prenups...especially the young women who tend to save and actually have something to lose within a shorter time frame.
The pathetic whiners here (predominantly the men) could certainly execute a prenup and insist their lovely brides do the same. Takes most (if not all) of the uncertainty in the event of a divorce down the road. And then what would they whine about?
It's just like any other agreement out there. It can still be argued. I tend to like my agreements in writing. Makes MY argument much more sound.
The saying goes, " Love is blind" but often, Love is dumb also. People don't think when they are in love because emotion takes over and logic takes a back seat. Pre Nups are a great idea, but they are not written in stone as any attorney will tell you.
When it gets this one-sided then many call it quits. Unfortunately, divorces get messy as some have expressed here.
On the other hand, if everything looks great at the beginning in entering a marriage, maybe more should think of a Premarital agreement* before taking the vow, as a safety precaution (just saying).
*Premarital agreements (also called prenuptial agreements or "prenups") are a common legal step taken before marriage. A prenup establishes the property and financial rights of each spouse in the event of a divorce.
I have no physical proof to contribute, it's just a suspicion.
Oh wait...I'm sure you were LOL
Good luck on finding that proof that contracts aren't enforceable. Seems like quite the conundrum.
You must have lots of tin foil in your house. You can reuse those hats you know.
russ...have YOU read the divorce decree yet? Since contracts aren't enforceable you know. You must still be married...or you were never married since that contract wasn't enforceable. Oh my LOL
Up until I started this wonderful part of my life, I made poor choices in women, civie women. Now, my choices are outstanding, of course civie women and men don't come with reviews.
Honestly, I'm just too damn selfish to be in a relationship. So, it's much better and easier to be alone, I still get my intimacy, it's just that I rent it instead of paying the installment plan.
And I bet you are happier now. I know I am. I wish I had discovered this lifestyle many year ago because I really think it's good for the soul. I run into old friends now and then and it seems that the ones who stayed in "loveless marriages" are really paying for it. They have big health issues, eight problems, grey hair, and I look at them and think, "We are about the same age ...WOW!" Because they really look like shit for their age. You can't carry that much stress year after year and expect it won't affect you. Maybe, I've discovered the fountain of youth.
Honestly, I'm just too damn selfish to be in a relationship. So, it's much better and easier to be alone, I still get my intimacy, it's just that I rent it instead of paying the installment plan.
When I realized that being married to the woman I was with was likely to make me as miserable as many of the men here, I got out, and I got out fast.
Maybe that's why I have no hard feelings towards my ex, I got out well before she could make my life a living hell, and I suppose before I could ruin her life in return.
and yes, most of the people my own age might as well be of a different generation. I really don't mind listening to them bitch about their horrible marriages, it only reminds me just how happily divorced I am.
You are on a forum where most members are unhappily married men paying to get their sexual needs met. You think the message might be a little biased here?
It is both parties working on the marriage. And lots and lots of forgiveness from both parties. Sadly many people chose to hold on to grudges, quit working the relationship, and behave like their spouse is the competition instead their partner. If both husband and wife support each other, work constantly on the relationship, spend time with each other, communicate with each other, and forgive each other, marriage works. I am very happy to be my wife's husband and I feel she is happy to be my wife.
but at least in my case, it was worth it.
I also have much less money to hobby with than I used to, but when I come home, it is my home minus the negativity I used to find, to say nothing of the mess it was.
Where there's a will, there is a way. You won't hobby quite as much as before, it is true, but the hobbying you do manage will be as sweet as nectar, and mean so much more. Trust me on that.
By the way, if you're lawyer hasn't suggested it already, see a good psychologist with experience counselling men going through divorce. I did, and it was worth every penny
So WTF are you babbling about?
You're another one that whines about having to live with someone that's a downer...then whine about it costing you some money that rightfully was never yours anyhow. I'd be curious to know how much the first wife made and contributed towards your standard of living....cause commenting that you don't have much now makes zero sense since YOU got remarried LOL
And why would or should some lawyer suggest to a client to see a shrink? Unless it's his cousin and he's getting a spif. Just another waste of dollars IMO.
I also have much less money to hobby with than I used to, but when I come home, it is my home minus the negativity I used to find, to say nothing of the mess it was.
Where there's a will, there is a way. You won't hobby quite as much as before, it is true, but the hobbying you do manage will be as sweet as nectar, and mean so much more. Trust me on that.
By the way, if you're lawyer hasn't suggested it already, see a good psychologist with experience counselling men going through divorce. I did, and it was worth every penny.
just marriage to someone you can't stand.
Now I'm married to the best person in the world, and loving it.
I'm not suggesting he see a shrink because he is insane or anything like that. I suggest it because having a skilled listener who can pick up your spirits is very important, at least my experience of it was.
You married someone you couldn't stand the phirst time around? Why in the phuck would you do that?
And now you claim to be "married" (even though you've said other times you're really not married) to the "best person in the world, and loving it"....probably the same words you chose with the phirst wife at some point.
I don't think that "insane" folks know they're insane. I doubt you can convince them to see a shrink for their insanity. How about if some lost soul is looking for some solace he just chats with the bartender. If he's so inclined to babble to someone who also doesn't care.
In all fairness there are many organizations that have forums for recently divorced souls to share their common disdain for their exes...and those folks all have something in common to whine about. Quite often it's free as well. Check your local listings.
Now I'm married to the best person in the world, and loving it.
I'm not suggesting he see a shrink because he is insane or anything like that. I suggest it because having a skilled listener who can pick up your spirits is very important, at least my experience of it was.
I had several good years of marriage, and got two great kids, so I would not term it a horrible experience, it had just run its course.
If you want to see a bar tender to get a grip on psychological woes, that's your decision.
But I don't rely on my accountant to repair my car, or my lawyer to fix up a good whiskey sour
refer some new divorcee to see a shrink..WTF is that all about?
Since when do lawyers have the requisite skills to make those evaluations?
Next thing you'll know is that your lawyer recommends his client to see a tantra LOL
And your accountant will recommend drinking pineapple juice LOL
Everything tends to run a course. Hence making global statements about the state of marriage is an oxymoron. People DO change...so those who "stick it out" are rare and lucky. Far too many people run when things get a bit difficult. And then of course they'll be happy to blame others for the failure of the relationship. And too few people don't recognize that it has run its course and stay with something that is just not productive.
As for wasting time with a shrink...to each their own. But since I've got a number of clients who are indeed licensed for that...I tend to see that bunch as being a bit off center anyhow. Funny thing is many of them tend to see shrinks too. Maybe professional courtesy...who knows
If you want to see a bar tender to get a grip on psychological woes, that's your decision.
But I don't rely on my accountant to repair my car, or my lawyer to fix up a good whiskey sour.
After listening to other peoples' woes all day, you would need a person to transfer your own burden to.
I think the lawyer suggests it because otherwise his client will tend to want to have the lawyer be his shrink, and that could be pretty disastrous. For the record, my accountant also suggested that I see a shrink
So your accountant is the brother-in-law of your attorney who has a cousin that's a shrink.
Do they all work out of the same suite to save money?
I guess I just don't see any value in babbling to someone about life's issues. That's what a dog is for. And it also provides good exercise assuming you take it for some nice long walks. Try it....you'll feel much better.
No charge for the advice.
I think the lawyer suggests it because otherwise his client will tend to want to have the lawyer be his shrink, and that could be pretty disastrous. For the record, my accountant also suggested that I see a shrink.
And they will play fetch...and roll over...and just be your damned best friend forever.
Also...they don't phucking charge an hour for only 45 minutes.
Why am I not surprised that mrfisher gets his referrals from his lawyer LOL
It will get better, patience , optimism and time will make it better. You'll get there.
Best,
Bianca
"Yo" to GaGambler and other lesser Masters: I want you all to know that
"The Street" tells Me to ask the following question, in re Divorce, etc....
"Why do men continue to want to buy the Whole Cow, when they sell Milk at every 7-11???"
am I doing better??
Regards to all!! Stay Lucky, be Smart! "The Street
I guess the same reason that when a guy wants a steak he'd go to Gibsons and not get that tube steak at 7-11.
What I do find interesting is the disdain the recently divorced whiners have towards marriage. I'll bet if mrfisher's shrink would chime in we'd find that most of these recently divorced dudes are butt hurt that their spouse rejected them on various levels.
And then they come into P4P and the hookers tell them how great they are...how wonderfully sexy they are. Some of these morons believe it too LOL
Even though vows claim to be "for life"....seems like many prefer to look at it differently. Business deals rarely are for life...things change over time. As does a relationship with anyone.
If some of these tools could take the emotions out of the rejection they feel...they'd see it too.
And just like the next terrific business partnership is just around the corner....so is that next "wife" who will love him unconditionally...forever
"The Street" tells Me to ask the following question, in re Divorce, etc....
"Why do men continue to want to buy the Whole Cow, when they sell Milk at every 7-11???"
am I doing better??
Regards to all!! Stay Lucky, be Smart! "The Street"
any affectionate contact at all, and finds creative ways to break things that I have to fix with my time and money"?
However with any "partnership" things change. And when it is changing and one of the partners is oblivious to the changes....they deem it rejection.
Seems to be an easy excuse for many.
It seems pretty easy to understand why ex-wives or ex-husbands had lost that sexual interest in their former spouses...I hear many of them even bought them mirrors and scales as gifts.
Does that help?
And many who have finished with it, that argument is lame.
I'm OK with people moving in different directions in life...I'd feel comfortable stating that most people search for other things in life.
Why anyone has to have disdain for the other when that partnership is over is all emotional. The argument that many seem to whine about is the financial aspect...however that is simply rarely an issue in reality. Life will change...that's a certainty. When someone embraces the changes they head in a positive direction.
Those who whine about being shit on tend to wallow in their own disdain for life.
Most of the comments so far are generalities and half truths, so in the spirit of things I will contribute a few more...
In most divorces, the standard of living goes down initially for both parties, but if they are careful and manage their resources well, financial and emotional recovery and resumption of enjoyable life style are not unusual.
Courts are not so interested in "he did, she did," but the welfare of and provision for any children involved. Divorcees have to pay for that anyway, e. g. child support and education expenses, so that's not so bad.
Providers and wives should not be natural enemies. Most providers understand that, very few wives do. They confuse marriage with control. A lot of marriages would be saved if the male could have an occasional flirtation/dalliance. Full blown love affairs are usually more complicated and destructive. And what's true for the gander is also true for the goose.
There is such a thing as "companionate marriage" if and when the passionate fires burn out.
The rules of marriage should not be made by religious authorities quoting rigid ancient scriptures, but by loving partners who agree on a set of principles. Here's a recent exchange of vows between two individuals who had a lot of ideological differences but who loved each other:
"To stay together in rough times;
To forgive each other for their shortcomings
To work together and show compassion for others who are suffering
To help each other to see various sides of situations
To accept the other's right to different opinions when disagreement arise."
Not nearly as eloquent as the traditional "To have and to hold..." but a lot more practical in building a lasting relationship