I am very rarely with a lady who fakes her response to DATY - most are comfortable enough by the time we get to that point, after talking for awhile, to genuinely enjoy it.
But occasionally, I am with a lady whose responses to DATY are obviously faked. This could be for all kinds of reasons - maybe she is too tired or stressed, or maybe the chemistry between us just isn't there, or maybe one of a hundred other reasons. But sometimes I think the reason may be that she just isn't a person who is able to easily be responsive, and perhaps may even be a person who rarely climaxes with a man.
So my thought is to gently suggest to her that she just try to relax about it, and we will take our time, and she can just let me know what is working and what is not (even if only by moving her body if she is not someone who makes noises). And so she may be able in this way to go over the edge. But I don't want to offend her or make her uncomfortable with my suggestion that we do this.
So my question is this: When she is really into "fake" mode, with the fake moaning and groaning immediately after I begin, how do I convey to her what I want to do about trying to make it real? What do you suggest I say to her? The difficulty is that she has started down the "fake" path, a path which usually ends with a fake "O" in a ridiculously short time, and it's tough to get her off that path and into being real. I could just stop the DATY once she starts the fake stuff, and say something to her about how I would like to take the time to do what works for her to make it real instead of fake, and we can take the necessary time to do this - but what do you think I should say? What could I say or do to help her to understand this?
Or is it just too much to ask, to ask a woman to let me help her to make it real? Is it an impossible goal for some of these women?
Note to the guys: I am interested in the ladies' responses to this, not yours. I know that many of you are very eager to let us all know about your experiences and views on this, but please refrain from posting them in this thread. Thank you very much.
-- Modified on 1/11/2005 7:23:08 AM
-- Modified on 1/11/2005 7:25:24 AM
Maybe you are her 7th appt of the day and there isnt anything you can do to make her enjoy it. Maybe you should think about what was there 15 minutes before you got there. Maybe you arent good at it and some are just better actresses.
Love live the Russian Empire.
You could quit focusing on whether or not she has an orgasm at all. Instead of waiting until you start and she fakes, why not let her know up front that she doesn't have to fake it for you - just enjoy it as much as she can and relax, and you will too.
I wonder how happy you might be if she just lays there like a lump and waits for you to be finished. Or if she stops you after 30 seconds and tells you straight out that she doesn't like what you're doing.
I understand that you would like your partner to have a genuine orgasm instead of just performing for you, but perhaps you have to accept that it isn't going to happen sometimes. If your motivation for DATY is because you enjoy it and it stimulates you, then her orgasm is secondary anyway, enjoy it yourself. If your motivation is her pleasure, there isn't any point to doing it if she is faking, so don't waste your time, move on to something else. I do think it's too much to ask for you to insist that your partner has an orgasm ("to help her to make it real"). Maybe she doesn't even want to.
Perhaps you should give her tips on improving her performance so that it isn't so obviously faked.
I like your "let her know up front" suggestion.
Your last suggestion was kind of interesting too.
Thanks.
Its over before she can think about how to fake it anyway. I'm gonna tell her not to blink and miss the good stuff.
I so appreciate that you are seeking a real experience.
It's worth a try. I was 22 before i had my first O and 30 before i could let go enough to have more after that. (i did not start providing until 32) When i am with a Gent that has ED and is having trouble "getting there" i generally ask him to think about he most erotic fantasy, i assure him there is no hurry. (i sometimes worry that he is worried about getting there in the time allotted.) Admittedly it is a different experience for men and women but i it is through other things i say that i get them to relax without actually saying "try to relax." (from my end that may backfire)
Finally, you are right there is chemistry, and there is the preverbal “You can not please all the people all the time.” Don’t take it so personally.
Love and Light
roxy
-- Modified on 1/11/2005 8:28:28 AM
I don't take it personally, actually, because I think they are that way with all or nearly all men. I just feel like it would be nice for her and for me too for it to be real, if that is possible for her.
Chainsaws, blenders, and electric vibrating knives. I like it sloppy and wierd, but I like the diesel truck vibrating tools like I love my lip gloss. Ya heard?!
Go ahead and fake that NOW honey! (rotflmao!)
http://www.cduniverse.com/images.asp?cart=224118793&pid=6786109&style=atoy&image=front
While you are at it can you pick me up one too? (evil grins)
It vill even make chicken zoup! My bald knish!!
to a suggestion that she use a vibrator? Is there a good way to suggest this? I guess the best way might be to say with an evil grin, "Look what I brought...want to try it out?"
[Funny answers welcome and eagerly anticipated, but I'm also interested in a serious answer].
-- Modified on 1/11/2005 9:56:59 PM
You're just going to have to face that fact that not *all* women have orgasms *all* of the time. I know you guys want providers to tell you how wonderful you are, how delightful your tongue feels, how you lick like no other, blah, blah, blah. And yes, I have said those things at times and have sincerely meant it, but sometimes NO MATTER WHAT YOU DO, I am NOT going to have an orgasm. I could be tired. I could be stressed about something in my personal life. I could be sore. I may not like you or something you said/did. I may be on anti-depressants. (Girls, if you've ever taken Prozac, you can surely relate. I could be fucking Jake Gyllenhaal, and most likely would rather be watching Bob Ross paint happy little trees.) I may get distracted along the way by someone walking down the hall of my building, the elevator bell, the neighbor, the El, sirens outside or anything other random noises outside my apartment. If you have been at it awhile AND I *really* want to have an orgasm, *I* will suggest my vibrator. A client's suggestion only puts more unwanted, unrelaxing pressure upon me. Then again, I'm a very, very vanilla provider so this probably isn't the case with other providers.
You may or may not be surprised to learn that having an orgasm with a client has *very* little to do with how I attractive I find him physically. There have been times when there's been absolutely zero physical attraction. I'll just lay there thinking about my next trip, Schoolboy cookies or a movie. Those things are usually enough to relax me to the point where I'll have an orgasm without me even thinking abou it. However, asking me to orgasm for you will usually yield zero results.
I dunno about you, but I don't have to fake my orgasms fantasizing about Maggie Gyllenhaal. (I would with Jake) All I have to do is think of her in "Secretary" with her arms tied to that stick trying to serve her boss coffee, and then that scene where James Spader takes her, bends her over, dominates her...well how can any man need to fake an orgasm then!
I was talking about providers who have a hard time having an orgasm with any man.
They make tongue sleeve vibrators. This will make her laugh and then over time you can introduce her to the heavy artillery later. Sorry for replying late, I was flying to LAX for a TV show filming.
Careful not to chip your tooth, the tongue ones are cool but can knock around, which will cost you more in dental work than you want to know. : )~~
You said: But occasionally, I am with a lady whose responses to DATY are obviously faked. This could be for all kinds of reasons - maybe she is too tired or stressed, or maybe the chemistry between us just isn't there, or maybe one of a hundred other reasons. But sometimes I think the reason may be that she just isn't a person who is able to easily be responsive, and perhaps may even be a person who rarely climaxes with a man
You said: So my question is this: When she is really into "fake" mode, with the fake moaning and groaning immediately after I begin, how do I convey to her what I want to do about trying to make it real?
You said:The difficulty is that she has started down the "fake" path, a path which usually ends with a fake "O" in a ridiculously short time, and it's tough to get her off that path and into being real. I could just stop the DATY once she starts the fake stuff, and say something to her about how I would like to take the time to do what works for her to make it real instead of fake, and we can take the necessary time to do this - but what do you think I should say? What could I say or do to help her to understand this?
Or is it just too much to ask, to ask a woman to let me help her to make it real? Is it an impossible goal for some of these women?
I say: Man you are really smelling yourself. Why does the fault have to be on the woman? Maybe you aren't doing it right. Maybe she isn't that big on DATY because of disease or it's not her thing. I found out there are many women providers and non who do not like men licking on them downstairs. How do you know that she is faking it immediately after you begin? Just the thought of a hot tongue on me makes me mean even before it happens. You are really out of tune with women's bodies it isn't even funny and your ego needs a serious overhaul, like you are the king of pussy eating. Quit flattering yourself. You should tell her beforehand when she knows you aren't LE and she is comfortable knowing that you are on the up and up that you enjoying going down on a woman that you your intentions are to make her feel good and ask her how she feels about that. Tell her that you want her pleasure to be real and if she needs to tell you what to do to make her cum then you will do it all for her. Tell her you don't want her to fake it but to lay back and enjoy what is going on in her nether regions. Unless she is not into oral sex on her, the DATY should go great for both parties.
The first part of your "I say" response was a little strange, and might have more to do with your attitudes toward men than anything I said.
The second part, starting with "You should tell her beforehand..." was good advice, and something I have often done. Maybe I should do it more often. Thanks for that part of your post.
You said it in your opening post on the board what I quoted you. I don't know how to quote someone on this board. I don't have a hostile attitude towards men but you are coming off like she isn't enjoying it because it's her fault somehow, like you are blameless. It could be that you don't know what you are doing. so many man say that they are good at DATY and they are horrible at it then comes the faking so that you can cut it out and stop it. We don't want to say stop it dammit because you are pissing me off so we fake it. There are men who are very good at DATY and we need not fake it. I assume that since the many providers you see are faking it then you are no good at it.
... "What do you enjoy?"
(She says what she enjoys) You do it. Tell her she can change her mind in the middle.
(She is non-comittal or says the equivqlent of "please yourself") You do that.
Sometimes women are just not comfortable with having an orgasm with a client. I consider myself a very flexible provider, but in the beginning, it was very difficult for me to come with a client. I had only ever had my boyfriend DATY, and it took him a while to get me to come. Sometimes, it requires a lot of trust to turn over that completely vulnerable part of yourself. As I have become more experienced, it has become easier, but it's taken a lot of cheerleading on my part.
However, this may be irrelevant.
Sex is all in the mind. Sometimes, I have it stuck in my head that I won't be able to come with a client, and so I can't.
And yes, sometimes, a client is not very good at DATY. But it's actually rarer than I thought it would be. Most are good.
My suggestion to you, is find a provider who is able to come. It's difficult to talk about it. Once you mention that you don't like that she fakes it, chances are she won't be able to do it for real. Like someone said earlier in the thread, the best way to get a woman NOT to relax is to tell her to relax.
Maybe it's just best to write these ladies off, and seek those who are able to come easily with a client. They are definitely out there.
Thank you for your candid and sensitive answer.
-- Modified on 1/13/2005 7:17:10 AM