I just wish some grown-ups were in charge.
What's with the any means justify the end? Are we talking about diverting terrorists from blowing up the Pentagon?
I'd like to think that this is just one of those periods of lunacy (e.g., dot-com go dot-con), and that there'll be a reversion to the mean.
Would any of you guys that got cought in there Vice sting and only goy a citation please call me.
I need to talk to you Thanks Debbie 619 596-8617
Did they have a search warrant before they broke down your door? Did you ask to see it? What evidence do they have on you? Were your phone calls recorded? Was the client/cop wearing a wire? If so, didn't you see it when he was naked? Where was it? No money changed hands and no services were discussed? That doesn't seem right to me.
Your story is really terrifying. I am so sorry this happened to you.
Like I said I saw them coming up the walk with a battering ram but my roommate answered the door and as to his wearing a wire he was most likley in his clothes I guess, but as soon as he said I have to PEE here they came they had to be listening.
My Lawyer and I have a big surrise for them in Court and LE if you are reading this to will see then.
And you will not be pleased.
To the rest of you please be very careful.
I sure hope she has one of Americas funniest home videos. LOL
I have been around this word for 38 years now and this poor guy had the smallest itty bitty little dick I have ever seen.
That was his miniture microphone!
Is it legal for LE to get naked??
And yes they can they can even have sex with you and then bust you how's that grab you?
I know we have a really strange supreme court, but it can't be "legal" for LE to have sex with you, and then charge you for prostitution. Yes, they can technically do it if there's a law on the books, and the assistant DA can try to intimidate you with it, but that doesn't mean it would stand up in court. The problem is taking appealing it high enough to get it ruled as unconstitutional. Where's levendi when you really need him?
Just think of it at one level. Suppose the "LE" (and I use this term loosely) acquired an STD during the course of his arrest and investigation. Who would be liable for the financial damages: His insurance company? The provider? The city or county that he works for? Take it up a notch. Suppose this LE became infected with HIV while "on-the-job". How many millions of dollars could he sue for? Your honor, I had to have sex with these women - my daywatch commander told me to! This sort of nonsense would never be allowed in a serious community.
Another thought on if LE acquires an STD from a provider during a prostitution bust. Are they going to charge her with a felony? Suppose, again, LE becomes infected with HIV in the course of his "duties". Are they going to charge her with attempted murder, claiming that she knew, or should have known, that she was infected with HIV and likely to transmit the virus?
Can't people think straight anymore?
-- Modified on 5/27/2002 3:33:52 PM
-- Modified on 5/27/2002 3:41:15 PM
in some states it is legal for cops to engage in intercourse before the bust. others it is not. even in those where it is not, it is their word against yours. they may not be encouraged by their superiors, but be allowed to go as far as they needed to go to get the bust. it would be difficult for him to prove he got the STD from the provider during the bust anyway. most cases where anyone sues anyone for intentional transmission of an STD are dismissed because it is too hard to prove that you got it from the person you are claiming to have got it from. who else was he having sex with. was his wife screwing around. too many possibilities and too hard to show he knows for sure where he got it. And just because you have evidence to show that they had sex with you during the bust does not excuse you from your own illegal behavior.
-- Modified on 5/27/2002 4:12:43 PM
Molecular biological techniques (i.e., recombinant DNA etc.) have indeed reached the point where you establish sources of infection. HIV, for example, is an extremely hypermutatable virus, so one can readily assess the likelihood of the source of infection with pcr-DNA and cloning techniques. The Feds are using these approaches to track down the recent anthrax-mail attacks.
You're thinking mostly of the actual prostitution bust. I'm thinking more of the liability issues, in which an insurance company being hit with a large claim does this testing to avoid large payouts. This would be the sort of thing where the insurance company sues a municipality over an HIV-infected LE.
Also, if you have a crazed DA, you could use the same molecular genetics testing to charge prostitutes with felony endangerment.
and see if they stop their behavior for potential insurance reasons. not to mention the idea that having protected sex with someone you are unlikely to contract anything, even if they do have something.
one example In Columbus
A police lieutenant who supervises vice officers who had sex with prostitutes before arresting them described the cases as good, aggressive police work. But the city safety director says he is investigating.
Lt. Robert Britt said the officers should not be disciplined because they had sex to make stronger cases.
example in Colorado
In April, a sheriff's spokesman for Fort Collins, Colorado admitted that
police officers actually engaged in sex with prostitutes during a January
sting instead of making the arrest at the point at which the women agreed
to have sex for money. Said the spokesman, "The officers thought they
needed to do what they did to make the case." And in June, North Carolina
Alcohol Law Enforcement agents in Jacksonville made similar admissions.
One agent testified, that he put his fingers on a woman's genitals in order
to "feel it occurring." Said ALE's lawyer, "If his wasn't the proper role
of law enforcement, I don't know what is."
and even if they don't do it themselves
TUESDAY, FEBRUARY 13 And now, news from the sordid world of CRIME. According to The Oregonian, the Portland Police Bureau is using a new method in their war against the escort services--actually paying private citizens to have sex with prostitutes. Calling them "informants," these "Huggy-Bears of the Boudoir" are paid $50 for four hours of "undercover work," in which they solicit, pay, and videotape a sexual act. Later, the informants will describe their evening of love in explicit detail in front of a jury. Now, we know what many of you are thinking: "Whoopee! Where do I sign up?" However, before forming a long line down at Chief Kroeker's office, please remember that, while government-sanctioned sex with a prostitute may sound like a dream career, there are a few things one should know: 1) There are no health benefits or 401K plans; 2) Just because you're allowed to commit one illegal act, does not mean you can also steal police department office supplies; and 3) No, you do not get to keep the videotapes. Is that understood? OK, fill out your application, don't forget your references, and most importantly, have fun!
too bad you're not in charge of policy, 2sense, but you aren't
-- Modified on 5/27/2002 4:45:26 PM
I just wish some grown-ups were in charge.
What's with the any means justify the end? Are we talking about diverting terrorists from blowing up the Pentagon?
I'd like to think that this is just one of those periods of lunacy (e.g., dot-com go dot-con), and that there'll be a reversion to the mean.
I noticed that these are excerpts. In the end, what happened in each case? Are they on the way to the Supreme court?? Just wondering.
I'm no attorney, but an informant doing what you claim they do is the same as a cop. When a citizen does what you mentioned with the knowledge of LE, he is working in the same capacity as LE. Now, if he were to do this, then give a tape and statement to LE,(wothout their prior knowledge), that would be different.
Also, I think that what people say about cops in certain areas being able to have sex to get the bust while others can't just does not sound right. When the Supreme court makes a decision, it goes for the entire Country. Now, that decision may be challenged later. Depending upon the circumstances, the Supremes may rule differently. I hope that came out right. Where the heck is that attorney that always joins in on this stuff. He could explain better than I can. I hope I didn't offend anyone.
-- Modified on 5/28/2002 7:37:06 PM
You're probably thinking of levendi, who hangs around LA.
I'm not sure that I see the difference between paying cops (or informants) to have sex for money, or paying them to buy and then take drugs. You don't need to do either to make an arrest, so why do it at all. Sounds to me like criminally-stupid LE.
Might add that to pay a provider for sex, have sex, and then arrest her sounds to me indistinguisable from legalized rape. Gee, does this mean the next time hobbyists get set up in S.D. by Lani or Naughtia that we'll get to have sex with them before they make the arrest? Otherwise the busts would be 'gender-biased'.
You know, you could call these guys "Inspector Clouseau", except for two reasons. Clouseau was way smarter, and a nice guy.
-- Modified on 5/28/2002 9:24:09 PM
I recent post in the legal corner discussion board links to an article that is very informative. Debbie - if you can remember any distinguishing marks on him, size of penis, etc.... tell your lawyer. When it goes to trial, the jury just may frown upon that. No matter what, go to trial!
Please read the article - It may help!
Well know this makes lots of sense........this is why we have so much action going on. All of them are out to getsome first and then justify no donation by busting you!!!!!!!!! Very clever!
And I wonder what they would say to their significant other, of course I'm sure they tell them that they have to fuck other women while on duty.
And could also be an excuse for hobbyists caught by their significant other: "Honey, I was doing undercover work as an informant for SDPD." Sort of like a update of the old TV program: "I Led Three Lives."
Yep. Actually in some jurisdictions they can actually go through with the session, depends on the DA.
LE has broad ability to decide on the spot what it takes to make the arrest.