My first question is, why do you care about an envelope? I like the envelope because I do outcall and it is nice to keep the bills tidy on my way out, but really it makes no difference to me. In fact, it is harder to discreetly check the amount when it is in an envelope.
I am not going to judge you for not counting the money upfront. I've done that a million times, especially with well referenced clients. I don't like to make a big deal about the money. It just takes some of the romance out of it. It is polite if the gentleman puts the money either in the bathroom so you can excuse yourself to wash your hands before you start or if he leaves it on the dresser and excuses himself to freshen up. You can start to make a habit of guiding the fellow in one of these procedures. But sometimes it just doesn't get counted until the end of the date. If this happens then take a quick count while he is getting dressed. This way if there is a mistake you can address it right then and there. I've found many short envelopes this way and they always make good on it.Once he leaves it is really uncomfortable to call him back. If it truly is a mistake he will probably think that you are trying to scam him out of more money. So what have I done when I have found out after he left that the amount was short? Well I have handled it a few different ways but none of them are ideal. One guy I didn't mention it until he tried to book again. He didn't believe me I could tell but he insisted on sending me the $100 he was short. But then he never booked with me again. Another guy denied it. And another guy insisted that my ad said it was less than it was. In every case I lost the client. My advice? Chalk it up to a lesson learned. If the money is important then find a way to count it before he leaves.
OK so, Im very friendly and easy going when it comes to newbies. However this problem I have encountered with both newbies and avid hobbyists and I just wanted to tell the story and see if this happens often or maybe I can do something to correct the issue for future appts.
I had an appt. with a person I had never met before. The conversation on the phone was pleasant and he was screened by me and I felt very comfortable meeting him. To make the story short; He showed up and he went to freshen up in the bathroom. Came back and left the donation on my dresser. I noticed he didnt put it in an envelope but I usually dont make a fuzz about it although I find it just a tad disrespectful (being discreet is always better, and puts me at ease faster). We had a lovely time.
When he left I went to clean up and when I went back to my room, I grabbed the money and counted it (yeah, i didnt count it before since he was screened and verified so, I didnt really worry about it) There was a 40$ shortage in the donation. I counted it 3 more times and I was indeed short by 40$. I called the person who, immediately apologized and came back and said that he had just gone to the ATM prior to see me and it should have been all there. He gave me the remaining extra $, apologized again, but also again he claimed he didnt short changed me. After he left, I felt bad because I could see this being a scam tactic from people to get more money. I know myself so I know I wasnt being deceiving. I got mad at myself because it was ultimately my responsibility to make sure the donation was correct from the get go.
Please guys, before you see a provider. make sure you have the right donation and please; put it in an envelope so you dont forget a 20 (or more) by mistake in your pockets. And also, Should I always mention the envelope to people? is that something I can say over the phone without being taken as talking $? thanks for the feedback in advance.
Count it two or three times an place it in an envelope. Sometimes I do forget it so I'll find some paper and fold it. I wouldn't be offended if you said to me on the phone, don't forget the envelope...... Sweetie.
Gives me an idea, I'm going to put some envelopes in my car right now.
-- Modified on 8/22/2015 2:44:59 PM
If I'm meeting with a provider for the first time, yah, it'll go in an envelope. I, too, always double and triple count it. A lit of times if the donation amounts to an odd number (10, 30, 50 etc) and I don't have a 10 spot. What the heck, she gets the extra 10.
If it's a regular I usually get a silly card of some type and stick the donation in with the card ( but let her know)
D.
PS envelopes (a box?? ) in the car is a great idea!
10, 30 and 50 are all even numbers...just sayin'. Hahaha. JK
My first question is, why do you care about an envelope? I like the envelope because I do outcall and it is nice to keep the bills tidy on my way out, but really it makes no difference to me. In fact, it is harder to discreetly check the amount when it is in an envelope.
I am not going to judge you for not counting the money upfront. I've done that a million times, especially with well referenced clients. I don't like to make a big deal about the money. It just takes some of the romance out of it. It is polite if the gentleman puts the money either in the bathroom so you can excuse yourself to wash your hands before you start or if he leaves it on the dresser and excuses himself to freshen up. You can start to make a habit of guiding the fellow in one of these procedures. But sometimes it just doesn't get counted until the end of the date. If this happens then take a quick count while he is getting dressed. This way if there is a mistake you can address it right then and there. I've found many short envelopes this way and they always make good on it.
Once he leaves it is really uncomfortable to call him back. If it truly is a mistake he will probably think that you are trying to scam him out of more money.
So what have I done when I have found out after he left that the amount was short? Well I have handled it a few different ways but none of them are ideal. One guy I didn't mention it until he tried to book again. He didn't believe me I could tell but he insisted on sending me the $100 he was short. But then he never booked with me again. Another guy denied it. And another guy insisted that my ad said it was less than it was. In every case I lost the client.
My advice? Chalk it up to a lesson learned. If the money is important then find a way to count it before he leaves.
I do count it several times & use a paper clip to hold it together. My perfered method of handling the donation is "Old School"... when I undress, I remove my pocket stuff & place it on the corner of her dresser, next to the chair she provided for my clothes... this way nothing falls out un-noticed. I always place the donation in my "key pocket" so it's the first thing on the dresser. After, I'll get dressed & pick up my pocket stuff... the donation is silently left behind. I don't pay notice to it but sometimes it is gone in the back & forth of dressing & bathroom use... sometimes not...
If her site has explicit instructions, I follow them... If she can't trust a guy to follow a simple instruction than how can she trust us with her safety?
My biggest fear is forgetting the donation... only once, i was embarassed to have left it in the car (Yeah, rght). I noticed as I was undressing & offered to get it immediately... or offered her my keys, to retrieve my gym bag from the front seat. We had seen each other several times at that point, she declined & say we could leave together. I retrieved the donation... we clasped hands & kissed lightly as we parted. The donation passed from hand to hand.
As a guy, I do not believe the guys "mistakes". They were scammers & weren't coming back anyway... unless you were willing to be scammed again... If I didn't want to pay the fee... I'd do without or find someone at my price point. I have no patience for scammers on either side.
xxxoooxxxoooxxxooo
...why I'm there and I'm sure you do as well. An envelope will not create the illusion that we are lovers.
Why do I have to be discreet if we're the only people in the room? We've screened each other so we know neither of us is LE. And even if I was LE, an envelope won't magically prevent you from getting busted. Don't make such a big deal about the damn envelope
If you are like most people who politely place the money in the dresser then, I have no problem with that. But what you probably don't know is that there's a fair number of people who come to my place, take out their wallets infront of me, pull out a bunch of bills and start counting bills infront of my face and then hand the money to me.
Just like you guys want to have a gfe experience, I also have my own bfe fantasies. And when guys do that whole counting money infront of me, makes me feel like I'm live stock. That's all.
I completely agree with BPS, the use of an envelope has been an issue for many years now. I am very happy to see that the majority has finally come around to my view of it's use.
If you care to, do a message search on the subject both here and on the General Board, Once upon a time hookers had most of the guys here convinced that not using an envelope was HUGELY disrespectful and dangerous for the lady. Fortunately common sense seems to have ruled out.
If you don't care to go to the effort of researching the subject, let me just say that a few years ago I got flamed by the mangina crowd for refusing to use an envelope.
If getting paid for what you do bothers you so, maybe a career change is in line, this is a business after all and you are the seller, not the buyer. It's the guy paying for the fantasy, not you.
...hundreds, so it's easy to tell if the amount is correct. It's usually left untouched until I'm gone.
I agree that counting it out in front of the provider is tacky, but there are guys who have been falsely accused of shorting the donation and they want to avoid those dramatics again.
Then again, using an envelope won't help when you have guys like this:
I am also very paranoid about shortchanging someone, so I count and recount the donation a few times before placing it in the envelope. I must have an honest face (!) because so far I have never had a provider even touch the carefully placed envelope until after I've left. And then, of course, I am second guessing myself as i walk to my car as to whether or not I left the proper amount of $$$.
I always use the bank envelopes, I get a handful when I occasionally go inside and use them when I go to ATM. Only had one mistake on the donation and it was my fault and I immediately made it right.
The provider I'm currently seeing trusts me. She never counted the money when I first met her. She never counts the money now. I always pay her after the session. Not before.
I often bring a wine bottle and carry it in in a plastic grocery bag.
For convenience put the envelope in with the wine bottle.
Have her the bag and went to the wash room to clean up and came out to a glass of wine.
Session went well and upon leaving the question was "did you forget something"
Found bag and envelope in the trash.
Had an extra laugh and kiss on the way out
lady's place as I entered her townhouse. I hadn't had a lot of dates to this point. Think it was in an envelope, pretty sure it was. Any way, after the date was over and I had asked to use her wash room, I had also left a tip there on the basin, maybe $50. She mistook that for me trying to also short change her, and I had to explain what the deal was. That look on her face was pretty priceless though, as was the tone of her voice as she counted out the tip and said, "this is only $45" or what ever it was, as it was an awesome 45 minutes we had just spent. : )
If receiving the donation up front and checking it is going to be a mood killer for either of you, then it's probably bound to be a bad date regardless. I'd rather the provider check it up front than be thinking about it for the whole session. I've had providers count the bills right in front of me, and only a douche would get offended at that. I like the relief of "business done, let's have fun!" And as you experienced, there's going to be more aggravation and ill will on both parties in dealing with this afterwards (calling him-apologies-turning around-mutual suspicion) than up front.
guess the cleaning staff can figure that one out!
Lots of great advice in this thread!!
I've read many times that clients like to just drop the donation on the dresser/nightstand/etc when leaving.... someone even posted recently that any provider who wants it upfront, especially to count it, is paranoid.
You can call it paranoia; I call it cautious. I like to think I learn from my (bad) experiences. 
Here's something that happens infrequently but it does happen: the gentleman HIDES the donation. Tucks it under the desk blotter, puts it behind a lamp or even in a drawer when I'm not looking, or under a towel in the bathroom. He may think he's being discreet by not leaving it laying out in the open, but if I don't see it at a quick glance around the room, then I have to ask, "did you leave the......?" to which they often seem to react in a shocked or flustered manner, or are even defensive about it.
Definitely an uncomfy moment for me.
A couple of men have even told me that I shouldn't WANT it in plain sight. Others have told me that some providers have requested that it be left in a "discreet place", usually the bathroom. Fine, but we ladies have all sorts of different procedures. If she hasn't asked you to handle it that way, then don't.
Please read through the lady's website/ad to see if she mentions how/where it should be placed. If there's no mention of it, I feel it's best to put it in plain sight with or without an envelope.
On my website, I have clear instructions on how I want the donation to be handled. Newbies are usually very good about following those instructions.
In my experience, it has been the well-seasoned hobbyists who disregard my requests and instead simply do it their own way.
Sigh..... these men consider themselves so well-versed that the rules simply don't apply to them. After all, they're one of the "good ones".... in their own minds.
They know that they are going to leave the proper amount so they do so at the end, or consider the envelope to be too superfluous so they disregard that, and/or just generally consider ladies' preferences on the matter to be tedious, pretentious, or anything other than requests that should be respected and followed.
To my mind, deliberately doing anything other than requested is usually a sign of disrespect.
Sure there are some people who are just so high-strung that they have to make sure I saw where they laid it and thus cannot stop from mentioning it.... I do give those types a pass.
In conclusion (this got a bit long-winded, sorry lol) if you want to convey the impression that you appreciate our services and have even a modicum of respect for us: then please please please abide by our preferences in handling what can often feel like an awkward moment.
Thank you..... appetizers and well-drinks are being served outside this meeting room. LMAO!!!
xxxoooxxxoooxxxoo
is either too anal, too paranoid, or just not smart enough for me to give her my business.
Just remember the words that many of us live by
"I will pay for pussy, I will beg for pussy, but I will NOT beg to pay for pussy"
I simply can't be bothered to jump through hoops that are completely unnecessary and who's roots were created by myths. I absolutely refuse to use an envelope for those reasons, not to mention it not only is an envelope not any safer than loose cash, quite the contrary, it's more damning to have the exact amount of a hookers advertised donation in a separate envelope marked "gift" or such foolishness.
Women who are that rigid about something as small, petty and meaningless as to INSIST on an envelope are almost always too rigid in other ways for us to be a good fit.
Ladies please remember that while you are screening us, we are screening you too.
For the record, on a first meeting, I almost always drop the donation in plain sight either as I disrobe or just before I head to the bathroom to shower or freshen up, and 90% of the time it's still there until after I leave.
In conclusion, if you want to convey that you are there to please us, appreciate our business, and have even a modicum of respect for what your customers (the guys that pay your bills) then please don't get over the top in demanding we jump through unnecessary hoops just to see you.
Thank you..... and where did you say the refreshments were?
I don't demand an envelope. I prefer one, and that is how it's worded on my site.
It's just my preference. Not a big deal to me...
If anyone reading this is curious as to why I prefer it that way, please PM me and I'll be happy to tell you. It's a private thing, based upon a bad experience in my past, and not something I'd care to detail publicly.
If you read my website and feel that I'm making unrealistic demands... then please do not seek my company. We wouldn't be a good fit. (That is not directed towards anyone in particular, btw, just a general statement to anyone looking at any lady's site and thinking she's too demanding.)
As to jumping through hoops.... well.... everyone sees it differently, I suppose. My requests and even non-negotiable procedures are what make me feel comfortable and best able to provide the most pleasing service/experience for my clients.
If that's "jumping through hoops".... again, I'm not the lady for you. 
These are simply what I've discovered help me to achieve a certain comfort level with a new person.
If I'm uncomfortable, my behavior and demeanor may well reflect that. And then we're both dissatisfied with the encounter; which is obviously not something I want.
GaGambler, I'm very pleased to learn that you always drop the donation in plain sight; for the record, even though we've never met, I did not doubt that.
xoxoxoxoxoxoxo
-- Modified on 8/23/2015 6:41:01 PM
That's why it shows as a reply under your post. The post wasn't directed to you.
I did that once in my early hobbying adventures. I got ripped off. I paid for a one hour session and just got 20 minutes and rushed out the door. Once you get ripped off like that you never ever pay a provider before the session starts. If a provider wants the money upfront I walk out on her. No talking it over.
If u decide to walk out if they want the donation upfront... Ure the scammer and flake. If you had a bad experience that's just something that happens in this business. Shame on her but, your post seriously just made me laugh. No way you are serious about it. 99% of providers want their donation upfront, specially if it's your first time meeting them.
If a provider doesn't ask for the money upfront I always have a great session. If you pay upfront you lose your advantage.
When I meet someone for the first time, and he doesn't produce the donation at the beginning, I'm wondering in the back of my head if he IS going to pay me, or if he'll short me, or anything along those lines. This may cause me to be not as relaxed as I would otherwise be, perhaps even a bit reserved. And when our time is up, I will subtly signal that and be completely disinclined to sit around chatting OTC.
Again, I get where you're coming from and why your comfort is achieved by not paying upfront; please try to understand my perspective in that I am far more comfortable when you've done as I request.
xoxoxoxoxoxoxo
Youre right. It will be in the back of your head the entire time. I think he harms the session more than if he just paid upfront.
It is his responsibility to make sure he is making an appt with an honest provider. that's why theres reviews and such. He got ripped off once, In my opinion it was his fault because he was probably thinking with the other head, and did not due his part in researching who he was meeting.
I always either leave a envelope in plain sight or in a bag with wine or a small gift and go to wash my hands.
I would say under half never touch it until after the session and after first they never do
Actually twice have had to find the bag to get the envelope once the session was over . Once on the counter and once in the trash.
The wine or gift was gone but the envelope was still there:
Trust goes both ways.
I'm never going to pay upfront ever again. A Provider wants money upfront before the session starts I walk out the door.
at the end of the day you are basically running your own business and your bills wants and needs are funded by your business. Alot of people say its rude to count in-front of your client but even with a regular you never know and you might not always have the opportunity to do it discretely. I had a client who had seen me everyday for a month so i stopped counting and he shorted me all but $20(in fives) of the donation in his envelope. I tried calling him thinking that he made a mistake and switched up his bills or something....he ignored my phone call and i haven't heard from him since. talk about feeling bad! my advice...count while your client is still there (in-front or while he freshens up) it allows both adults to handle any and all discrepancies.