This is something I've ponder over the years. There are some great college program out there; such as Duke, UNC, UCLA, Indiana and so on. However, with most of these programs that year in and year out are great college teams,and have great players; the players on the team do not go on to be great players in the NBA. When Bobby Knight was at Indiana year in and year out they kicked ass, but the players on the teams never made the jump to the NBA. I think of that team that had Scott May, Kent Benson, Quin Buckner, and Bobby Wilkerson. Buckner and Wilkerson at best were role playing journey men. The only Indiana player that I can think of that was a great NBA player was Isaiah Thomas. May and Benson were turds in the NBA punch bowl. Duke also really stands out in my view with only Grant Hill and Boozer make the big step up to the next level. UNC of course had Jordan, Perkins, Worthy, and Charlie Scott, but lots of players who were great at the college level, but not the pros Phil Ford. UCLA stands out in my view as having the most players how made the jump to the next level. So is it the program or the player? Just thinking out loud.
players who best fir into his program. I've said before (or someone has) that it's not the coach's job to prepare a player for the NBA. His job is to win games for the school. If the player's NBA skills and talents develop within the program, great.
-- Modified on 3/29/2010 10:36:41 AM
Looks to me like duke has many great NBA players and a few coaches.
I guess your definition of great and mine are different. Of the players on the list I would say that the only two "great players" are Hill and Boozer. The rest are role players at best JJ Redick is in no way great, or solid players Elton Brand. Mike Dunleay great? I think not! Shane Battier role player at best.
Well, Big Poppa,
we agree on Hill and Boozer and the other players you mention and indeed Duke has not put that many 'great' players in the NBA. Laettner was pretty good and not a 'great'. He was a truly great college player. Hurley would have been a journeyman at best had he not gotten almost killed in a wreck-he was never the same after.
Jason Williams would have been 'pretty good' had he not had the career destroying motorcycle wreck. Corey Maggette is having a good career but not by any stretch is he a great. In fact, Duke has not had many 'super athletes' at all since 2001 and their national results reflect this. Things have fallen into place for this year's bunch and they have no NBA players that I can see.
Anyhow, enjoy your posts-later, 1rob
Dear BigPoppaPumplv:
With respect to the college game it is usually a combination of recruiting,coaching and having the right mix of players with a proven strategy and the ability to executed it that will determine long term success at that level. With respect to the players making the successful transition to the NBA, that is a bit more involved because now your talking about certain physical attributes how well they adjust to the speed of the game and how well certain critical skills have been honed to ensure them functionality at the professional level. These things also speak to the development and coaching at the AAU level where they have been getting away from teaching fundamentals on a regular basis. This is self evident in the low free throw shooting percentages and the inability to hit the three point shot which happened to be Kentucky's demise this weekend. Also professionally you have to be able to defend,rebound,dribble and shoot with proficiency on a consistent basis to have a prolific career. Also what is the work ethic from the players and development which is critical. Also this is where power forward and centers will miss the tutelage of former Olympic and University of California Coach Pete Newell, who had a big man camp that preserved the careers of several former and current NBA players. Also because of the one and done rule you will never see the development of players the way you had years ago because there not in college getting the repetition you would receive from critical drills that are so essential to a players functionality. Henceforth your provider will be better at her job than your incoming NBA star will be at theirs. This is something that you would want to entertain when seeking a reply for your question.
... if you are trying to pinpoint the "next best thing" to hit the NBA, I'm not sure looking at college programs is going to be your best place to look.
In fact, the two most (arguably) talented, outstanding players (Kobe and LeBron) currently in the NBA did not even play a single game of college bsketball. Look down that NBA list we also find D. Wade hailing from Marquette (not a major program year in and year out).
Ultimately, it is the freaks who excel and take the game to places where no else can at the time. And these freaks are not bound to certain schools/programs.
As I think on this, I am draw to the top 50 players put together by the NBA for its 50th anniversary. The list is quite populated with what can only be categorized as "no name" colleges. The only thing thay all have in common is this: they were "freaks".
I would also like to see great graduation rates as well.....as much as everyone likes to rag on Duke, I am sure more than 90%, if not 100% are graduating.....as much as everyone may like Kentucky, look at the coach, trouble has followed him everywhere (UMass, Memphis, UK).....
Hey, I am sure all of the Cornell kids are graduating.....FWIW.
While a great college player can carry a program to tremendous heights during their 4 year run (see Ralph Sampson at Virginia, Keith Van Horn at Utah or Tim Duncan at Wake Forrest for example), those schools that have long term year in and year out success really don’t need to have NBA type players.
Take a school like Louisville which over the past 30 years has one two national championships and has been to several final Fours. A very solid winning program year in and year out. However, over these past 30 years, the school has NOT produced ONE player who I would consider to be a great pro. There have been numerous very good to great college players (Darrell Griffith, Rodney McCray, Derek Smith, Pervis Ellison, Lancaster Gordon, Felton Spencer, Milt Wagner Billy Thompson, LaBradford Smith, DeJuan Wheat, Francisco Garcia, etc., etc.) but they are mediocre to poor NBA Players. Griffith is about the only player on that list who was even good (and his pro career was no where near his college career in terms of success)in the NBA. You have to go back to Wes Unseld in the 1970's to find the last Louisville player who was an NBA All Star/ or Hall of Famer.
So the successful programs are not the ones who necessarily produce the NBA stars. The successful programs are the ones who have great coaches (Coach K, Roy Williams, Tom Izzo, Calhoun, Boeheim, etc.) that are able to get the most out of their players no matter who those players are.
-- Modified on 3/30/2010 1:09:08 PM