TER General Board

My path to hobbying
TwoMints 969 reads
posted

I think over the years, I always thought that I should get a divorce, though I love my wife, I just don't find her attractive. I almost pulled out of the wedding (almost 20 years ago) at the last minute, but really didn't understand why. So we married, had a child and life went on. Sex came and went, and is rare these days and has no variety at all, its exactly the same most every time. I gained a lot of weight, like many guys, because deep down I didn't really care. It wasn't a rational thing it just happens. A few years back, while on a gambling forum, a guy I followed, talked off an on about losing weight and one day it just clicked. I was sick and tired of being obese. Not to brag, but I do have unusual discipline. I exercised most everyday, often twice a day, have a physical job (not that any of that matters much for weight loss, about 20% of it tops) and cut calories. At my peak I was 300+. I stuck to my calories everyday. Every month a calorie allotment of 1600 a few months, up to 2100 some months. I don't think I went over my calories once in 10 months. I lost the weight oh and quit smoking in the middle of it. (eventually getting down to 178 at my lowest weight. Since then, I've put some back on but I'm still 215ish at 6'4" and cutting off and on, its harder to do again so if you lose weight don't put it back on... Yeah, you end up with loose skin and scars which still bothers me to this day and always will.  I joined a gym somewhere in the middle once I felt comfortable that I wasn't a huge fatass and began lifting weight. (not that I ever really gained a lot of muscle) A side effect of weight loss and excise is testosterone. I was constantly horny, and not getting enough at home. Looking at all the hotties at the gym didn't help... I had consider what outlet I could manage. I came to the conclusion that P4P was the best route, I didn't want to get a divorce for a lot of reasons and trying to hookup seemed implausible. I checked around off and on for months eventually running across P411 which led to TER. I got a burner phone and used a fake email before ever starting. I then set up a solo trip to meet some gambling friends in Vegas and set up a few dates. First one, wasn't anything to write home about, using a condom for the first time in 25 years wasn't all that great. She also, not that I knew before hand, looked a bit like my wife and was a bigger gal similar to my wife but I knew she'd see me and would be a good starting point for references. Over the next 4 or 5 days in Vegas I saw a lady a day and was hooked. I saw a top 30 rated lady, an anal queen (first time since well before my wife) and another nice lady that gave me my first ever CIM. (yes, my sex life was that boring) I dabbled a bit when I got home, but the following year was terrible at work and I didn't have a lot of extra funds for it. So I was on hiatus. Last year was fantastic, I renewed my memberships and spend some time looking and thinking about it and eventually took the plunge again. I've seen numerous lady since then and don't plan on stopping any time soon though I may need a break soon. The thrill is waning somewhat.  

This hobby of ours gave me the ability to see a lot of different looking ladies, (younger, older, aa, white etc...) and I've enjoyed. to different degrees, every encounter. I do the research, and I've never had a bad date. Hopefully I can continue sampling for a few more decades or until my equipment stops working. I don't defend my actions, what I do is morally wrong but I've never felt bad about it.  I can look at the hottie, or Milf at the gym and smile to myself, knowing that at some point in the near future I can take care of those urges, with someone that doesn't judge me, at least to my face and to someone that doesn't involve an entanglement.  I have the desire to be "loved" in a sexually charged way for those brief encounters and it is exhilarating.

I'm always in love. Ever since high school half a century ago, I've always been in love with one woman or another. There's always someone special that I yearn for so much that it takes away my appetite for food and makes it hard to get to sleep. That love has not always been unrequited, but in these twilight years I'm pretty sure it's going to be a solo jaunt these last few laps to the grave.

So the woman I'm in love with at any given time, including the woman I'm currently in love with, always turns out to be very, very beautiful. I'm funny that way-- I fall for the most beautiful woman, the Village Venus of any group. At least until someone else turns my head.

And you all know how it is with beautiful people, they are never short on suitors. The woman I currently find myself in love with sleeps with someone else, or sleeps around, and although I can partake of her often, I'll never again be anyone's "only one."

The way I deal with this angst (if that's what angst means--never been sure of the exact definition--but call it angst) is to hobby my ass off. Book a session when I think she's probably doing someone else. It takes the edge off reality. We all need to do that at times.

Now, unless I change the essence of my soul and stop being always in love, I'll always be having two-, three-hour trysts with ladies who are happy to enjoy sex with me as long as I give them a little money. Because if I stayed home alone while the woman I love is off sucking off some other lover, I'd go crazy. I couldn't stand it.

So it turns out I'm stuck in the hobby. Not the worst place to be stuck considering the shape of today's world, to be sure, but stuck.

That's my problem with love and the hobby. I'd really like to hear yours.

Newto10001469 reads

But you need to see a shrink.

You are obviously discussing your "romantic" love for this woman who appears to be unfaithful to you. The problem seems to be that you do not truly love yourself and respect yourself enough, because no matter how beautiful a woman, a self-respecting man shall have to endure the "angst" which you are afflicted with. This Hobby to you is just a panacea which doesn't last very long. Instead of festering and then messing around with escorts, work earnestly on yourself so that the objective of sport fucking becomes just that, i.e, a sport!

This hobby is the most pleasurable way to deal with it. But...it goes around to being the next thing to deal with sometimes.

Absolutely wrong about the "most pleasurable way of dealing with it" because the Hobby when used in this manner is about as depressing as drinking can be when the effect of alcohol wanes! You'd be far better off getting yourself off of those love hormones which run amok in your veins every time when you melt and bend at the knees for that lady who is the subject of your affections!

I've had it, been there and lost. It's said "better to have loved and lost, than to never have loved".

I love every one of the providers I've seen to some small extent. I care about them, their well being and their prosperity. But in the end, ours is a short played sport. We get the best of a woman for short periods of time, without having to deal with the bullshit, as do they. It's simply perfect, I have found happiness and only running out of money or death will end this happiness.

nom_de_plume1333 reads

... because somehow I am able to separate romantic love from non-romantic love... the kind of love one has for family and friends.

My "problem" is that the one I love and am committed to cannot satisfy my needs for intimacy.  Even though she loves me and is committed to me.  So I hobby to fill those needs.  And I love some of the providers I've met.  With one, the love is like that for a very good friend.  And we are good friends.  With others, it's less so, more like love for buddies.  Not very deep.  More an "I really like her" kind of thing.

I think if I were younger, this love thing could be a problem for me.  But maybe I've learned something in the past 30 years.  For one, I've learned how to separate "love" from "infatuation."  I wonder if you know the difference?  ;)



-- Modified on 2/17/2015 10:19:56 PM

But for the past couple of decades my magnetism has lost its punch, I guess. I'm actually happy being family free. Probably there's something embarrassingly old-fashioned and anachronistic involved, like a broken heart or something like that. And...life involved so much more than fucking around. For me at least. I'm sort of a blue collar working man at heart, subject to such afflictions.

89Springer1211 reads

Nothing wrong with love and all that. I wish I still had it.

Have you identified what it is about you or about this woman that makes you tolerate her cheating? Yes, you're cheating, too, but it sounds like you wouldn't be if she wasn't

Yeah. I have this attitude about not being guarded when it comes to matters of the heart, who I like, relationships of any kind. Oh sometimes I find myself pulling back the reins and trying to remain talk in the saddle, but mostly I like to let things go where they want to go as fast or as slow as the moments dictate. I'm not saying that's smart, but it's free. If I get thrown or if it just goes badly, I figure that's what it turned out to be. If it goes well, then it turned out to be that.

I've always had to push for things in my early life, and at some point I guess I just decided that this was one area I didn't want to struggle to control everything.

I know that since becoming involved in the hobby that this is a complete turnaround in that regard. But on the sunny side of the street I'm happiest when I can meet a lot of women and date a few and wind up in bed with even fewer...and then then just let the good times roll. Guiding where it goes sort of implied guiding it toward marriage, and when I was young I really wanted to get married, buy a house in the suburbs, have my two and a half kids and live out life at a steady job. That was considered the good life back then, and I'd always wanted a family, but that's not how life turned out. As those kinds of things seemed more and more not what was meant for me, I started pretending I didn't care and just had a series of long lasting flings. And pretty soon I really didn't care. The whole life story. Oh, except there's another aspect to life that made it great adventure. Except now, today, I'm thinking, maybe I should forget about the fling thing altogether. Got enough when I was young. Certainly don't want to marry up and sire any kids at this point.

Posted By: 89Springer
Nothing wrong with love and all that. I wish I still had it.  
   
 Have you identified what it is about you or about this woman that makes you tolerate her cheating? Yes, you're cheating, too, but it sounds like you wouldn't be if she wasn't.  
   
 

GaGambler1225 reads

but your own life seems to be very fucked up in many respects, maybe you should stop looking down on others that you deem inferior than you, and start learning from them instead?

You know how I have criticized you when you try to be "funny", maybe the reason you have such difficulties with humor is that in truth you are a very unhappy person,  it's hard to be funny when you have as many demons as you seem to have. Try not to take things, or yourself so seriously, you will be a much happier person, and may even learn how to tell a joke someday. lol

Oh,  and to answer your OP. Sorry, but I don't have a problem with love in the hobby, and this is coming from a guy who has been in several LTR's with hookers, both active and retired. It's only a problem if you let it become one, and I don't let it become one, or at least I have done a pretty good job over the last 40 years or so since I saw my first hooker. lighten up a little bit, you might find fucking hookers can be a lot of fun instead of just a bandaid for your fucked up love life.

I am very proud of the conveyor belts, turbines, escalators, carousels, even a grain elevator and a Ferris Wheel that I helped build. If I look down on anyone it would be the wheeler-dealer shysters who exploit the working man and make their living screwing the people who actually make things.

As for the rest of your comments about tucked up love lives, all that is so off topic that I can't even respond to it.

And where you got the idea that comedy and "unhappiness" are mutually exclusive simply baffles me.

GaGambler1021 reads

You often make rather snide comments about "common people" and you are not doubt an academic, and unless your OP is a troll post, it's clear that you aren't having fun in the hobby, instead you are using it as a way to self medicate. Feel free to stop me if I am getting any of your own words wrong here.

As for being off topic, Sorry but it most definitely YOUR topic we are talking about, by your own words you are fucking hookers so you don't sit at home stewing in your own juices because the woman you love is out sucking other cocks. Your words, not mine.

Wittgenstein was a machinist during the war. Spinoza was a lens grinder. Gurdjieff was a rug weaver. Faulkner was a farmer. Mark Twain piloted a steamboat and later went mining for silver. I think working men make up a large share of the academic world.

And no, hobbling is not the apogee of my life, but I'd hardly call it self medicating. I don't need a fix twice a day like some.

So what you observe as snide remarks about The Common Man really amount to recognition of behavior that can be referred to as quite common. Of course there are no dictionaries that I know of that translate the expressions of working men into parlance fitting the hedonistic plutocrats.

You just made his point with this post.  

Your last sentence, btw, is not grammatically correct. Sorry

'tight-ass'...that's good, right? That means I'm young and svelte. Solid assessment.

I'll let you keep the snob moniker. Suits you better.

-- Modified on 2/18/2015 6:50:39 PM

I finally got sick of the lady playing mind games and I told her to move on.  Funny thing, suddenly she couldn't live without me. I never looked back.

Maybe not easy, but it seems to me that you need a clean break.
Best of luck in finding that which your heart truly desires.

In my case, however, I'm thinking it would be better if I moved on and DID NOT seek out someone else. Since a lot of the vicious circle amounts to looking for the next object of fixation. We'll see what happens.

-- Modified on 2/18/2015 5:38:47 PM

It's all relative. It always is. But I have a thought for you. If this woman was 100% faithful to you, would you stop the hobby? You might have a roundabout way to arrive at the hobby, but I think, like your lover, you are attracted to multiple partners. Besides, I think your angst will always be there, because, how can you ever be sure she is 100%?  Either way, you still hobby.  

The thing is, you still get to make love with the woman you love. You still get to hobby. You have the best of both worlds. Many of us Jo's, don't get the best of both worlds. Many of us don't get to make love with the woman we love at all. Nada! Nothing! Zilch! Not even on our birthdays. Could you possibly imagine that? If you want to talk about angst, there it is. But ahhhh, we have the hobby to soothe our souls. The hobby is our savior. When Zero is your real life, your atf becomes a religious experience. Amen

You asked the 64 dollar question. If she was 100% faithful, would you still hobby?

I like to think men are more romantic than we admit. I think a lot of us are on a quest to find "the queen of all my dreams" (apologies to Led Zep).  We imagine that if we found that one woman and we knew she was monogamous, we'd never stray.  

The problem is, at least in my case, there is always something that prevents that lady from being the One. So I keep looking.  Kind of like the Seinfeld Show:  Jerry dated some great chicks, but one had big hands, another was using an anti-fungal cream, etc.  Always a reason to keep looking.

TwoMints970 reads

I think over the years, I always thought that I should get a divorce, though I love my wife, I just don't find her attractive. I almost pulled out of the wedding (almost 20 years ago) at the last minute, but really didn't understand why. So we married, had a child and life went on. Sex came and went, and is rare these days and has no variety at all, its exactly the same most every time. I gained a lot of weight, like many guys, because deep down I didn't really care. It wasn't a rational thing it just happens. A few years back, while on a gambling forum, a guy I followed, talked off an on about losing weight and one day it just clicked. I was sick and tired of being obese. Not to brag, but I do have unusual discipline. I exercised most everyday, often twice a day, have a physical job (not that any of that matters much for weight loss, about 20% of it tops) and cut calories. At my peak I was 300+. I stuck to my calories everyday. Every month a calorie allotment of 1600 a few months, up to 2100 some months. I don't think I went over my calories once in 10 months. I lost the weight oh and quit smoking in the middle of it. (eventually getting down to 178 at my lowest weight. Since then, I've put some back on but I'm still 215ish at 6'4" and cutting off and on, its harder to do again so if you lose weight don't put it back on... Yeah, you end up with loose skin and scars which still bothers me to this day and always will.  I joined a gym somewhere in the middle once I felt comfortable that I wasn't a huge fatass and began lifting weight. (not that I ever really gained a lot of muscle) A side effect of weight loss and excise is testosterone. I was constantly horny, and not getting enough at home. Looking at all the hotties at the gym didn't help... I had consider what outlet I could manage. I came to the conclusion that P4P was the best route, I didn't want to get a divorce for a lot of reasons and trying to hookup seemed implausible. I checked around off and on for months eventually running across P411 which led to TER. I got a burner phone and used a fake email before ever starting. I then set up a solo trip to meet some gambling friends in Vegas and set up a few dates. First one, wasn't anything to write home about, using a condom for the first time in 25 years wasn't all that great. She also, not that I knew before hand, looked a bit like my wife and was a bigger gal similar to my wife but I knew she'd see me and would be a good starting point for references. Over the next 4 or 5 days in Vegas I saw a lady a day and was hooked. I saw a top 30 rated lady, an anal queen (first time since well before my wife) and another nice lady that gave me my first ever CIM. (yes, my sex life was that boring) I dabbled a bit when I got home, but the following year was terrible at work and I didn't have a lot of extra funds for it. So I was on hiatus. Last year was fantastic, I renewed my memberships and spend some time looking and thinking about it and eventually took the plunge again. I've seen numerous lady since then and don't plan on stopping any time soon though I may need a break soon. The thrill is waning somewhat.  

This hobby of ours gave me the ability to see a lot of different looking ladies, (younger, older, aa, white etc...) and I've enjoyed. to different degrees, every encounter. I do the research, and I've never had a bad date. Hopefully I can continue sampling for a few more decades or until my equipment stops working. I don't defend my actions, what I do is morally wrong but I've never felt bad about it.  I can look at the hottie, or Milf at the gym and smile to myself, knowing that at some point in the near future I can take care of those urges, with someone that doesn't judge me, at least to my face and to someone that doesn't involve an entanglement.  I have the desire to be "loved" in a sexually charged way for those brief encounters and it is exhilarating.

I been out of high school as long as I may age when I got out and Love or no love I just need pussey.

Posted By: WickedBrut
I'm always in love. Ever since high school half a century ago, I've always been in love with one woman or another. There's always someone special that I yearn for so much that it takes away my appetite for food and makes it hard to get to sleep. That love has not always been unrequited, but in these twilight years I'm pretty sure it's going to be a solo jaunt these last few laps to the grave.  
   
 So the woman I'm in love with at any given time, including the woman I'm currently in love with, always turns out to be very, very beautiful. I'm funny that way-- I fall for the most beautiful woman, the Village Venus of any group. At least until someone else turns my head.  
   
 And you all know how it is with beautiful people, they are never short on suitors. The woman I currently find myself in love with sleeps with someone else, or sleeps around, and although I can partake of her often, I'll never again be anyone's "only one."  
   
 The way I deal with this angst (if that's what angst means--never been sure of the exact definition--but call it angst) is to hobby my ass off. Book a session when I think she's probably doing someone else. It takes the edge off reality. We all need to do that at times.  
   
 Now, unless I change the essence of my soul and stop being always in love, I'll always be having two-, three-hour trysts with ladies who are happy to enjoy sex with me as long as I give them a little money. Because if I stayed home alone while the woman I love is off sucking off some other lover, I'd go crazy. I couldn't stand it.  
   
 So it turns out I'm stuck in the hobby. Not the worst place to be stuck considering the shape of today's world, to be sure, but stuck.  
   
 That's my problem with love and the hobby. I'd really like to hear yours.

My wife completely lost interest in sex and two years later I started having amazing sex with beautiful young women. The only problems I'm aware of are needing more time, opportunity and resources so I can do this more!

The way I figured this, I'm not a psychiatrist, psychologist or even criminologist but I detect something really wrong here, I agree with the first guy that responded with your post, you need PROFESSIONAL help man, seems to me your honest enough to share your thoughts about what you are experiencing. Just feeling that way is kind of creepy. I don't know if you're really serious about this, announcing your somewhat true emotions to the public, that is not healthy, getting involve with someone or even saddened about the lady's activities knowing that she's sucking somebody's cock or cocks and doing plenty of fucking which is her job and you admit you can't stand it, is like you're having the "hopeless romantic" effect, if you know what that means. get a hold of yourself man. You're going down the path of confusion, stalker, depressed or even a creeepooo, get some help dude, that is IMHO.

 

 

 

Posted By: WickedBrut
I'm always in love. Ever since high school half a century ago, I've always been in love with one woman or another. There's always someone special that I yearn for so much that it takes away my appetite for food and makes it hard to get to sleep. That love has not always been unrequited, but in these twilight years I'm pretty sure it's going to be a solo jaunt these last few laps to the grave.  
   
 So the woman I'm in love with at any given time, including the woman I'm currently in love with, always turns out to be very, very beautiful. I'm funny that way-- I fall for the most beautiful woman, the Village Venus of any group. At least until someone else turns my head.  
   
 And you all know how it is with beautiful people, they are never short on suitors. The woman I currently find myself in love with sleeps with someone else, or sleeps around, and although I can partake of her often, I'll never again be anyone's "only one."  
   
 The way I deal with this angst (if that's what angst means--never been sure of the exact definition--but call it angst) is to hobby my ass off. Book a session when I think she's probably doing someone else. It takes the edge off reality. We all need to do that at times.  
   
 Now, unless I change the essence of my soul and stop being always in love, I'll always be having two-, three-hour trysts with ladies who are happy to enjoy sex with me as long as I give them a little money. Because if I stayed home alone while the woman I love is off sucking off some other lover, I'd go crazy. I couldn't stand it.  
   
 So it turns out I'm stuck in the hobby. Not the worst place to be stuck considering the shape of today's world, to be sure, but stuck.  
   
 That's my problem with love and the hobby. I'd really like to hear yours.

I used to have the Midas touch, but lately, not so much.

In any case, have you tried dark chocolate?  It really does take away the heart ache.  It's just a chemically induced need, nothing particularly mysterious about it really.

There is a theory that some people are addicted to the emotional high we get from a new love/infatuation and that once that wears off, it's on to the next one.   I've known many women who are always looking for that "crazy in love" feeling and as soon as that settles into the more comfortable emotions of a real relationship, they either begin cheating with someone who gives them that feeling (and become serial cheaters, always looking for that "high") or they move on.... and on and on and on.  
I'm sure there are men like this too, but I've never personally met any who've owned up to that.   So your post is very interesting to me, in that aspect.

You don't mention it, but if you have a SO you also "love", then this could be polyamory.  If you don't know anything about polyamory, you may want to look into it.  You'll discover that you are far from alone in your feelings.   I've only known a couple of people who've called themselves this, but their stories were very similar to yours.  

The only difference was that they didn't mention their new loves always being the most beautiful around.   IMO, that lends a slightly different aspect to it and could mean this is more about you always having to have the best trophy to be had rather than infatuation addiction or polyamory... but I could be wrong.  
It does happen.... once in a while! :-P

xox

I'm guessing there are two types of people. Those who fall in love once in awhile, and those who are always in love with someone. I fall into the second group. The times when I have lived, worked, socialized without having one woman on my mind that I'm totally fixed on have been very rare. There are a lot of people, as is obvious from the posts on this thread alone, who are perfectly comfortable with not having their emotions directed at any one person.

As for the "best trophy" aspect of your response, that doesn't really ring true. Beauty is subjective, for sure. And it might be more a matter that once I fix my attention on a woman she becomes the most beautiful woman in my eyes. Or maybe it's a little of both. I am drawn to beauty, not just physical qualities but beauty of all kinds. I'm not talking about the pretty young thing who's gorgeous until she opens her mouth.

Also, it's not love IN the hobby as much as my turning to the hobby when the object of my affection isn't there.

Back in the 30's Lorenz Hart wrote the lyrics "Falling in love with love is falling for make believe," and for as corny as those old musicals were, that song had a bit of truthful insight to it. I do love the rush of falling in love, and, yes, once it wears off I start looking around for someone to elicit that feeling again. When I was younger, that wasn't so much of a problem.

who you are in love with? Is she also a provider? If you know she is sucking many a man's cock...I'm going to guess that she is.So this lady friend...who is sucking and fucking....at your age..that doesn't sound like some young treat you got lucky enough to score....that's a hooker, no? Otherwise why would  you say you lost your magnetism? And use phrases like "in my twilight" and 'my grave"...

More like someone I met when she was cheating on someone else. But that's vague too.

...as I am not in love. Problem with the hobby is I wish I had a lot more money.

My problem is being single while enjoying experiences in this scene. Every now and then a man comes along that I meet as and client and there is something about our connection that is truly exhilarating for me and I start to find myself falling for him..just a little. Its hard to maintain the boundaries between fantasy and reality at times when I meet a man that takes my breathe away and that my body responds to at a very high level. If I had a significant other I'm sure that I would not be having day dreams about my clients and could maintain more control over my heart. So in short, being such a romantic at heart and meeting men who I have a natural "turn on" for can be a very dangerous cocktail of emotional jumbles for me.

SITARA DEVI

I can completely see what you are talking about and I have often thought that I am lucky that I get to play with a parachute, a safety-valve.  I can let go, I can like women, but at the end of the day, I know that I have somebody at home that I would never want to replace.  If I were single, I think it would be much harder to reign-in my feelings.

I'm single and some of my friends here take my breath away when I see them. And if they too are also single, I've found myself doing the "what ifs" more than once.

SIGH...

Steph

GaGambler1232 reads

Now I can completely understand if it's a married guy, but if you find a client you really like, and he likes you, AND he's available, why not?

Speaking as a guy, I have gone down this road several times, and most likely will do it again in the future. Believe it or not, some guys really can deal with dating a hooker without getting all weird on you.

JackDunphy1273 reads

She has been holding out for me!  

But unless she undergoes the same thing that happened to Brad Pitt in "The Curious Case of Benjamin Button" it aint gonna happen. :D

GaGambler938 reads

but fuck I had no idea you were ANCIENT!!! lmao

If this is an example of your current photographers work, next time you better get Aldo. lol

I guess this means we are not going to Appleby's then?

When I went out of town on "tour" there were major problems. The guilt tripping was intense. Many mind games were played. Not good!

I barely "work" so it was enough to completely rattle me to no end. And then there were my reviews-SIGH. I wrote you about it last year. I did care for him a lot.

Steph

-- Modified on 2/18/2015 1:34:13 PM

GaGambler1015 reads

How could you possibly expect me to remember who you were seeing? I think that is why so many women trust me with their personal information, they know I have adult ADD and won't remember what they said five minutes later. lol

GaGambler1042 reads

The answer would be yes.

Now OTOH, if you are asking me if I have ever forgotten a woman that I had only fucked 18 hours before? Sadly, the answer is not only yes, but yes it has happened several times.

Hey, I drink a lot, and not all women are that memorable. lol

I do have to recall a time only a few years ago at the Del Rey, I was taking a pretty hot chica upstairs and asked her what her name was, it kind of surprised me when she got a bit mad and reminded me that we had had sex less than 24 hours before, for the life of me I couldn't remember who the fuck she was, but she knew my name, room number and a few other intimate details that proved she wasn't lying. I guess the happy ending to the story is that she fucked me good enough that night that I remember her to this day, but I will confess I don't have the slightest idea what her name was. lmao

Don't worry Steph. I haven't even met you but I still love you!!!LOL

As you know I'm in the Raleigh NC area and the high here tomorrow is going to be about 19, low tomorrow about 4 degrees. Friday is hideous as well. :-(

Grrrr...

Steph ;-)

-- Modified on 2/18/2015 5:49:04 PM

Poor Baby. It is supposed to hit 83 in Tucson tomorrow and cool off to 81 on Friday. But, mind you we have to suffer lows from   49 to 51. I think I will make it through that by a meeting with an ATF. 8o)>  (I have a beard}

I said it was going to be freaking 4 degrees here Friday morning.

:-)

Steph

Steph, Tell me do you use antifreeze instead of a cherry-flavored lubricant at times like these? LOL I know, I'm being cruel but I can resist about anything but the temptation to be a smart ass.

I can relate.  I've always had the tendency to fall for stunningly beautiful amazingly sexy women.  Being an average guy, there were some very long dry spells between finding such beauty's.  

The problem is, these exceptionally sexy women exude sex appeal and beauty.  Most, if not the vast majority, have trouble keeping their panties on.    They are pursued relentlessly by high quality dudes.    

I think the drama you are detailing is just the trade off that comes with loving ultra sexy beautiful woman.

Great topic.

Vagazzle886 reads

Marry a frumpy, faithful woman and fuck hot women.

Posted By: Red_Mouse
I can relate.  I've always had the tendency to fall for stunningly beautiful amazingly sexy women.  Being an average guy, there were some very long dry spells between finding such beauty's.    
   
 The problem is, these exceptionally sexy women exude sex appeal and beauty.  Most, if not the vast majority, have trouble keeping their panties on.    They are pursued relentlessly by high quality dudes.    
   
 I think the drama you are detailing is just the trade off that comes with loving ultra sexy beautiful woman.  
   
 Great topic.

Canitbe824 reads

Hmmmm I am actually not sure I know how to to love  
People always talk about that special feeling, I can not say I have ever felt that.
I do enjoy the company of some woman more then others and of course I am horny all the time
I basically stay married because I can not afford to hobby all the time lol

(1)  I absolutely hate lying to my wife; (2)  unlike many of the married guys, I cannot say that I don't get any (I do, just not enough) and I can't say that I find my wife unattractive, in fact, it is quite the opposite, I find her very sexy.    However, let's say that in an alternate universe, I fall in love with someone who I found wildly attractive, that she felt the same way about me, and let's also say that she provided me with all the physical attention I wanted.   I don't like the fact that I cannot honestly say "yeah, I would be faithful."  While I don't think monogamy is natural, I find the feeling that I don't know whether I could be faithful a bit unsettling.   Just to clarify, I believe I can do anything I set my mind to, so yes, I could stop doing this, the question is how grumpy would I be and I think the answer is very grumpy.  I also find the finality of saying, ok, this is the last woman I will enjoy time with to be depressing as hell;  (3) since finding TER and P411, this is not as big of a concern, but it remains, and that is the question about whether I am in some way participating in or enabling something that hurts the other party, whether she knows it or not.   As for (4), drumroll please, despite (1) through (3), my final problem is that I don't get to hobby enough :)

So there you go, those are the little issues always spinning in my head about this hobby.  As for you, WB, it seems to me that you given up on finding someone to be their  "only one," whatever that means.   It is very safe to just pine for someone you know you will never fully have, doubly so if we are talking about someone who requires an envelope to see you.   Not a criticism, just giving you my POV.

HidingBehindMyAlias1203 reads

If I book a two hour session with a provider, the opportunity to have a conversation is there, and getting to know a provider on a more personal level can certainly lead me to have more of a feeling of a connection.  In the end I always remind myself that this woman would most likely never talk to me in real life, and therefore the feelings are contrived in that if it weren't for the money, I wouldn't get the time of day.

Booking a shorter session of just an hour, let's me have just enough time for the sex, with just very casual short talks that do not get too deep, and therefore I do not get any sense of attachment with a provider other than the physical type.

If I feel like I am falling in love with a beautiful provider, I remind myself that I just paid her to be nice to me, and that I am actually falling in lust with her beautiful body and seductive ways.

I do not think that anything is wrong with the way you are feeling.  I believe you have just forgotten to play by the unwritten rules of P4P.  If you truly desire love and companionship, then I can see no other option than meeting a nice civie woman who shares a lot of the interests you may have.  

Of course, the fact that I am here myself, shows that I do not have the answers.  Good luck to you Brut.  I hope you find what you are looking for.

It was a great lesson, and even today I shake my head and think "there but for the grace....." when I'm in a club and see all of the RIL's there fawning over their ATF's. Those dancers don't give a rat's ass about them. I have too much to lose  if I let myself go there, so I don't.

JackDunphy1041 reads

Is it just frame of mind? I don't go into a session pining for the girl and when I think of her after, its because I had an awesome time or I was working on something for her on a personal level.

I guess I just completely divorced myself of the notion from the git go. There was also the issue of me not being able to deal with my girl fking strangers, or anybody at all other than me, so I knew I could never date a hooker, although I had a few opportunities over the years.

Maybe one of the reasons I use so many "business" analogies here is because that is how I view it. Strictly. It is a business transaction, not a personal one. Sure, sex is unlike any other business but I don't get emotionally involved when I go for a civie massage and that can be very personal as well.  

Does that make the sex any less fun? Hell no. I love the slutiness of the business, for lack of a better word. When the girl opens the door, I know in 10-15 minutes I will be fking her and that is the turn on for me, not the emotional factor.

WB sounds like a mess, in the sense he just doesn't sound happy. Not ripping him or singling him out here as there are many just like him.

But I just think it is how you approach this game from day one as to whether or not it is more likely to bite you in the ass in terms of feelings. I simply don't allow it. Never did.

And if I ever did for one fleeting second, that would be the indicator to me to ice that girl and see someone else.  

I actually feel bad for some of these dudes that cant separate the fantasy/sex from the relationship/emotions. They are complicating their lives so much and turning something that can be so positive into a downer.  

And paying big money to do it. Ugh...

GaGambler1011 reads

AND WB seems to have an affliction that is common among academics, He thinks he is superior to the average John, or anyone in what he perceives as a lower station in life, and it no doubt bothers the fuck out of him to find out that he really is no better than anyone else.

If he would just learn to lighten the fuck up and enjoy life, he undoubtedly would be a much happier and less angst ridden person.

so I think the "lighten up" train has already left the station. LOL

That's not to say he cant make some changes in how he views p4p or life, but if he is really falling in love with every girl, there is a sickness there of some sort that needs to be addressed professionally, I do believe.  

At the least, it is a very unhealthy and self destructive habit. Being on a high horse as you claim he is, only makes matters worse

Vagazzle1032 reads

I was having this exact conversation last night with a fellow provider and friend.  It's frustrating for everyone involved when a man meets an escort, falls in love, starts a relationship with her (thinking that he can deal with her being an escort), but he keeps making little rude digs (or angry outbursts) at her when she goes to work.  

Then she starts to feel bad and backs up on working to spend more time with him, but then her finances start to suffer.  Of course he doesn't care about her financial security or offer to support her.  

Then comes resentment and the inevitable break up.

:0

JackDunphy1061 reads

Some rule out dating at all when involved in their p4p years, some try to and fall, some play it by ear, some have SO that they tell and some have SO that they DONT tell. LOL

It is the rare guy that can deal with the gal fking other dudes. Some guys cant even have their girls work in strip clubs even when that is where they met the girl!

The green monster is real indeed. So much more pressure on a relationship with a p4p girl than a civie girl imo.

I am honest with myself about it, so maybe it needs to start there with some of these dudes. I couldn't handle it. I knew that on day one. So I don't put myself in that situation.

You are, how shall I say, very 'wordy' this evening Jack. Got alot on your mind huh...do tell? Lol

I'm a great listener :)

xx kisses

JackDunphy1287 reads

I guess that other playground wasnt all that it was cracked up to be? You figured that all out in less than one day so I'll give credit where credit is due.

And you are right. I am being too wordy so I'll back down. Looks like you and WB are working out his hooker/love issues bc.

What could possibly go wrong there? LOL

Are you going to miss me or something? Don't answer that, I already know the answer ;)

But you do seem rather focused on my impending departure lol. Are you crushin'on me or something? You boys are far too confusing for me lol.

Anyhoo, yes, you'd be amazed at what goes on behind the scenes in my lil neck of the world here lol.  

Is that why you wanted to be a part of it too?    Curious huh....lol

 
xx kisses xx (double just for you)

Btw...you know what you have to do to make that happen. Lemme know if you change your mind then. I don't bite :)

 

Posted By: JackDunphy
I guess that other playground wasnt all that it was cracked up to be? You figured that all out in less than one day so I'll give credit where credit is due.  
   
 And you are right. I am being too wordy so I'll back down. Looks like you and WB are working out his hooker/love issues bc.  
   
 What could possibly go wrong there? LOL
-- Modified on 2/18/2015 11:15:24 PM

JackDunphy1024 reads

Nice name change. You lead the majors in that category. LOL

I thought you liked keeping it real? 3 name changes in 10 days is a bit much, don't ya think? LOL

Could not agree more. I too view this as a business, I do what I am contracted for and then my life is mine. Don't bug me, just email for your next appointment.  

What amazes me is the lack of "something"....have not found the right term, that some guys who go into this have such blinders on. I had one guy who is incredibly unattractive, started to smell (BO), yeah tricks degrade with familiarity and he wanted to date me as in no more paying because he developed feelings. The guy is gross, old and completely out of shape. I was more irritated that he thought there was a snowballs chance in hell I would touch him without the money than losing business.  

Does he not have a mirror, does he not get that the ONLY reason I came within an arms length of him was because he was paying me to? Yep I actually told him that because there was no subtle way to get it into his head that I was not about to date his fat wrinkly ass.

If you are paying someone to do something, they are there because of the money. If I do a great job at the GF thing, hey, not my problem a guy can't get his together. That is on him. I am there to make money and for no other reason.

A guy is there to fuck and then leave, not to moon over a hooker he wants to date...

Nice hearing form you. Wondered where you been. I hope this cold weather has still enabled you to keep that athletic bod? I am sure it has.  

Yes we are in clear agreement. Blurring the lines is always problematic, at least for me. I really do pay hookers so they leave, not so they stay.

That doesn't mean I don't have tons of fun with girls I am friendly with off the clock as I do, but part of that, from their end, is that they know I am not looking for a GF in p4p and thus I pose no threat, for lack of a better word, in that particular area for them.

They know I don't read into OTC anything more than it is. Just two people hanging out and shooting the shit because we didn't want to go home and watch TV, lol.

Nice seeing you back.

I needed to get away for a bit so I don't become a homicidal trick killer...lol. This board can make a hooker, this hooker want to slice and dice so stepping away keeps me out of prison, yeah I am joking, sort of.  

On my tangent I am floored at the guts it takes for some of the nastiest looking men to think a woman so far removed from their league would consider dating them, unless of course there was a huge monetary incentive. Think that wizened up octogenarian Hefner and his 23 year old bimbos, yeah they want to suck that stale mothball smelling ball sack for free....NOT. That is why men earn more on the dollar than women so they can pay for the pussy they really want.  

Got myself a fabulous coach so the bod is in fine shape thanks.

People are wired differently - not to mention they are at different points in their life, are looking for different things, have different levels of emotional maturity.
But I think it's the fundamentally different wiring that is the main thing, and what actually makes life so interesting.
Also, to feel bonding emotions surrounding sex is quite natural - though it's certainly stronger for some.
We have to use our intellect to override that in this biz.
Some people are better equipped to do this.
And some guys don't want to even try, because those "feelings" are a big part of the "high" they get from this - it's not just about good orgasms.
Whatever floats their boat, it's not so much the feeling that is wrong, it's letting that feeling override the intellect and drive one's actions.
Me?  Fuck, I'm somewhere in the middle.
I'm a single guy and I love women, and certainly have enjoyed more than just the sex with these ladies, but also getting to know some of them just a little bit too.
Life is good.

It's all I ever think about. It's the ultimate drug: the love of a beautiful woman.

I spend all my money on seeing beautiful providers

I spend lots of time and effort trying to date civilians....

But at the same time the beautiful women I pine for are all chasing after beautiful men. Tall handsome men that are macho and confident.

Such is life.

GaGambler1033 reads

I have had truly beautiful women fall in love with me, and I do own a mirror and I KNOW I am not all that, but like many of the hookers here who aren't what most would consider "beautiful" I am comfortable in my own skin.

One other thing I have found is that a beautiful woman is no more likely to cheat than a homely woman. ALL women have lots of opportunity to cheat if they so choose, just because most of us are shallow doesn't mean that just because a woman is HOT that she is going to be looking for someone better looking or richer that the guy she is with. I think that is just your own insecurity coming to the surface.

physical appearance has nothing to do with depth of character, for men or women!

Even that beautiful single woman may not be looking for someone better than you... she simply has her guard up as she has heard every fatuous line in the book; she is a skeptic. As you say, it is easier for a guy to blame her than to face his own insecurities.

GaGambler1029 reads

Some women are just so ravishingly beautiful that the guys with no confidence is afraid to approach her.

and are trying to fill that emptiness inside of yourself with an outside source.

Learn to love yourself. Adjust your mindset & the way you speak. If you say you will always be alone, you will always be alone. It's a self fulfilling prophecy.

Only you can fill that emptiness. Not romantic love or sex or drugs or money or religion, ect.

You are NOT stuck in the hobby. You are stuck in a negative mindset & unrealistic expections of love, society & our true human nature.

If you really love this woman, can partake in her whenever you want & are considered one of her lovers or friends, what is the downside?  Simply because you are not monogamous? You can't stand to share her? Love is an unlimited source. Sex is an unlimited source. She isn't going to run out of either being with other men, but she will end up being pushed away if you are too negative or put too much focus on your lack of love.

Just relax, focus on the time you DO have with her, appreciate that & maybe get another "real" hobby that is fulfilling on a more personal level to keep yourself busy when you are not with the woman you love or indulging in this wonderful hobby.

Only YOU can make YOU happy.

Best of luck to you...

xoxo Helen

Both release wonderful chemicals and the body really digs it.  I really do like your line that love is an unlimited resource, it is obvious, perhaps so obvious that we don't think about it, but the limits on love and our capacity for it are self-imposed.

Agree 100%. Good response.

Although I also think WB is , if not 70's, late 60's and his self esteem train has permanently left the station. So, while the advice is solid, it's wasted, because that dog ain't learnin' new tricks

to experience a sexual, spiritual and Self healing and awakening and learn to tap into that unlimited source of love/self divinity we all have inside of us.

xoxo Helen

go there. 'They'll' pounce lol  

xx kisses

...even when I share the same sentiment as a few others here...my lips are sealed my friend. Feel free to PM me if you'd like to know :)

Although there were many helpful and sincere responses, I've reached no conclusion as to a course of action yet. Apparently those who are easily at peace with not constantly being in love with someone view the situation as foolishness. Just like when somebody asks me what is my favorite dessert or favorite cocktail, I rattle off half a dozen items that I like, but have no concept of having a favorite, and I'd think that kind of question is foolish. But I know that some people have a favorite cocktail or a favorite dessert, although their favorite might change from month to month.

Being always in love with someone, though whom that is might change over the course of time, probably causes a lot more yearning than people who go long periods of time without being in love with anyone suffer. Whichever type you are, it's hard to imagine what it must be like for the other type, or to even seriously consider their way of looking at the world.

When you reach a stage where you know you don't want marriage or any kind of long-term pair bond--and age is not the most important factor in that, let alone the only factor--those who have always had that special someone in their mind obviously have a more difficult time than those of the other mindset.

It's been very useful hearing the responses from both sets. Maybe the answer is to focus attention on something bigger, more consuming. That can be a different kind of hell, but more productive in the usual 21st Century sense of the word. But like I said, I haven't reached any conclusion. I'll have to think about it some more. Furrow out some thinking time for myself.

"Johnny come lately, the new kid in town
Will she still love you when you're not around?"

How special we all are only to be outdone (maybe for some to come undone?) by the next fad, the next trend, the next desire as time passes by (even long term becomes short term). “They will never forget you 'til somebody new comes along.” (If that matters?)

Don’t worry, live the moment—that’s all you've got. And, who cares if you can't make up your mind towards your own likes, dislikes and desires, as well as trying to make sense of the advice posted here; just own the decision or non-decision (In the end, time will eventually make it for you and you won’t have a choice.) So make the best of your situation; what more can one ask for? Peace

Ah, there's a new generation in town. Would've slouched off into oblivion last December 31st if I hadn't misplaced my scythe.

Hey, I’m going to switch gears here, and it’s sort of a rediscovery for me to what I’ve been missing or overlooked; that is, if you can have intense feeling towards the opposite, than that may be just as good as money in the bank or money well spent, even on a provider. Better to feel sex plus emotion than just sex without any affection towards the other. From the provider’s perspective, it’s better to feel emotion and love towards a client than just as strictly business. I mean, these are human traits that create a heightened sense of existence making living all the more worthwhile. (Now I don’t mean for everyone, every time; I mean that when it happens it’s better than anything less, every time.) It’s like the power of sex, plus romance, plus love, which all add up to so much more than each by itself. (If anybody wants it to be anything different that’s okay too, boundaries are necessary to protect one’s own interests and other commitments. My point here is to seek what gives human interactions more meaning and also keeping it in perspective at the same time.) In essence; better to feel alive inside than to feel dead inside.

As far as myself, I have been increasingly callous towards the opposite, full of distrust as see selfishness written all over their faces. Not cool, not cool, I know, as I’m just as guilty in my own self-centered way (if there is an even trade-off). However, when it becomes a shared experience, where the above caustic is thrown he wind, and a girlfriend or provider brings out this emotion of love through companionship or sex; all the better. In my own awareness, I know I own that emotion and it is not necessarily the same for her, even when we part ways and we never see each other again. As far as the girlfriend or provider, if she can walk away having good thoughts not only knowing that she got something out of it or made some money, but also made a boyfriend or a client feel happy about being with her; hopefully, that will add and/or enhance her own self-worth. She is so much more than just a sexual companion or a body collecting money to pay her bills.  

 
Just a thought that needed to resurface to seek understanding and not a solution, by any means, to others’ choices many times over. Anyway, keep that scythe on the sidelines; you have so much more living ahead of you

I mean, everyone tries to make the best of whatever life they have, right? And everyone's experience of the universe is whatever they experience. So the more emotionally layered your experience, the more complex and exciting the universe you get to live in becomes. Uh-huh, I agree with you.

And this world of P4P is all about fantasy. People with rich emotional lives meet up to play make believe for an hour or two at a time, and pretend afterwards that they really don't care about each other at all. But the moments together are what they are.

What's odd is the guys who most put down experience as just a business deal are usually the same guys who hope to retain the memory of their escapes for pleasant thoughts while slumbering on their death bed. But if they can't fully experience the moment now, what makes them think they'll fully experience their deaths?

Speaking of memory...I still wish I knew where the hell I put that fucking scythe!  


-- Modified on 2/20/2015 6:53:51 AM

Thank you for acknowledge that a heighten experience has its merit. I had a lot of fun and enjoyed reading your thread and your ideas as well as some of the other OPs' here, including the stories, philosophies, light-hearted spats now and then and the occasional joksters. On the flip side, I need a good laugh, that is, if and when it ends, may it end as good as good as it can get

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