Do you think gun laws prevent guns from going from one state to another??? LOL.
Apparently there are magical gun fairies that restrict guns from entering high crime, gang related areas. ROFL. That is an idiotic argument parroted by NRA clowns. If the entire country banned hand guns, that would be one thing. What would that look like I wonder.... Oh yeah, we don't have to wonder, we can just look at Canada. Go ask a border agent for Canada what they look for when americans cross into their country. For you gun nut donkeys to be right, the rest of the civilized world must be crazy (along with those libruls!).As a provider how would you feel if a client is armed upon arrival for the visit and also as a client how would you feel if the provider is armed. First make this a level conversation both are legally armed and with a concealed and carry permit issued by the state.
My first reaction is "WTF, why is this even a question?" But I get that it might be something that has to be dealt with in a c&c state. I can tell you that if I ever see one I'm a memory. What's next, are providers going to need to hang these on their incall doors?
I support the absolute right of every human being on earth to be armed at all times in all places with any weapon they want. As a disabled person, I do not have a gun as I have only one useable hand and could not physically safely and accurately fire one. But any person, including a provider is welcome to carry any weapon around me including in my home. I support the repeal of any and all international, federal, state, county, and municipal laws restricting in any way the right of anyone to own or possess any weapon. Self-defense is a basic human right and predates the overly restrictive Second Amendment. Current gun control laws are also racist in their impact, disarming convicted felons and certain misdemeanants, which has a disproportionate impact on minority people because of the racist criminal justice system in the U.S. that incarcerates more people of color than whites, and disarms people unjustly for having sought mental health care and counseling, including tens of thousands of military veterans who sought treatment for PTSD. Four of my grandparents and my older half sister died in Hitler's concentration camps. I wish they had possessed guns or other weapons.
Great rant. Still doesn't change the fact that the govt has tanks, nukes, and drones. Oh, and something called the NSA. What do you, and your merry band of nincompoops have again? Oh yeah, a couple of ak-47s and 9mms? I'm sure that will end well. Let's go ask David Koresh how well it ended for him? How would hand guns have helped the jews? Hitler hand tanks right? Planes with bombs? Ok, another crap argument.
Wake up, the NRA and gun industry are brain washing you into thinking you need guns everywhere for the age old reason of.........$$$$$$$$$. Just go look up how much money they are making off you idiots. Meanwhile, kids die almost every day due to the easy availability of guns.
It's nice to hear somebody who support's the rights of the Taliban, al-Qaeda, and ISIS to procure nuclear weapons.
I'm sorry about your grandparents and older half sister, but I doubt that a few guns would have helped them survive. Guns certainly didn't help the residents of the Warsaw ghetto - except that they managed to kill a few of their oppressors.
Yes, IL has much more crime than our neighbors, and much of out gun violence comes from the streets, not from legal gun owners, but these are narrow truths that hardly tell the whole story.
First of all, almost every single gun on the street was originally bought "legally", then funneled into the black market. Why do you think there are huge billboards everywhere warning against the severe penalties for buying a gun for someone else. This (and many other aspects of the debate) go directly back to the overall ease of access for anyone wanting a gun. Yes, the gun industry wants to sell as many guns as possible, and no, they don't care one bit about the consequences (see the uproar on the right regarding the recent treaty that proposed to ban govts from selling weapons to known terrorist organizations...what a terrible idea...heaven forbid we artificially depress sales...let the free market solve it).
A responsible gun owner may not be the overall problem (until their kid finds it, their older disturbed kid steals it, or someone uses it as the easiest way, by a country mile, to commit suicide...many would never go thru with it otherwise...check out suicide rates in most places with lower access to guns), but the ease by which they obtain their weapon is a huge problem. It allows a massive flow of deadly weapons to enter almost every aspect of our lives. We act as if we're these completely rational beings that are always in control. Guess what, we're not. There's always going to be moments of rage, anger, or dispair where someone basically loses it. In these moments we lose our grip on consequences. Insert a gun into this moment, and things can quickly go from ugly to deadly (easy example is the KC Chiefs player who shot his gf in a rage when he realized she had gone out that night...good thing there just happened to be a gun lying on the counter...then, to complete the cycle, he committed suicide in front of his coaches). That is why having a gun in a home makes it exponentially more likely that someone living in that home will die from that, or another, gun. There are some scenarios it will be useful for, but it also opens up so many other dangerous doors. Kinda like buying an attack dog for protection, knowing that it might snap at some point and turn on you.
I'll stop, but my last observation is that guns are a huge ego trip, and to deny it is impossible. Simply holding a gun is a powerful thing. It evokes all kinds of base level emotions, especially in men. This is why it has been such a successful political wedge for the right. It gets people to operate on an emotional and exceptionally biased level. The issue has nothing to do with governance, which is exactly where they don't want the light shown. Go ahead and keep taking what's being spoon fed to you while our corporate run system pushes almost everyone into financial serfdom. At least you'll have your guns if they ever come for something really important. Oh wait...
I'm sorry about your grandparents and older half sister, but I doubt that a few guns would have helped them survive. Guns certainly didn't help the residents of the Warsaw ghetto - except that they managed to kill a few of their oppressors.
She's literally got you vulnerable and by the balls when your pants are sitting on the chair and you're getting your BJ. You know if you have a weapon, the person you're trying to protect yourself from can use it?
-- Modified on 7/6/2014 9:02:25 AM
I think you have my question wrong I am NOT advocating visiting any one or anywhere armed but looking for preferences as to how you would feel if a client came armed or at an outcall the provider came armed NO intentions of any criminal behavior but exercising their right just to carry one. Todays news has so many people stretching the laws as to the right to carry they feel they can carry anywhere, anyplace with no consequences as to other people and how they would feel around them. I was waiting at a well known downtown restaurant and other party was talking about their guns openly and other people got up and walked out of the restaurant and others it did not bother how would you feel.
Of course, I wouldn't feel comfortable because it's a fast easy way to do major harm, but it's also a liability. I wouldn't want to take any risk.
-- Modified on 7/6/2014 3:09:54 PM
is the python in your pants. Anything else on either side is really inappropriate.
If the person has a carry conceal permit. The only time I would be concerned if they are carrying illegal.
A person that has gone thru the process has had back ground checks and has been okay'd by the Sheriffs department. You need to worry about the people who carry for other reason besides safety concerns. Bad things happen to good people all the time when we least expect them too. As for someone else using your weapon against you, it can happen but not as frequent as you think. Its very unlikely that this would happen to trained individual. How many times do you hear a cop got his weapon taken away and used against him? Remember Its called "CONCEALED CARRY". No one should know that your carrying unless there is trouble. There are a lot of different ways to carry a concealed weapon that do a great job of hiding it.Even if I leave my pants on the chair next to the bed. More than likely someone rummaging thru my pants would not know unless they knew what they were looking for. And what about a knife? They are equally dangerous in the wrong hands and they can kill just as easy with out making a noise. The people that are carrying legally are not the ones you need to worry about its the other assholes.
Be safe and don't take unnecessary risk.
WOW. A knife can kill just as easily as a gun? Maybe if you're Dexter and you have a bunch of Saran Wrap and a needle with sodium pentathol.
That must be why England's homicide rate is equal to ours. They have a bunch of psychos stabbing everyone in schools and movie theaters and shopping malls. Oh wait, they don't. Never mind.
WOW. I've seen some utter rubbish on this board, but that might just take the cake. Holy hell
Check the stats folks. Don't be fooled by the idiots amongst us. The UK, Canada, Australia, Japan, nearly every western democracy - all have outrageously lower gun deaths per population unit than the US. Coincidentally, they all ban assault weapons as well as hand guns. Hmmmm. Why does anyone tolerate all the school shootings and random killings every day in this country?? Because some old guys thought that the people should have guns to form a militia to rise up against the government? The same old guys who thought slavery was A-ok and women shouldn't vote? Those guys? Yeah, I think they got a few things wrong. You do realize the govt now has nukes, tanks, and drones right??
And I'm tired of that BS phrase, "responsible gun owner". There's no such thing. How are you making sure 24/7 that your gun isn't stolen? You can't. Once it is stolen, it could be used in a crime, to shoot up a school, kill a cop, or in a random drive-by. Good job, you just helped kill somebody.
Recently a guy in Seattle disarmed a crazy guy with a gun using just pepper spray. Anyone who says guns are necessary is foolish at best. They are part of the reason why you are 600% less likely to get shot and killed when you cross the border into Canada. Yeah. The stupid is nauseating.
Pepper spray and/or a taser is all you need. What are you going to do otherwise? Just start shooting a guy for not paying? Or threaten a provider for reneging on services? Really? How do you geniuses see that scenario ending exactly? I don't want to know, just shut up already
Stats??
I'm among the 14,813 "responsible" gun owners in Cook County who've spent over $600 to get a CCL.
Of the more than 1,173 shootings in Chicago this year, we are "responsible" for 1 of them.
One.
One more than none of them.
And it was ruled self defense.
What I'm tired of is you people and your Gun Grabbing BS.
Stand and Fight
Gun violence and crime generally is way down and has been going down for years. There is no gun violence problem. And the worst gun violence is in places that have the harshest gun laws. Gun control is a solution without a problem. Repeal all gun laws now, and make guns and ammo available for free to those who can't afford them.
Yes, not all amongst us are idiots! Some people want to say Guns are the reason for violence but don't care about all the violence in video games and at the movies. You blame "gun culture" for the problems but what it boils down to is "violence culture" We can successfully debate the issues but liberals will never see anybody else's point of view but their own. So they blame decent law abiding citizens who NEVER used a gun in a crime or own a gun that has been used in a crime. How many guns are out there, how many been used in a crime, and how many have been used by first time offenders? check them stats. Most violent crimes are from re peat offenders. No more gun laws enforce the laws that are on the books.
Yeah, more guns is the answer. Why not legalize grenade launchers and machine guns too? Are they not arms?? Would our holy founders not want us to have these weapons to overthrow the government??
Gun violence has been going down because ALL crime has been going down. That has to do with better (and more) policing, as well as novel prison sentencing.
Again, go look at other countries with similar societies. This is a no-brainer. Then again...
This country has a people problem, not a gun problem. When kids are killing each other over
cell phones, and " respect " that is not the gun's fault. A gun is a tool, just like any other.
And I am one of the 3.800 Du Page residents who has a concealed carry license, I have owned
guns all my live, have two " assault " weapons, (obviously you don't know what an assault weapon is ) and have raised children and grandchildren who participate in the shooting sports. My daughter at one time lived in a desolate area was being stalked by an ex boyfriend, the only way she could
get the police to come out to her place to tell them she owned guns, and was going to shoot him
the next time he came out - so much for orders of protection. Freedom is not free, and all those
wonderful " rights " you have were won for you by people with guns.
Cars and texting kill a lot of people too. Paralyze them, mangle them, cost them tons of money, put people in jail, kill entire families, etc etc. So if I sell a car, or buy one, and some careless dip shit steals my car, gets in an accident, and kills someone... Did I just help him kill someone?
Guns don't kill people. People kill people.
Newton, you bastard.
Huh?
The primary purpose of a car isn't to kill someone. That is, however, the primary purpose of a gun.
By your "logic", nuclear weapons don't kill people, people kill people. Now, why aren't we allowed to have those again? Or vials of anthrax? Or a surface to air missile? Or a rocket launcher? Or a grenade launcher that can also fire vials of anthrax at people?? FREEDUUMM
Because it pisses off people like you.
So what does Mike Bloomberg's dick taste like?
Didn't I just assist someone in paying for sex?
Nope. Intentions are unrelated.
In attempts to control people in making them remain good citizens, we are neglecting our own responsibilities and freedoms to uphold those responsibilities.
-- Modified on 7/6/2014 10:57:11 PM
It's really the bullets that are to blame. They are designed for putting holes in people.
Freedumbs! Except when we give it away in the interest of "safety".....
f someone has a CCW in Illinois or anywhere else they have gone through a backround check and in Illinois safety courses. If a client is armed he isn't armed so he can shoot the provider, he is armed in case he is accosted anywhere he may travel. He or she carries a firearm just like one carries keys, wallet, etc. Painting legal gun owners like maniacs just out looking to shoot someone is idiotic. One has far more to fear from someone carrying who is doing so illegally, and they will not care if anyone is offended. The stats are out there that those who have legal carry permits are no more likely to commit a gun crime than is a police officer. In Indiana right next door there are hundreds of thousands of people who have carry permits, yet they don't have all the shootings that Illinois does.
There is too much emotion by the anti gun people with not enough information and logic.
By your logic, we should be able to have conceal and carry for anything. Why, I have a permit to carry a thermonuclear weapon. I'm a law abiding citizen goddammit! FREEDUUMMB! And me and my law abiding ilk should be able to carry whatever we choose. Uzis, grenades, whatever suits our fancy. Never know when I'd need to take down a gang of criminals! You wouldn't want me to be outgunned would you?? It happens all the time!
Which is more likely to happen? A good guy takes out a bad guy with a gun? Or the gun goes off accidentally and kills someone? A kid? The "good" gun owner? It gets reported lost or stolen only to be used later in a crime? Assists in suicide? Gets found by a mentally deranged relative who shoots up a school (Newtown)?
You gun nuts are so easy to beat down. You know why? You've been fed the same old stupid, tired arguments for years. Does the USA own all the crazy psychos of the world? Then why do we have school shootings way more than any other country? Why is it that you are 20X more likely to die from gun violence than any other civilized country?
Instead of regurgitating the same idiotic, failed arguments you see from Fox News or the NRA or some other right-wing gun nuts united site, why don't you look at the actual facts? Look how many school shootings and gun deaths they have in Canada. Or Europe. Or Japan. Or Australia. Or any civilized country with a stable, functioning government.
The rest of the western world has it figured out already. Yet again, they point and laugh at this country and its idiot citizens and politicians. Yes, the English are laughing at you, as are the Canadians and Australians. Yes, you right-wing idiot, they are pointing and laughing at your dumb ass, as you clutch that handgun going on a spittle-filled rant about freedom, while kids die in our schools and streets. The only benefactors in all this stupidity of carnage are the NRA & gun manufacturers who have made a killing (NPI) brainwashing you fools.
-- Modified on 7/6/2014 4:51:09 PM
Which is more likely to happen? A good guy takes out a bad guy with a gun? Or the gun goes off accidentally and kills someone? A kid? The "good" gun owner? It gets reported lost or stolen only to be used later in a crime? Assists in suicide? Gets found by a mentally deranged relative who shoots up a school (Newtown)?
You gun nuts are so easy to beat down. You know why? You've been fed the same old stupid, tired arguments for years. Does the USA own all the crazy psychos of the world? Then why do we have school shootings way more than any other country? Why is it that you are 20X more likely to die from gun violence than any other civilized country?
Instead of regurgitating the same idiotic, failed arguments you see from Fox News or the NRA or some other right-wing gun nuts united site, why don't you look at the actual facts? Look how many school shootings and gun deaths they have in Canada. Or Europe. Or Japan. Or Australia. Or any civilized country with a stable, functioning government.
The rest of the western world has it figured out already. Yet again, they point and laugh at this country and its idiot citizens and politicians. Yes, the English are laughing at you, as are the Canadians and Australians. Yes, you right-wing idiot, they are pointing and laughing at your dumb ass, as you clutch that handgun going on a spittle-filled rant about freedom, while kids die in our schools and streets. The only benefactors in all this stupidity of carnage are the NRA & gun manufacturers who have made a killing (NPI) brainwashing you fools.
-- Modified on 7/6/2014 4:51:09 PM
By the way I think you are a coward for hiding behind an alias with such inflammatory posts
then yes.
I love that when the facts beat you down like a tired old dog, you just go on about unrelated nonsense that isn't germane to the topic at hand.
I love that when the facts beat you down like a tired old dog, you just go on about unrelated nonsense that isn't germane to the topic at hand.
As individual states have made gun ownership and ccw easier their murder rates have dropped.
I guess those facts are probably unrelated nonsense and aren't germane to the topic at hand.
Since you are hiding behind a cowardly alias and talking like a lunatic I wonder if you are even a member here or some troll that surfs the net and drops in on these conversations
Do you think gun laws prevent guns from going from one state to another??? LOL.
Apparently there are magical gun fairies that restrict guns from entering high crime, gang related areas. ROFL.
That is an idiotic argument parroted by NRA clowns. If the entire country banned hand guns, that would be one thing. What would that look like I wonder....
Oh yeah, we don't have to wonder, we can just look at Canada. Go ask a border agent for Canada what they look for when americans cross into their country.
For you gun nut donkeys to be right, the rest of the civilized world must be crazy (along with those libruls!).
Apparently there are magical gun fairies that restrict guns from entering high crime, gang related areas. ROFL.
That is an idiotic argument parroted by NRA clowns. If the entire country banned hand guns, that would be one thing. What would that look like I wonder....
Oh yeah, we don't have to wonder, we can just look at Canada. Go ask a border agent for Canada what they look for when americans cross into their country.
For you gun nut donkeys to be right, the rest of the civilized world must be crazy (along with those libruls!).
We have had a war on drugs for how many years? If we can't stop illegal drugs from entering the country, how could we possibly stop the illegal flow of guns if suddenly hundreds of millions of them here just vanished overnight?
By your logic, machine guns and grenade launchers should be legal as well. Surely, only the criminals would use them for nefarious purposes. Millions would own those weapons "responsibly" as well.
I'm not arguing that there aren't millions of well intentioned gun owners. I'm saying look at the stats! Look at the countries with no hand guns! Look at Canada, at England, at Australia, at Japan! Why are there so few gun deaths there??
Does this country have all the world's psychos? I think you know the answer. Admitting you are wrong is the hardest thing for any person to do. But if you sat down and looked at the price this country is paying so some people can own guns, I think you would realize the truth. How many more school shootings have to occur before the price becomes too high?
to name calling, shouting, belittling, and immaturity. Yet, those in favor of gun ownership seen to be more calm and forego the name calling? I may be right or i may be wrong, its just something i've observed.
I'm a libertarian, so i'm neither a liberal or a conservative. As a Libertarian, i believe the Government should never tell its citizens what to do and to stay out of our lives completely. Whether its gun control (or lack thereof), abortion (or right to life), or who we should marry (gay or straight), or what we should eat (saturated fat or non-saturarated fat), or what insurance we have to have (ObamaCare or choose not to have insurance at all), or how much of a Big Gulp i can buy at 7/11 in New York.
The more any Government enters our lives, the result in every case is less freedom.
I guess you missed the part about the guy telling me to suck bloomberg's dick? Ok then.
For the gun nuts to be right, the rest of the civilized western world (and all those crazy liberals here) must be wrong. Somehow, I highly doubt that.
But keep living in fantasyland while kids get shot for no other reason than they live in a country with a bunch of brainwashed fools
and there's really no getting around this. It's one thing to carry a weapon into a store, when nobody knows you have it, and quite another to carry one into a situation where you're going to disrobe and there's no hiding it. Add to that the fact that you're about to engage in an illegal transaction with someone you've never met, and now you've injected a deadly weapon into a situation that is inherently potentially volatile. Nobody will ever convince me that this is a good idea. Frankly I think you'd have to be an idiot to carry to an appointment, whether provider or patron.
-- Modified on 7/6/2014 8:32:26 PM
Hey Axxel, it is really the NRA that paints the legal gun owners as maniacs - promoting the removal of all restrictions on who and when people can buy guns. And most recently, the movement for a bunch of gun nuts to visit public places armed with AK-47s certainly doesn't help. It is certainly true that it is states with big cities and high murder rates that have the toughest gun laws, but the gun laws aren't so effective because they can get guns at unregulated gun shows in nearby states.
I'll agree that responsible, legal gun owners aren't generally a threat. But, it is also the case that gun ownership will rarely make you safer, unless you have some specific reason to think that you'll need to defend yourself with a gun. The tragedies of the irresponsible gun owners leaving loaded guns available for kids and the mentally ill gun owners who go on mass murder sprees are what makes the news. But the main threat due to the high gun ownership in the US is suicide. If you have a gun in the house, its just more likely that someone will commit suicide in your house because a gun is a very easy way to do it, and it doesn't allow much opportunity to change your mind about it.
Anyway, it is amusing to see you complain about the lack of information and logic on the gun control side of the debate. It is the NRA, after all, that has pushed for laws to prevent the study of gun violence. They obviously feel that facts and logic are not on their side.
I'll agree that responsible, legal gun owners aren't generally a threat. But, it is also the case that gun ownership will rarely make you safer, unless you have some specific reason to think that you'll need to defend yourself with a gun. The tragedies of the irresponsible gun owners leaving loaded guns available for kids and the mentally ill gun owners who go on mass murder sprees are what makes the news. But the main threat due to the high gun ownership in the US is suicide. If you have a gun in the house, its just more likely that someone will commit suicide in your house because a gun is a very easy way to do it, and it doesn't allow much opportunity to change your mind about it.
Anyway, it is amusing to see you complain about the lack of information and logic on the gun control side of the debate. It is the NRA, after all, that has pushed for laws to prevent the study of gun violence. They obviously feel that facts and logic are not on their side.
Drugs and prostitution are illegal but easily obtained. Why do you think guns would be any more difficult to obtain than a bag of weed or a hot blond? If the gang bangers can get illegal drugs to sell, do you really think they couldn't get guns? They would by default replace the gun shops to not only arm themselves but to sell to others.
The idiots with the open carry demonstrations are 1 percenters and are giving legal gun owners a bad name as are the gang bangers that commit most of the shootings
Anyone can do a study of gun violence and stats, studies are all over the place on the net. Its news to me that the NRA has the ability to stifle them. Can you cite the laws that the NRA has supported that make it illegal to study gun violence?
I recently read a article that said if you were to remove Chicago, New Orleans, and LA from the US murder stats that the US would have one of the lowest murder rates in the western world. I don't know if its true or not, but it would be very interesting if it is.
The murder problem is not about guns, its about the gang culture and the lace of respect for human life that they embrace.
Shortly after its most recent mass shooting in 1996, the conservative-led Australian government banned semiautomatic and automatic rifles and shotguns, including a mandatory buy-back program for newly banned weapons. Australia hasn't had a mass shooting since then, and the suicide and murder rates have dropped (although the murder rate was already low and can't be conclusively shown to be related to the law).
If the government made a serious effort at gun control, they could make it more difficult for criminals to get guns. I'm sure that the richest criminals would find a way to get guns, but reducing the number of criminals with guns. The cops could make drugs and prostitution more difficult and more expensive if they wanted to and had enough funding.
The NRA's efforts were directed at preventing federally funded studies of gun violence. This is something that the CDC looked at before, and the NRA preferred not to have any objective scientific studies. Of course, they couldn't prevent privately funded studies, but many of these are funded by gun manufacturers and are not very objective. Obama did manage to push through a bill to get a federally funded study just after the Sandy Hook murders, but that study has been done. One of the findings was that "the U.S. rate of firearm-related homicide is higher than that of any other industrialized country: 19.5 times higher than the rates in other high-income countries."
I really don't see why so many responsible gun owners follow the NRA on gun control. Gun control does not mean banning guns, and responsible gun owners would be safer with reasonable restrictions on gun ownership. The NRA can't even bring itself to criticize the open carry demonstrators.
If the government made a serious effort at gun control, they could make it more difficult for criminals to get guns. I'm sure that the richest criminals would find a way to get guns, but reducing the number of criminals with guns. The cops could make drugs and prostitution more difficult and more expensive if they wanted to and had enough funding.
The NRA's efforts were directed at preventing federally funded studies of gun violence. This is something that the CDC looked at before, and the NRA preferred not to have any objective scientific studies. Of course, they couldn't prevent privately funded studies, but many of these are funded by gun manufacturers and are not very objective. Obama did manage to push through a bill to get a federally funded study just after the Sandy Hook murders, but that study has been done. One of the findings was that "the U.S. rate of firearm-related homicide is higher than that of any other industrialized country: 19.5 times higher than the rates in other high-income countries."
I really don't see why so many responsible gun owners follow the NRA on gun control. Gun control does not mean banning guns, and responsible gun owners would be safer with reasonable restrictions on gun ownership. The NRA can't even bring itself to criticize the open carry demonstrators.
If people can smuggle tons and tons of drugs into the country every day they can just as easily smuggle in guns. It is preposterous to think that they couldn't smuggle in enough guns for themselves and than set up shop selling guns on the black market alongside the drugs. Can you explain how the government would be able to keep thousands of guns from being smuggled in every day when they haven't been able to stop drug or human trafficking over the borders?
1) Canada
2) UK
3) Australia
4) France
5) Germany
6) Japan
etc
etc
How do all these countries prevent hand guns from entering the country? Do they call The Avengers? Or Batman?
Sure, guns will sneak in here and there, but THE FREAKING POINT is that they aren't more easily accessible than a pack of potato chips. Right now the gun manufacturers can't make them fast enough for all the crazy gun nuts out there. That's how any a-hole who wants a gun (legally or not) can get one easily.
This isn't rocket science
The NRA claims to be an organization that supports peoples rights, but there is a good argument to be made that there main goal is to maximize gun maker's profits. They argue against virtually every single law to restrict gun ownership or to allow law enforcement collect any information about gun owners. And they fight against any effort by the government to study gun deaths or gun safety. How, exactly, does not knowing that people living with guns in their house have higher suicide rates help support people's rights? It obviously doesn't. If it were widely known, some gun owners might take precautions that would prevent the suicide of their family members. But, the NRA doesn't want people to know about this because it could hurt gun sales.
The AAA is an organization that supports people's rights to own cars. But if the AAA had the same mindset as the NRA, they'd be arguing that speed limits and traffic signals should be outlawed. But, the AAA prefers to balance public safety vs. car owners rights. The NRA apparently does not think that gun owners rights should be limited at all by public safety considerations.
Your argument regarding smuggling drugs and guns is very strange. We have many laws in this country that protect our rights and our safety. Yet, every law is violated and most crimes go unpunished. Nevertheless, the laws we have do substantially reduce crime and make us much safer. I agree that we can't expect gun control laws to be 100% effective, and we shouldn't prevent law abiding citizens from owning guns to help protect themselves from criminals.
At present, the pro-gun-rights states in the US are the source of guns that are smuggled into other countries, notably Mexico, where the combination of our senseless drug laws and lax gun laws are fueling a very bloody war. If you think that tightening some of our gun laws can't reduce the number of guns available to criminals then you just aren't thinking rationally. Certainly, rich criminals will have no problem getting guns, but the poorer ones will be priced out of the market.
-- Modified on 7/7/2014 9:46:37 AM
If its concealed - how would anyone know i'm carrying it? I take no sides on this issue. Though i know many people who have guns in their homes, yet providers come over to their houses. I'm pretty sure these gun owners don't say "hey, look! i'm a licensed fire arm owner and here's my gun, right next to my bed in my night stand!" I don't think many gun owners do this at all. So why would someone who has a Conceal-Carry permit going to walk in to a session with a girl and say "look, here's my gun!" Most people who have guns or conceal carry-permits keep this to themselves. I know if i had a carry-permit, i would excuse myself to the bathroom, hide the gun within my clothing, and then proceed to hump away. If you need to bring a gun into a setting with a provider, you need to check your over-inflated-ego. Cause the only reason you're bringing it in with you is to "show-off". the likely hood of anything confrontational is virtually nil.
Again, i don't care about the this particular issue. Though i do want to point out that Montana, Idaho, N. Dakota, and/or Wyoming have virtually little/if any gun laws. No permits required for most anything, etc, etc. Yet, those states have some of the lowest gun violence incidents. I've been to those states and you can be sitting at your local Denny's or McDonalds and see people with side arms. Go for a horseback ride down the trails and see people on horseback crossing major streets, all with sidearms.
Illinois has had the toughest gun laws in the Nation. But it doesn't stem the violence. The violence is caused by those who don't follow the laws. The killings done this past weekend in Chicago are done by criminals, not those following the law
Now that Concealed Carry is legal in IL... I would make the assumption the lady is armed - legally
Thank you JosephAldruski (whoever you are) for presenting a totally logical & factually correct argument as to why this country is so outrageously more violent than any other civilized place. Way more U.S. citizens agree with you than not, but as you say it's ALL about the $$, and when a product has saturated the market the manufacturer needs a flack, like the NRA, to keep selling more product.
There was no debate because joe took them out like yesterday's garbage. Ouch. I kinda feel bad gun fetishists.
Vegas Vacation
Cousin Eddie: I haven't seen a beatin' like that since somebody stuck a banana in my pants and turned a monkey loose.
I've read all the posts here on the subject. Predictably, I would venture to say that no one's mind on either side was changed. Me, I think guns are good and that there is absolutely no valid argument whatsoever for "gun control." I usually don't vote, but the current controversy over gun control is too important so I will cast votes this fall against any politician who is not a strong supporter of the Second Amendment, even if I don't like the rest of their opponent's positions on other questions (which as a far left person I undoubtedly won't). It is just too important a basic right of self-defense to allow the vile tyrants in government disarm people.
You vote only on the second Amendment? No wonder the govt is all f'ed up. That amendment has no chance of being repealed or even modified. Do you know what that would take?? You might want to look that up.
And what politicians these days are NOT strong supporters of the 2nd Amendment?? Maybe a few from San Francisco. These clowns couldn't even pass common sense background check legislation after Newtown. What makes you think there is ANY danger of the govt "taking away our guns"??
And you do realize that you and your merry band of gun owning "patriots" have NO CHANCE of beating the military of the USA right? Ever shot down a blackhawk helicopter with a hand gun? Yeah, thought not. It would mow you gun nuts down and keep going like you weren't ever there. ROFL.
Clowns like you who vote on this one stupid issue is the reason we have obstructionism and lack of progress in Washington.
you didn't read my posting. I am NOT a "patriot," and the current background checks is what I oppose.
Its done all the time. IE; gun control, abortion, taxes, big government, etc....So are those that only vote for or against abortion just as STUPID as YOU state above?
if you vote for someone who disagrees with you on EVERYTHING except one issue like guns or abortion. In fact, it is damn near insane.