Thank you aless1944,
A marriage and family therapist with license to practice in the states of California and New York, with a specialized focus on human sexuality and gender/sexual issues.
Welcome to our board,
the Love Goddess
Not in all, but in many marriages after a few years there is a noticeable disparity between the sexual wants/needs of one partner compared to the other. My in one such marriage.
For me a normal sex life would be 2-3 per week. 4-5 times would make me very happy, 1 per week or less very unhappy.
My point of view is that if she was an enthusiastic participant, it would make me much more receptive to help out with all of her duties, become more of a partner, etc.
I have heard it said, to often, from many marriage counselor types that if the man helps out with the housework, etc. It will make the woman more receptive to the man's needs in the bedroom. Truthfully, that makes me a bit sick. First, I dont think its totally true. I understand that wives and mothers have a full plate, and many times dont feel in the mood at the end or beginning of a busy day. But phrased as above, makes it sound like more of a whore, where if the husband does all his chores, he will be "rewarded" by the wife (like a dog) with what should be a essential component of a healthy marriage anyway.
Why not turn it around. If the wife provides for the husbands sexual needs, he will be much more receptive in helping take some burdens off his wife?
As many (mostly) men have experienced, often times wives will submit to the mans desires and "do her duty". Nothing is more un-sexy than a woman, especially a wife, who just lays there and is not really into the experience.
I understand about spontaniety, flowers, trips, listening, helping, gifts, etc. But my question is this. How often is it just simply one does not need it as much as the other? If I dont have sex regularly it first becomes a distraction for me, then an annoyance, then it affect my attitude toward my life with some bitterness.
In someways, I think wouldnt she PREFER if I found a mistress...a "fuck buddy". It would take much of the burden off her, and relieve alot of the tension and needs for me. I, like most men in this situation, love my wife and am not interested in divorce. But is that the early stage? After a few more years, does bitterness become isolation and coldness?
Isnt it true that historically, many families did quite well with a mistress? I understand the wife may fear development of intimacy, loss of money with gifts etc to the mistress, etc.
But hasnt this been going on forever? Is the end result either divorce or one person settling into a trough of an unsatisfying marriage?
Sorry for the rambling, but I have read your thoughtful responses to other questions and am interested in what your mind thinks.
I had a mistress for years. We met 11 years ago in a strip cloub when she was 25 and I was in my 50s. She is beautiful, with exactly the kind of body I always craved--big breasts, narrow waist. Good looking young men all chased her. When we were out together, I could see the looks of envy from the other men who saw us together.
Sounds great, huh? Well, the fact is that the longer we were together, the more tensions arose between us. What I have learned is that the more the fantasy becomes a reality, the more a real person this phantom "mistress" becomes--with all the difficulties and foibles that go with all realtionships. And this happened to us in spades.
I also made the mistake of falling love with her. She kept rejecting my entreaties of marriage, but I am pretty sure the reason was that she wanted me to leave my wife first (perhaps to prove i would do it) To this day, she tells me that informs friends that the reason we never got married is because I would not leave my wife.
As the years progressed, she became more like a wife. And to top it off, she began to refuse to have sex, and we decided to call it off. I am still helping her, trying to give her a career independent of me.
I now have other providers that I see regularly, and one who seems to see no one else (she is UTR for personal reasons) who describes me to her roommate as her "lover." But although we are friends, and I see her about as often as I saw my mistress, she will never be my mistress in the same way. I will never allow myself to get attached to another single woman in the same way again.,
doing housework in the nude together?
Seriously, it's actually a tantric practice and quite exciting.
(Yes, I have a one track mind today. Sorry.)
Dear telluride00000,
One of the problems in almost all societies worldwide is that women have been treated like commodities. Expensive to keep, but necessary. And so, women's sexuality has also been commodified - by men and women alike. And as long as we keep teaching our daughters about "not giving it up," and "saving themselves for someone special," many women will internalize the messages and treat their sexuality like it's something to be protected and bartered for. It stops women from being the sexual aggressor, and it stops women from being in charge of their own sexual needs.
In my opinion, when a woman is tired of a man sexually, she should state it honestly, plainly and distinctly, and then she should do something about it. If it entails leaving her man, fine, leave. If it entails getting laid elsewhere, then she should state that it's a necessity. Of course, most men wouldn't go for that, but still, a woman who is in touch with her sexual needs will not fall into that "withholding trap."
The problem is that women are just as hardwired as men in terms of changing partners. What keeps some women from doing it is fear of reprisals [almost hardwired, witness this cross-culturally, where the woman is the one getting punished for screwing outside the marital union]; fear of losing financial protection and loss of community [in most cultures, female adulterers get cast out]; fear of losing the offspring [in traditional cultures, where women are second class citizens, the children most often fall to the male's family]; and of course, fear of disrupting the family and hurting their children. Hence, women stay put and pout instead, until they literally can't stand it. Then, they get divorced. The times when women put up with mistresses for avoiding to have sex are gone, at least in the Western hemisphere.
Maybe the members on this site are the kinds of men who stay married and try to satisfy their sexual urges outside the marriage? If we went to another board dealing with divorces, we might find guys who suggest leaving their wives, rather than do the "stay-and-stray."
Not much of a complete theory, but...
the Love Goddess
Love Goddess, thank you for such a clear-headed theory. Always good to find some rational thinking here. Who are you?
Thank you aless1944,
A marriage and family therapist with license to practice in the states of California and New York, with a specialized focus on human sexuality and gender/sexual issues.
Welcome to our board,
the Love Goddess
The housework help solution just addresses the common situation where the wife doesn't feel sexy or attracted to the husband when he doesn't help around the house, partly because she's tired and partly because she resents him not helping out. That dynamic might vary depending on whether the wife works outside the home.
In my view one of the biggest causes of distress in marriages is a marked difference between the spouses in sexual drives. Often when women have kids their sex drive drops off and doesn't come back. I'm in one of those marriages and sex between us has dropped off to almost nothing. It was down to once a month when I started having affairs and seeing providers. Now I almost never initiate and therefore we don't have sex.
Believe it or not there are women who have higher sex drives than their husbands. See this website--www.philanderers.com for extensive discussions on affairs with a community which is mainly women.
For me I get by now with a provider visit every two months or so. Due to age and some health problems my own libido is diminished from that of my youth, although it hasn't disappeared. A good hour of boffing will carry me for quite awhile now.
Divorce is an option, but the kids aren't quite out of the house yet.
I empathize with you - but I also disagree with your posture. (Note I am NOT licensed to counsel, I'm just a member of this community with some mileage).
"Now I almost never initiate..." - aren't you shortchanging your spouse and yourself? Try a romantic weekend; market it to her softly. It did work for me.
"Divorce is an option, but..." It always is, except the consequences may not be all that pleasant, even if the idea looks attractive at first. Think that one through very, very carefully, especially considering age and health problems you mention, unless the prospective SO (replacement of your current spouse) is a trained medical professional and agewise within reach. May/November relationships don't last!
Good luck
ski