Minnesota

Re:Republican efforts to steal Presidential election in Florida through vote-tampering
sin-tex 3824 reads
posted

40-60 years ago Republicans had a strong elelement of paranoid conspiracy theorist who believed in improbable plots to undermine the country and take over. While based on real events,  they took on a life of thier own and grew to fancifull proportions.  The republicans eventially weeded these factions out.  The democrats today do not seem to be concerned that an even more paranoid faction is thriving in thier midst.  They believe half truths and lies because they want too. Like Dan Rather's little scandal, the portion of the press and the media that hold to leftist ideals will accept any claim that helps substanciate there core beliefs.  The occurances of vote tampering by democrats are legion (dead people voteing in Chicago, thousands of illegal aliens being registered and voting in California etc.) Do you see republicans in paranoid fits about it.  No, because the vast majority of our electoral system is honest and accurate and the unethical actions of a few have not been able to change that.  A media coopeative (It included the NY Times & Wash. Post) hired auditors to go over all the ballots in Florida very thoroughly. The auditors concluded in the spring of 2001 that Bush won. Some people still refuse to believe that.  Some never will.

FatnHorny5374 reads

By Paul Krugman
Originally published in The New York Times, 10.15.04

Earlier this week former employees of Sproul & Associates (operating under the name Voters Outreach of America), a firm hired by the Republican National Committee to register voters, told a Nevada TV station that their supervisors systematically tore up Democratic registrations.

The accusations are backed by physical evidence and appear credible. Officials have begun a criminal investigation into reports of similar actions by Sproul in Oregon.

Republicans claim, of course, that they did nothing wrong - and that besides, Democrats do it, too. But there haven't been any comparably credible accusations against Democratic voter-registration organizations. And there is a pattern of Republican efforts to disenfranchise Democrats, by any means possible.

Some of these, like the actions reported in Nevada, involve dirty tricks. For example, in 2002 the Republican Party in New Hampshire hired an Idaho company to paralyze Democratic get-out-the-vote efforts by jamming the party's phone banks.

But many efforts involve the abuse of power. For example, Ohio's secretary of state, a Republican, tried to use an archaic rule about paper quality to invalidate thousands of new, heavily Democratic registrations.

That attempt failed. But in Wisconsin, a Republican county executive insists that in this year, when everyone expects a record turnout, Milwaukee will receive fewer ballots than it got in 2000 or 2002 - a recipe for chaos at polling places serving urban, mainly Democratic voters.

And Florida is the site of naked efforts to suppress Democratic votes, and the votes of blacks in particular.

Florida's secretary of state recently ruled that voter registrations would be deemed incomplete if those registering failed to check a box affirming their citizenship, even if they signed an oath saying the same thing elsewhere on the form. Many counties are, sensibly, ignoring this ruling, but it's apparent that some officials have both used this rule and other technicalities to reject applications as incomplete, and delayed notifying would-be voters of problems with their applications until it was too late.

Whose applications get rejected? A Washington Post examination of rejected applications in Duval County found three times as many were from Democrats, compared with Republicans. It also found a strong tilt toward rejection of blacks' registrations.

The case of Florida's felon list - used by state officials, as in 2000, to try to wrongly disenfranchise thousands of blacks - has been widely reported. Less widely reported has been overwhelming evidence that the errors were deliberate.

In an article coming next week in Harper's, Greg Palast, who originally reported the story of the 2000 felon list, reveals that few of those wrongly purged from the voting rolls in 2000 are back on the voter lists. State officials have imposed Kafkaesque hurdles for voters trying to get back on the rolls. Depending on the county, those attempting to get their votes back have been required to seek clemency for crimes committed by others, or to go through quasi-judicial proceedings to prove that they are not felons with similar names.

And officials appear to be doing their best to make voting difficult for those blacks who do manage to register. Florida law requires local election officials to provide polling places where voters can cast early ballots. Duval County is providing only one such location, when other counties with similar voting populations are providing multiple sites. And in Duval and other counties the early voting sites are miles away from precincts with black majorities.

Next week, I'll address the question of whether the votes of Floridians with the wrong color skin will be fully counted if they are cast. Mr. Palast notes that in the 2000 election, almost 180,000 Florida votes were rejected because they were either blank or contained overvotes. Demographers from the U.S. Civil Rights Commission estimate that 54 percent of the spoiled ballots were cast by blacks. And there's strong evidence that this spoilage didn't reflect voters' incompetence: it was caused mainly by defective voting machines and may also reflect deliberate vote-tampering.

The important point to realize is that these abuses aren't aberrations. They're the inevitable result of a Republican Party culture in which dirty tricks that distort the vote are rewarded, not punished. It's a culture that will persist until voters - whose will still does count, if expressed strongly enough - hold that party accountable.



Leave this $@%* for the correct board. If I want to debate politics, I'll go elsewhere. Besides both candidates suck, probably BBBJTC!

sexluvr2958 reads

You don;t get to pick....  you get to ignore.  That is your free choice.

A certain provider began all of this with one of her posts....  many posters/participants chose to participate.  You get to choose to NOT - but that is your only choice.  You are not Ashcroft.

Do I like these posts??  Nope....  but I like restricting people's freedoms to do as they wish even less......

sl

-- Modified on 10/16/2004 3:28:51 PM

I agree.  You can all keep your opinions to yourselves!

sexluvr3538 reads

The Mod can and should do the right thing....  

I don;t think a lot of people here are interested in any of this stuff.  Mine was simply to remind you that you have a right to read or not read......  By NOT reading - and by NOT posting to a thread - it WILL die.  So don;t blame anyone other than yourself for its continuance.

sl

Ny Times.  Enough said.
Name 1 person of color who was not allowed to vote in 2000.

Trivial, Single-Mind, And I Love This Country Because....

sin-tex3825 reads

40-60 years ago Republicans had a strong elelement of paranoid conspiracy theorist who believed in improbable plots to undermine the country and take over. While based on real events,  they took on a life of thier own and grew to fancifull proportions.  The republicans eventially weeded these factions out.  The democrats today do not seem to be concerned that an even more paranoid faction is thriving in thier midst.  They believe half truths and lies because they want too. Like Dan Rather's little scandal, the portion of the press and the media that hold to leftist ideals will accept any claim that helps substanciate there core beliefs.  The occurances of vote tampering by democrats are legion (dead people voteing in Chicago, thousands of illegal aliens being registered and voting in California etc.) Do you see republicans in paranoid fits about it.  No, because the vast majority of our electoral system is honest and accurate and the unethical actions of a few have not been able to change that.  A media coopeative (It included the NY Times & Wash. Post) hired auditors to go over all the ballots in Florida very thoroughly. The auditors concluded in the spring of 2001 that Bush won. Some people still refuse to believe that.  Some never will.

five-eight4419 reads

Oh yeah, you see Republicans in fits about it. Check Mary Kiffmeyer. She and hard-core Republicans in Minnesota are WAY in fits about alleged (or imagined) electoral mischief in the past couple of elections.

with a trunk load of voter registration card that should have been turned in with in ten days of being filled out.

Oh yea; he was arrested for voter registration fraud and he was working for a democratic party organization.

....what this board is all about! Seekers of truth and knowledge in the search of the finest providers in an activity that has been around for many, many, many, more years than any politics in the good 'ol US of A. Thank goodness the hobby will always prevail, as we will always be smarter than the knucklehead politicians that try to inforce their will against us...albeit right or left!

And through all of this, thank you to all of the wonderful service men and women who have put their lives in peril to support our great country!

five-eight4953 reads

The service men and women are astounding. Bless 'em.

I don't mind a little political talk here - I'm very impressed by what people have posted here, on all sides. It's good to engage the big head. This stuff is important.

Maybe some gender balance though. What do Misty and other vocal providers have to say on the issues of the day?

I think our current president has us on target.  I didn't see either much of a good choice ... oh well, ducking to keep under the values radar

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