yes, before i began in the business...i tip-toed into the the world of sugar dads. the issue was, i wasn't looking in the right places, despite meeting men who were real estate brokers, entertainment producers, etc. also i admit, 6 years ago, i didn't have the breast enhancements that i have now nor dental work either. so...even though i got lots of free dinners, it wasn't paying the bills. i myself ended up (at the advice of a friend) began doing the sex work thing. at first i thought i didn't uite believe that guys on the internet would actually want to pay...but i was making steady money from like February thru august, not paying a dime for advertising. once i got serious about it, i started paying for ads. that was 6 years ago.
even now, i have clients who offer me the sugar babe thing, but i'm quite independent. however, my situation is changing, and i may need to temporarily take on 1 of the offers, simply because business in my local town has dried up. it'd be ok if i worked full time on the side, but when trying to do it alone...it's not enough.As a provider, I'm just curious. I've heard now from 2 different female friends (1 white, 1 middle eastern...if it makes any difference), how they met these men in bars who gave them money ($100-200), free hotel nights, and buy all their drinks...but yet don't receive any sex in return.
these sound like men they just met who are middle-aged 40s/50s. But what gets me is, this is occurring in my local area. However, I and other women i've spoken to...are seeing it hard to find decent paying clients in this town. i'm just wondering if this is like the new trend to where things are now: where a guy gets to spend time at will with someone, but not get anything out of it but arm candy for show.
I'm not jealous of what they've told me, but how is it that I'm dealing with guys who haggle and bargain with my rates (again, only in Denver...i don't have that issue when i tour), when they're actually getting something out of it. Yet, I'm hearing these stories of moochers who are doing nothing, getting paid. What's wrong with that picture?
Plus, they are face to face with your friends. They have had a chance to build a connection and build up to that moment of "thanks for being nice to me, you made my day. Here's something nice for you too" moment of a gift. The internet has made things easier in some ways, harder in others.
The guys are being sweet to them in hopes that one day, the girl could show them affection. But when you're a provider, the guys spend on what they find to be valuable for their money now. So you're talking about two totally different things.
i just don't get it though. i bet those same guys would balk at the idea of paying someone for sex...yet they rather pay people who have told me they would not (and have told them) have sex with them.
of course, assuming my friends are telling me the truth (actually they both told me the guys did foreplay or massage activities on them, but only once).
I'm not trying to be mean but if you're not satisfied with your provider business in your city, change something! You can't change looks but you can change rates, services, marketing, even change cities. So who cares what your civie friends recieve from men. Or what the men do or don't recieve from them. All you can control is what you do.
i didn't find your post mean (thank god).
i do know i need to change cities. that i know. thats why i'm only home maybe 10 days each month. i've changed everything you've mentioned, but nothing works in this town. doesn't matter if i charged $5 or $500...i cant make any money in this town. things only ever get better when i LEAVE lol.
The common denominator needs adjusting. Don't think that city, or those men, or your "friends" are the issue. Again, just my observation. Why is this a GD topic anyways? Dammit I'm confused now.
It really is the city Hun. Trust me, how is it that I can visit DC and have minimum 2 clients a day, yet here struggle to see 2 clients per week? On my last tour, I had atleast 1 client in every state I visited (a total of 4). In Pittsburg, I stopped over for overnight layover and came across a new client in 10 minutes. Didn't complain about my rate, and even tipped....not like the ones in Denver who cancel, no show, or haggle over every little thing.
I fail to understand why some people don't believe that some things aren't in a persons control. I'm a minority woman trying to operate out of a fairly small western town well Over 500 miles from the nearest major city even worth going to.
When I do everything from change photos to pay for new ads, to changing wording, etc...and the phone fails to ring on a Sunday, new clients who book cancel the day of, yet...when a text does come thru it's: "I'm curious to try this, but I have to sneak out when my wife is asleep", followed by, "I don't have your 1 hour rate, does massage include fucking?"...and then regulars who say stuff like. "I've paid less before", or even, "$300 for 2 hours isn't that great of a deal"...you best believe it's got something to do with the mentality of the city.
If it looks like I'm running from this problem, hell yeah I'm running. Why stay here and struggle, when I can command my rates and get clients who actually show up, pay my rate, and have a mix of local and business clients to stand by? I have non of that here. Or it's very sparingly. And I doubt it's anything to do with me, but more of external factors beyond my control.
Since I can't see any ads for you, I don't know what to say. But if you put "NO NEGOTIATIONS!" Or anything rude about haggling, time minimums, Q&As that complain about what guys who contact you do, they will most likely mess with you and email for discounts, etc. but never book.
I've a also noticed a difference between even $50 more per hour. Less inquiries, but I almost never get someone looking for a deal. The less expensive I've been, the more people who want deals.
I also state that I don't offer extensions on dates, so please schedule the time you truly need. It's all in the wording, and I try to be respectful and uplifting in my wording on ads & my site, as though I haven't judged them before they even contacted me. But in return, I get the result I want.
Trial & error throughout the past year and 1/2. It's worked well.
And backpage, I just stay away because it's notorious for hagglers & time wasters. It's a site where you get low rates anyway, so lowballers will be present. Sites where the guy is held accountable for membership is a different story.
-- Modified on 11/3/2014 9:16:17 AM
Big problem here is NOT listening! I've only responded to her posts, but based my responses to her also on my observations. My observations have been just off past TER posts, on the GD board and her local board, and even my (DC) board. Tons of reputable folks have given her advice and guidance, and she CHOOSES to have a pity party about everything. The fact that she's broke and can't figure out how to survive and then posts a bad threAD about how her non-provider friends can get cash for nothing, and she can't, I mean c'mon!?!
Basics to hooker-ing... I was getting cash for no ass a LONG time ago- i.e. since I realized I had tits and a vagina!!! And when I am not selling my ass for cash, I can still find a way to get money for almost nothing. It's not that hard. I just find it ridiculous that hoes and random sluts in her area, Denver, are making money and she can't. They obviously are doing something right. If she can't figure it out, and wants to keep this whiny, depressing persona on TER and thinks it won't affect her business, well, we'll see.
Courtney you'll be around, I'll probably be around, and this one, ehhhhh...
Good luck to all.
you sound ratchet as hell. no one said i can't get what i want. and besides, why are you making such a point about it anyway? you sound like some old groupie ho anyway. and FYI, i've been getting paid for my game since i was 19 and guys helped but my in apartments (not hotels) on south beach to help me get thru my freshmen year of college. granted, i didn't have to to just sit and look cute...but hey i'm happy to work (or play lol) for my money. it's done me well 6 years strong.
you on the other hand, need stomped out. i hate big mouth hoes who have a vendetta against someone who just happens to be dealing with a local issue. and yes, i've paid attention to the threads on d.c. plus what makes you think other girls in my area are doing so much better than me? have you talked to all of them? no ho. so shut your fucking face bitch. because if you ever took the time to see whats going on...i'm one of the longest running advertisers, versus the ones who pop up 1 week, and are history 3 months later.
so SHUTUP. i don't care to hear from you no mas.
Basics to hooker-ing... I was getting cash for no ass a LONG time ago- i.e. since I realized I had tits and a vagina!!! And when I am not selling my ass for cash, I can still find a way to get money for almost nothing. It's not that hard. I just find it ridiculous that hoes and random sluts in her area, Denver, are making money and she can't. They obviously are doing something right. If she can't figure it out, and wants to keep this whiny, depressing persona on TER and thinks it won't affect her business, well, we'll see.
Courtney you'll be around, I'll probably be around, and this one, ehhhhh...
Good luck to all.
Ads, (location & content,) website, reviews, (reviews do help - a lot,) rate structures, preferred demographics, pictures, etc etc.
It's impossible to give localized information vs info on other ladies you're talking about. It's like going to war not knowing who the enemy is. So I simply stated how I have noticed elimination of deal seekers.
One thing that has never helped me is putting that I'm slow on local or general board discussions. Instead, I budget & pay ads/bills first, then expenses, then fun. (In most cases,) and I don't have to scramble when I start running low.
I've gone two to three weeks with one client request per week, without being afraid because I knew to be prepared. So I had no need to act in desperation, nor any need to give discounts. (This is more recent as I learned that this business can be feast or famine)
Now what I do know is when I'm not paying for ads, I become slow. Which turns out to be because I'm not advertising.
I take advantage of time off, grow out my leg arm and twat, then get waxed lol.
-- Modified on 11/3/2014 2:30:12 PM
good point you made. now you say you add $50 to make a difference, what would the starting point have been? 200 to 250? 300 to 350, or even 150 to 200?
and yes, i know back-page attracts those types. but to be honest, that seems to be the 3rd best site to get my business from...around here. however, a client told me about another woman he sees also advertising on BP...that she is so fed up with it, and wants to start advertising on other sites. i told him that it isn't just BP though, it's the town. changing sites will only make one more accessible to the plethora of time-wasters in this town. it's just the type of market Denver has become. something changed awhile ago that has made this place a time-waster's paradise. me-thinks marijuana legalization. that's about when things started going downhill.
i see how the men in this town are. they work all day, come home, plop in front of the TV and smoke weed. then they get bored and high, and want to call an escort.
Girls talk about the slow seasons, best advertising secrets, or results from things they've done...
$50 at any rate structure helps. When I started, I did $60 QV's to $180 hours. Bumped up to $200, almost all my $180 guys backed off. $250, even different clientele - all but a few dropped off. $300 I ended up being busier than at $250 (this was all in North Carolina, which has different rate structures all together,) because I bumped into the higher end category. Then in Chicago, I've been at $350 & $400. I had great clients at both rates, but had to turn a lot away at $350. Now at $400 I have many less, but the inquiries vs cancellations or last minute requests have dropped significantly. It's a perfect place for me. Love the clients, love the emails, love longer dates, which are encouraged in my rate structure. I don't need as many clients because I get more at once.
But I do have reviews to back up the rates, and fit in a couple different markets, such as booty, some meat, but still HWP thin, so that helps too.
Knowing where you are at in the market - huge help. The more accurate you are, and proud to be there, the better as well.
I have talked with some local providers, but I just don't find it does me any good. One of my male friends happens to know a drag queen, and he'd always tell me she made bank, and how she went and made $800 off 1 client. Despite all of this, he drives her around to her appointments, so I don't know if she has a car or not.
But, I do have a client who either sees or befriends other working females, and he has told me of 2 stories where both were struggling to the point of leaving the business all together. It's ironic though.
The slow season in Denver has become a permanent thing, for me. It's sad because I used to have 2 reliable regulars who'd give me rent money each session, but 1 moved, the other stopped seeing me (albeit, I think he needed me during a certain time in his life when his business was very demanding) all together. The other regulars either come too infrequently, or only want to pay $120 for an hour. 1 would call me 5-10 times in a row until I pocked up, but he refused to pay any more. In my mind, he's fired. I just don't have time for that.
I would like to increase my rate, but I don't know if it'll work here. By, I have nothing to lose though. I personally want to because I'm not seeing enough people at $200 and less, I may need to bump it to $300. However, from experience, it used to be $160-180 was the sweet spot for over 2 years. Nowadays, I may see 1 or 2 if I'm lucky...clients a month at that price . It's more like, "what rate can you give a senior citizen?" Or, would you be willing to do full service 1 hour for $100?
$50 at any rate structure helps. When I started, I did $60 QV's to $180 hours. Bumped up to $200, almost all my $180 guys backed off. $250, even different clientele - all but a few dropped off. $300 I ended up being busier than at $250 (this was all in North Carolina, which has different rate structures all together,) because I bumped into the higher end category. Then in Chicago, I've been at $350 & $400. I had great clients at both rates, but had to turn a lot away at $350. Now at $400 I have many less, but the inquiries vs cancellations or last minute requests have dropped significantly. It's a perfect place for me. Love the clients, love the emails, love longer dates, which are encouraged in my rate structure. I don't need as many clients because I get more at once.
But I do have reviews to back up the rates, and fit in a couple different markets, such as booty, some meat, but still HWP thin, so that helps too.
Knowing where you are at in the market - huge help. The more accurate you are, and proud to be there, the better as well.
It's the rates that attract a lot more discount seekers, not just the location. Based on my own experience, and hearing other ladies talk about it. I don't really know why tho.
-- Modified on 11/4/2014 12:37:24 PM
Some guys will pay a lady just to come in the room to talk to her. That is what a provider told me about some guys she has seen. I think he was a pimp or someone who was on the fence about seeing the provider. She was not a model type.
Could just be luck. Recently I met a man who just wanted to cuddle in bed he told me he was happy without sex. Everyone is different. I have not had the luxury of a paid room yet I just figure I have not met the right guy yet. Hopefully it does not discourage you with negotiations if he can meet your request there is always someone who will value your time without hassle.
but they sure hope for it. And in the extremely unlikely event, in that situation, that sex happens, they get to tell themselves the fiction that it was because the girls wanted them.
and with that said, i eventually warn my friends of entering into these kind of contracts. I hate hearing stuff like this anyway, because even the guy consents to giving the money, it does no benefit to either person. not to mention, they get to reap the benefits of being an escort, yet have no desire to become one nor understand what it's really about. it kinda annoys me lol. they just want a free ride.
i must also mention, the 2 friends who told me about these guys...are known for being moochers of their friends (at times, me...in which case i had to clearly let them know, we could still be friends, but i'm not the one). and they don't truly have their shit together either. i'm kinda thinking girls who meet these kind of guys have some kind of user-personality. Rather than being strong and independent, they rather play the damsel in distress game.
They're under the radar, you're not. Don't be mad at different business models. Just learn from them, yeah?
trust me, i have nothing to learn from them. if anything i learn what not to do. both of these chicks...1 lives hotel to hotel or couch to couch. the other lives in her parent's house. i on the other hand, actually care about the men who pay me...and have my own vehicle in my name and a place to live...also in my name.
again, i'm not concerned about what they are getting. i'm just like...what makes these guys different from our clients. and even people who call our ads?
These girls are apparently getting paid to sit at the bar, so obviously they ARE doing something right.
You could learn how to spot a generous guy, you could learn how to tweak communication to encourage longer dates, you could learn how to move on from the no's cause there's always gonna be a yes, you could learn to evaluate what kind of guy finds you attractive... Shoot you could learn how to go out and just have fun once in a while.
The issue with those guys is they can quickly evolve into clinger types. And for my friends, they become dependent on the life support. When the guys realize my friends are playing them, they'll quickly cut off that life support and leave them high and dry. My friends are actually the ones more at risk, not the rich man they tout about. I'm not an advocate of these type of situations unless it's made clear the conditions.
As I mentioned, the 2 girls I mentioned are the needy types anyway (which is why I tend to keep a barge pole distance from them, and one, I actually decided to severe ties with her this past weekend. I can't stand a drunk white woman). But again, it's NOT THEM I'm worried about. I just want to know whether these same guys would invest money into a real hooker, instead of paying these old side chick hoes. Something tells me the answer is "maybe", but maybe not.
they get to tell themselves they're not "whores"
But probably in the back of the guys mind they are thinking there might be a chance that we can hook-up.
To the OP how do you know your friends are even telling you the truth?
In civie world guys will spend money wining/dining and dates with the hopes he gets something out of the deal besides just having arm candy.In this business guys know what they want and they seek out the lady they are interested in pay their money and have a good time.
At least with the providers he pays a certain amount and has fun with civie lady he can spend and arm and leg and keep getting the excuse "I am not ready to do that with you yet"or some other variable of basically No.
And when and if the "date" leads to her incall, maybe not even the first night at one or two bills, he'll have the feeling that he won her, that he picked up a really hot woman in a bar.
To the OP how do you know your friends are even telling you the truth?
In civie world guys will spend money wining/dining and dates with the hopes he gets something out of the deal besides just having arm candy.In this business guys know what they want and they seek out the lady they are interested in pay their money and have a good time.
At least with the providers he pays a certain amount and has fun with civie lady he can spend and arm and leg and keep getting the excuse "I am not ready to do that with you yet"or some other variable of basically No.
They aren't "doing nothing."
I guarantee they're tickled, think he's fabulous, and make sure he knows it.
And those amounts are peanuts compared to hiring an escort for those drinks, etc.
Just an observation. It's not something someone can show you, it's just something that you instincitvely do. And if you do it well, you won't have to put out to get back. There are no secrets to it. But it all ebbs and flows. Real hustlers don't complain when their hustle is slow, they just keep at. It's called "stayin on the grind".
Civvie bitches lie everyday. But if you believe their "he just gave it to me, I didn't have to do annnnnyyyyything" story, then I have a bridge to sell you... Or however that saying goes. LMAO!
Maybe some guys just like to fuck with a girl's head more than with her ass. Maybe they're closet homosexuals who just want to parade some straight strange in front of the breeders they work with. Maybe they are just having a lonely night and in the mood for something more exciting than being the morose drunk drinking alone in the corner booth. Maybe they have something to say to the world but have decided, for now, to dump on some rented bimbo. There are all kinds of flics could be made out of that. Why compare what goes down with you to what's going on in the bars?
connection:
)
soul and heart.. eyes to yes heart to heart ..
Lips to lips ....
Man can t be with no woman ..
and not just because of he does not have pussy ..
We crave love .. we can get dirty as we can in love .. but we are all vulnerable humans ..
I love be loved and return ...
Who remembers War and Peace?
Natasha Rostova?
All meaning of her life was LOVE
Sex is one shining edge of diamond of male and female lust for each other
Kiss you
Lovers
and ONLY lovers kinky open lusty hungry for a woman :
Right after my Divorce I was lonely and I didn't like eating alone. I wasn't ready to start dating again so I would contact a provider to go out for dinner. I just wanted someone to talk to and pay attention to me with out any expectations after. I didn't want sex, just the interaction and attention. I think it depends on the mindset of the guy and what's going on in their life.
I use to meet a client in Vegas, an Asian man, he was in poor health, in his mid 60's. His wife passed away about 5 years ago.But he loved to go to Vegas and gamble. When it became late we would go to the bar and I would search for a girl for him to just talk to and flirt with. Because of his illness he was harmless. But he love to just talk and would give 500 for about ninety minutes of just talking. He'd buy the drinks and I would be like his chaperone. Almost like that movie "Rain Man"...It was fun and some of the ladies we met were all great. Now I just found out last week that he's serverly in poor health and our trips will be no longer happen...some of the stories, we're taking them to our grave.
Enough of them exist to actually have a name for the type of relationship.
I had one that was long distance. We would talk on the phone, Skype and text a few times a week. He wanted a pretty girl to be interested in him and send him pictures. He would transfer $200 worth of bitcoin to my blockchain each month. Super nice guy, and I always tried to think of ways to make him feel special and wanted. He ended up getting back with IRL sugar baby, and she didn't want me in the picture, so we parted ways.
When I was sugaring, before I became a provider, I'd go to nice bars in business districts to pick up older men. The arrangements I got that way always started off platonic and would eventually lead to sex when I felt comfortable. Eventually, I got super slutty, became comfortable fucking on the first date and just decided to become a provider. The hustle was hard and the struggle was real. Providing is so much more efficient and safer than sugaring.
But I don't think she gets that. Or she'd be at the bars with her GF's getting $50- $100 from randoms with empty promises of favors. Instead she's confused and pissed and trash talking her resourceful friends. I am not bashing another providerfor her struggle, BUT I am a fan of people listening, learning, and helping themselves.
Yes, the hustle is hard. (Sometimes) and Pimpin ain't easy. LOL!
yes, before i began in the business...i tip-toed into the the world of sugar dads. the issue was, i wasn't looking in the right places, despite meeting men who were real estate brokers, entertainment producers, etc. also i admit, 6 years ago, i didn't have the breast enhancements that i have now nor dental work either. so...even though i got lots of free dinners, it wasn't paying the bills. i myself ended up (at the advice of a friend) began doing the sex work thing. at first i thought i didn't uite believe that guys on the internet would actually want to pay...but i was making steady money from like February thru august, not paying a dime for advertising. once i got serious about it, i started paying for ads. that was 6 years ago.
even now, i have clients who offer me the sugar babe thing, but i'm quite independent. however, my situation is changing, and i may need to temporarily take on 1 of the offers, simply because business in my local town has dried up. it'd be ok if i worked full time on the side, but when trying to do it alone...it's not enough.
No there is nothing wrong with that picture. You have to have that about your in your personality or looks. When I was in Minnesota I had a young guy 35-40 yo business man ask me on a date after contacting off the PAGE. He arrived at my room ask if I wanted to upgrade it to the one down the hall I said no. He was like well likes go to the casino/hotel mystic lake. I was a little against it but this personality of mine loves fun. We stayed on the 10 floor pent suit. We stayed up and talk all night the next night he went to work left me there all day with his credit card. When he arrived that night he just went to gamble n when I woke up the following morning he was telling me he was leaving and how it was such a great weekend. Wow just like that he left no sex spa treatment and credit card to finish out my weekend. It was a great weekend n he was a great guy haven't seen him since♡♡ secretly I would have rode him tell he went numb maybe next time.
We meet in public and I flirt and tease him. If he get's hard, he apologizes and says he doesn't want me to feel disrespected. He is a total gentleman. He's bought me diamond earrings and chocolate diamond ring along with the $1500 cash. I don't get it, but I'm not complaining
Also killing good business is these girls who read a book about becoming an escort, then get themselves busted or wanna undercut everyone in the area .. It's killing us everywhere.. not just your location.. I hear about it in the 7 cities of VA as well.