I have lost the most sleep over the fact that we have a president who is hellbent on radically changing this country, passes unconstitutional legislation to relieve us of burdensome freedoms, and uses federal power to retain his own power. This coupled with the fact that we have a citizenry so removed from the brutal realities faced elsewhere in the world that being politically informed is a bother. Obama and the like continue to get elected, either by voters who are tuned out, voters who are dependent on government, and repeat voters - as national elections are enforced solely by the honor system.
The NSA thing could be worse than I ever dared to imagine. I guess I'll have to see this movie.The devastating thing about all of this is that it is coming from liberals and they are pointing directly at Obama for destroying our rights.
And this is why this current occupier of the WH will go down as the worst president in U.S. history. There are many, many other reasons as well, but when a liberal Prez loses key liberal supporters on civil liberties, you know that his fate has been sealed by the yet to be written history books.
Who would have thought that a constitutional law professor, an African American and a community organizer would be the one to do the most damage? The irony is stunning. The end result for America is devastating.
I have lost the most sleep over the fact that we have a president who is hellbent on radically changing this country, passes unconstitutional legislation to relieve us of burdensome freedoms, and uses federal power to retain his own power. This coupled with the fact that we have a citizenry so removed from the brutal realities faced elsewhere in the world that being politically informed is a bother. Obama and the like continue to get elected, either by voters who are tuned out, voters who are dependent on government, and repeat voters - as national elections are enforced solely by the honor system.
The NSA thing could be worse than I ever dared to imagine. I guess I'll have to see this movie.
however, I think I'll wait for the historians to make that judgement vs. Snowden, this author and this rag that he writes in. Not, that I don't think that the government snooping on us, illegally, is a big problem. I just wish we'd see the same condemnation of those companies you've probably never heard of, who are collect probably as much data on you and I as the government is.
...is that the corporations don't take an oath to protect and defend the constitution and our rights. I am guessing you would hold an elected official, the leader of the "free world", to a higher standard than a business. At least I hope you would
He also has sworn to protect us. Have those companies done so? Noooooo! Nor, all the hackers hacking into companies databases and mining our financial, spending, and health info. Who do you trust more with that information? Someone who has sworn to protect you or someone who has not We live in a much different world than we did before 9/11. There will be disputes regarding who much freedom we need to give up to be protected. When they wrote the constitution, did they have in mind the treats we face today? And, you don't think Congress knows most, if not all of what's going on?
No such person exists or ever existed or ever will
Another American creation to stroke their fucking egos.
The federal government, on the other hand...
And, yes companies can. I recently caught a few charges that I didn't recognize, on my bank statement. Come to find out, they were charges from a company that supposedly checks your credit rating for free, that is until the trial membership is up, then they start charging a monthly fee. Well, someone used my debit card number for the service, and the company didn't even check to see if the card number matched the identity of person using the service. Fortunately, I got my money back, but yes they can take you money. And, just as bad, and at times even worse is they can ruin your credit.
By "deception" yes, by "force" no.
Forcing a person to either pay up or go to jail like the IRS does, now that is taking your money by force.
Well, that's how the game works. You don't have to like, but you do have to play.
Unless you can survive in another country with a lower tax rate.
Forcing a person to either pay up or go to jail like the IRS does, now that is taking your money by force.
I simply pointed out to Matt that Government can take your money by "force" whereas a corporation can not. Please try to keep up.
That's been a fact of life for as long as I can remember.
Corporations don't have to take your money by force. Corporations don't need to because corporations control every commodity people need in order to survive. Government granted corporations with this privilage through regulation.
Can I say it in a 'figurative' sense? lol
Anytime someone takes my money, it feels like it's by force.
Figurative or not, there is a HUGE difference.
Nice attempt at mental gymnastics though.
The rest of my remark was just rifting on the confusion some people here have had on the difference between the terms 'literally vs. figuratively, and they misuse them. Just trying to add a little humor.
If you learn anything about Monsanto, you will see this is this exactly what they do to the farmers. They sell them the seeds from the many seed company they have boughten up over the years, then the farmer shall be treated as a hardened criminal, (Monsanto/FDA go in guns drawn, yes they are one and the same) if they are even suspected of keeping a seed accidentally. Then they/the farmer must pay, meaning "are forced" to pay 30% of all monies on yearly crop (and for those that think the farmer is making the money? Nada)
Here is a link to what Monsanto has done in the past and what they plan on doing in the future. I do understand it long, but if we are really interested in the preservation of humanity, we really need to fight this Evil Corporation. This is the most insidious Corporation in the world, they will kill us all very slowly.
Oh yes, and let us not forget about the HR 875 Act, which is the Act for making "Organic Food" illegal, because you see, if it is Organic we cannot patent it, if we cannot patent it, we cannot make the MUCHO DENEROS.
https://www.govtrack.us/congress/bills/111/hr875/text
I realize this can be time consuming when we watch these documentaries of what this Company/Fed is doing, but what they have been doing (and what they are doing present and future are growing exponentially) has also been very time consuming and also very Profitable for them for well over 50 years and we have sat back and allowed it. Do you not think it now time to take a stand at least for the sake of humanity????
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=87qrTXZaXk
in the US they can. For that matter, police can seize you property under the Federal Civil Forfeiture Act without a court order and never have to return it.
Try owing money to a corporation and see what they can do.
Get a clue
I have clues to spare. I wish you would let me give you one.
Try owing money to a corporation and see what they can do.
Get a clue
Could you help us identify some of the “destruction” this caused?
Anyone killed?
Anyone tortured?
Any businesses ruined?
Anyone even lost money bc of this?
Can you even name anyone beside Verizon that actually was a victim of NSA metamining?
Add up up, Jack. What ya got? Nada?
I feel your pain, Jack. Senator Paul has the same problem in his class action lawsuit. Invasion of privacy is not even actionable without damages. Hurt feelings just don’t do it.
But the good news is that his attorneys will make a lot of money out of this. The Plaintiffs, not so much. LOL
Turn on your TV, Jack.Add up the lives lost, the lives ruined, the billions of dollars spent, and there is still no end in sight for his horrific decision to invade Iraq. I wouldn’t take that award away from Mr. Bush just yet.
“Paul says he expects the case to quickly rise to the Supreme Court and that "the American people will win." Unfortunately for the American people, he's almost certainly wrong. So far, damages and injury from NSA data-gathering have been hard to establish even on an individual basis. Several groups have brought lawsuits against the administration by saying a particular individual organization or person has suffered because of surveillance. But even for Verizon customers, who have a leaked court order to back them up, there's no definitive way to tell whether the NSA actually collected metadata from them, and the claim is too hypothetical for many judges. If Paul wants to go forward with the suit, he'll need to calculate and prove similar damages for every single member of his class.
If it's no big deal, why are so many liberals pissed off and feel like Obama has betrayed them? How in the world has Obama united the far right and the far left on an issue?
Love to hear your thoughts on why there is bi-partisan outrage over this at a time of hyper partisanism in both the country and in congress.
When liberal film makers turn their guns on the very man that made them cry for joy 6 years ago, something has drastically changed and yet it's all no biggie to you, right?
-- Modified on 10/11/2014 8:18:27 PM
It's funny, sometimes I find myself agreeing with FatBoy that Mari is a fake lawyer, and other times I find myself thinking that only a real lawyer could take the positions he takes on some issues and argue them with a straight face.
I don't feel the "Liberal" are as up in arms as you think. Some are bothered but I don't think they're running around with their hair on fire over this. So you're taking this like some board with a bad hair day, calling it the WORST??..... dude chill
You are either out of touch or in denial. From Matt Damon to michael Moore to Harvey Weistein to Tavis Smiley. They don't even talk about Bush anymore.
They now trash Obama. Regularly. You might to tell them to chill bro.
But they aren't jumping on the GOP band wagon. They're not going to disown the party and for that matter the Pres....Like I said, to call it the "worst"..you must be having a bad hair day...And I hate that term "Bro".....it's so 80's.
Bro is out, duder is in.
This would have been of interest before the 2012 election, this didn't happen before then so it's not.
Only a goof would still talk about Bush almost six years after he left office.
They now trash Obama. Regularly. You might to tell them to chill bro.
to “isn’t it a big deal”?
Sorry, Jack but we can’t even use your favorite “moving the goal posts” analogy here.
You haven’t merely moved the goal posts – you’ve rescheduled the game in another city. LOL
But I do have a question for you- what is the difference, as to United States citizens, between Mr. Bush’s executive order -bypassing the FISA court - authorizing the warrantless surveillance of phone calls, Internet activity (Web, e-mail, etc.), text messaging, and other communication of suspected foreign terrorists which quickly morphed into warrantless surveillance of purely domestic calls, and the warrantless surveillance of the NSA under Mr. Obama?
Leaving aside the “no injury” problem, you need to be able to explain the difference before crowning Mr. Obama without mentioning Mr. Bush.
Careful, it’s a trick question. LO
Stay focused Mari. It is you saying it's no biggie, not I. Confused about your own position that fast? Lol.
Try to respond to what I am asking.
The criticism isn't just coming from the right. It is now coming hard from the left. It is apolitical in nature and bi-partisan and you want to make this a left vs. right thing for some bizarre reason.
The thought of liberals making a documentary to criticize Obama for civil liberty violations only a few years ago would have had these people ostracized.
Why is the hard left turning on Obama on this issue? Simple question and you made zero attempt to answer it. Why so scared of the question?
-- Modified on 10/11/2014 11:10:41 PM