You have a different case when you put the link below. People v Johnson can only be accessed in a law library or subscription to a legal database. It said that gifts or social companionship for sexual activities is not criminal. It states that money for sex is criminal. It is possible that the Illinois legislator change the laws. The social companionship is still a legal defense. This case is cited in a law journal article; “Trading Sex for College Tuition: How Sugar Daddy "Dating" Sites May Be Sugar Coating Prostitution.”
The case you provide a link bellow do give a legal remedy. “Moreover, the drafters of the Illinois statute were careful to craft the language of the statute to distinguish between "the prime concern" of the legislation, the business of selling sex, and private, noncommercial acts. 720 ILCS Ann. 5/11-14, Committee Comments-1961, at 448 (Smith-Hurd 2002).” I was looking for this case. I saw it in the law library but lost tract of it.The prostitution laws, police sting operations, and the case laws concerning prostitution don’t favor the poor or the middle class hobbyist. Most poor people or middle class hobbyist don’t have the money to burn on dates. They cannot waste money on a date hoping to get lucky. Rich people can afford to go on dates with sugar babies or escorts. So they can afford to avoid getting sting
I did some in depth legal research into escorting and the prostitution case law. After reading People v. Johnson 60 Ill.App.3d 183, Com. v. Potts 314 Pa.Super. 256, and Bergen v. Wood 14 Cal.App.4th 854, I realized that sex with an escort may be legal.
There is a male escort agency in Las Vegas, NV that caters to women. Their male escort sometimes appears on talk shows. On the shows I watched, the talk show hosts ask them if they have sex with their female clients. They said that they do engage in sexual activities with their female client sometimes. They make it clear that they are not contracted to have sex with them. When the reporter interviews the owner of the agency, he said that he doesn’t sell sex but companionship. The policy of the agency is money up front and no guarantee of sex.
On their website it said that if there is a romantic activity that happens, it is legal. They must consult with lawyers before making such statements. Also they use the disclaimer that state any activities between consenting adult is personal preference and not contracted for.
Why their male escort doesn’t get into trouble with prostitution? The answer is how the escort session is conducted. Women hobbyist goes onto dates with these male escorts. Male escort, on the other hand, tend to book appointments for specific sex session at hotel rooms.
The specific sex session gets male hobbyist into trouble with the law. The Com. v. Potts make it clear that specific sex session for a fee is engaging in prostitution business. If an escort shows up at the hotel or motel room and charge a fee for specific sex session, the act is considered engaging in prostitution business.
If an escort goes out with a client to dinner, movies, shopping, and the date ended up at a hotel room, these activities are considered social companionship. If sex occurs after these activities, it is personal preference between consenting adults.
From the case Bergen v Wood, the court state that a sexual relationship with companionship as a collateral is not prostitution even with the evidence of monetary exchange.
If you show up at hotel rooms, motel rooms, or apartment for specific sex session for pay, this legal defense of social companionship for sexual activities is not a valid defense. In the court decisions Comm. V Pott and People v Johnson did NOT state that you cannot pay for social companionship (escort services). It is a good idea to originate the date in public and move private latter on the date.
Disclaimer
Just legal theory. Not legal advice
If you study what social companionship means, it can mean escort services. Sacramento City Code
““Escort” means a person who, for pecuniary compensation, consideration, hire or reward, 1. escorts or accompanies others to or about social affairs, entertainment or places of amusement, or 2. keeps company with others about any place of public resort or within any private quarters.” – Sacramento City Code 5.04.010 Definitions.
The case Com. v Pott 460 A.2d 1127, 314 Pa.Super. 256 (1983) was in the context of escort services. Miss Pott was using escort services as a front for prostitution. Instead rendering escort services to her clients, she sold them specific sex acts instead. She was busted for selling specific sex acts to her clients.
A Sovereign Citizen told me that there are sometimes remedies or loopholes are hidden in case laws. Especially, case laws that involve prostitution.
There is a possible legal loophole of trading escort services for sexual activities in this case law. There is no mentioning that the social companionship must be given for free.
How does it apply to the entire United States? I ask the Sovereign Citizens on how this case can be used in the entire United States. He told me there is a secret trick written in this case law that he will not tell me. He said that if you look carefully, you will find the secret trick. He refused to tell me the secret trick.
He said that it is not necessary to find the secret trick. Just find those buried case laws and you MAY find there is a case law in every state that allows for this loophole.
This may be the reason the famous male escort agency in Nevada never get busted for prostitution. They instruct the male escort to take money upfront from the female clients and go on dates with the clients. If sex occurs, it is personal preferences between consenting adults. They are using this loophole.
The best approach for an escort is to render escort services according to the legal definition of escort services, don’t show up to hotel or motel rooms, and don’t list sexually suggestive services on their ads. If something happens between the client and escort, it is personal preferences between consenting adults.
This doesn’t guarantee an escort will not get charged with prostitution. This will guarantee a strong legal challenge. Legally challenging the right to sell specific sex session never work. The judges will state that selling specific sex session is prostitution business. There are court opinions where the judges state prostitution businesses encourages human trafficking, creates traffic, and contributes to social evils. Escort services are like mistress-lovers relationship because it doesn’t create the high volume of traffic and encourage human trafficking. In arguing a defense, it is possible to argue that pimps love specific sex session because the clients never know the escort well enough to report the crime. . Pimps don’t like the escort to go on dates with escorts because they cannot control the situation. There is a strong legal defense that true escort services with sexual activities don’t create the traffic and social evils that specific sex session creates
While I agree companionship without any reference to any sex act in ads or when contact made is the key to protect from a prostitution conviction, let me comment on your legal cases.
People v. Johnson 60 Ill.App.3d 183
The prostitute lost and was convicted sentenced to 4 years in prison on felony prostitution. She lost on appeal. Nowhere are gifts mentioned.
http://www.state.il.us/court/opinions/appellatecourt/2004/3rddistrict/may/html/3020456.htm
Bergen v. Wood a palimony co-habitation family court case nothing to do with prostitution.
Com. v. Potts 314 Pa.Super. 256 from 1983 prostitute was convicted from ad offering companionship and yes then offered specific sex acts. It is a PA case and the comment about "secret trick" is just silly. Any advice from a so called "Sovereign Citizen" idiot should be ignored. The entire concept has no legal basis.
A better discussion of commercial vs non commercial prostitution is Commonwealth v Finkelstein Non-Precedential Decision No. 1876 EDA 2010 decided 12/20/2011 however it is a non citable case not even allowed to be used as a cite in PA. This is the famous case in the media of a women selling sex in exchange for world series baseball tickets. However she won because PA law says prostitution must be part of a business so a non-commercial sex for tickets was relatively easy vs under most states broader prostitution law. Arizona is very broad and would argue vague and could be challenged.
Another case of interest mostly for the dissenting opinion is 9th Circuit on Escort Agencies and Vagueness of Criminal Laws 836 F. 2d 1185 - Idk Inc v. County of Clark. However this was before the 2003 Lawrence vs Texas case which gives more arguments for prostitution law challenge, even though Lawrence specifically does not address prostitution but in private consenting adults and that no law can be based on morality. In the IDK case it is in the dissent good issues against the Escort Licensing law (similar to what we have in Phoenix and Scottsdale). And while negative about prostitution has all the elements that a challenge would have to take into consideration.
While the majority opinion in this 9th circuit does support commercial vs non commercial related to freedom of association etc, the dissenting opinion believes the concepts should apply to both, without the distinction.
You have a different case when you put the link below. People v Johnson can only be accessed in a law library or subscription to a legal database. It said that gifts or social companionship for sexual activities is not criminal. It states that money for sex is criminal. It is possible that the Illinois legislator change the laws. The social companionship is still a legal defense. This case is cited in a law journal article; “Trading Sex for College Tuition: How Sugar Daddy "Dating" Sites May Be Sugar Coating Prostitution.”
The case you provide a link bellow do give a legal remedy. “Moreover, the drafters of the Illinois statute were careful to craft the language of the statute to distinguish between "the prime concern" of the legislation, the business of selling sex, and private, noncommercial acts. 720 ILCS Ann. 5/11-14, Committee Comments-1961, at 448 (Smith-Hurd 2002).” I was looking for this case. I saw it in the law library but lost tract of it.
The prostitution laws, police sting operations, and the case laws concerning prostitution don’t favor the poor or the middle class hobbyist. Most poor people or middle class hobbyist don’t have the money to burn on dates. They cannot waste money on a date hoping to get lucky. Rich people can afford to go on dates with sugar babies or escorts. So they can afford to avoid getting sting
The link was to the Appeals court case that extensively cited the conclusions from People v Johnson, I realized it wasn't the Johnson case itself but at first glance would think wrong link.
There are hotel and casino that have a bar or restaurant. You can meet the escort there if you are the hobbyist. If you are the hobbyist, you can meet the escort there. It give a buffer toward police stings. It is not full proof but it helps. Then you may decided to head up to hotel room for some action. Stick to the line that you only sell companionship or you only buy companionship. You don't sell sex or buy sex. This is not the type of business you are. If you are the hobbyist, stick to the line that you are not looking to patronize a business that sell sex acts. It is worst to go to a restaurant and make a solicitation for sexual services. It is called public solicitation. If you say it, you are done. Undercover cops may try to make a case. They may keep pressing you to admit that you sell sex acts. You can tell them to leave because you are not in that type of business.
The way can be done is an agreement watch movies or cuddling together. After you receive the money or hand money over, there should be no offer or agreement for sexual favors. After 1 hour of movies or cuddling, then maybe get sexual.
If you offer massage, they can bust you for not having a massage license. Most states license massage.
An undercover cop may ask if there is fondling or nudity in the cuddling. You can say no to it.
You can agree to watch movies with an escort and have a sleep over. That is legal because the relationship is not pure sexual.
If money being exchanged and clothes come off, the courts will not accept it as social companionship. They will say that is a fee for sexual activities and criminal.
If you tried to challenge the constitutionally of the right to sell quickies, the court will use the excuse that specific sex session is an opportunity to create traffic of Johns. With 1/2 hour quickies, Johns can come in an out a location. It can be compared to run a restaurant in your home where customers come in and out. They will say that it creates social disorder. With 2 hour companionship, there is no high turn around rates to create the social disorder.
Thanks for writing back Dave. Keep up the good work.
The case you provide a link bellow do give a legal remedy. “Moreover, the drafters of the Illinois statute were careful to craft the language of the statute to distinguish between "the prime concern" of the legislation, the business of selling sex, and private, noncommercial acts. 720 ILCS Ann. 5/11-14, Committee Comments-1961, at 448 (Smith-Hurd 2002).” I was looking for this case. I saw it in the law library but lost tract of it.
The prostitution laws, police sting operations, and the case laws concerning prostitution don’t favor the poor or the middle class hobbyist. Most poor people or middle class hobbyist don’t have the money to burn on dates. They cannot waste money on a date hoping to get lucky. Rich people can afford to go on dates with sugar babies or escorts. So they can afford to avoid getting sting.
You can ask the BP escort that doesn't have any reviews if they would like to meet you for dinner. You can offer them $40 for an hour dinner. You don't want to be paying $200 rates for just dinner. If it is a problem, then ask them to come to you. You don't want to pay $200 and not get laid. If they are great and they have a website, you can help their business by writing a review.
If you going to do dinner dates, movies, etc. and want to get laid, you should to hire a well reviewed escort or an escort from a reputable agency. You don't want to be wasting money and at the end of the night got nothing.
If that is the girl next door and you know her, you can give her some money to dinner with you like $25 or $40 on top of dinner. Ask her that you willing to pay more $$$ for companionship at your place. You can offer her money for companionship at your place without dinner date. It is possible to ask if she willing to get pay for a sugar date. Never offer to pay for sex. If you are a stranger, she can get you for solicitation.
Don't be dump in wasting big money on dating and not get laid. Do your research, practice the art, and don't just walk into a situation without knowing. That is how guys get sting because they are acting like paying for sex is legal when it is not. They don't check out the provider or play a game. They straight forward accept or offer to pay for sex with a stranger
and take her for a drive through a McDonalds drive-up and scarf down something from the Dollar Menu, then head back to her place and bang away for the rest of the time, it's all kosher?
(The sex, that is, not the burger which I know is tref.)
If you know someone as a personal friend or in an intimate relationship, it is legal to give gifts for favors. The crime is when you offer sex for pay to strangers. Don't offer it to strangers. If you don't know the escort well enough, don't agree to the offer or offer to pay for sex. You can know them through reviews. There are many dump men who don't use their heads. They walk into a sting operation and so straight forward in offering or agreeing to pay for sex. They didn't do their research. That why they get into trouble.
If an ex- friend goes to the police, the police may say there is no strong evidence for an arrest. An officer must witness the transaction. Also highly personal relationship is protected from eavesdropping. If there is evidence, it can be thrown out of court.
For escorts, it is important not use dinner dates to sell specific sex session. Insist on you only get pay for companionship. If the client is begging to pay for sex during dinner date, then tell them to end the conversation or else you will walk out. Once the date move into the hotel room, then whatever happens between consenting adults is considered entrapment.
(The sex, that is, not the burger which I know is tref.)
I met a ex- sovereign citizen at a law library. He gave up litigation in court because he know that there are soo many legal angles and cannot win if the is not a lawyer. He said do his own legal research to write contracts for his own business. After discussing my legal research, he showed me copies of a hobby friendly law book that decriminalized method of hobbying for all 50 states. He accessed it on a law database at the law library. He used a permanent marker to blot out the title on the couple pages.
You don’t have to have a copy of the hobby friendly law book to know the principles in the law book. The hobby friendly chapter has the exact legal principles that are found in the court case Commonwealth . v Danko 421 A.2d 1165, 281 Pa.Super. 97 (1980), Commonwealth v. Potts, 460 A.2d 1127, 314 Pa.Super. 256 (1983), and People v. Johnson, 376 N.E.2d 381, 17 Ill.Dec. 382, 60 Ill.App.3d 183 (1978))
This theory is practiced by the male escort agency in Nevada that caters to female clients. It has proven to work.
There are high end escort agencies in United States that practice this model. Like what I wrote in a previous message on this forum; money up front, originate the date in public, no guarantee of sex, no solicitation, and no specific sex session. If sex happens between the escort and the client, it is personal preference between consenting adults. Sexual activities with companionship as a collateral is not prostitution according to this principle. The courts already said that specific sex session creates traffic which cause disturbance in the neighborhood, encourage human trafficking, and other social evils.
Sugar babies and sugar daddies practice this same principle that why their transaction is legal. Like what it said on the ABC show “ABC Nightline on Sugar Daddies and Sugar Babies” the court ruled that it is not prostitution for a woman to be paid for other services. You can access it on Youtube.
He NEVER let me to see the title of this hobby friendly law book because he was afraid of my safety. He told me that if I found out the title law book and tell people about it, I could end up like JFK.
The ex-Sovereign Citizen told me his JFK conspiracy theory. He believes JFK was going to expose this hobby friendly law book and the secret society that publish it. At this point in history, politicians and judges did not have case laws on their side to engage in the hobby. No judge dare at this point in history to issue a court ruling legalizing a method of the hobby. So they rely on the 50 states subscribing to this secret hobby friendly law book.
John F. Kennedy knew what was going on. He was Catholic and believes the hobby was a sin. He was going to stop the states’ subscription to this secret law book that decriminalized a method of the hobby. He was assassinated before he exposes this secret law book (not secret, can be accessed by anyone, and a copy can be found at a local law library) and the secret society that publish this book.
I asked the ex-Sovereign Citizens for his phone number but he refused to give it to me. He don’t want to get caught knowing too much. He wishes me good luck on my legal research.
The ex-Sovereign Citizens advice to hobbyist and escort is to operate according to the principles held by the famous male escort agency in Nevada. If there is any trouble, then hire a lawyer that is seasoned in the escort service law to get out. Don’t operate an escort business to where legal system can slam dunk you with a guilty verdict. Selling specific sex session and originate the escort services at a hotel or motel room will give the legal system a slam dunk for a guilty verdict. His message is don’t be afraid to be an escort or operate an escort agency in United States. Just don’t sell specific sex session and originate the date in a hotel or motel room
Like the Uniform Commercial Code. It is good for the entire United States. That is the hint the ex-Sovereign Citizen gave me.
The lawyers and judges did their best to decriminalize the hobby. They cannot legalize the hobby because of public outrage. Especially from the Christian majority.